Author Topic: RAPS, the down and dirty.  (Read 16559 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #30 on: April 19, 2005, 05:29:00 PM »
I wonder how many parents would have been signing their kids up for this destructive travesty had Cedu been honest and truthful about the Synanon connections & methods in their slick brochures, web site, and video tapes?

Quote
On 2005-04-12 07:22:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote





if you want to understand this history - the "raps" (called "forums" at Cascade) were based on the Synanon Game. you can read about it here:


http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia. ... nanon.html


cedu = charles e. dederich university. don't buy that see - do crap."




From the article:



"Encounter Groups:

Encounter Groups have less stigma than orthodox psychotherapy because they emphasize the idea of perfecting oneself rather than solving problems. Synanon therapeutic ideology focuses on behavior not the fundamental cognitive structure 23.







The Game

The Game was group psychotherapy for the whole community and served as a way to discuss organizational change 24. Members were grouped by a Synamaster, usually an older member tried to achieve a balance of female-male participants and a varying range of Synanon membership seniority. A basic game consisted of ten to fifteen members and a Synanist to facilitate the activity 25. The Synanist was someone who had shown the ablility to either control the symptoms of his addiction for a considerable time or seemed to be progressing at a faster rate than his peers 26.



The Game was an emotional and aggressive group meeting in which members attacked each other verbally. It was an open arena for voicing and airing problems with one another en route to finding a solution. Members were free and encouraged to be honest with their feelings and frustrations. The "attack" was seen as an expression of love 27. It presumably helped people to see themselves as others do and compelled them to examine their own thoughts and actions. The Synanist acted as moderator and tried to help the participants find themselves and would use such tactics as ridicule, cross-examination and hostile attack to further the session 28. It was estimated that the typical resident participated in three to four three-hour games per week 29.





Role-joining was a very important aspect of the Game and was used to progress the session. Role-joining was an agreement between two or more game members to combine their efforts to place an individual on the "hot seat." Once the plan was evident to the other members, they supported and aided in the scheme. Role-joining was essentially like joining a bandwagon and would result in all the session members joining forces against one of their own 30.





The Game is also the cornerstone around which the Synanon community was formed 31. It was key to Synanon government and created an in and out of game dichotomy. When "in the game," one was expected to criticize others and reveal any personal conflicts one might have with whoever was in the "hot seat." On the other hand, when "out of the game," one was supposed to portray a happy, pleasant, and helpful manner 32.





Members were also expected to follow the rules and standards established during Game sessions. Compliance to the norms expressed was rewared by material and social goods such as personal prestige or occupational mobility. Wealth and status symbols were regulated by the small group 33."





"
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline dniceo7

  • Posts: 242
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #31 on: April 25, 2005, 12:48:00 PM »
That is some seriously sick shit. Do you think that there really is a direct correlation between Charles E. Dederich University and the name CEDU? Seems like it...I want to use that Synanon website to make a real point to some people in my life that just can't comprehend what BCA was like, so it'd be nice to be able to make a direct connection (looks like it's there anyways).

I never did buy that see do bullshit anyways.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
I don\'t look at myself in the mirror because I\'m a narcissist, I simply like to watch myself exist...

Offline blownawaytheidahoway

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 645
  • Karma: +4/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2005, 08:37:00 AM »
. Carmen?s raps were deep. Even deeper than the average rap and as I walked out of my first rap with her, I was resolved that this was NOT the place for me. I had never been a junkie and I had never been to jail. I was fourteen and this place was insane! Carmen had almost every person in the circle crying at the same time. I don?t know how to explain it.
 I do, but it?s hard to get across.
 I can only explain it from the point of view of an older student even though I wasn?t one in this particular rap. Carmen had the power to tell your family head how you were doing. Therefore, she could have you on work assignments for weeks on end, or she could tell your family head that you did whatever it was that was expected of you. You might get to get off campus for a milkshake or a basketball game at the gym in Bonners Ferry. Of course leaving campus was almost an impossiblity for the first year, though. Let?s say the rap started and there was an indictment about someones bathroom habits, or they are not clean enough, this degrades into an embarrasing commentary on the persons acne. Carmen insists that there is more to it than sanitary measures and claims to know that this person is ?holding on to something?. She calls the girl dirty and a liar. Another student jumps on the Carmen?s bandwagon and takes another pot shot at the girl from Carmen?s half of the circle. Carmen springs out of her seat and switches to the other side to take the seat next to the sobbing girl who has already at this point told us all the slutty things she has done in her life and that?s why she has acne. Carmen lays a hand on her back and blasts back at the guy who tried to get a point at the girls expense. Carmen rails him. She really lets him have it telling him he?s so full of shit. A tremendous kissass and a waste of resources in the community. He?s terrified, he?s not sure what he?s going to do. Neither are we. Noting the lull, Carmen demands of the older students in the rap to get honest and tell this kid what they think of him. Three people, like synchronized machines stand up and switch sides of the room and begin to yell. When one stops to breathe, the other two take up the slack. The whole time, Carmen is multitasking. She?s like an executive with three phones in front of her, and each one is blinking and bleeping with high end client on the other end shelling out thousands to get a few minutes on the phone with the woman. She was comforting the girl who is sobbing about her confidence issues; she has just had everything she?s ever done exposed by people who hardly know her. At the same time, as facilitator, she?s encouraging a full- scale attack on a kid who seemingly allied himself with her just a few moments before.
It was confusing. The kid who was trying score a point is now in tears and Carmen is asking other parties if they feel like doing some work. The older students see a double opportunity in this: Firstly, they can skip any of the humiliation of being indicted in front of all the kids, but they have to put on a convincing show of being upset and empathizing with either the bawling boy or girl. If they play the cards just right, they too can have the comforting hand of Carmen laid upon them. They too can know that they have escaped ?having another asshole ripped? for that day.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
Life is a very wonderful thing.\' said Dr. Branom... \'The processes of life, the make- up of the human organism, who can fully understand these miracles?... What is happening to you now is what should happen to any normal healthy human organism...You are being made sane, you are being made healthy.
     \'That I will not have, \' I said, \'nor can understand at all. What you\'ve been doing is to make me feel very very ill.\'
                         -Anthony Burgess
                      A Clockwork Orange

Offline shanlea

  • Posts: 316
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2005, 11:23:00 AM »
Holy Crap, Blown. That was a PERFECT depiction of the insidious, manipulative, mind fucking nature of raps. Can anyone call this therapy?!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
hanlea

Offline rmasurvivor

  • Posts: 2
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #34 on: May 29, 2005, 12:19:00 AM »
don't get me started... I'm afraid I have too much to say!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
You can bomb the world to pieces, but you cannot bomb the world to PEACE\"
-D.C. Peace march 2003

Offline Antigen

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 12992
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile
    • http://wwf.Fornits.com/
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #35 on: May 29, 2005, 02:25:00 AM »
Aw, g'won! Odds are it'll resonate w/ what we all saw and did. Hold forth.

Impiety: Your irreverence toward my deity.
--Ambrose Bierce

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes

Offline Antigen

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 12992
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile
    • http://wwf.Fornits.com/
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2005, 02:28:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-05-26 08:23:00, shanlea wrote:

"Holy Crap, Blown. That was a PERFECT depiction of the insidious, manipulative, mind fucking nature of raps. Can anyone call this therapy?!"


Yeah, some can. But only those who see themselves as above reproach. They're wrong, of course.

Faith is believing something you know ain't true.
--Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #37 on: May 29, 2005, 12:55:00 PM »
You should have tried a propheet with Allgood.

Quote
On 2005-05-26 05:37:00, blownawaytheidahoway wrote:

". Carmen?s raps were deep. Even deeper than the average rap and as I walked out of my first rap with her, I was resolved that this was NOT the place for me. I had never been a junkie and I had never been to jail. I was fourteen and this place was insane! Carmen had almost every person in the circle crying at the same time. I don?t know how to explain it.

 I do, but it?s hard to get across.

 I can only explain it from the point of view of an older student even though I wasn?t one in this particular rap. Carmen had the power to tell your family head how you were doing. Therefore, she could have you on work assignments for weeks on end, or she could tell your family head that you did whatever it was that was expected of you. You might get to get off campus for a milkshake or a basketball game at the gym in Bonners Ferry. Of course leaving campus was almost an impossiblity for the first year, though. Let?s say the rap started and there was an indictment about someones bathroom habits, or they are not clean enough, this degrades into an embarrasing commentary on the persons acne. Carmen insists that there is more to it than sanitary measures and claims to know that this person is ?holding on to something?. She calls the girl dirty and a liar. Another student jumps on the Carmen?s bandwagon and takes another pot shot at the girl from Carmen?s half of the circle. Carmen springs out of her seat and switches to the other side to take the seat next to the sobbing girl who has already at this point told us all the slutty things she has done in her life and that?s why she has acne. Carmen lays a hand on her back and blasts back at the guy who tried to get a point at the girls expense. Carmen rails him. She really lets him have it telling him he?s so full of shit. A tremendous kissass and a waste of resources in the community. He?s terrified, he?s not sure what he?s going to do. Neither are we. Noting the lull, Carmen demands of the older students in the rap to get honest and tell this kid what they think of him. Three people, like synchronized machines stand up and switch sides of the room and begin to yell. When one stops to breathe, the other two take up the slack. The whole time, Carmen is multitasking. She?s like an executive with three phones in front of her, and each one is blinking and bleeping with high end client on the other end shelling out thousands to get a few minutes on the phone with the woman. She was comforting the girl who is sobbing about her confidence issues; she has just had everything she?s ever done exposed by people who hardly know her. At the same time, as facilitator, she?s encouraging a full- scale attack on a kid who seemingly allied himself with her just a few moments before.

It was confusing. The kid who was trying score a point is now in tears and Carmen is asking other parties if they feel like doing some work. The older students see a double opportunity in this: Firstly, they can skip any of the humiliation of being indicted in front of all the kids, but they have to put on a convincing show of being upset and empathizing with either the bawling boy or girl. If they play the cards just right, they too can have the comforting hand of Carmen laid upon them. They too can know that they have escaped ?having another asshole ripped? for that day."
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline KathyR

  • Posts: 4
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #38 on: June 09, 2005, 09:02:00 PM »
*chuckles*
Now this brings back memories.
I recall people trembling when getting called into her raps. I never had trouble with Carmen though you would never know that such a petite lady could yell SO loud!
I can't say that people screaming at me at the top of their lungs taught me any great wisdom. But I do recall moments of compassion when I was struggling with family.


Quote
On 2005-05-26 05:37:00, blownawaytheidahoway wrote:

". Carmen?s raps were deep. Even deeper than the average rap and as I walked out of my first rap with her, I was resolved that this was NOT the place for me. I had never been a junkie and I had never been to jail. I was fourteen and this place was insane! Carmen had almost every person in the circle crying at the same time. I don?t know how to explain it.

 I do, but it?s hard to get across.

 I can only explain it from the point of view of an older student even though I wasn?t one in this particular rap. Carmen had the power to tell your family head how you were doing. Therefore, she could have you on work assignments for weeks on end, or she could tell your family head that you did whatever it was that was expected of you. You might get to get off campus for a milkshake or a basketball game at the gym in Bonners Ferry. Of course leaving campus was almost an impossiblity for the first year, though. Let?s say the rap started and there was an indictment about someones bathroom habits, or they are not clean enough, this degrades into an embarrasing commentary on the persons acne. Carmen insists that there is more to it than sanitary measures and claims to know that this person is ?holding on to something?. She calls the girl dirty and a liar. Another student jumps on the Carmen?s bandwagon and takes another pot shot at the girl from Carmen?s half of the circle. Carmen springs out of her seat and switches to the other side to take the seat next to the sobbing girl who has already at this point told us all the slutty things she has done in her life and that?s why she has acne. Carmen lays a hand on her back and blasts back at the guy who tried to get a point at the girls expense. Carmen rails him. She really lets him have it telling him he?s so full of shit. A tremendous kissass and a waste of resources in the community. He?s terrified, he?s not sure what he?s going to do. Neither are we. Noting the lull, Carmen demands of the older students in the rap to get honest and tell this kid what they think of him. Three people, like synchronized machines stand up and switch sides of the room and begin to yell. When one stops to breathe, the other two take up the slack. The whole time, Carmen is multitasking. She?s like an executive with three phones in front of her, and each one is blinking and bleeping with high end client on the other end shelling out thousands to get a few minutes on the phone with the woman. She was comforting the girl who is sobbing about her confidence issues; she has just had everything she?s ever done exposed by people who hardly know her. At the same time, as facilitator, she?s encouraging a full- scale attack on a kid who seemingly allied himself with her just a few moments before.

It was confusing. The kid who was trying score a point is now in tears and Carmen is asking other parties if they feel like doing some work. The older students see a double opportunity in this: Firstly, they can skip any of the humiliation of being indicted in front of all the kids, but they have to put on a convincing show of being upset and empathizing with either the bawling boy or girl. If they play the cards just right, they too can have the comforting hand of Carmen laid upon them. They too can know that they have escaped ?having another asshole ripped? for that day."
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
ith love and care~
Kathy

Offline blownawaytheidahoway

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 645
  • Karma: +4/-0
    • View Profile
"Ok, Well I'll start"
« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2006, 12:00:00 PM »
REDACTED
« Last Edit: January 10, 2007, 08:22:07 AM by Guest »
Life is a very wonderful thing.\' said Dr. Branom... \'The processes of life, the make- up of the human organism, who can fully understand these miracles?... What is happening to you now is what should happen to any normal healthy human organism...You are being made sane, you are being made healthy.
     \'That I will not have, \' I said, \'nor can understand at all. What you\'ve been doing is to make me feel very very ill.\'
                         -Anthony Burgess
                      A Clockwork Orange

Offline try another castle

  • Registered Users
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 2693
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2006, 02:51:00 PM »
I remember getting upset in raps, even when I indicted myself, because I genuinely was upset. But not for any past issues, like they pushed you to believe. It was always because I felt I wasn't doing right in the school. It was an endless source of frustration for me. I wanted to be so perfect and do everything right, or close to it, because I wanted to fit in and gain approval. Sometimes I can't really remember who was harsher on me: the faculty and my peers, or myself. (I think I'll vote for the faculty.)

I have an obsessive problem with perfectionism, so going to a school like RMA was like putting gasoline on a bonfire. John Aaron told a friend of mine later that he thought I was probably the most tormented person he had ever known at the school.

I also used to get accused of having a "whipped puppy" expression on my face when I got screamed at in raps, as if I was being manipulative to gain sympathy. I was always thinking "hell yeah I have that expression on my face. You're screaming your ass off at me and I'm upset!" That was a favorite expression there, "whipped puppy." How dare you be upset when we're yelling at you. The best was when you started crying after being indicted and the staff would ask in a concerned tone "What's going on?" implying that some past issues are coming up. I wish I had had the wherewithal to have said "What's going on? You're screaming at me and it's making me cry! DUUUUH!"

The raps I dreaded the most were Caroline's, since we weren't exactly the best of friends.

On a lighter note, I used to do a flawless impersonation of Carmen for my friends. (Especially her saying "That's right!" and "You know, that's really sad.") It would crack them up. I also did a pretty convincing Bob. (I forgot his last name. Voyager staff, older guy, salt and pepper moustache, tan skin. Kind of weird.) I would always do his "What we're... what we're going to do here..."

_________________
"Learn from your mistakes so that one day you can repeat them precisely."
-Trevor Goodchild
[ This Message was edited by: sorry... try another castle on 2006-03-03 11:52 ]
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2006, 02:57:00 PM »
Bob Sulfies, the guy from voyagers.

"I knew a man, Bob Sulfies, and he'll rock your shit". It's a spoof of "I knew a man, BoJANGLES and he'll dance for you...."!In case you didn't make the connection.

I once heard someone singing that before a rap.

He was pretty mild though, he wouldn't "hurt a fly".

BTW- Im HERE FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

never

  • Guest
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2006, 07:01:00 PM »
i remember the raps we used to have over at browns. we had this idiot of a human being running the rap. he gave us this sheet of paper and on it were what they called.THINKING ERRORS. i will quate a few. POOR ME.he loved that one. ALL OR NOTHING,FALSE THINKING AND OTHERS I CANT REMEMBER. i went along with it giving people advice like a good CULT MEMBER. thinking i will get out sooner. I DIDNT
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Willy B

  • Posts: 7
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
RAPS, the down and dirty.
« Reply #43 on: March 03, 2006, 09:37:00 PM »
Raps served only one real purpose that worked.  Yelling at people at the school who were annoying you so they wouldn't repeat it.  But it was only little stuff, things you would have knocked the person senseless at any other school.

Carmen was so fake.  She figured since she was Dan's wife, she therefore had some kind of great wisdom to impart on everyone in raps.  Most of the staff were that way, as though they were checking a cheat-sheet constantly looking for the right thing to say.  

Bob Silfies was generally a decent guy, though he played the "That's right!  How does that feel?  Ah huh!"  game a lot too.  

Caroline was just a bitch.  She wouldn't indict me in raps because she was too easy to turn the conversation back on.  She had an IQ of a prostitute...  wait a minute...  She was a prostitute...  If you used a word large enough, her eyes would glaze over and her mouth would shut.  She could yell, but generally I would just give her the Spock raised eyebrow, she would stop, and ask "What?"  And then I would have her.  But having the rep/title of an intellect, most of the uneducated students who were not getting any more education while there would back down, or not bother to speak to me in raps.  I think I got indicted four times the entire time I was there.

Another game I would play was "Find the Indicter."  Figure out who had requested you, and watch them.  When they tried to maneuver in position to indict you during someone elses indictment, in preparation for blowing you away, you continuosly switch seats with people to place yourself next to them, since the rules were; no indicted someone next to you.  Too intimidating.  Which seemed a rule totally opposite of RMA's goals.  To intimidate people into submission.

Tim Brace was usually my worst rap leader since he was armed with detailed information about my past.  He loved to bring up that I was adopted, therefore abandoned, therefore worthless.  Worked a couple of times too.  But I got him back.  I found my birth family a few years ago, found out I have 5 siblings, and they tried more than once to find me.  They wanted me!!!!  Not so worthless afterall, eh Timmy??!!!???

But I agree with most people who have said they liked to label people at every turn, with mostly inaccurate titles like slut.  Everything was so canned and generic there, it was hard to take much of it seriously.  And when people say they went to that school with few problems, but came out with plenty because RMA gave them the problems, I can relate to that.  I had never seriously considered the fact I was adopted until it was put in my face several times.  And intellectually, I was interested in finding them, but not with RMA's help.  Being forced to think of my birth family in negative terms was not something I had ever wanted to do.  I didn't know they well enough to judge them, and RMA sure as hell didn't know them any better.  And that was the problem.  The always came armed with erroneous information about students, all coming from parents who had no idea what was going on with their own children, that everyone was just taking shots in the dark trying to label and judge everyone without taking the time to get to know them.

I hated being indicted or watching others get indicted by look goods or older students who were forced to participate and yell at people in order to get privledges or keep them.  Want to be in leadership?  Indict 3 people per week.  Want to ski at Sweitzer?  Get three new students to tell you their story.  These people didn't know you, didn't seem to want to know you, yet were forced to yell at you for whatever they could think of.  Talk about needy people.  Look goods just sucked.

Raps were also far too long.  Three fricken hours in plastic chairs, cushioned ones if you were lucky, listening to people yell and scream about things I would prefer not have known about.  And the graphic details...  My God!  I did not need to know how someone went about getting one of the sheep at the farm to hold still while they performed sex with it.  

The worst was the all-female rap I somehow got put in.  Twenty four women led by Caroline Wolfe, all discussing things no man was meant to know, and then being put on the spot as the only guy in the rap to tell them which guys masterbated to which girls.  Including myself.  Though I did get to see Caroline Wolfes breasts in that rap.  For the second time.  She loved to flash people.  Problem was, I was having sex with someone there, on a regular basis, and was in love, so I had to keep my answers brief and strictly lies.  I learned that deodorants and rubberbands had more uses than I was aware of.  Personally, tight constricting rubber and chemicals don't generally find their way anywhere near my manhood.  (Cringe!)

Well, that's my comment about raps.

--Bill,
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
-RMA graduate 1986

Offline blownawaytheidahoway

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 645
  • Karma: +4/-0
    • View Profile
REDACTED
« Reply #44 on: March 13, 2006, 07:24:00 AM »
They assured me that in a few months we could talk about the possibility of coming home. My heart raced at this. A shred of light emanated from that sentiment. I took advantage by interjecting that that I was being monitored at that moment and I wasn?t supposed to complain. Something deep inside of me begged them to understand I wasn?t playing a game, I wasn?t lying or anything but really hearing what they had said confirmed two things simultaneously to me. One, that there were some reservations about their decision and secondly that they didn?t really believe I should be gone until I was eighteen! The older student took the phone at the moment and said to my parents that my time was almost up. He handed me back the phone. I started to cry, for the first time out of sadness, and pity, ?Please, Mommy, I?m so sorry for whatever I did, PLEASE, let me come home.? They hung up, but strangely, I felt better. The next few days were more tolerable? until I got indicted for the first time in a Rap.
<

...REDACTED
« Last Edit: January 09, 2007, 03:53:29 PM by Guest »
Life is a very wonderful thing.\' said Dr. Branom... \'The processes of life, the make- up of the human organism, who can fully understand these miracles?... What is happening to you now is what should happen to any normal healthy human organism...You are being made sane, you are being made healthy.
     \'That I will not have, \' I said, \'nor can understand at all. What you\'ve been doing is to make me feel very very ill.\'
                         -Anthony Burgess
                      A Clockwork Orange