The Muslim Hijacking of Ground Zero

[Stonewall]

Stony, I firmly believe that you are the hardest working man in show business, particularly in light of the passing of James Brown.  This is a medium that I think is fertile ground for working comics like yourself, and I have to tip my hat to you.  And as always, I admire your willingness to stick with the bit.  This factually challenged propagandist that you play is a great character.  The absence of empirical evidence in your arguments is consistent, and as always points to the fundamentally absurd nature of bigotted hate propaganda.  The bit about the Crusades coming two hundred years after the advent of Islam is a nice touch.  The presentation of factual inaccuracies by propagandists is a common tactic, and you blow it right out of the water.

You forgot something... When you debate someone and find some inaccuracy you then go on to prove it. You don't just say something is wrong and then call names. You might be new to the whole debating thing. If so, I don't mean to criticize. Just guiding you in the right direction...

 

[ajax13]

Stony, you are more talented and your repertoire is more complex than you let on.  The post-post-modern aspect you introduced is intriguing.  You state that the Crusades came two hundred years after Islam, a very specific factual inaccuracy, in keeping with your character, and then you claim that no factual inaccuracy is presented.  It's brilliant.  The introduction of an alternate reality constucted of conditions contrary to those that we perceive in the material world is really daring.

[Stonewall]

Stony, you are more talented and your repertoire is more complex than you let on.  The post-post-modern aspect you introduced is intriguing.  You state that the Crusades came two hundred years after Islam, a very specific factual inaccuracy, in keeping with your character, and then you claim that no factual inaccuracy is presented.  It's brilliant.  The introduction of an alternate reality constucted of conditions contrary to those that we perceive in the material world is really daring.

When did the first crusade take place?

When did Muhammad create his Islam?

[Pile of Dead Kids]

What, do they not have Google where you live?

Islam got started in 610.

The first Crusade got started in 1095.

You really don't have a fucking clue, do you?

[Antigen]

The concept of Jihad cannot be blamed on forces outside of Mecca and Medina.

Not blaming Jihad on the Catholics. Just noting that any religion will do. All it takes is for said religious fanatics to take the notion that God is telling them to start the killing.

[Stonewall]

The concept of Jihad cannot be blamed on forces outside of Mecca and Medina.

Not blaming Jihad on the Catholics. Just noting that any religion will do. All it takes is for said religious fanatics to take the notion that God is telling them to start the killing.

No doubt about that.

And, Islam took that notion on almost immediately. That is how it took over Arabia, and then the whole of the Middle East. Then beyond that.

Certainly Muslims enjoy the right to create Mosques in the U.S.. Even the one at Ground Zero, but they should build it somewhere else. So, the controversy would disappear. A person may have the right to open a slaughter house for swine next to a Mosque. I would say it would create controversy where none is needed. It's about respect. Not simply about a "right" to do it.

[Antigen]

Not blaming Jihad on the Catholics. Just noting that any religion will do. All it takes is for said religious fanatics to take the notion that God is telling them to start the killing.

No doubt about that.

Ok, so then why blame the religion?

And, Islam took that notion on almost immediately. That is how it took over Arabia, and then the whole of the Middle East. Then beyond that.

And how did Christianity take over most of the rest of the world even quicker? Here's an interesting animated time-line:
http://www.mapsofwar.com/ind/history-of-religion.html

Certainly Muslims enjoy the right to create Mosques in the U.S.. Even the one at Ground Zero, but they should build it somewhere else. So, the controversy would disappear. A person may have the right to open a slaughter house for swine next to a Mosque. I would say it would create controversy where none is needed. It's about respect. Not simply about a "right" to do it.

Ok, so what happened to convert the Holy Roman Catholic Church from a blood-thirsty conquering military complex to a mostly benevolent spiritual and welfare organization? In my opinion, it was Catholics on the ground acting on what they view as their mission and beliefs. So if the activity at that mosqu turns out to be hostile, call them on it. If it turns out to be in the spirit of Cordoba as they say, praise them for it. But it would be a huge mistake to make enemies of one of the largest religions on the planet. I say "one of" because I don't really buy the notion that the majority of people living under any theocracy really believe the ruling religion. They just keep quiet about their beliefs till they have a chance to act or escape.

[none-ya]

Antigen wrote;
"Ok, so what happened to convert the Holy Roman Catholic Church from a blood-thirsty conquering military complex to a mostly benevolent spiritual and welfare organization?"

[/b]

When did that happen?

[BuzzKill]

Ok, so then why blame the religion?

Google: Honor Killing. Take a good look.

See also:
http://http://www.drmarkgabriel.com/books.html
Dr. Mark Gabriel was born and raised in Egypt in an Islamic family. By the age of12, Dr. Gabriel had the entire Quran memorized. He graduated from Al-Azhar University in Cairo and then became a professor of Islamic history at that university. He also served as the Imam (spiritual leader) of a mosque in Giza, where the pyramids are located.

In short, Dr. Gabriel was a highly prestigious figure in the Islamic world when one day he dared to question the authenticity of the Quran. That evening he was kidnapped by the Egyptian secret police and thrown in prison where he was tortured unmercifully for days due to questioning his religion. Miraculously, just as he was about to be executed, he was delivered from the prison by a relative with political connections.

During the next year while unemployed and living with his parents, Dr. Gabriel met a Christian pharmacist who gave him a Bible. That Bible led him to Jesus, and when he read the Sermon on the Mount, he decided to accept Jesus as his Lord and Savior. When his father discovered that mark had become a Christian, he tried to kill him. Running for his life, Dr. Gabriel fled to South Africa where assassins were sent to kill him. Finally he fled to the United States where he was granted religious asylum.

Your right that the RCC shed a lot of blood but when they did this it was in direct opposition to what the Gospel of Christ calls for. The same can not be said of Islam. When they slaughter women and children and infidels it is in obedience to their prophet.

I agree with the sentiment that they can build their mosque after they allow a church and synagogue to be built and freely attended in any Islamic country.

If this jeering lie they call Cordoba house is truly about interfaith tolerance and understanding then include a church and synagogue inside.

Why you should not believe their explanation of intent:
http://http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/JR/Future/ch16_understanding_dishonesty.htm
http://http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/the-doctrine-of-deceit/
http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-hA59eiySI

A Christian might lie for any number of reasons, but as with blood shed, when they do they are going against what they are instructed by their God. Not so of Islam.

This mosque is Not OK.

[none-ya]

Death to Salman Rushdie!

[ajax13]

A Christian might lie for any number of reasons, but as with blood shed, when they do they are going against what they are instructed by their God. Not so of Islam.

So Christians kill in the name of their God, and this has occurred on a massive and diverse scale from Crusaders to Conquistadors, from the murder of the Cathars or the massacre of the Hugenots to the rampant slicing and dicing of the Thirty Years War, right up to the Wehrmacht, who wore the slogan on their belt buckles, but they're violating the instructions they receive from their God.  Muslims however, kill in the name of their God when they correctly follow their instructions.  So clearly, all this shootin', stabbin' and burnin' has it's roots in something other than which magic person folks believe.

[T-Rex]

A Christian might lie for any number of reasons, but as with blood shed, when they do they are going against what they are instructed by their God. Not so of Islam.

So Christians kill in the name of their God, and this has occurred on a massive and diverse scale from Crusaders to Conquistadors, from the murder of the Cathars or the massacre of the Hugenots to the rampant slicing and dicing of the Thirty Years War, right up to the Wehrmacht, who wore the slogan on their belt buckles, but they're violating the instructions they receive from their God.  Muslims however, kill in the name of their God when they correctly follow their instructions.  So clearly, all this shootin', stabbin' and burnin' has it's roots in something other than which magic person folks believe.

Could not have said it better, they all have killed in the name of???
Still are!!!!

[BuzzKill]

A Christian might lie for any number of reasons, but as with blood shed, when they do they are going against what they are instructed by their God. Not so of Islam.

So Christians kill in the name of their God, and this has occurred on a massive and diverse scale from Crusaders to Conquistadors, from the murder of the Cathars or the massacre of the Hugenots to the rampant slicing and dicing of the Thirty Years War, right up to the Wehrmacht, who wore the slogan on their belt buckles, but they're violating the instructions they receive from their God.  Muslims however, kill in the name of their God when they correctly follow their instructions.  So clearly, all this shootin', stabbin' and burnin' has it's roots in something other than which magic person folks believe.

What God or gods a people believe in make a very big difference. What ever the history of Christendom; for what ever reasons some Christians went so horribly astray - they have the gospel of Christ to return to in times of awakening and revival which corrects their willful and  wayward destruction. The Muslim can only turn to more blood shed if they are to remain a "good" Muslim. I would argue this is why they remain so primitive and vicious.

That said, you're right enough that something else is at play. Not sure we'd agree as to what that something else is.

[Antigen]

Buzzkill, what happed to  Dr. Gabriel sounds just exactly like what happened to Galileo.

T-Rex, ok, the Catholic church has it's money into all sorts of ugly shit. Granted. But when's the last time you heard of a witch dunking or bloody inquisition?

I live in a very Catholic area. I once pissed off an old Catholic lady. I was talking on the phone  to a friend and mentioned Catholic mythology.  She was so angry she said something and gave me a hard look  for months afterward every time she had to wait on me at the checkout. But that's it. No jail, no interrogation, no heresy charges...

Something changed. How'd that happen and what should we look to and look to encourage wrt Islam?

[RobertBruce]

This should help.

http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2010/07/t ... video.html