I tried heroin for the first time last night and I liked it!

[Anonymous]

I've been doing drugs since my early teen years, but have always stayed away from H for some reason. I guess the whole anti drug brainwashing campaign, eggs in the pan type of shit goes through my head. I thought you came addicted the first time and automatically turned into a junkie. Well I met some responsible H users and hooked up with them, and felt safe enough to give it a try. Boy I was missing out! It's some really good shit, we had a ton of fun. do you like drugs as much as I do?

[psy]

I've been doing drugs since my early teen years, but have always stayed away from H for some reason. I guess the whole anti drug brainwashing campaign, eggs in the pan type of shit goes through my head. I thought you came addicted the first time and automatically turned into a junkie. Well I met some responsible H users and hooked up with them, and felt safe enough to give it a try. Boy I was missing out! It's some really good shit, we had a ton of fun. do you like drugs as much as I do?

If I were you I would avoid it.  Then again, I'm not you and I've never done H.  It's your body.  Do with it what you will.  Just be safe and educate yourself.  Heroin today is not as safe as it was when it was legal. Impurities such as quinine in it nowadays are what really kills people (in addition to mixing it with various other substances).  You can read about some of that here:

http://www.peele.net/lib/heroinoverdose.html

If ever you feel like you're getting addicted and want to quit, my advice is to avoid NA (loads of reasons if you're interested in why I would say this).  There are plenty of other alternatives that are far more effective.  There are also drugs that are effective in dealing with withdraws and cravings, both legally available as well as the illegal (yet highly effective) ibogaine:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibogaine

[Anonymous]

Pure heroin, given in a medical setting with careful monitoring of dose, vitals, and administration is a very safe drug.


the problem is this: Heroin is adulterated with a 10001 different substances, many of which are toxic, along with varying in potency. You might be used to a certain type of heroin, then one day that wont be available so you switch brands, or the dealer himself might change brands/sources and stamp it as the same brand. You use that heroin, same amount as before, and it may be 10x as potent as before, causing an overdose. once you snort of push the shit in, there's no going back unless you find your way to a hospital. There is no way to accurately tell potency until you do it, and heroin can sometimes be so potent that an eyeballed fraction of the weight of heroin of what a junkie may be used to can be enough to cause an OD. Also, physiological and psychological tolerance are affected separately with opiates. meaning, the amount of heroin it takes to get you high can exceed the amount needed to depress your vitals enough to kill you, especially when you are on other drugs (which is the case 99% of the time, as heroin is often adulterated therefore leading to metabolic differences). Also, needles=bad idea. You dont want to inject anything but a pure drug into your veins. ever seen someone who shot Tar heroin for a few weeks? their blood vessels turn black. a few months? they need weekly/daily kidney dialysis just to stay alive.  

I would also like to note something: most of those "responsible" users of heroin are either going to stop altogether, or become total junkies. the "responsible" phase only lasts a few weeks or months. eventually, you start doing it more and more. once you start doing it more than once a month, it's a habit. more than once a week, it's an addiction. more than that, and you're a straight up junkie.

If I were you, i'd just stick to pharmaceutical opiates - theres plenty strong ones, even stronger than heroin - Diladud (hydromorphone, it's actually preferred over heroin by experienced junkies), oxycodone, fentanyl, etc. it's standardized and unadulterated, and the risks are therefore cut in half.

but then again, it doesnt seem like you care much about your life, or risk, nor do you even have a head on your shoulders. COKE? really? fav drug? i bet you werent around in a big city during the late 80's early 90's....you have no clue how ugly the shit is. i would say coke is about 10x as dangerous and addictive than heroin, and destroys 10x as many lives. Every time you blow a line, you run the risk of having a heart attack or stroke. it's not about dose or frequency, it's about how your body is structured. A single weakness or defect in your cardiovascular system can one day kill you when you blow a single speck of coke. you may be doing coke every day for a week, blow one tiny bump, and it may be the end. you can not do it for years, blow a bump, and it can be the end. it's like playing russian roulette. so considering you like coke, it doesnt seem like you will care much about what anyone says here.

have fun being a junkie. keep doing heroin, doesn't matter how often, it will happen.

[psy]

Pure heroin, given in a medical setting with careful monitoring of dose, vitals, and administration is a very safe drug.


the problem is this: Heroin is adulterated with a 10001 different substances, many of which are toxic, along with varying in potency. You might be used to a certain type of heroin, then one day that wont be available so you switch brands, or the dealer himself might change brands/sources and stamp it as the same brand. You use that heroin, same amount as before, and it may be 10x as potent as before, causing an overdose. once you snort of push the shit in, there's no going back unless you find your way to a hospital. There is no way to accurately tell potency until you do it, and heroin can sometimes be so potent that an eyeballed fraction of the weight of heroin of what a junkie may be used to can be enough to cause an OD.

That's actually a myth.  It isn't the potency.  It's the impurities that kills.  Check out the above link to peele.net in my previous post.  Of course it's worth noting that in the "wild" there is really no way to tell whether what you're getting has in it.  It's risky to say the least.

Brecher noted that heroin overdoses began to be reported in New York City after World War II, and accelerated into the 1970s. Yet the average purity of a street dosage prior to the War was 40 times the concentration of a 1960s dose.

Research at the Jefferson Medical Center in Philadelphia in the 1920s showed that addicts could tolerate up to a ninefold increase in the concentration of their standard, already large, dose. These researchers estimated that a toxic dose of heroin would be at least 500 milligrams for nonusers and 1800 milligrams for addicts.

In the 1960s, New York City Medical Examiners Drs. Milton Helpern and Michael Baden studied heroin addict deaths. Heroin found near dead addicts was not unusually pure and their body tissues did not show especially high concentrations of the drug. Although the addicts typically shot up in groups, only one addict at a time died. Furthermore, the dead addicts were experienced rather than novice users and therefore should have built up tolerance to large doses of heroin.

Wikipedia has similar information.  It's not accurate to call something an overdose if it's actually a poisoning, mixture of drugs, or allergic reaction.

As to your assertion of Heroin's physically addictive properties.  Of course it's physically addictive.  The progression you speak of, however, I'm not so sure exists unless you tell somebody that and they take it to heart as a self-fulfilling prophecy (which seems to be the norm with public education about the drug).  I'd say if you're going to use heroin, be very very careful and read up on it from reputable sources.  Preferably don't do it since it's better to be safe than sorry but...  It's your body.

[Anonymous]

As i noted before, it's not just the concentration of heroin that causes overdoses, it's the combination of drugs or other substances in the heroin which cause the overdose. I think me and you, psy, may have a slight misunderstanding.

There are two types of interactions that cause heroin fatalities, and i will use layman's terms for this: metabolic - or liver, and effect-doubling on the brain itself.

The liver has certain enzymes, and pathways, for specific groups of substances. When a certain enzyme is preoccupied with breaking down a substance, it looses it's ability to break down others....you're body's reserves are preoccupied with something else. So for example, one common interaction is grapefruit and a few benzodiazepines: valium, ativan, xanax.. benzos and grapefruit are both processed by (i think) CYP-3A4. when consume both at the same time, your liver cant process either as efficiently and the effects of either substance is multiplied - eat a grapefruit with a xanax and you will get just as messed up as eating 2-3 times the dose without the grapefruit. same applies for Zantac and lexapro. take both, and you will have toxic levels and fluctuations of both.

another type of interaction is the doubling of effects, not through metabolic interactions but through simply doubling the effect on the brain itself. this is obvious - combine a depressant with another depressant, you will get doubly depressed. combine any of the following: opiates, alcohol, barbiturates, dissasociatives, deliriants, qualudes, or benzos, and the effect of each would exponentially enhance the other. One beer and a benzo is just as much as six times the dose of either individually - psychologically. BUT, the effect of either on the heart and lungs is uncertain. people have died from a beer and a benzo before, because even though they werent too "fucked up", their heart and breathing rate sank at some point to a dangerous level for a period of time. Same applies to opiates. you mix a beer or two with a shot of heroin or some oxy, and you're liable to make your heart slow down to dangerous levels.

Combine the fact that people who use heroin also use a variety of other substances, and the fact that heroin itself contains unknown substances which can have unknown effects on the metabolism, and you are injecting it directly into the bloodstream, and you have a dangerous combination. If you take a long acting benzo like librium for example - and shoot heroin a day later, you can die - of a heroin overdose. You might not think you're even mixing the two, but you are, because different substances also have different ranges of effects, half-lives, and metabolic pathways.  It is true, most people who die of "overdoses" were in fact using the same amount they normally do. but the combination of that plus another substance caused their liver to stop working as efficiently, their tolerance went down temporarily, the concentration of whatever substance went up in their bloodstream, and they die. They die of an overdose, caused by an interaction. the interaction itself does not kill - it's the changes in liver chemistry that in turn effect concentration in blood which in turn causes a deadly effect.

Just to be clear, i'm not against drugs, but i'm not for them. i went through a period myself when i did quite a bit of drugs. i never touched heroin, crack, and meth, but i did almost everything else including some exotic stuff like the 2C's and DMT. i'm actually pretty stoned right now...nothing wrong with weed i think...which explains the crappy writing. I just think that people must be more informed and stop being so ignorant as to take one side or another. We have a shining example here, the person who started the thread, of someone who takes side. It's a fact, we get lied to alot by the government and other institutions about drugs. dare is bullshit. so people try weed, do a little research, and find out they were lied to about weed. they start smoking weed. then they get curious about other stuff, they figure "they lied to me about weed, they probably lied about everything else". so they do coke, or pills, and see it's not that bad (at first) and begin to take a nonchalant attitude towards it. eventually that nonchalance leads to drugs like meth, crack, heroin, and related drugs. {note: another thing causing the nonchalance is parents giving pills to kids, which then leads to kids taking whatever pills they feel like, but thats another dimension for another conversation]. You cant take sides like that. you need to do you own research, and find out for yourself what you're getting into from unbiased sources. you need to have limits, boundaries. for me, the limit of safe drug use is at moderate use of marijuana, alcohol (not liquor) and an occasional psychedelic tryptamine. other people might set that limit higher, but that should be an INFORMED risk. what bothers me the most is the person in question used the example of the individuals he met as an informative experience towards the safety of heroin. it's not. nor is the example of a junkie at rock bottom. the information should come from an objective source, not from subjective experience.

[Anonymous]

btw...psy....are you or are you not mandy mitchell?

if you are, please let me know how i can get in touch with you to set up an appointment... i would like to 69 you, they fuck you in the ass, then have you suck my cock, then have you fuck me in the ass. i will reward you with unlimited amounts of cocaine while we are at it.

[Antigen]

Please.... please,






















 :feedtrolls:

[Anonymous]

i'm sure ya did but how many people do i know who are dead because of that, answer is, lots, lots of people dead