Author Topic: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program  (Read 15441 times)

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Offline Whooter

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #30 on: September 23, 2009, 07:09:03 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"

Clinical -- Involving or based on direct observation of the patient


Wait - you mean "student", don't you?  You need to read what Aspen's lawyers said again.  No kid in an Aspen program can be called a "patient", now can they?   So your definition of clinical was taken from a source describing legitimate health care, not a school like Aspen.

Sorry, Whooter.  No way around AEG's confession that they provide no treatment or therapy.  We don't need you to speak for them anymore.  They've finally spoken and admitted that they and you have been lying for years.  You're dismissed.

Awww, a little upset that their outcome study didnt line up with your expectations?  Maybe you can write to Aspen and ask them to put a disclaimer that they dont provide treatment or therapy.  Would this make you feel better (I never guest post RB)?  Ha,Ha,Ha  

Let me know how that works out for ya.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline psy

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #31 on: September 23, 2009, 10:24:33 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Patient -- the recipient of any of various personal services.
I posted this in the other thread but felt it appropriate to repeat in light of the absurdity of the above:
Quote
LOL.  They are what they want to be when they want to be.  They want the marketing benefits of appearing legit with none of the accountability.  Same deal with benchmark choosing to call itself either a school or a program depending on which licensing agency they're talking to.

Program -> dept of education "we're not really a school.  we teach 'life skills' to troubled teens.  we're a program."
Program -> program licensing "we're not a program.  We're a school and are thus aren't required to be licensed.  We teach kids valuable life skills."

Patients are "recipients of any various personal services"?!?!?  WTF? What dictionary did you pull that out of?  My dictionary says "a person receiving or registered to receive medical treatment"

You can't just redefine words to mean what you want them to.  If you advertise X you deliver X or it's fraudulent misrepresentation / false advertising.  You can't just say "at our business, X is another word for Y".  It's bullshit.

Even in the rare instances where Aspen avoids advertising blatantly to provide medical services it is VERY clear to a parent or just about anybody that it is what they are offering (a program providing treatment for psychological(medical) conditions).  It's in their advertising.  Look at what they advertise to and the keywords in their advertising.  They advertise to help kids with medical conditions.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
Benchmark Young Adult School - bad place [archive.org link]
Sue Scheff Truth - Blog on Sue Scheff
"Our services are free; we do not make a profit. Parents of troubled teens ourselves, PURE strives to create a safe haven of truth and reality." - Sue Scheff - August 13th, 2007 (fukkin surreal)

Offline RMA Survivor

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #32 on: September 23, 2009, 10:34:48 PM »
Not just medical conditions, but pretty much all medical conditions.  When they talk to parents they are so certain they can cure whatever the problems of the child are, despite having never met the child or conducted any testing or evaluation of the child in person to know what the problems of the child actually are, that should be a crime.   And that is where criminal charges should be filed.  When Aspen or any other program tells parents over the phone or internet that they have the cure for actual medical conditions, such as something as common as depression, despite not actually providing treatment, that should be a crime on top of false advertising.  

But I agree with an earlier poster that this thread and the information about Aspen's legal position, should be top of the list for this site.  Everyone who logs in should see it at the top.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline RMA Survivor

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #33 on: September 23, 2009, 11:00:16 PM »
Some more flaws with that study.  Many teens who had left the program would have a vested interest in lying about their progress so as not to be sent back.   Additionally, they would also want to avoid telling their parents they had wasted their money and that they were the same or worse than before.  

Also, how did the study determine the stress and anxiety levels of those in the study?  Did they just ask them? "So, how stressed are you feeling right now on a scale of one to one hundred about being sent to the middle of nowhere, against your will to a strange place you know nothing about surrounded by people you have never met and are about to be forced to live in a cramped dormitory with?"  Umm...90?

One year later... "How stressed do you feel now, compared to when you first arrived now that you know where you are, who everyone here is, and have had a chance to settle in?"  Umm... zero?  "Let's go with fifty, since we want the graph to look like it drops evenly since nobody would believe we cured you so quickly and besides, as soon as we say you are cured, though we don't claim to be actually treating you, your parents will pull you and stop paying us, so how does fifty sound?"  Umm... yes, a fifty sounds much better.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #34 on: September 23, 2009, 11:07:43 PM »
MATTHEW E. PENCE, et al., Civ. No. 05-6199-HO
Plaintiffs, ORDER
v.
ASPEN EDUCATION GROUP., INC.,
Defendants.
Summary judgment is appropriate if there are no disputed
issues of material fact and the moving party is entitled to
judgment as a matter of law. Fed. R. Civ. P. 56(c).
Oregon's confidentiality statutes provide only that a
confidential relationship is not breached if a disclosure is
permitted by state or federal law. Or. Rev. Stat. § 192.523;
Or. Rev. Stat. § 192.520. Because she is not a licensed
counselor and there is no evidence she is an employee of a
licensed counselor, Harless is not subject to confidentiality
laws applicable to licensed counselors and their employees. Or.
Rev. Stat. § 675.765.

Based on the foregoing, plaintiffs' motion for partial
summary judgment [#38] is denied; defendants' motion for summary
judgment [#48] is granted with respect to the first and second
claims of the complaint, and otherwise denied.
IT IS SO ORDERED.
DATED this 16th day of November, 2006.
s/

s/ Michael R. Hogan
United States District Judge
 Aspen Education Group does not provide a therapeutic milieu that is conformative to standards set by any medical body for their "patients," medically recognized therapy, or medically accredited personnel, Aspen's own lawyers successfully argued in Pence v. Aspen Education Group.
http://www.websupp.org/data/DOR/6:05-cv ... 80-DOR.pdf

Aspen education group turned the details of one of the confessions it mandates from its "patients" over to the police.

The "patient" had confessed he had peeped into the girls dorm, after climbing onto a roof.

The "patient's" parents sued over Aspens failure to provide a clinically valid therapeutic milieu, for failing to conform to clinical, medical standards, for violating the confidentiality of the patient/ therapist relationship, and for subjecting their "patient" to "therapy" from a group of people who were not licensed therapists or medical personnel.


Aspen Education Group's defense was that, yes, they failed to provide therapy that conforms to standards of medicine, but that was OK because they ONLY agreed to provide...
Aspen Education Group wrote: "group and individual counseling as dictated by
PROGRAM design......NorthStar did not promise to do the things that plaintiffs
complain they failed to do, such as provide counseling by a
LICENSED counselor,2"


Aspen education Group argued that confessions the "patient" was expected to make was NOT part of a therapeutic treatment program, and that NorthStar was NOT a drug and alcohol or mental health therapy program.

Aspen Education Group argued largely SUCCESSFULLY that because their "patient's" therapist was unlicensed and semi-successfully that because their employees were not actual medical personnel, HiPPA statues did not apply to them.
Pence v Aspen Education Group wrote: "Because she is not a licensed counselor and there is no evidence she is an employee of a licensed counselor, Harless is not subject to confidentiality laws applicable to licensed counselors and their employees."

Pence v Aspen Education Group wrote:"There is insufficient evidence to conclude that there are no disputed issues of fact as to whether information conveyed by Harless to police was protected health information within the meaning of HIPAA, and whether NorthStar is a covered entity within the meaning of HIPAA."
This judgment is dated 2006. Does anybody know how the rest of the case turned out?
Anybody, other than a guest posting troll-bag called whooter.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Troll Control

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health pro
« Reply #35 on: September 24, 2009, 07:15:06 PM »
Pretty much says it all right there...
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #36 on: September 24, 2009, 07:23:15 PM »
Quote from: "Perjury Penalty or Misrepresentational marketing?"

Pence v Aspen Education Group wrote:"There is insufficient evidence to conclude that there are no disputed issues of fact as to whether information conveyed by Harless to police was protected health information within the meaning of HIPAA, and whether NorthStar is a covered entity within the meaning of HIPAA."
This judgment is dated 2006. Does anybody know how the rest of the case turned out?

Anybody, other than a guest posting troll-bag called whooter.

Conclusion
Based on the foregoing, plaintiffs' motion for partial
summary judgment [#38] is denied;

IT IS SO ORDERED.
DATED this 16th day of November, 2006.
s/ Michael R. Hogan
United States District Judge
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Whooter

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #37 on: September 24, 2009, 08:04:04 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Unbelievable.  I am generally a 'pro-program' person here and I had actually been telling people I thought that Aspen programs were 'some of the best'.  Boy, I am sorry to see that they came out with this information about not providing treatment.  I never would have believed it until their own lawyers said it in court.  I doubt they would perjure themselves and ruin Aspen's reputation.  That wouldn't make sense for their own attorneys to do.  Man, this blows me away that Aspen has been lying to all of us for so many years.  It's really quite sad.

I mean, hell, I would still send my kids there because they are 99% successful and you cant beat that.  Its just amazing that it is accomplished with little or no medical personnel.  Ya gotta give'em credit.  They do good.
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Offline RMA Survivor

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #38 on: September 24, 2009, 08:18:26 PM »
They do very good at claiming 99% success and getting you to believe such hype.  But being gullible is not a crime even if you are guilty of it.
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #39 on: September 24, 2009, 08:20:57 PM »
Quote from: "RMA Survivor"
They do very good at claiming 99% success and getting you to believe such hype.  But being gullible is not a crime even if you are guilty of it.

As long as the check clears and the kid turns out okay.... everything else is gravy!!!
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Offline Troll Control

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #40 on: September 24, 2009, 08:30:35 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Unbelievable.  I am generally a 'pro-program' person here and I had actually been telling people I thought that Aspen programs were 'some of the best'.  Boy, I am sorry to see that they came out with this information about not providing treatment.  I never would have believed it until their own lawyers said it in court.  I doubt they would perjure themselves and ruin Aspen's reputation.  That wouldn't make sense for their own attorneys to do.  Man, this blows me away that Aspen has been lying to all of us for so many years.  It's really quite sad.

This parent seems much more reasonable than TheWho, the guy who keeps saying Aspen is wonderful even though they just admitted they provide no treatment during the trial phase of a lawsuit, under oath.  She seems upset to find out she was cheated and her trust and advocacy were misplaced; that she was fleeced and her child denied the services needed to make them healthy.  This seems like it would be a normal reaction.
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #41 on: September 24, 2009, 08:42:56 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Unbelievable.  I am generally a 'pro-program' person here and I had actually been telling people I thought that Aspen programs were 'some of the best'.  Boy, I am sorry to see that they came out with this information about not providing treatment.  I never would have believed it until their own lawyers said it in court.  I doubt they would perjure themselves and ruin Aspen's reputation.  That wouldn't make sense for their own attorneys to do.  Man, this blows me away that Aspen has been lying to all of us for so many years.  It's really quite sad.

This parent seems much more reasonable than TheWho, the guy who keeps saying Aspen is wonderful even though they just admitted they provide no treatment during the trial phase of a lawsuit, under oath.  She seems upset to find out she was cheated and her trust and advocacy were misplaced; that she was fleeced and her child denied the services needed to make them healthy.  This seems like it would be a normal reaction.

Well money is a big motivator.  She wanted her money back, so sure she was pissed.  Plus she found out her son is a pervert and its all over the web.  How would you feel?

The rest of us can enjoy the benefits of Aspens 99% success rate while the other 1% get all the attention and sound bites.
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Offline Anonymous

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2009, 07:40:37 AM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "RMA Survivor"
They do very good at claiming 99% success and getting you to believe such hype.  But being gullible is not a crime even if you are guilty of it.

As long as the check clears and the kid turns out okay.... everything else is gravy!!!

The kid is now in prison based on what his "treatment team" reported to the police. Maybe he's out by now.
What would be interesting to get is Aspen's expert testifying that it did not supply a mental health or drug abuse treatment program, that AEG is not covered by HIPPA because it does not provide any sort of treatment, and that it never promised to.

Ursus, are you interested in filing an FIA demand?
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Offline Whooter

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #43 on: September 25, 2009, 09:13:02 AM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "RMA Survivor"
They do very good at claiming 99% success and getting you to believe such hype.  But being gullible is not a crime even if you are guilty of it.

As long as the check clears and the kid turns out okay.... everything else is gravy!!!

The kid is now in prison based on what his "treatment team" reported to the police. Maybe he's out by now.
What would be interesting to get is Aspen's expert testifying that it did not supply a mental health or drug abuse treatment program, that AEG is not covered by HIPPA because it does not provide any sort of treatment, and that it never promised to.

Ursus, are you interested in filing an FIA demand?

At the trial all parties agreed that Aspen Education group provided a licensed therapist for Matthew Pence during his stay at NorthStar.

The parties seem to agree that ...... one member of Matthew Pence's "treatment team" was a licenced therapist.

What was Matthews lawyer thinking going to trial?  They got killed on this one.

If Matthew had just followed the rules and didnt run around breaking into offices at night he would have had the opportunity to get the help he needed.  Instead he ended up in jail.

I guess when they say "dead insane or in Jail" they have a reason behind it.  I just feel bad for everyone involved.
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Offline Anonymous

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Re: Aspen Education Group lawyers..AEG not mental health program
« Reply #44 on: September 25, 2009, 09:51:10 AM »
Quote from: "John Reuben"
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "RMA Survivor"
They do very good at claiming 99% success and getting you to believe such hype.  But being gullible is not a crime even if you are guilty of it.

As long as the check clears and the kid turns out okay.... everything else is gravy!!!

The kid is now in prison based on what his "treatment team" reported to the police. Maybe he's out by now.
What would be interesting to get is Aspen's expert testifying that it did not supply a mental health or drug abuse treatment program, that AEG is not covered by HIPPA because it does not provide any sort of treatment, and that it never promised to.

Ursus, are you interested in filing an FIA demand?

At the trial all parties agreed that Aspen Education group provided a licensed therapist for Matthew Pence during his stay at NorthStar.

The parties seem to agree that ...... one member of Matthew Pence's "treatment team" was a licenced therapist.


No. All parties agree there was a licensed therapist at Northstar but that the "therapist" Pence saw, "Trudy Godat," was unlicensed.

Quote from: "Pence v aspen education Group-- who killed Mathew Reuben"
Plaintiffs complain that Matthew Pence was seen by an unlicensed therapist, Trudy Godat, when Matthew's depression significantly worsened, his personal psychiatrist was not contacted, an appointment with a different psychiatrist was scheduled at a future date, Matthew did not receive supervision and a safe environment, Matthew was instead allowed to roam the premises and gain access to the roof, offices and computers, Matthew's confessions were turned over to police, and Matthew was expelled, arrested and indicted.


Aspen's successful defense was that since it was not a treatment program for mental or drug abuse disorders, and never promised to conform to any medical standard for a treatment center, it was not liable.

Aspen was also successful in arguing that Hardess was not under the supervision of a licensed therapist, was not medical personnel, though "director" of Pences "treatment," and was thusly free to turn Pence’s confessions over to the police.

You’re purposely obtuse. Perhaps if you respected the seriousness of this issue, you wouldn't have killed your son.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »