I personally escaped this Cult

[TC_Saved_Me]

but some groups have very manipulative ways of keeping people in the group without brute force.

I actually left one of the Teen Challenge induction centers (Philadelphia TC).  Got into an argument with the staff, and just walked out!  You have to sign a release form when you enter the program which states that if you leave the program, you have to go through a 90 day waiting period to get back into the program, so my mom forked up the airfare for me to go to San Diego induction (there's no induction fee in Southern California TC).  

The San Diego TC had me doing store-front fundraising one day - about 3 months into the program - and I used some of the money from the can to call my sister on a pay phone to have her bring me a cup of Starbucks (this is against the rules for a couple of reasons).  When the staff found out what I did, I was going to be put on restriction (not allowed to communicate with other students for two weeks and have to do extra chores and stuff).  I was so ticked off that I wanted to leave the San Diego induction center!

When I told the staff that I wanted to leave, they offerred to call my older sister to have her pick me up.  I'm sitting in the main lobby of TC, and my sister comes rolling into the center with her Senior Chief (Navy NCO)!!!  He takes me to the side, and threatens to beat my --- if I left the program because it would break my sister's heart!  That's about the only cohersion I got to stay in the program - was from my sister's Senior Chief!  

Also, it's my understanding Teen Challenge is not totally open about the fact that conversion to Christianity is an absolute requirement for graduation.  Is that still accurate?

That's not true.  I've never even heard of that before.

[none-ya]

You can check out anytime you like but you can never leave
Sorry about the synanon reference.....

[cmack]

I hope you stay involved here on fornits and learn more about the industry in general. I believe you when you say that TC helped you and that you found redemption through faith. I only hope you're not too quick to suggest a similar program for your neighbor's 14 year old when he's caught smoking pot or drinking a beer.

Admittedly, I have been.  But the more that I've been reading, the more skeptic I've become, and will certainly urge anyone thinking of joining a program like this to do some serious research before making a decision.

I glad to hear that you are rethinking referring teens to programs. As you said in one of your earlier posts; people need to hit rock bottom before they can be helped. For the most part, teens sent to these programs aren't addicts. They haven't used long enough and they haven't had the series of negative life altering events that led you to want and seek help. Many young people are forced into treatment by parents who are fearful or just pissed-off.

Look at these links and keep them for future reference:

http://www.peele.net/lib/panic.html

http://mensnewsdaily.com/2010/08/08/whe ... mokes-pot/

I know that one of the TC Induction Centers that I was in had an outreach program for teenagers.  We weren't involved in the program, as students, but I did see our staff members interacting with the program.  I don't think this program was quite like what's being described in here either.

Thanks for being mature about this.  I have honestly gotten some good things out of these discussions - though some of the comments I've had to disregard    

Teen Challenge, to my knowledge does not require staff members and counselors to get any kind of certification or professional training before getting this kind of responsibility.  I used to think this was what seperated them, and made them a stronger program (drug addicts can relate with former drug addicts and are more willing to open up to people who have been through what they are going through instead of some counselor who just got some social services degree).

But now I truely think that all of these staff members should be required to meet certain criteria before playing the role of a counselor in a Teen Challenge or any other drug rehab.  They should be properly trained and educated.  I still think that I would have opened up alot less to my counselors had they not dealt with similar struggles (most of them have criminal records like myself), so I think any regulations about that sort of thing should be overlooked - unless of course someone is a convicted sex offender or even someone convicted of a physical assualt charge of any kind (that could help to prevent the kind of abusive behavior that might take place at these sort of centers).

Many programs use untrained staff even if they also have trained clinicians on staff. The untrained staff are cheaper and turnover tends to be high. Due to their lack of adequate training, overwork, under staffing, difficult working conditions, and the vagaries of human nature the door to abusive behavior is opened. Not all staff members are abusive, but the conditions make it likely that some will be.

[none-ya]

cmack wrote
I glad to hear that you are rethinking referring teens to programs.

That's good, Now let's work on not referring teens to church.

[cmack]

cmack wrote
I glad to hear that you are rethinking referring teens to programs.

That's good, Now let's work on not referring teens to church.

 

[dr phil show]

<-->

[none-ya]

Hey doc that's a great idea why don't you save me a spot sunday morning?

[none-ya]

I know this quaint little chapel near Dresden.[attachment=0:2rb6jnf0]nazi bishop 2.jpg[/attachment:2rb6jnf0]

[Ursus]

As you said in one of your earlier posts; people need to hit rock bottom before they can be helped.

:eek: ...Do you really believe this?

[cmack]

As you said in one of your earlier posts; people need to hit rock bottom before they can be helped.

:eek: ...Do you really believe this?

NO, I was referencing something he had said in an earlier post. I didn't want to argue the issue with him.

This is what I said:

viewtopic.php?f=57&t=38310#p409415

Thanks for sharing your story, and congratulations on getting your life back on-track. You didn't say what your drug of choice was, but I'm assuming it was something more potent than marijuana. After three arrests in under a year it sounds like you were ready "desperate" to get clean and straighten your life out. I believe people change when they're ready to change. You found solace and redemption through faith. Others follow different paths to sobriety. But I don't think any program can be effective if the person isn't ready to change.

This is what he wrote in response:

viewtopic.php?f=57&t=38310#p409424

I agree with you about the "prerequisite" of change being that you have to hit "rock bottom" first. And I believe that "rock bottom" is very different for everybody. I personally would have never entered the program if I hadn't been court ordered. Like any rehab, Teen Challenge does not work for people who are not ready to change. I have personally seen alot of men enter the program who hadn't hit rock bottom, only to leave the program and start using again.

"Rock bottom" is AA language that I don't subscribe to, but I don't think arguing the issue with him would have been productive and it would have been a distraction to the main thrust of the dialogue.

But thanks for being vigilant and keeping me honest.

[cmack]

TC_Saved_Me, as I've said in earlier posts; I fully accept that TC was the vehicle through which you found Christ and were able to turn your life around. As you've learned here on fornits, many others have had bad experiences at various programs. I don't know anyone personally who has been through TC, but there are published accounts of people who aren't thrilled with their time there.

Without invalidating your own personal experience I urge you to continue your education regarding this industry and exercise restraint when referring others to TC or other programs.

Here are some links you might want to explore.

Thanks to reddit for this: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/5/4/ ... 954/504505

Behind the Walls: The Teen Challenge You Won't See
http://www.teenchallengeexposed.com/index.html

[TC_Saved_Me]

Without invalidating your own personal experience I urge you to continue your education regarding this industry and exercise restraint when referring others to TC or other programs.

I wouldn't refer anyone to the TC program for minors after the things that I've read.  I think that needs to be investigated, and those centers should be held to a higher standard.  These are kids we're talking about.

Certainly though, anyone could benefit from the center that I went through (San Diego Induction - Riverside Training Center, Southern California).  Since I have first hand experience of how beneficial that center is, I would not hesitate to refer someone there.  I referred some of the TC people I know to this website to read around, and get there opinion about what's being said in these Discussion Boards, and their all convinced that these negative opinions are from people who either got kicked out of the program or left early on their own accord.  There's alot of people who can't stand the rules, and are not ready to admit that they have not made wise choices with their lives.  So they'll either keep getting high, and get kicked out of the program - or they'll leave the program for "greener pastures" (jail, other rehabs, back on the streets) - and they'll be bitter towards the program.

I know at least ten people who have left the program, and gone on to graduate from Bible College (or secular college in my case soon), to be leaders in the Youth Groups of their churches, husbands, fathers, etc.

Here's what one of the TC graduates said about these Discussion Boards:  "People who aren't willing to surrender fully and need a scapegoat... Nobody takes credit for their part of failure anymore" -  His words, not mine.

[TC_Saved_Me]

Oh, and here's what my wife had to say,

"I've seen sites like that before. I don't care what anyone says, God used Teen Challenge to save my life." - her words, not mine.

I'm one of those Teen Challenge homers who married a chick that graduated the program!  :-)

She's a graduate of the Pennsylvania Teen Challenge (Philadelphia Induction Center - Rehrersburg Training Center, Pennsylvania).

[TC_Saved_Me]

http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQRcXtKeuMU&feature=relmfu
http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EH6lvqDv1DA&feature=youtu.be

[Samara]

I didn't attend TC, but the quote from your friend asserting that people who reject the program are essentially losers is irrational, illogical, and moronic. What he is essentially positing is that the ONLY valid perspective is a positive one. It proves the point that dissent or critical thinking is undervalued.

I did not go to a program for drug use or delinquency. Many of my peers also did not.  And yet, there we were. Whether someone split, left, or graduated is inconsequential to the fact that the program practiced systemic, trenchant, and pervasive verbal and psychological abuse. If a kid were a drug addict, bipolar, or simply rebellious would not convince me that their stay at the program was therapeutic. In fact, the opposite. I don't feel this way because of rules or work details. That sh*t is petty and frankly, inconsequential to the fact that the program practiced systemic, trenchant, and pervasive verbal and psychological abuse.  

It is very tiresome to continue to explain to Program People that dissenters are not rule whiners. Do you think we would be talking about this over decades later if we simply hated a few rules? No. In fact, I could give a rip  what happened to me a long ass time ago.  I don't want today's kids to be placed in programs that practice, yes, again, systemic, trenchant, and pervasive verbal and psychological abuse.

I don't know much about Teen Challenge pro or con. However, it is true --based on my experience, research, and professional and academic expertise-- that I lean toward skepticism. Nice brochures and "Jesus Saves" slogans are not effective arbiters of therapeutic ethics.