Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Seed Discussion Forum

the higher power...or the making of a cult.

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Filobeddoe:

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GregFL wrote,
 In addition, it was encouraged to say, "the group is my god" or "art is my god" during rap. ALmost anyone here will confirm that.

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I was never encouraged to say or heard "the group is my god" or Art is my god".

If I would have heard those statements, even at my young age while in the program... it would have been a real tip-off that I was surrounded by some real wackos.

I am surprised that cleveland seems to share your opinion? Are there others who felt they were supposed to consider Art as their saviour or higher power?

It wasn't my experience and everytime I hear you mention it, it tends to take away from other points you make that are otherwise valid. I keep waiting to hear someone say Art was a wife beater or kicked his dog.  :grin:  

Just my opinion....

PS Sorry I mistook your comments on AA as praise for the organization. Evidently I was mistaken and we differ on it's merits.

GregFL:
no problem on any difference in opinion or perception Filobeddoe. This is after all a discussion forum and if we always agreed, there would be nothing to discuss.

I just think you plain don't remember the steps rap and the whole Higher power routine.  The rap leader would insinuate that anything at all (a la AA) could be your higher power then would call on kids and ask them what their higher power was. Almost to the man it would be the group or Art barker, and this was never challenged, people would agree, the rap leader would go into a tirade about how the group was also his higher power, etc etc. I Personally repeatedly professed the group as my higher power and proclaimed myself powerless without it in rap session after rap session.

The thing is, most people have forgot most of this stuff. I had also but as part of the project of maintaining this website I have spent considerable time researching the seed and the memories flooded back to me.  Step raps were an almost everday occurance in the morning, and the higher power schmeel was drilled into you over and over.

Finally, I find myself in disagreement with many people on the merits of 12 step treatment in general. I am comfortable with the conclusions I have drawn and take no offense with others that haven't come to a similar conclusion. The offense almost invariably comes from the other direction.

 I would respectively like you to consider that AA may not be all its cracked up to be and do a little research on the cultic aspects of AA. One day in December of last year  I got into a  debate with about 20 AA guys in a hotel of questionable repute  in Costa Rica while they were having a meeting in the lobby!The ironic part is that the hotel has a casino and bar right there and these guys hung out there the whole time I was there, in a bar casino setting but drinking coke and tonic water. This was the Los angeles AA group, a semi famous very cultic branch of AA. I observed for a moment, walked over to the tables they had pulled up, sat down with my beer and listened. Eventually they asked me a question and I told them what I really thought.


  What a hoot! Me vs 20 AA guys, me with beer in hand, the guys getting loud and angry, calling me an alcoholic and me calmy counterpointing every thing they said. Some got disqusted and left because the could not get me angry nor could they really back up anything they said. Others did everything in their power to convince me I was wrong and became frustrated that I would not buy their "victim of alcohol" routine but instead placed the blame squarely on their individual weaknesses and inability to control their compulsive behaviors.  Other People gathered around including hotel employees and listened. Many people nodded in agreement as I spoke and People for days came up to me and talked about it.


 :grin:

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