Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Facility Question and Answers
Into the Belly of the Beast, the Comparison
Che Gookin:
It's fascinating getting a generational perspective of Elan. We've done something similiar in the past but never quite as detailed as this thread.
viewtopic.php?f=52&t=22295&start=0
Nimda used to be my old account, got a little too liquored up and depressed one night and predictable pathetic hilarity followed, this isn't the place to go into that story though.
Matt C. Hoffman:
Interesting to read this link Che - I was not reading fornits when this topic was going on and alas did not see this topic until now.
Thank you for posting it.
WTF2 was in the program with me, she wrote the truth. no doubt about that.
Those were some insanely sick times in Poland Springs , she saw the evilness (that was Elan), and she knows the truth.
Che Gookin:
What prompted the change from the ultra-violent 70s to the less violent yet more creepy cedu-esque 80s?
Do you think this played a long term role in the eventual closure of Elan?
Matt C. Hoffman:
They certainly knew that what they were doing in 1974 was illeagal or Joe Ricci and the directors wouldn't have tried to control what state inspectors were allowed to see by hiding what was going on inside the walls. Ken Zaretzky said it best ,he was an assistant director -now dead - Kenneth said " we lied thru our teeth " in referece to the state of Illinois and other state inspections.
The directors certainly didn't hide the violence or insanity because they were embarrassed,I actually believe they seriously enjoyed what they were doing, by what they were having children and adults to do to each other . And as a resident you knew from " learning from iothers mistakes" -lol- that you were never allowed to speak to state inspectors about the horros that the directors were putting us thru.
good Question Che - I think it is possible that because elan was growing so fast during my time , maybe 110 residents in the existing two houses at the time I arrived . 50 to 55 in Elan 2 -located in Waterford ,Me. Asnd at Elan 3 in Poland Springs about 55 people when I got there in July of 74 that by January the population had more than doubled in less than 6 months. The violence was a way to control us and give us something to do. For the directors it was in my opinion it was a sick form of entertainment. People were splitting and they had to instill the fear into us as to what happened to those that split and subsequently got caught- though people were desperate and still knowing what could await them split quite often.
Some residents had prison hanging over their heads and I remember one person telling Gottlieb during one general meeting that he wopuld rather be in prison when he was asked if he wanted to go to prison, Gottlieb left the gm briefly and then came back and then told the fellow you should be careful for what you wish for and he cashed his prison ticket for him .The resident was probably better off for this. Though his general meeting got seriously sick with graphic descriptions of prison rape and as the homophobia of the directors was off the charts as they really seemed to get into what could happen to a young adult in prison.
The directors were obcessed with all things realted to homosexual behavour, in the most negative fashion - mockery -shaming -and this is what will -not could but will happen to you in prison. and then the old question does any one else want to go to prison instead of being here in Elan. Elan was insane, and the employees were homophobic freaks. making kids sing the vasilene song - insane. Thank god that hell holes past caught up with it.
I think too that on down the road they reaslized that eventually if they didn't change that it would be closed down therefore from knowing this - And under doctor Davivsons guidance and Ricci lack of involvement they more than likely fine tuned the program over to where they knew the what would still achieve the means or out comes thay were getting from being so violent.
I think they went from being extremly violent in the 70s and were finding their way back to the middle the median of the stick - I don't believe the pendulm ever sung so far to where it was ever a fun placve to be. they were learning about mob mentality -and human behavour -and certainly how far you could push certain types of personalities until they snapped or broke down.
The directors had no formal training -schooling in the ways and means of basic human behavour - they were common thugs -con men -ex junkies or serioult sick sociopaths- I think Elan in the beginning for these cretins that helped Joe Ricci get fraudulently wealthy were getting on the job training in the sickest psychiological way possible -as a result there are many from my time that eventually committed suicide.
I don't think Elan closed because it became less violent -no one in the public eye (except for the ones in the Maine state government that aided and abetted Ricci in his fraudulent sham of a Residential treatment center ) knew just what the hell was going on in there .
Elan made sure that you knew before you left that the abuse you received and witnessed was good for you , thru their public speaking program ,where residents went into the schools and community and gave speaking engagements. These were practiced in the house and you bet were highly cwnsored as to what you were allowed to talk about . Phrase that the public wouldn't understand therefore you should say this instead . The cult of Elan got you coming and going -
I think the past of Elan thru this wonderful thing we know as the internet was instrumental in the closing of Elan. Its skeletons that it aquired over the years finally caught up with it. II think that if what Elan did as far as brutaally abusing people and the superior job they did at getting the formerly abused residents to believe that they needed this insane abuse and were in fact better for this abuse -that elan would have been exposed many years earlier. And of course the residents that committed suicide certainly elan didn't caqre about them -they were just the expected collateral damage that Elan just wrote off as not my problem - and then play the blame the victim game -they weren't going to make it any way.
Elan back in my time- you could get in trouble -serious trouble if you spoke badly -"bad mouthed the program" - something you were taught from day one -and you could get dealt with rather harshly for this behavour. Elan left an indelible mark on our minds and a lot of us didn't wake up to what happened to us until 20 or so years after the fact, and then the truth that elan was the big lie and that the abuse we went thru was not good for us, in fact quite the opposite was/ is true.
We were treated like animals, call the house into the dining room and Tom Blanchard ( drugged to the point that he would stand motionless in one spot ) would just start to drool.
Elan I feel and think always reserved the right to come out sick on the residents of the later years and I am sure there are incidents of this as to the fact that Muppeter wrote that they did se the ring in 86 though maybe 3 times in their stay where many of us from my time saw it close to 100 plus times or even more than likely experienced it during our stay either for the house or going in the ring against the house.
Just like those ESPN missmatched early televised fights ,you always went in the ring against some one bigger than you when you went in against the house. and this could happen repeatedly in 4 or 5 rounds until the directors felt you understood your helpless situation.
Elan was a one size fits all program no regard to individuality and the employees had many brutal tools of compliance to make you fit into it's cult based program. And you can believe some of us tried to get with the program as fast as we could, though nothing you did in Elan was ever good enough.
"the more that you give the more they will take until you reach that fine line where you really can't fake - fire -fire on the mountain"
Muppeteer:
Well, good morning all, but especially to the folks posting in the nice little thread we got here.
Matt, you are not stepping on my posts at all. And I hope you don't perceive me to be stepping on yours, either :) I have much interest in this evolution at Elan (evil-loution? Lol)
We "spun" folks as well, especially in the high-stress expeditor branch of the dichotomy. I don't recall "P.O." per se, but it sounds similar to what I would call "S.P." or "support person" in my time. Essentially, you were assigned to watch another detainee, who was usually in the corner (and thus also "shot down") for some real or imagined offense, and make sure they didn't try to hurt themselves or anyone else. You were also encouraged, as an S.P. to try to talk to the person you were watching and try to get them to calm down/capitulate.
The dichotomy I posted, as I mentioned, was from memory, and I think the corrections you have made would apply to my time as well.
Re-entry, by the time I was there, was less a "staff" position than it was a position where you had more freedom to re-adjust to the outside world. One thing, however, was still the same, they were continuing to groom "staff" from the re-entry ranks. That is why I chose to work in the kitchen, heh. One of my peers from Elan 5 (I was in 8), actually got to do re-entry at home (in the mid-atlantic). Haha. She never came back for her "graduation."
We still haven't touched on parent groups and a host of other stuff we probably need to get to, and last night I was trying to go over the daily and weekly schedules in my head, they were pretty much the same as you have described earlier, but there are still a few missing blocks of time in my mind.
We also should talk about the house departments and their roles in the system, briefly, Cleaning Crew, Kitchen Crew, Broadcasting/Communications, and the Business Office. These departments existed in each individual house. Each department also had a ranking, akin to the ranking of suits in a deck of cards.
Che, I will offer some insight and speculation on why things began to change at Elan, as soon as I have a bit more time this weekend.
I also realize I have been answering but not asking a whole lot here. But I do have questions. Many, in fact, and I will get to some of those as we go, but for now, let me just toss one out there...
For you guys who went through the propheets in CEDU, or other programs, I'd like you to help me flesh out the "dreams" propheet. I have read the wiki on it and I see it kind of drops off there. I remember the can, the Jaws music, the guided imagery, and, very vaguely recall the slip of paper in the can. It seems to me the "Dreams" propheet was an exercise in guided imagery, followed by a "suggestion" which was represented by the piece of paper in the can. Does that ring true for you guys?
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