What illegal drugs would you legalize?

[Ursus]

Incidentally, fwiw, Oxycontin is technically not an "illegal drug."

[psy]

I have known many a drunk on the street that would slit your throat for that next drink. I guess it all depends where you grew up.

Maybe we should start prohibiting alcohol and pre-emptively arresting alcohol users.  Goodness knows, if you say it's true, they must all be out to kill us.  Will somebody please think of the children!

I guess if this is how you choose to perceive what I wrote.

I was making a point about the prejudice of drug prohibition.  It's future crime.  You can't have X drug because X might cause you to do Y bad thing.  Pre Juduced. You are judged before you do.  The second problem there is that people consider alcoholism a disease (please discuss in other thread), and because a disease is an uncontrollable thing, it's really not their fault.  It's the drug's fault.  Sure it makes the addict feel good, but it's not objectively true (which is the only thing that really matters).  Because it's really "the drugs" that are causing crime, there is enough public health consideration to take the rights to use them away.  Or so the argument goes.  Me?  I believe in free choice and I believe that individuals should be judged on an individual basis, not by what is in their blood, but by what their actions are.

If people are harming others.  Lock them up for those harmful actions.  But if nobody is being harmed but consenting, responsible adults, leave them alone.  The alternative to this is punishing all individuals (including responsible ones) based on group membership (drug users), which is wrong.

[DannyB II]

I have known many a drunk on the street that would slit your throat for that next drink. I guess it all depends where you grew up.

Maybe we should start prohibiting alcohol and pre-emptively arresting alcohol users.  Goodness knows, if you say it's true, they must all be out to kill us.  Will somebody please think of the children!

I guess if this is how you choose to perceive what I wrote.

I was making a point about the prejudice of drug prohibition.  It's future crime.  You can't have X drug because X might cause you to do Y bad thing.  Pre Juduced. You are judged before you do.  The second problem there is that people consider alcoholism a disease (please discuss in other thread), and because a disease is an uncontrollable thing, it's really not their fault.  It's the drug's fault.  Sure it makes the addict feel good, but it's not objectively true (which is the only thing that really matters).  Because it's really "the drugs" that are causing crime, there is enough public health consideration to take the rights to use them away.  Or so the argument goes.  Me?  I believe in free choice and I believe that individuals should be judged on an individual basis, not by what is in their blood, but by what their actions are.

If people are harming others.  Lock them up for those harmful actions.  But if nobody is being harmed but consenting, responsible adults, leave them alone.  The alternative to this is punishing all individuals (including responsible ones) based on group membership (drug users), which is wrong.

Not much to argue there.
My point and it is very brief is, a full blown alcoholic suffering will come close to killing someone for his next drink or for trying to take his drink.
Trust me I know, my grandfather knocked me across the room when I was 5 years old for trying to remove a bottle from his sleeping hand. Just wanted to help "pa pa" put the bottle on the coffee table.
Addiction can be a nasty foe, very unpredictable.

[psy]

Just because grandaddy was an drunk who preferred alcohol to you doesn't mean it applies to everybody.  He made a choice.  He continued to make choices.  That's not a mental disease.  That's assholitis.  You might not just want to admit it because it's so close to home, or you see it through a dogmatic lens.  It's why personal anecdotes are so unreliable.  Most drunks are obnoxious and embarrassing to be around.  Not a whole lot smack kids.  Those who do probably would have smacked the kid for a couple hundred dollars while entirely sober.  This is why it's fair to only judge those who commit crimes under the influence.  To do otherwise is to judge the obnoxious yet relatively harmless other drunks their right to personal sovereignty...  or those who use alcohol responsibly.

[none-ya]

psy wrote;
:That's not a mental disease. That's assholitis."

Isn't that what alchoholism is in the first place? When your buzz if more impotant than anything or anyone else in your life.I'm sorry . I don't suffer drunks very well at all.I've seen people do the craziest shit in the world while drunk.Far worse than any illegal drugs.

[Maximilian]

Just because grandaddy was an drunk who preferred alcohol to you doesn't mean it applies to everybody.  He made a choice.  He continued to make choices.  That's not a mental disease.  That's assholitis.  You might not just want to admit it because it's so close to home, or you see it through a dogmatic lens.  It's why personal anecdotes are so unreliable.  Most drunks are obnoxious and embarrassing to be around.  Not a whole lot smack kids.  Those who do probably would have smacked the kid for a couple hundred dollars while entirely sober.  This is why it's fair to only judge those who commit crimes under the influence.  To do otherwise is to judge the obnoxious yet relatively harmless other drunks their right to personal sovereignty...  or those who use alcohol responsibly.

If only the world were that simple. Alcoholism and other forms of addiction reside in the realm of irrationality, where choices no longer matter.

[none-ya]

What's his name wrote
"Alcoholism and other forms of addiction reside in the realm of irrationality, where choices no longer matter."

That's a complete cop out'(in the words of your precious program)
There are allways choices.

[Anne Bonney]

Just because grandaddy was an drunk who preferred alcohol to you doesn't mean it applies to everybody.  He made a choice.  He continued to make choices.  That's not a mental disease.  That's assholitis.  You might not just want to admit it because it's so close to home, or you see it through a dogmatic lens.  It's why personal anecdotes are so unreliable.  Most drunks are obnoxious and embarrassing to be around.  Not a whole lot smack kids.  Those who do probably would have smacked the kid for a couple hundred dollars while entirely sober.  This is why it's fair to only judge those who commit crimes under the influence.  To do otherwise is to judge the obnoxious yet relatively harmless other drunks their right to personal sovereignty...  or those who use alcohol responsibly.

If only the world were that simple. Alcoholism and other forms of addiction reside in the realm of irrationality, where choices no longer matter.

"Where choices no longer matter"  Of course they matter.  How is it that a lot of people decide to just quit and, lo and behold, they do?  They get sick of arguing with family, sick of feeling sick, sick of losing jobs, sick of the guilt so one day they just up and quit.  It truly does happen every day.  It does have a clinical name - spontaneous remission.  If someone is addicted to something to the point where they have physical symptoms of withdrawal, then they need medical help to detox.  After that, it's their choice to stay clean or not.  If someone isn't physically addicted to a substance (and in some cases even if they are), then they have a choice each and every time they go to pick up a drink/drug.

[Maximilian]

Why am I not fat, yet many people struggle with it? Why do I not have a gambling problem, but many people do? Because I choose to be this way? Is it really that simple? It's easy to point fingers and accuse people of willingly destroying their own lives. The reality is a lot more complicated than that.

[none-ya]

Maxi pad wrote
"Why am I not fat"

For all we know , you are!

[Anne Bonney]

Why am I not fat, yet many people struggle with it? Why do I not have a gambling problem, but many people do? Because I choose to be this way? Is it really that simple? It's easy to point fingers and accuse people of willingly destroying their own lives. The reality is a lot more complicated than that.

Because those things don't interest you.  Drugs and alcohol do.  If your use of drugs or alcohol is effecting your life more negatively than positively, stop using them.

[Maximilian]

If your use of drugs or alcohol is effecting your life more negatively than positively, stop using them.

Well hell, all those rehab facilities should shutter their doors. Looks like Anne has found the solution to addiction. That's like telling a fat person to just stop eating, not very helpful really. Simplistic solutions to complicated problems will not work.

[none-ya]

Why am I not fat, yet many people struggle with it? Why do I not have a gambling problem, but many people do? Because I choose to be this way? Is it really that simple? It's easy to point fingers and accuse people of willingly destroying their own lives. The reality is a lot more complicated than that.

Because those things don't interest you.  Drugs and alcohol do.  If your use of drugs or alcohol is effecting your life more negatively than positively, stop using them.

I don't know, he still sounds like a fatty to me

[Maximilian]

Why am I not fat, yet many people struggle with it? Why do I not have a gambling problem, but many people do? Because I choose to be this way? Is it really that simple? It's easy to point fingers and accuse people of willingly destroying their own lives. The reality is a lot more complicated than that.

Because those things don't interest you.  Drugs and alcohol do.  If your use of drugs or alcohol is effecting your life more negatively than positively, stop using them.

I don't know, he still sounds like a fatty to me

You aren't hurting my feelings, just the other posters who might actually be fat. But hey, if third grade humor is your thing who am I to say anything.

[Anne Bonney]

That's like telling a fat person to just stop eating, not very helpful really.

Personal responsibility is a bitch, I know.