14 Year old Dies at THAYER LEARNING CENTER

[tlcrescue]

pia, to check private messages on here, there is a button under the forums link to the left titled "private messages".  just click it...it may ask you to log in again.

[Cruella]

"I was just wondering if your child put you through so much the last year, did you ever stop to think what you might have done in her earlier years or present that might have contributed to her attitude.

Maybe you need to look at yourself in the mirror and see if maybe there is something you need to change instead of sending your child off to be "corrected" by someone totally unqualified."

Point taken.  I have more children than just my daughter.  All the children live under the same rules at home.  The other children don't have a problem with it at all.  My daughter decided when she turned 16 that rules (any rules) didn't apply to her.  She had this 18 year old boyfriend that helped her a lot into getting into trouble (fear of getting pregnant twice).  They ran away to the French Quarter to make a 'life' for themselves.  The laws in this state require a parent to actively participate in locating and bringing back your child who has run away (under the age of 18).  She ran off several times after this and swore she was doing drugs (although now she claims not to have touched any thing except for alcohol).  She was taken to the ER 4 times.  We've called the police on her various times for her violent behavior (threatening a younger sibling), running away, playing the suicide card, etc.  She made it to class 5 times last quarter.  (Five days out of six weeks.)  She was in JAC once.  She was in the mental hospital twice.  She was able to manipulate mental health doctors into giving her anti depressants.  We made counseling appointments for her, she acted up the days she was suppose to see her, those appointments were cancelled as my daughter ended up in the mental hospital (playing the game).  The list goes on and on.

It is easy to say to a parent, 'why didn't you parent her better'.  We are talking about teenagers here, they think they are invincible and don't have to live by the rules.  With counselors (doctors) and police departments on different pages, it's a wonder our children can manipulate the system.  They learn it from their friends.  In some peer groups this behavior is expected.  On the other hand, when a parent steps in and takes that child away from those groups---those so called friends never call to see what's up.

These children make choices on their own, some know the consequences of these choices, some gravely don't.  We had to stop her from making choices that would ultimately take her to the grave.

Sometimes it's not the parents fault children turn out the way they do.  Sometimes it is.  What could I have done differently?  Take her out of public school and place her into a small ratio (military based) christian school.  Where respect for yourself and everyone around you is re-enforced with what is taught at home.  That's what I would do differently if I had the chance to do it over again.

It's too bad that abuse runs wild everywhere.  Just recently, we had a teacher accused of having an affair with one or more of his students in a public school.  Kids are still shooting each other on school grounds.  Bullies are still taking potshots at their victims.  It's around no matter where you go.   [ This Message was edited by: Cruella on 2005-03-17 07:49 ]

[ExSgtRocha]

I have one thing more to say to Cruela and then I'm done.  If you think Thayer is going to turn your child around, make her have respect for herself and others and teach her to follow the rules.  YOU ARE SADLY MISTAKEN.  The only thing Thayer is going to teach her is how to be better at what she already knows.  I will not waste my energy on you anymore.  You will be the one to suffer the repercussions of your actions when your daughter returns home. Good luck, you will need it now more than ever.

[Antigen]

I just feel very sad for this kid. "Playing" the suicide "card?" It's really frightening that you think this way. And, from what I've heard so far about Thayer and the Bundy's other enterprises, she's not going to get any help there either. Just more grief.

As to what you could have done differently, who the hell knows? It's not about that. I know people who had great families and hit the skids anyway and others who's homelife was hell but who grew up just fine. As regards your daughter, here's a new idea for you; IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU!

You could do something differently now. How about taking her out of the care of these people who just recently let a kid die in their care. Read up on some of the facts coming out of that incident. They told everybody this kid was FAKING just like you think your daughter was FAKING a suicide attempt. And when they call you (if they even bother) and tell you she's at it again, obviously you'll take their word cause that's what you want to believe.

I hope the kid makes it through this ordeal. I hope the boyfriend waits around, too, cause she sure as hell doesn't have a mother to come home to.

Religions are all alike; founded upon fables and mythologies.
--Thomas Jefferson, U.S. President, author, scientist, architect, educator, and diplomat

[Anonymous]

Now just hang on one moment here!  "Cruella" writes "She was able to manipulate mental health doctors into giving her anti depressants."  Huh?  In case you didn't know, anti-depressants do *not* have any recreational/abuse potential.  They don't get you high.  They're not the objects of drug-seeking behavior.  So what reason on earth would a kid have to "manipulate" doctors into giving them to her?

It seems to me that if the doctors at the hospital administered anti-depressants to her, they must have diagnosed her with depression.  Unless "Cruella" subsequently took her daughter to a good pediatric psychiatrist who, through proper testing protocols, managed to rule out depression, there's no reason to think the initial diagnosis was wrong.

It sounds to me like "Cruella" simply doesn't *want* to believe that her daughter could have any problems other than simple refusal to kowtow.  She's apparently concluded that her daughter was simply faking symptoms of depression, yet nothing she's posted indicates that she's even remotely qualified to make that determination.  The diagnosis of depression is part of the practice of medicine, and anybody who tries to make/refute that diagnosis in another person (including their own child) without being themselves a qualified medical professional is practicing medicine without a license.

This "I know better than the experts" attitude is really at the core of the problem with all the "lock-up schools."  Most of the reported deaths have been kids who had real medical problems (both pre-existing conditions and injuries incurred during incarceration) which were ignored because people with *no medical qualifications whatsoever* took it upon themselves to judge the symptoms as malingering.  That is simply *not* something that an unqualified layman can judge for him/herself.

What got me following this whole area was my interest in pseudoscience and medical quackery.  Lock-up schools are, along with "attachment therapy" (does the name Candace Newmaker ring any bells?  If not, stick it into Google), the really dark side of the whole "alternative medicine" movement and the mentality it represents.  The underlying characteristic here is the "privileging" of gut feel and "common sense" (which in many cases is more properly called _prejudice_) over detailed knowledge and the scientific method.

[Antigen]

Oh, and BTW, props to some of our trolls. It's getting harder and harder to tell you apart from the real dingbats.

               The body of
        Benjamin Franklin, printer,
      (Like the cover of an old book,
            Its contents worn out,
    And scripts of it's lettering and gilding)
       Lies Here, food for worms!
     Yet the work itself shall not be lost,
For it will, as he believed, appear once more
                 In a new
         And more beautiful edition,
          Corrected and amended
                By it's Author!

Epitaph for himself.

--Benjamin Franklin 1706-1790

[TLCNOMORE]

Will everybody leave this poor Cruella woman alone. She needs to make a decision about the life of her daughter and you guys are just being vicious. maybe a little friendly advice might help. You push people away when you're so mean. She doesn't know everything that the rest of us know unless we tell her and give her resources to investigate. Remember that Thayer can be very convincing and manipulative and distraut parents are their specialty and an easy target as well. You people are being to judgmental in my opinion. Give this woman a chance to obsorb all the information she's being given. It's a tough decision to make when you don't know what you'll do with your child once you get them home. And don't blame her for her childs decisions. She may have been a great mother and her kid just went the wrong way. It happens. I agree that Thayer is no place to leave a teen to get help,especially the help this girl seems to need but this woman was brave enough to come on here and tell her story. Maybe she needs advice and support not criticism and ridicule. Well you all can get mad at me if you want for speaking my mind but this is how I feel. I'm not ashamed to sign this one either. Pia

[Antigen]

I'm not mad at you, Pia. You came around here (and I'm guessing, this wasn't your only stop) looking for more depth. Cruella, otoh, seems to me to be looking just for some rassurance. If she can find the right Program recipe to refute all her lyin' eyes tell her, then that makes her a better Program parent. Trust the Process, remember?

Maybe I'm wrong. But if she keeps on in her thinking that suicide attempts are just head games all about influencing her, she's either going to wind up w/ a dead kid or a kid to whom she's dead.

Either way, I'm far more concerned for the daughter than for the mother.

I believe in God, only I spell it Nature.
--Frank Lloyd Wright, American architect

[tlcrescue]

Pia, I can understand....and Cruella, I can understand how you feel as well.  I have 6 children, and out of all of them, only the one i sent to thayer seemed to feel the same way, that rules didnt apply to him.  But honey, there are alternatives to places like Thayer.  I really feel for you and would be willing to talk to you more in person or in private if you wish.  My son was only there one week, but the hell he went through the one week there was enough to make him understand that rules DO apply to him.  He has been out 6 weeks now and the transformation in him is amazing....i am sure that part of the reason is that he feels we might send him to another school.  I really would like to talk to you if interested.  Pia has my personal numbers, or you can private mail me here, or click on my profile nad private mail me at my email address.

[Cruella]

For those you have responded with VALUABLE information, THANK YOU.  I will keep in touch with you via e-mail.  

For others, you've received a SUMMARY of the hell that we've been through, I do not have the time to tell you every LITTLE detail of our lives.  I came here for more information, and credible references from those who've had bad experiences with Thayer.

Thanks again Pia and tlcrescue for your valued information.

Cru

[Deborah]

"I went on http://www.baptiststandard.com and I'ts sad what happened at San Marcos Academy but look at what they did about it. The perpetrator was fired immediately, all families were contacted, charges were pressed and the program is clearly sorry that this happened and isn't trying to hide anything at least that I can see. This is how The Bundys should be acting lf they truley had nothing to hide."

That is questionable. Before you put them on a pedestal for having 'done the right thing', read this thread:
 http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... &forum=9&6
Excerpts

26 Jan 2002
http://amarillo.com/stories/010602/tex_ ... ther.shtml
Student, mother allege sexual abuse at boarding school

HOUSTON (AP) - Two years after a dormitory director was charged with sexual abuse, a former student and his mother are suing a San Marcos boarding school for negligence, alleging that school officials knew of the abuse and did nothing to stop it.

The Houston Chronicle reported in Saturday's editions that the lawsuit alleges school officials knew of Dixon's predatory behavior and "implicitly condoned it through inaction."

"Dixon often and repeatedly for years demonstrated sexually inappropriate behavior with children that was witnessed by employees, including supervisory employees at the academy," the lawsuit alleges.

Before the abuse, the lawsuit says, the boy had ranked high academically and was a cadet corps member. But he had to withdraw from the school and suffered an emotional collapse after officials discovered a pornographic video Dixon made in which the boy was an unwitting subject, the lawsuit stated.
****

In that thread you'll also read about another inappropriate sexual incident since then, resulting in decreased enrollment, and their dire attempt to change their image.
Point being, this appears to be a valid concern when kids are incarcerated. Parents should have the safe talk with their kid AND refuse to have contact limited or severed, if they are going to board them anywhere.

[ExSgtRocha]

Cruella,

I was wanting to hear an update from you.
Have you went and got your child out?

Please !!

[Anonymous]

i dunno what to say but my name is chance rutherford yeah i went to TLC. and guess what. im going back. thats right im raising money to storm up there myself. well not really storm more of drizzle. im probably gonna stay in cameron for a few days. i dont really have this planned out yet but im gonna do something. also the fact that its 3 23 in the morning but im gonna drag my lazy ass up there and fucking kill some damn mormons. well not kill, but somethings gonna happen. AIM = nonesuch2890 . if you fucking attended TLC you better im me bitch nipple. also [email protected] thats another little doozy of a way to contact me. yeah. nipples. and shit. :scared:

[Anonymous]

What happened to Cruella?

[tlcrescue]

she was going to visit her daughter this coming weekend, so she may be on the road traveling.  I have had a few conversations with Cruella and she did say that if anything seemed amiss during her visit this week she would pull her daughter out.  Let's pray for the best for her daughter!