Buzzkill and WWASP

[Rainy]

buzz, how many seminars and parental support groups did you attend? can you answer?

Well, it depends. Do you count the BBS? That was basically a heavily monitored and censored forum for the WWASP program parents which could be said to function like a internet support group.  I used it daily until they kicked me off.  I was booked for the Discovery seminar, but didn't attend. When I got the rules, I figured out what it was, and I wanted no part of it.  

But if you are looking for a program parent's account of the experience you can look here:
http://www.nospank.net/bean.htm

I do think it important to point out that as disturbing and intense as the Parent version is, what they put the kids through is much more so. They admit this, and make a joke of it.

Hi, I didn't want to derail the other topic, as sick as it is, but I'd like to undestand WWASP from the parent's perspective, as best i can.

So, it seems there are various support groups, an 'in person' one, an internet one, the BBS and the seminars?

What does BBS stand for?
I am trying to understand how Diane and Micheal Carter came to think it "normal" to verbally abuse their kid, to the point their willing to do it publicly in a way it will be publicly documented.

Is that sort of thing and outlook encouraged at the "BBS"?

Program literature?


How so?

thanks. Also, how did they make a joke about how much worse it was for the kids. Also, what was so bad about the rules? If you don't mind saying, as best you can.

BTW, i hope you are join that suit, if you are not part of it, already.

[Che Gookin]

BBS is short for Bulletin Board System, or a web forum like this one here. The exception being WWASP only allows parents on theirs and it is heavily moderated.

[BuzzKill]

Nah Gookin - BBS stands for Board of Bull Shit.
Or maybe Bogan Brainwashing Service.

But this is right:  WWASP only allows parents [or grads] on theirs and it is heavily moderated.

In short  - yes the BBS was used to encourage a negative, cold and callous attitude toward the kids. Like the parent support groups, It was used to re-enforce the conditioning that takes place in the seminars.  It was used to create a dependency upon the program for one's social net work and even one's own sense of self. It helps one to become a good program parent.  

All of these Syanon based programs encourage all kinds of public bashing. What you are seeing is what goes on in the programs with the addition of input from the "chattering pigs" - which is what the program taught the parents to think of anyone who criticized the program. BMW was another favorite  - Bitchin' Moaning Whiner.  

That said, I doubt these folks have thought about the ramifications of taking this to the world wide web. I expect they are so accustom to the constant validation received from the Legion of Faithful, that finding out there is this kind of dissent is probably a great shock to them. They are probably so full of Kool-Aid they can not conceive that anyone would question their actions.

Joking about the kids - it was just often commented that the parents got a "Lite" version - that the kids had it much harder. That if they did the parents the way they did the kids none of them would see it through. The kids of course, have no choice. It was all treated like  - I don't know - almost like vengeance - the way you might make light of some hardship your evil neighbor has endured.

This attitude - and they way I saw people change after taking part in the seminars from a concerned and caring (but desperate) parent to this callous and unfeeling (almost sociopathic) parent was really what got me questioning what the hell was up with this program.

And even those who never did become so cold and unfeeling toward their kid, did what the program told them even when it killed them to do it. For all practical purposes they had ceased to think for themselves.

How and Why is complicated. I am firmly in the camp that argues they are brain washed. They have been indoctrinated into a cult.  The Program operates exactly like a cult. I think it is a cult.  A good program parent will divorce a spouse who is non-supportive of the program; they will cut off their parents and siblings for questioning the program - they are strongly encouraged to do this by the program - and you just don't get more cult like than that.

Like all cults WWASP has a hook - something they offer that a stressed and depressed person needs -in this case help for their kid. Other Cults offer a path to enlightenment, or wealth, or health, or a better world - always something that people feel they need.

Anyway - if you'll make a study of coercive persuasion; particularly the type practiced by the North Korean's, you'll read all about the WWASP program - it is just the same - and that's how they do it.

Why is much easier - money. Tons and tons of cash.

[BuzzKill]

Also, what was so bad about the rules? If you don't mind saying, as best you can.

I forgot to explain: I had learned about LGAT in my HS psychology class; and had heard James Dobson, of Focus on the Family fame, discuss it as well. He was concerned about all the business suites being forced to attend these things by their companies. Keeping in mind I was already concerned about what was going on with them; when I got the rules, it all clicked, and I knew then exactly what I was dealing with.  

But let me stress, even so - getting out was no piece of cake. It really is hard to leave a cult.  Psychologically I mean. I don't want to imply I was threatened with any thing other than being assured pulling a half baked kid would guarantee he'd soon be dead of in jail.

[Miss Antsy Pam]

I forgot to explain: I had learned about LGAT in my HS psychology class; and had heard James Dobson, of Focus on the Family fame, discuss it as well. He was concerned about all the business suites being forced to attend these things by their companies. Keeping in mind I was already concerned about what was going on with them; when I got the rules, it all clicked, and I knew then exactly what I was dealing with.

I find it interesting that you had the same reaction to the rules for the seminars that I did.  I booked myself for Discovery, but once I read the rules, I KNEW something was terribly wrong with this organization/association.  I knew about LGAT from the "team building" trips that I attended in the corporate world, but they were never as restrictive as what I saw with WWASP.  I was also quite active on the BBS, but they started deleting my post or heavily editing them once I began to question things.

Once I made the decision that this program was not right for "us", I pulled him within a week.  That was 5-6 years ago now and he is NOT DEAD INSANE OR IN JAIL...at least not at the moment.  He has had his troubles, but has had to work them out.  To me, that is our obligations as parents...to let them work it out in their own way without overreacting to something YOU might find unsettling.  

Now that his teen years are behind him (he is now 21) he has "evened out" so to speak.  There are still flare ups from time to time, but that is to be expected.  I LET him come back home for awhile so he could save some money, but even doing that might not have been the greatest idea. Ahhh...we ALL live and learn.  I expect he will be back in his OWN place within the next 2 weeks.  It is time for both of us.  We are very close, but both need our independence from one another now.