Author Topic: What is the economy anyway ??  (Read 21858 times)

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Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #45 on: November 05, 2011, 12:12:06 PM »
...or geo-thermal, where that is possible.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline Froderik

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Sugar Mamas
« Reply #46 on: November 05, 2011, 12:12:36 PM »
Quote from: "Loli"
They bring it.

That's what I'M talkin' about!!   :nods:  :rasta:  :seg:
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Offline Froderik

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #47 on: November 05, 2011, 12:14:04 PM »
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
...or geo-thermal, where that is possible.

I have heard only good things about the potential of geo-thermal.

Fuck the oil industry and its franken-food, plastic society.
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Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #48 on: November 05, 2011, 12:23:05 PM »
...easier said than done, my friend... :rofl: , but we are working on it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline Froderik

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #49 on: November 05, 2011, 12:24:39 PM »
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
...easier said than done, my friend... :rofl: , but we are working on it.

Vote VERMIN SUPREME in 2012!!!
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Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #50 on: November 05, 2011, 12:26:06 PM »
:roflmao:  O0
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #51 on: November 05, 2011, 03:04:54 PM »
It's a good thread though, except for none ya...  :beat:  ... :roflmao:

...LOL...o man.  ...

No, but even just having to respond to criticism is helping me to refine my vision and examine my own life and situation...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #52 on: November 05, 2011, 03:48:17 PM »
I also have this idea about making quadricycles, which would be a replacement vehicle for the modern car, with it's combustible engine.  I mean why can't we make a pedal car (like we had when we were kids, remember??) out of lightweight metal that has 2 front seats and a supply bed for groceries and supplies, etc., and a set of pedals in front of each person, on the floor, so that either person could pedal the car.  The pedals would have to have about 23 gears to get up to high speed or get up hills etc. but this would be a great adjustment, and do a lot to improve the world situation.  They would have to have very lightweight metal frames, resembling a bicycle, but being a car.  If it's cold out you might have to bundle up.  If it's raining you throw on the top.  People would be healthier and so would the whole planet.  It's only a partial solution though because it wouldn't be too good on steep hills and would have some weight limitations too, but might work very well in flat areas or for localized gettin around.  I don't know...hmm...

Now people will say, "O yeah, but people with jobs will have to build them".  Fair enough.  I'm not against people working together to build such things in a small localized community factory or something, as long as the job is not just about money, but serves a just purpose to the community and the world at once and doesn't require more than around 20 hours of job time per week or so.  I'd think that'd be about the most a homesteader could reasonably spare...if that.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #53 on: November 05, 2011, 04:01:46 PM »
Is that unrealistic ??
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline none-ya

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #54 on: November 05, 2011, 04:55:04 PM »
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
Is that unrealistic ??

No more unrealistic than expecting women to stop marrying for money. And I never said ALL WOMEN.
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?©?€~¥@

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #55 on: November 06, 2011, 09:02:30 AM »
"Freedom to Fascism", a documentary by Arron Russo      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUpZhhbKUBo

"Collapse"        http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo ... __part_1_/

"Food Inc"        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvMtDRzqB6g
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline Paul St. John

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #56 on: November 06, 2011, 04:00:22 PM »
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
Well...le's see...I don't know anyone who leads a just and moral life.  If you drive a car, and import your food and other goods, like tools and  clothes and furniture from halfway around the world you're not living justly.  

That's some statement alright.  Care to explain why?  I would say that If halfway around the world goods are being produced by people willing to part with them at a better price, giving your business to them is the JUST thing to do.  The person who would go this direction of trading with those across the world has a just mind, and yet at the same time, justice in the truest sense cannot be even applied to this situation, because who you choose to trade you with, and what things you choose to purchase, and do with your earned money is your business! That is justice.

In fact, if that is the case, then you are stealing the worlds health and robbing future generations of their chance to lead a good and healthy life.

I'm sorry man.. Seriously, but you have so much to learn.  It is hard to believe how little you understand about how things really work.  You really should learn more.  These ideas are so entirely incorrect.  You aren't stealing the world's wealth.. LMAO!  Quite the opposite, you are building their economies and helping them live a higher quality of life.  Go to India, and ask those how we outsource to how grateful they are for the opportunity.  They and their families, including extended are living longer, higher quality lives, then they ever could ve dreamed for in their youth.

 I have a good friend who once told me, "Justice is not using anybody for anything, ever, period ".

This could be taken more then one way, so I'm not gonna respond. I have some silly friends though, too.

   In other words, justice has no ego.  The moral and the just are mostly invisible people, few and far between.  I don't know a whole lot about the Amish, though I nearly finished a book about their history once.

I've studied them  a bit.  I have no quarrel with their ways, but I would not attempt to impose it on others.  Actually, one of the coolest things, I think, about their culture, is that they actually let the teens leave, and go into the outside world for a bit, once they reach a certain.  They are allowed to abandon every Amish rule, for a time period, and then they get the opportunity to choose which ways they will embrace.  It's kinda fucked up , taht if the youths choose the outside, their family disowns them, but at least they give them a choice.  

 It seems to me though, that they do a pretty good job of living sustainably on the Earth.  They don't use electricity and they don't drive cars(although they take rides) and they grow most of their own food.  I know that they have some participation in the economy but I think it's minimal and I suggest that an Amish way of life or something akin to it, is the answer, sans religion.

What we have now is corporate feudalism.

What we have now is whatever you want.  You want to be a corporate serf, you can be.  But to tell others that they have no choice is incorrect and to be honest, just a plain old downer.

 The schools main purposes are not true education, but social conditioning.  Students learn the skills that will enable them to become part of the corporate power structure, instead of how to truly support themselves.  They learn dependence not independence.



 Where are the schools that teach gardening and farming, leather work, metal smithing, hunting and fishing, and tailoring and carpentry, in addition to the 3 "R"s.

They are called trade schools, and if you need to find them, look around.  Usually though, these things are taught through an apprentice type environment. ( on the job) because there just isn t enough people who get excited about these fields and are interested in them to fill schools, and make them profitable.. - supply/demand

  The schools homogenize the population and make the people dependent on the economy and therefore submissive and

 easy to control.  

Dependent on the economy?  You talk about the economy as is it is some big monster.  Economies are amoral. No matter where go.  No matter what you do, there will be some form of economy.  

I didn't mean to give the impression that I was proud of my hypocrisy, In fact I'm ashamed, but my shame doesn't prevent my honesty or my search for answers.  

I think that most Americans, if they're honest with themselves, will realize that they frequently trade justice for convenience.

I would probably agree with your statement here, in regards to many people, but just they we arrive at the idea, for entirely different reasons, I would guess.

I think the idea that one has to be free of hypocrisy in order to point out an injustice is just silly and immature and frankly egotistical.

I am not sure why I am being accused of assuming all the liberties of immorality, hypocrisy and injustice.

Very simple.  You can say whatever you want, because MAYBE you are immoral, unfair, and unjust.  You are not bound to be honest, or even consistent, because even if you are, I should focus on your argument.

However, you didn t come out and say.  Look man.. let's get this shit out of the way.. I am an immoral person.  I am a hypocrite. I am unjust.  AKA  I am not good.  I am a bad person.  I am an unfair person.... But look, I m still right about this one thing..

Because then you know that people will not trust you.  


 You think I'm some kind of a nihilist or something ??  Far from it. My life is a work in progress and I do my best to live a conscientious life or as you put it, Samara, to live fair and just regardless of the matrix.

Personally, I think you re probably a pretty good guy, who hold himself to ridiculous ideals.

For what it s worth, if anything.  I could be wrong too, but more often then not, I m right about this shit.


Paul

[/b]
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Offline Paul St. John

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #57 on: November 06, 2011, 04:08:22 PM »
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
... I suggest that an Amish way of life or something akin to it, is the answer, sans religion.

... and with some source of renewable energy, like solar.


Where will these solar panels be created?  Who will make them?  Who will supply the numerous supplies necessary to make them?  Will they last forever or will they need repairs sometimes?  Who will run the wires from these panels to everybody's homes?  Who will produce the rubber around these wires?  Who will mine the copper for these wires?  How will all these things be transported?  Who will negotiate the prices?

Oh, and where did all the technology that made these solar panels come from to begin with?  Was it from a farmer, metalsmith, or fisherman?

Paul
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Offline starry-eyed pirate

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #58 on: November 07, 2011, 01:06:05 PM »
[
Quote from: "Paul St. John"
quote="starry-eyed pirate"]Well...le's see...I don't know anyone who leads a just and moral life.  If you drive a car, and import your food and other goods, like tools and  clothes and furniture from halfway around the world you're not living justly.
 

That's some statement alright.  Care to explain why?  I would say that If halfway around the world goods are being produced by people willing to part with them at a better price, giving your business to them is the JUST thing to do.  The person who would go this direction of trading with those across the world has a just mind, and yet at the same time, justice in the truest sense cannot be even applied to this situation, because who you choose to trade you with, and what things you choose to purchase, and do with your earned money is your business! That is justice. [/quote]

So let me get this straight, cause I can't believe you really mean what you wrote here.  What you are telling me is that Justice has no place in peoples private business and that where there is money, there should not be justice and yet somehow you are also telling me that Justice is concerned with getting the best price for goods or services, regardless of the acidification of our oceans, and the burning and clearing of the worlds rain forests, the degradation of air quality, or the toxification of the water table, the eradication of indigenous, sustainable cultures, and unique animal/plant species, etc.  Is that what you mean to convey ??  I hope not.[/quote]


Paul[/b][/quote]


Quote from: "Paul St. John"
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
In fact, if that is the case, then you are stealing the worlds health and robbing future generations of their chance to lead a good and healthy life.


I'm sorry man.. Seriously, but you have so much to learn. It is hard to believe how little you understand about how things really work. You really should learn more. These ideas are so entirely incorrect. You aren't stealing the world's wealth.. LMAO! Quite the opposite, you are building their economies and helping them live a higher quality of life. Go to India, and ask those how we outsource to how grateful they are for the opportunity. They and their families, including extended are living longer, higher quality lives, then they ever could ve dreamed for in their youth.

Yeah, I'm learning more all the time...the American economy expands by force.  It's an imperial force.  If you can't see that in Iraq you're just not looking.  The vast majority of foreign countries host U.S military bases.  The 5th phase, over glorified Haliburton employees are there to enforce the program on the newcomers.  And domestically our corporately whored out governments policy is one of national brainwash on the youth.  I was in $tr8 Inc for 2 years.  The western market economy nurtures the culture of the ego in order to sustain itself.  If you understand this, then you know how hard it is to be a saint in the city.  The money cult appeals to the ego, and as always the easiest and most sure-fire way to manipulate anyone is through their ego.  Just because the people in India are saying that they are happier then they were before the western economy stole it's way into their lives doesn't mean they aren't violating the rights of their neighbors, in order to achieve it...and when you say "building their economies"...the process you are really describing is the exploitation of the natural resources of some American slave colony, where ever they may be in the world.  You don't get something for nothing in this world.

Perhaps those folks in places like India and Indonesia, who are relieved to have established themselves in the western market economy are simply being pushed into it, and like some kid sitting on front row, the first week, are relieved to take the pressure off themselves when they sell out and begin to motivate and go along with the program, motivating and singing the required songs in order to be socially acceptable and attain some physical comfort.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline Froderik

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Re: What is the economy anyway ??
« Reply #59 on: November 07, 2011, 01:12:25 PM »
Quote from: "starry-eyed pirate"
Yeah, I'm learning more all the time...the American economy expands by force.  It's an imperial force.  If you can't see that in Iraq you're just not looking.  The vast majority of foreign countries host U.S military bases.  The 5th phase, over glorified Haliburton employees are there to enforce the program on the newcomers.  And domestically our corporately whored out governments policy is one of national brainwash on the youth.  I was in $tr8 Inc for 2 years.  The western market economy nurtures the culture of the ego in order to sustain itself.  If you understand this, then you know how hard it is to be a saint in the city.  The money cult appeals to the ego, and as always the easiest and most sure-fire way to manipulate anyone is through their ego.  Just because the people in India are saying that they are happier then they were before the western economy stole it's way into their lives doesn't mean they aren't violating the rights of their neighbors, in order to achieve it...and when you say "building their economies"...the process you are really describing is the exploitation of the natural resources of some American slave colony, where ever they may be in the world.  You don't get something for nothing in this world.

Perhaps those folks in places like India and Indonesia, who are relieved to have established themselves in the western market economy are simply being pushed into it, and like some kid sitting on front row, the first week, are relieved to take the pressure off themselves when they sell out and begin to motivate and go along with the program, motivating and singing the required songs in order to be socially acceptable and attain some physical comfort.

Well stated here, pirate...I like the use of that comparison. Big Oil Uber Alles!
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