How many deaths have occured at Aspen Ed programs so far?

[Troll Control]

Wow.  Thanks for posting that.  Can you enlighten us on why the kids aren't helped when they need it?  Does the admin direct staff not to help children in distress?  Please tell us the thinking behind this cruel behavior.  Thanks in advance...

[9403390]

well I admit I dont work with kids now or even as some kind of dr or social worker so dont want to come off as an expert in what kids need. Also it was a long time ago now. But it is like i said before if a kid said they were not well they would usually have you tell them to just drink more water. It was usually only if they went really red or white in the face or maybe threw up or something that they would be beleived. I dont remember being explicitly told not to believe kids, it was less overt stuff like being reminded that kids were keen to go home and likely to try manipulative things. We were told to use our judgement with this in mind. The guy who owned the place said he was troubled as a teenager and knew how they thought.
Also some staff did shit that was just bad like being too heavy handed with kids. Like a kid would maybe be obnoxious but not a physical threat but they would restrain them, or if a kid was say having a tantrum one guy I worked with wouldn't actually try and talk them down he'd more say stuff that would make them more keyed up and then get physical. I understood when we learnt restraint technique it was supposed to be for emergencies only not as regular discipline.
On hikes kids werent allowed to know when the next rest stop was or anything. This was totally demotivational and made some kids worse, If you ever coached a sport you'd know the best way to get kids to push themselves is to remind them how close the finish line is not keep them in the dark. Also some kids would have to talk about deeply private stuff that they just didn't want to. Im sure this might be some technique that works with private Drs but it just freaked the kids out to have their friends listening. The kids kept diaries that we were supposed to read for progress. I never kept a diary so dont know what they are all about but anyone who has a sister knows how batshit crazy girls get if you read their diary so I think they should have just given kids privacy here if they really thought the damn thing was such good therapy.
Also some kids were pushed way too hard like one little guy was scared of heights and frankly i think borderline retarded. So we had to go across this bridge and I promised him I would be behind him the whole way and if he did it he wouldn't have to do anything high again (except maybe cross it on the way back). So he did it and we all clapped him and then the next day there is a trust exerciese where you climb up and fall into the other people and I tell him he just has to be a team player and catch the other guys and he is happy enough with that but my co worker later makes him go through with the high climb exercise and he is sheet fucking white and trembling and he eventually literally pisses his pants and is totally humiliated in front of the others. I just dont get how that builds a kid up.

[Anne Bonney]

I dont remember being explicitly told not to believe kids, it was less overt stuff like being reminded that kids were keen to go home and likely to try manipulative things. We were told to use our judgement with this in mind.

That's so they can maintain plausible deniability.

Also some staff did shit that was just bad like being too heavy handed with kids. Like a kid would maybe be obnoxious but not a physical threat but they would restrain them, or if a kid was say having a tantrum one guy I worked with wouldn't actually try and talk them down he'd more say stuff that would make them more keyed up and then get physical. I understood when we learnt restraint technique it was supposed to be for emergencies only not as regular discipline.

Yeah, again so they can maintain that deniability.  It was standard operating procedure in Straight and, from what I've read and seen, in most other programs as well.

On hikes kids werent allowed to know when the next rest stop was or anything. This was totally demotivational and made some kids worse, If you ever coached a sport you'd know the best way to get kids to push themselves is to remind them how close the finish line is not keep them in the dark.

Because it's not about building kids up.....it's about tearing them down.

Also some kids would have to talk about deeply private stuff that they just didn't want to. Im sure this might be some technique that works with private Drs but it just freaked the kids out to have their friends listening. The kids kept diaries that we were supposed to read for progress. I never kept a diary so dont know what they are all about but anyone who has a sister knows how batshit crazy girls get if you read their diary so I think they should have just given kids privacy here if they really thought the damn thing was such good therapy.

But then that would deny them their ability to humiliate the kid.  Another aspect of 'breaking their will'.

Also some kids were pushed way too hard like one little guy was scared of heights and frankly i think borderline retarded. So we had to go across this bridge and I promised him I would be behind him the whole way and if he did it he wouldn't have to do anything high again (except maybe cross it on the way back). So he did it and we all clapped him and then the next day there is a trust exerciese where you climb up and fall into the other people and I tell him he just has to be a team player and catch the other guys and he is happy enough with that but my co worker later makes him go through with the high climb exercise and he is sheet fucking white and trembling and he eventually literally pisses his pants and is totally humiliated in front of the others. I just dont get how that builds a kid up.

It doesn't but then again, it's not designed to.  That's what they tell parents in the glossy, prettied up brochures but it's far from reality.  

When you forcibly change someone against their will, you first have to break that will.  That's never pretty and can do some serious and lasting damage.

[Inculcated]

I’ve just read through this and recent related threads; and I caught the overall theme of how the programs often ignore signs of distress ( all too often due to traumas inflicted and neglect incurred by those very programs) and how deadly the assumption of malingering can be.
 
The dismissal of physical symptoms as being a display of manipulation is pervasive throughout these programs and ultimately serves to undermine the individuals placed in their care.
In fact another example of such undermining can be seen in the mentality of program that insists on imposing a presumption of manipulation on the part of its charges into the parent or guardian’s minds. This serves to preemptively  discredit what the child has to report about the program.

Island View (The facility where Brendan Blum died before that location was purchased by Aspen Education Group…who are known for the deaths of Sergey Blashchishen and Matthew Meyer )offers the following on the topic of commitment under FAQs:

•   The parent is pressured by the child into coming home for a visit without the treatment team's approval and recommendation.
•   A parent is persuaded by Mr. Manipulation to come home for good as soon as he achieves the ‘Impact’ status without consultation with the treatment team.
You can readily see the pattern. A parent, feeling guilty for the ‘pain’ the child has to go through as part of the treatment process, feels compelled to “throw the child a bone.’

It’s an Aspen program that they announce as “high impact”.In case you’re wondering…Yes, it is Lon Woodbury approved…and he says that (after a year or so) “most teens transfer from Island View to another facility…”

And … They call it Island View …and it’s in Utah? Remote viewing?

[Whooter]

Even the deputy conducting the investigation indicated that there is difficulty differentiating between a behavior issue and real symptoms.  I believe when they get down to the root cause that this is what they will find.

When you are dealing with kids who are on a hike voluntarily and a child is complaining of feeling ill and wanting to stop then I believe it would be reacted to more quickly than if a child in a program exhibited the same symptoms and asked to stop.  This is because the staff needs to weigh the behavior issue and try to determine if the child is trying to manipulate the staff or is really sick.  This ends up playing against the child’s chances of getting help more quickly.

Hiking groups outside of programs do not have to weigh these options.



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[Ursus]

Island View  (The facility where Brendan Blum died before that location was purchased by Aspen Education Group…

Mmmm... You may be confusing particular deaths with their respective programs. Which is certainly easy to do, given their number!

Brendan Blum died of a bowel infarction on June 2007 at Youth Care Inc., now dba as Youth Care of Utah, and located in Draper, Utah. Then, and still, an Aspen Education Group program. As a result of his death, Youth Care was put on probation (not even fined), but was completely free to take on new clients. Which they've continued to do.

For more information on Brendan Blum, please check out THIS link.

Island View RTC (previously known as Island View Academy) in Syracuse, Utah, is another Aspen Ed program. They did have a suicide in 2004, which allegedly occurred before Aspen purchased the facility.

[Ursus]

Even the deputy conducting the investigation indicated that there is difficulty differentiating between a behavior issue and real symptoms.  I believe when they get down to the root cause that this is what they will find.

When you are dealing with kids who are on a hike voluntarily and a child is complaining of feeling ill and wanting to stop then I believe it would be reacted to more quickly than if a child in a program exhibited the same symptoms and asked to stop.  This is because the staff needs to weigh the behavior issue and try to determine if the child is trying to manipulate the staff or is really sick.  This ends up playing against the child’s chances of getting help more quickly.

Hiking groups outside of programs do not have to weigh these options.

Why is it even necessary to differentiate between a behavioral issues and real symptoms? Isn't it supposed to be "Safety First?" I guess not!

Why, indeed, is it that programs and some otherwise well-meaning parents seem to think that the appropriate course of "remedy" for undesirable behavior is necessarily psychologically punitive? Sure, actions have their consequences, but wilderness is hardly the place to work those out, don't ya think? Especially when those "consequences" have ended up as being death all too many times!
 
My guess is that a lot of those parents, as well as, and especially as, those parents who are misled into believing the program experience to be one of some ill-defined therapeutic value, are not entirely aware of what actually goes on in the field, where the rubber meets the road.

There is a mindset at work in programs that is incredibly derisive of kids, ever so well spelled out by that excellent quote provided by Inculcated... What kind of "professionals," with children's best interests   ostensibly at the fore, are so jaded and filled with cynicism that they refer to a kid as "Mr. Manipulation" on their website, their marketing facade presented to the world at large?

[Troll Control]

Well said, Ursus.  And clearly a window into the twisted thinking behind these programs.

[Inculcated]

Thank you Ursus.That clears up some confusion for me and helps me to
follow the title of the thread with the answer that thus far now I am aware of
three deaths that have occurred in Aspen education Group programs.
Sergey Blashchishen and Matthew Meyer  andBrendan Blum

[Whooter]

Thank you Ursus.That clears up some confusion for me and helps me to
follow the title of the thread with the answer that thus far now I am aware of
three deaths that have occurred in Aspen education Group programs.
Sergey Blashchishen and Matthew Meyer  andBrendan Blum

There have been a total of 6 since 2000.  See Oscars data below:

From our victim list pages:

1980's: 1 (SUWS - However before Aspen ownership)
2000-2004: 2 (Island View and Lonestar Expeditions)
2005-2009: 4 (SUWS, Aspen Achievement Academy, Youth care and Sagewalk)

They are not among the most deadly programs, but who is setting the numbers determing what kind of number it takes before the entire operation is judged as a failure.

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[Whooter]

Why is it even necessary to differentiate between a behavioral issues and real symptoms? Isn't it supposed to be "Safety First?" I guess not!

I agree it should be.  The problem may occur when several kids say they are tired or want to rest and the staff give in and the rest of the kids see how easy it is to manipulate the staff into stopping that they ask for a break every 5 minutes and essentially sabotage the entire hike.

Or maybe calling in a medic helicopter 4 times a day just as a joke may put the pressure on trying to better differentiate between behavior and real symptoms.  I am sure it is not an easy call in every case.



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[Inculcated]

There have been a total of 6 since 2000.  See Oscars data below:

From our victim list pages:

1980's: 1 (SUWS - However before Aspen ownership)
2000-2004: 2 (Island View and Lonestar Expeditions)
2005-2009: 4 (SUWS, Aspen Achievement Academy, Youth care and Sagewalk)

...

Who’, Thank you for quoting that for me. So, the number of children who have died in Aspen programs is six. Aspen Education Group could hardly be considered by anyone as one of the “safer programs” I suppose.

There is a mindset at work in programs that is incredibly derisive of kids....... What kind of "professionals," with children's best interests   ostensibly at the fore, are so jaded and filled with cynicism that they refer to a kid as "Mr. Manipulation" on their website, their marketing facade presented to the world at large?

That’s an excellent question.

Who,
Do you think the mentality of a program that insists on imposing a presumption of manipulation on the part of its charges into the parent or guardian’s minds that serves to pre-emptively discredit what the child has to report about the program also reinforces a negative perspective by which staffers come to view their charges?

So for instance, when a staffer dismisses the physical signs of distress or self reported symptoms of distress as being malingering, do you believe that Aspen programs have some fault for fostering/perpetuating  a dangerous invidious bias that impedes communication and safety?

[Whooter]

Who’, Thank you for quoting that for me. So, the number of children who have died in Aspen programs is six. Aspen Education Group could hardly be considered by anyone as one of the “safer programs” I suppose.

Safer to me means better than some of the others or better than average.  We would need to know if other programs average a little under one death per year.

That’s an excellent question.
Who,
Do you think the mentality of program that insists on imposing a presumption of manipulation on the part of its charges into the parent or guardian’s minds that serves to pre-emptively discredit what the child has to report about the program also reinforces a negative perspective by which staffers come to view their charges?

So for instance, when a staffer dismisses the physical signs of distress or self reported symptoms of distress as being malingering, do you believe that Aspen programs have some fault for fostering/perpetuating a dangerous invidious bias that impedes communication and safety?

Unfortunately it does tag an unsuspecting child entering the program and prejudge them.  I t does show that these places do have a problem with manipulation if they have gone as far as assuming most or all kids are manipulative.  But seasoned staff will not be swayed by what others say and will treat the kids according to their own experience.

I do know from experience that many kids are manipulative and that is how they get their way and get stuff.  They don’t have any leverage of their own or rights or job or money so they are dependent on us parents so they learn how to manipulate their environment to get what they want and need.

I would advise caution in assuming that all programs take the same approach or attitude that the one posting “Mr. Manipulation” does.



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[Ursus]

I would advise caution in assuming that all programs take the same approach or attitude that the one posting "Mr. Manipulation" does.

Yep. That would be one of Aspen's programs, that is, Island View RTC in Syracuse, Utah, previously known as Island View Academy, same location.

I take it this would be one of those programs you describe as "safer ... means better than some of the others or better than average," eh, Whooter?

Their name change may or may not have had anything to do with the suicide that occurred there in 2004.

[Whooter]

Yep. That would be one of Aspen's programs, that is, Island View RTC in Syracuse, Utah, previously known as Island View Academy, same location.

I take it this would be one of those programs you describe as "safer ... means better than some of the others or better than average," eh, Whooter?

Well it may be safer, but I was referring to Aspen as a whole not any one of the schools within the group.  I do see the word “Safer” as defined “More safe” or "more secure from harm".  If there were 100 programs  I feel the description safer would mean better than 50 or more of them, if that helps.

Their name change may or may not have had anything to do with the suicide that occurred there in 2004.

I agree, its hard to tell why they changed their name.  If the suicide caused them bad press or their activity dropped off because of it then it may have been due to the suicide.  But I don’t think so because they maintained the words “Island View”.   If Ford had changed the name of the Edsel to Edsel II I don’t think it would have been a good business decision.  They just eliminated the name all together.  Do you see what I mean?




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