Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Troubled Teen Industry
Apologia - Serious debate only, please!
Antigen:
--- Quote ---On 2003-12-22 21:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
"May be a bit off what you said Ginger, but how do you explain this:
You have the same two parents to two or three kids. Two of them came through their teen years very differently than one of them...where did they "fail?" The one wasn't loved any less. Just some food for thought on laying blame on the parents.
"
--- End quote ---
Maybe just when they thought all kids are the same and should be treated so. Or maybe not at all. Maybe the one kid just marches to the beat of a different drummer. Or maybe he actually has some problems and could use some help. But brainwashing isn't helpful to the person receiving it. It only seems to benefit the control freak paying for it.
Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway.
Andrew Tannenbaum
--- End quote ---
GregFL:
How about laying blame on no one and realizing that life, especially your child's life in the teenage years, isn't totally in your control?
At some point, you have to trust that they will either make it or fail on their own. Taking drastic measures such as thought reform camp for your child often results in tragic ends and/or lifelong problems for your child and more often than not complicates the existing problems.
You may as well be rolling the dice in vegas with your child's life on the come line, and you are subjecting your loved on to intense trauma and possiblity spliting your family apart forever.
For what? Some perceived gain that cannot be measured...in a place that is overtly abusive and controlling?
Brave new world indeed....
"for $250 dollars Art Barker will turn your brooding, dope-smoking, average rotten teenage into a right-thinking American Kid. Send him a 15 year old Janis Joplin, The way a retired Army colonel did last October, and Barker, who operates out of Florida, will return a Karen Carpenter by Mid November."
These are New Times, 1974 in a national article about the seed.
Anonymous:
The thing about bullshitting a bullshitter is that its very easy if you are telling him what he wants to hear.
If he wants to hear that you did drugs and you tell him you shot 1000 grams of morphine, he'll believe you (even though you couldn't fit that dose of morphine into a syringe and it would kill even a stone junkie if you could).
If he wants to hear that you had sex and you tell him you fucked 100 men in 15 minutes, he'll buy it, even though it's physically impossible.
If you say I *didn't* do any drugs or have any sex, however, you could be telling the god's honest truth and have physical proof of virginity and a negative drug test and you would never be believed in a million years because there is no possibility at all that your parents could be wrong and you could have been put in the program by mistake.
GregFL:
right, and eventually you will admit to anything they want you to say just to get out of there.
In fact, a common thing that happens is that if you are in one of these programs, the more outlandish your story, the faster you progress out of the early stages. The longer you hold steadfast to the truth, the longer you are severly tortured.
Therefore, culturally, the program early one encourages you to become a liar and to embellish your past. Often, you repeat it so long you start believing it. Then you get 30 years later, people saying they would be deadinsaneorinjail without the program and really believing it to be true, and when you dig a little, you find that they were just smoking some pot at age 14 or something.
Of all the enemies to public liberty, war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other.
--James Madison
--- End quote ---
Anonymous:
Bullshitting, lying, looking good? What's so different about those that choose to do this INSIDE the program? They are all over the world,outside of the programs... your next door neighbor, your co-worker, maybe even a good friend. It's easier to be secretive by what you learned from your first "spanking" from your parents, who learned it from their parents. You may still do the same thing, but decide not to be caught. In the program, you're with your peers 24/7, you're with the staff 24/7 in the beginning. Those that merely "play the game" will eventually show their true colors and then is when their healing begins. If they don't, then that's their choice and the way they will continue to live their life. Neither good or bad, really, just sad.
Maybe, a kid says what they want to hear. Flipside of that is that they are learning to make better choices, even if they don't think so, even if they think they're pulling the wool over everyone's eyes.
What you don't accept is that programs don't work for everyone. You think just because a parent pays for it, it's a guarantee! You gotta want it, or it won't work. Did you ever have a job you hated and couldn't wait to get out of there at the end of the day? Did you ever learn anything from that experience? If you didn't, then you didn't want to.
Yes, programs are here to stay. There will always be kids crying abuse, crying brainwashing, and always parents that believe them. Co-dependence and control are two of the worst drugs I know of. It takes a true commitment and a lot of work to overcome that addiction.
I know that with all the publicity that Tim Weiner started (from the bogus information provided to him from those outside of WWASPS) that wwasps programs are among the safest programs around now. Who would want to fan the flames in their program now?
I full heartedly agree with the philosophy and the process of change that this program stands for. I love and respect children and feel that everyone deserves the best possible way to be happy. These kids and families learn what happiness is. It's a process and I trust that process.
You can look at it positively or negatively, agree or disagree with the process. No, the parents can't control their kids choices, but they can control what they do about it. In the process they learn a better way to relate to each other, a better way to BE a family.
:wink:
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