Author Topic: blog of a program parent  (Read 28529 times)

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Offline try another castle

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #240 on: April 10, 2009, 05:39:08 PM »
Quote from: "mcarter.fornits"
Quote from: "psy"
Btw: name's Michael Crawford

..and just so you know, there is hardly any regulation at all over private programs for teens.  You might want to read a book on this such as "Help at any cost" by Maia Szalavitz.

Thanks Michael.  Yes, I've read the book.  Not what I would call an open or balanced account of anything.  In fact, I have yet to see
anyone write anything that tried to be balanced - they have all started with an agenda and tried to prove it.  The most interesting
part of the book is that of the very few programs she talked about, Cross Creek came out basically without a problem.  She didn't like
it, but couldn't condemn it (aside from the fact that they wouldn't meet with her).

Guest - I name you coward - and beyond that refuse to acknowledge anything you respond with (nor the insults you throw) until you come
forward, reveal yourself, and quit hiding behind the internet.

Buzzkill - oops, another anonymous name pushing a cause.  Come forward if you truly want to be heard.

People saying that it is prudent to remain hidden on the internet - WHILE ATTACKING OTHERS - are cowards.  Period.

If you choose to attack me - then reveal yourself, don't hide.  In the US Courts - everyone has a right to confront their accuser.  People
here are attacking me and hiding.  No charges have been brought against me, nor will any be, because I have not broken any laws, and
while many people do not agree with the decisions I have made ( every person's right - but then these are anonymous beings out there, not
people - I acknowledge no rights to anyone without a name!) they are my decisions.

As I stated before, I doubt I'll check this very often - because it does not seem that many people here wish to actually discuss anything.
They instead want to make hidden attacks against me - and I refuse to give them that power.

So group up, welcome to the real world, and once you quit hiding behind your keyboard then we can talk like people.

Regarding the anonymity thing for a second, although some of the bickering does come across as if it were Internet Tough Guy action, there is a real fear from survivors associated with revealing their identities that has nothing to do with cowardice. A lot of us, because of our experiences, are incredibly paranoid. When I first found these boards, I lurked for a long time and promised myself I would never post, then I finally started posting as a guest, but did not register. Why? I feared for the possibility, however remote, that there was a chance someone here might have known me back then, and might figure out who I was.

What your daughter is doing right now is remarkably brave. Especially since she came out of a program so recently.

As for now, I have no issue with people knowing who I am, or who I was then. The current picture in my avatar of the rather demented looking gent brandishing a bottle of manischevitz is indeed myself (happy passover, btw.) However, I do not post my name simply because prospective employers DO google names, and my laid-off animator self is currently looking for employment. Being sent to one of these places is a stigma. Period. I will never ever be proud of it.

However, if you would like to know more, I would be more than happy to discuss things with you via private message or email. I am not a WWASPS grad myself, but a CEDU one, (the grandaddy of them all) and my placement story is similar in some ways to your daughter's. (Living with father and stepmother before placement, and returned to living with them after... which was uncomfortable and tense, to say the least.)

While I understand survivors' anger towards other program parents, I do not share it. I think probably the strongest emotion I feel regarding that is frustration. For the most part, (there are exceptions) the parents are also victims, and their very real and very normal concern for their child has been taken advantage of by the industry. Whether  you agree with this or not, at this point, is not something I wish to debate. Just know that I have read a good portion of your blog, (I started at the beginning) and I experience what I normally do when I read such accounts: sorrow. Not just for Katie, but for the family. It seems now that things are on the mend, which makes me happy. However, the pathos expressed in your blog is difficult to simply read with indifference. There has been much hurt, which has been only exacerbated by the program. I am sure that you can agree that when Katie returned home, things had gotten worse? I hope that you are able to see that this is not simply an issue of a defect in her character, and certainly more than what was done to her in the program. The family cohesion has been compromised, as was mine.

It's been 20 years for me, and I feel that my relationship with my own folks is relatively functional. However, it is most certainly different than it was prior, regardless of how much tension there was because of the fact that I was an unruly teen who was up to stuff that my parents didn't fully comprehend. There has been damage, especially between my father and myself. I'm sure I love him, but I am unable to connect with that. We won't talk for months and neither of us will think anything of it. Not because of any argument, but rather because we have nothing to say to each other. It's like dead air. This situation, while on the surface, is tolerable, simply because I am so used to it, bothers the hell out of me as well, because I feel nothing. We are strangers. Comparing that to the connection I had with him before, when I was given a choice with which parent to live with, I chose him, since I had wanted to be his kid again ever since the divorce and all we had was visitation.

Ironically enough, one of the pet issues while I attended CEDU was my relationship with my father. The amount of energy directed towards that was disproportionate to everything else, sans the gay issue. (homophobia in the 80s rivals present day, i assure you). I came to lionize him and think of him as my hero, (something initiated by the program and willingly embraced by my brainwashed self.) One would think that when I resurfaced into the real world, our connection would be even tighter.

It was the opposite. It had been completely severed. I daresay I hated him, and at the time, it never even occurred to me that the program might have been responsible. I continued to believe in CEDU and what it "taught" me for a good two to three years after getting out. One thing I did know, however, was that I could no longer stand being around him or my stepmother for very long before reacting violently (verbally) for even the slightest transgression of etiquette on his part. He can still really push those buttons and hit those nerves to this day, and although arguments such as that are rare, when they happen, and after I inevitably hang up on him, I always ask myself "Where on god's green earth did that come from? What the hell is wrong with me? Why do I still let him get to me that way?" He *does* say unreasonable things, mind you. The rare times that I have brought up how much it bothers me that our relationship is pretty much nonexistent, he tells me it is all my fault, and that if he is guilty of anything, it is being an enabler. (verbatim) Now, regardless of the relationship, the odds that any dysfunction is entirely, 100% the fault of only one of the parties is virtually nonexistent, because it is a relationship between more than one person, so to hear this, from a man who is a lawyer... well, it hurts.

I moved out of my father's house after my freshman year of college and found a sublet with a six dollar an hour job. Aside from a christmas break visit the following year, I have never gone back to visit either parent, even overnight. They travel to see me about once a year, which is nice, but I wouldn't want any more than that. I just only recently visited (for about twenty minutes) their new house in san antonio, and while it was beautiful and I still appreciate seeing them both, I couldn't wait to get the hell out of there. I felt like I was going to break out into hives.

The good news is, my relationship with my mother, and her side of the family, is much more solid.

I do hope you read this. Especially because I feel that dialogue with program parents is probably one of the most important things to me on this forum. (Although I have tangled in the past, and I still talk trash quite frequently on here, but about matters of much less importance, and always in jest, and rarely with parents, unless I am unaware that they are.) Regardless of whether we ever agree, I feel that the communication is important, because a lot of times you will hear things that you may need to hear regarding what kinds of things happen in these places. Things that you may never hear from Katie. (I refuse to talk to my parents about specifics regarding my experience at CEDU. It is too much.) In addition, hearing parent's accounts, such as your blog, is equally significant to me. (Although I do laugh at parent testimony that are on referral sites, because the context is extremely distasteful, as opposed to something such as your blog.)


I do want to say (and I mentioned it in Katie's blog, but you stated you were not going to return there) that if you *are* doing WWASPS referrals, I implore you with every fiber of my being to please please stop. That is blood money.

Anyway, if  you want to get in touch with me, please feel free to PM me. I no longer have my email function, but I can give you my address via a PM.
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Offline TheWho

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #241 on: April 10, 2009, 05:44:50 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Color coding for patient risk factors has been going on for years indicating dietary restrictions, fall risks, allergies, suicide risk, DNR  etc..  Hospitals have been using color coding for years as visual communication tools.  Medications are now being color coded also because of the successes being seen on the patient level.

LOL

Are you implying hospitals force patients to wear colored scrubs establishing they are "self injuring" risks, or "bad"(undeserving of the right to urinate or bathe without being “watched” or speak to the outside world because they are too “manipulative”)?

You live in fantasy. And your ridiculous declarations won’t make them real.

Actually, I have to admit, Color coding is being used in most hospitals today.  Hospic uses it to indicate DNR patients, local hospitals and psychiatric hospitals are starting to use it also.  Cross creek may be ahead of the pack on this one.  I wouldnt jump to calling it abusive.
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Offline Anonymous

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #242 on: April 10, 2009, 05:59:04 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Quote from: "Guest"
Color coding for patient risk factors has been going on for years indicating dietary restrictions, fall risks, allergies, suicide risk, DNR  etc..  Hospitals have been using color coding for years as visual communication tools.  Medications are now being color coded also because of the successes being seen on the patient level.

LOL

Are you implying hospitals force patients to wear colored scrubs establishing they are "self injuring" risks, or "bad"(undeserving of the right to urinate or bathe without being “watched” or speak to the outside world because they are too “manipulative”)?

You live in fantasy. And your ridiculous declarations won’t make them real.

Actually, I have to admit, Color coding is being used in most hospitals today.  Hospic uses it to indicate DNR patients, local hospitals and psychiatric hospitals are starting to use it also.  Cross creek may be ahead of the pack on this one.  I wouldnt jump to calling it abusive.

This flight of the imagination is similar to your last one where you mentioned a fabulous  "new lawsuit option" where parents can sue their kids for not "working their program" as "they approach retirement."

Where is the link confirming that new lawsuit option I asked you for?



Please provide me a link which establishes ANY hospital is color-coding people according to how crazy or bad they are, who.

We're waiting… And YOU may not call that psychological abuse but medically, that is how such violations are classified. And no legitimate medical instruction would participate in such an atrocity
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Offline Anonymous

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #243 on: April 10, 2009, 05:59:57 PM »
Those who post on this forum believe anything and everything is abusive. They even think being forced to do gym class in public school is abusive. I think it's time to bring back the paddle in public schools, because it's got totally out of control with kids manipulating their family and school officials. Parents today are too weak willed to properly deal with a troubled teen, and that is why they seek help. I tried everything with my daughter, even the paddle, and nothing worked. I had no choice but to seek outside help. Because of this, I am made out to be some sort of bad guy on this forum. If parents had the freedom to do what programs do to kids, we wouldn't need outside help. It's time to loosen government regulation and laws regarding what a family member can do to another, and then programs wouldn't be needed as much, at least by people like me.
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Offline Anonymous

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #244 on: April 10, 2009, 06:07:18 PM »
What does your daughter think about her experience in treatment and your parenting style, NeilW? And what does she think about your obsessive ranting on fornits? I'd be willing to bet that you don't even have a daughter, or any kids for that matter.
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Offline FemanonFatal2.0

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #245 on: April 10, 2009, 06:10:00 PM »
Quote from: "NeilW"
Those who post on this forum believe anything and everything is abusive. They even think being forced to do gym class in public school is abusive. I think it's time to bring back the paddle in public schools, because it's got totally out of control with kids manipulating their family and school officials. Parents today are too weak willed to properly deal with a troubled teen, and that is why they seek help. I tried everything with my daughter, even the paddle, and nothing worked. I had no choice but to seek outside help. Because of this, I am made out to be some sort of bad guy on this forum. If parents had the freedom to do what programs do to kids, we wouldn't need outside help. It's time to loosen government regulation and laws regarding what a family member can do to another, and then programs wouldn't be needed as much, at least by people like me.

retarded troll is retarded
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[size=150]When Injustice Becomes Law
...Rebellion Becomes Duty...[/size]




[size=150]WHEN THE RAPTURE COMES
CAN I HAVE YOUR FLAT SCREEN?[/size]

Offline Anonymous

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #246 on: April 10, 2009, 06:10:51 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
Why is everything twisted around to be abusive here?  What’s the point?  Is there such little evidence of abuse within these places that you have to start fabricating definitions?

You've turned the problem on its head. What WWASP (and other abusive programs) do is take the tactics and methods and practices that are used by legitimate hospitals and care facilities in appropriate ways, that benefit the patients, and twist them into actions and methods that inflict humiliation and pain. The pain and humiliation is required to achieve the breakdown necessary to coercive persuasion. They use the fact professional and legitimate facilities  sometimes use a color code and restraint and isolation as a shield which they can use to hide what they are actually doing.

For example: Restraint in a WWASP program is a very different thing from restraint in a legitimate care facility. When a parent hears restraint may be used, they think they know what that means. They have no idea that what WWASP means is the kid will be thrown to the floor with enough force to break teeth and jaws in some cases; they will have their joints ground into the surface of the floor - as well as their chin; they will have their joints twisted into extreme positions which will frequently cause dislocations. They will scream in pain and beg for this to stop while those "restraining" them laugh at them. No one pictures anything remotely like that when told by the WWASP sales staff or family rep that their child may be restrained. Nor can they imagine this will occur if the kid so much as looks out a window or is overheard saying they wish they could go home. You'd assume a kid would have to be dangerously out of control to be restrained. In a WWASP program this assumption is way wrong.

And when you hear Isolation, you think of a room where a patient is left to gain control of their overwrought emotions in a safe quite place. You imagine it might last an hour or two. WWASP uses a number of terms for their version of isolation - but what it is in a WWASP program is a place where the teen must maintain a stress position, and silence, for up to 12 hours a day; for days and weeks and even months at a time.  They are fed very little; They are not allow rest room breaks and often are forced to urinate and even defecate on themselves; They are not allow to shift from their assigned positions. If they do they are restrained.

Peer review is another good example. Peer review is used by some legitimate group therapist and when used appropriately, with professional guidence, for positive reinforcement, or constructive criticism it can be helpful. But what WWASP does is turn the kids into vicious, verbal attack dogs who focus entirely upon the humiliation and degradation of whatever poor soul they are "reviewing".  This erodes then destroys any tendency towards kindness or decency in the attack dogs and any joy and hope and confidence from the victim. It is terribly harmful for all concerned.

All of this is designed to create the fear and anxiety required to program the kid. That's why this kind of abuse is so systemic in these teen warehouse type facilities.  They must inflict physical and mental abuse for the program to "work".

As for it "working" - It sometimes produces a kind of programmed stupor that can pass for improvement, but this seldom last. Most of the kids seem to come out and fall into behaviors far worse than what sent them there.  They are not helped, and instead come out with their problems exasperated by Post Traumatic Stress.  Its nothing less than tragic.
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Offline try another castle

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #247 on: April 10, 2009, 06:17:17 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"
What does your daughter think about her experience in treatment and your parenting style, NeilW? And what does she think about your obsessive ranting on fornits? I'd be willing to bet that you don't even have a daughter, or any kids for that matter.

That's not neil. Someone is spoofing him.

Time to get an account, neil!  :seg:
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Offline NeilW

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #248 on: April 10, 2009, 06:27:57 PM »
Good idea! It seems like some troll has nothing better to do than pretend to be me, I'm flattered to be so important!

I would suggest ignoring anybody else using my name that isn't signed in. The little rascals here want nothing more than to silence my point of view.
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Offline Antigen

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #249 on: April 10, 2009, 06:34:14 PM »
Quote from: "NeilW"
I think it's time to bring back the paddle in public schools, because it's got totally out of control with kids manipulating their family and school officials.

Yeah... right?? Cause the 12-16 year olds hold all the power in our society. They've got decades of life experience and learning, earning power, moral authority and credibility that us old farts just haven't got. They can pressure us to do damned near anything without question or challenge. Many people even dismiss obvious abuse resulting in death as just an unfortunate accident blameable entirely on the adult for being non-compliant.....

Oh wait! Sorry, sorry, sorry, I forgot, it's the other way around. Whew! Slipped into another world there for a minute! You should have seen the sky, though! The color was just.... indescribable!

Seriously, not that kids should hold all the power in any society, but don't try and kid yourself that they do. They don't have the savvy, experience or social leverage to apply anywhere near the pressure that an offhand choice on the part of any of possibly hundreds of adults in their lives as we can to them. Laying the blame on the obviously less powerful party.... well that would be as cowardly as, say, to sin by silence when one should protest.

Peace
Honestly
Ginger McNulty

P.S.
I agree very strongly with TAC's sentiments above. I wish I could connect on any meaningful level with my mother or any but one of my 5 brothers and sisters. That one brother is the only one who might piss on me if I were on fire, but he'd probably piss on me anyway. He and I split the program without graduating, the eldest never went through but joined a rather militant Stepcraft coven later in life (to treat her two glasses of wine a night addiction.... or maybe just to get back in good standing with the rest of the family).
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Offline TheWho

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #250 on: April 10, 2009, 06:39:15 PM »
Most hospitals in Wisconsin now have standardized color-coded alerts for patients.
Many hospitals use color-coded alerts as a way to quickly identify important information about a patient, including his identity, allergies, risk of falling, and do-not-resuscitate (DNR) orders.
Dana Richardson, with the Wisconsin Hospital Association, says the format varies, but the concept is the same.

http://http://209.85.173.132/search?q=cache:Dvt_eu6pEZUJ:www.wrn.com/gestalt/go.cfm%3Fobjectid%3DDA3A1F8B-5056-B82A-37CB12A212CB0A72+color+coding+patients&cd=15&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us


Sick and injured children come in all sizes, challenging their caregivers to provide them with appropriate doses of medication and other necessary therapies. Harborview Medical Center is offering a conference next week on a system that allows paramedics, physicians and nurses to assess a child's size in time to prepare the treatments he or she will need.

http://http://uwnews.org/article.asp?articleID=10010

NOW SHOW US YOUR LINKS THAT PROVE COLOR CODING TO BE ABUSIVE.  YOU ALREADY LIED TO US ABOUT THE KIDS HAVING TO STRIP NAKED AND PUT ON JUMPSUITS.  LETS SEE IF YOU CAN REDEEM YOURSELF.  JUST POST US ONE LINK.....
THOUGHT SO
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Offline Che Gookin

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #251 on: April 10, 2009, 07:04:41 PM »
I don't think anyone can argue that in a hospital setting color coding is detrimental to the health of the patients. I sure as hell won't as I'm the guy who used a felt tip marker to draw a big circle on my knee that needed surgery and a big "X" with a "NO" under it for the knee that didn't need surgery. I'd damn well hope that hospitals pull their heads out of their asses and come up with some sort of visual id system for patients given the surgeries and medical treatments involved.


However, going to a hospital for routine or emergency medical care and dealing with licensed medical authorities is an entirely spectrum than a young man or woman in a program.

To compare the to is at best a fallacious argument as a program is not a hospital and a hospital is not a program. The best interests of the residents in a program are not actively served by stigmatizing a young man or woman by singling them out for special attention based upon an orange jumpsuit. Personally, as being one of the fellows who worked at a program here I'll say that the need for orange jumpsuits and other identifying marks are absurd. Literally you live and work in an atmosphere of paranoia in the first place. The chances of a kid doing anything secretly are minor at best given that he is surrounded by peers 24 hours a day and is under continuous staff supervision.


A hospital being so busy at it is with all sorts of things going on are wise to use a color coding system for meds. Seriously, I want the big green pills that make my hair fall out and my teeth turn purple to be well known.

I want the doctors to know that I'm there for yet another bout of whatever weird South East Asian veneral disease I picked up rather than a bladder to mouth transplant.

Damn I definitely want them to be able to figure out that I'm in for a minor toe surgery and not a leg amputation.

Considering all of these things make sense the arguments for color coding in a program make absolutely no sense. I can understand a common group color, but I can't understand a special color for high risk kids. This merely serves to aggravate whatever social discomfort they are already suffering and increase the humiliation factor.

Other than playing mafia wars on facebook I don't have much use for it other than chatting with friends and kids I worked with at Three Springs.

One of them recently told me that being on link (forced to hold the end of a garbage bag) was so humiliating that frequently it increased his thoughts of suicide rather than made his environment safer. Makes me regret ever putting anyone on link, but I hated link so much I rarely ever kept anyone on it as long as I was supposed to put them on it anyway. On occasion I was forced, forced I say, to put a kid on link with himself.

Take it as you will, but the argument here about jumpsuits and hospitals are a side show deserving of their own thread. I strongly suggest conducting the discussion on www.4chans.org as well for sheer epic fail of attempting to blow smoke up our asses.
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Offline TheWho

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #252 on: April 10, 2009, 07:05:44 PM »
Quote from: "try another castle"
Quote from: "Guest"
What does your daughter think about her experience in treatment and your parenting style, NeilW? And what does she think about your obsessive ranting on fornits? I'd be willing to bet that you don't even have a daughter, or any kids for that matter.

That's not neil. Someone is spoofing him.

Time to get an account, neil!  :seg:

Thanks, It seems someone has already grabbed my name.  I am not sure what I said to upset that person.  I guess it is pretty funny, but it does show why you need to register if you want to protect what you say.  I will post as a guest for awhile until I can come up with a different name.

NeilW
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Offline FemanonFatal2.0

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #253 on: April 10, 2009, 07:07:18 PM »
Quote from: "mcarter.fornits"
If you choose to attack me - then reveal yourself, don't hide.  In the US Courts - everyone has a right to confront their accuser.  People
here are attacking me and hiding.  No charges have been brought against me, nor will any be, because I have not broken any laws, and
while many people do not agree with the decisions I have made ( every person's right - but then these are anonymous beings out there, not
people - I acknowledge no rights to anyone without a name!) they are my decisions.

Let me entertain this notion for a moment, lets say that charges were brought against you... Do you realize that it would be none of us that would do so, it would be your daughter who would have the case against you. I think you should rephrase your thinking on who is attacking who at this moment, we are simply advocating for her because she seems to blame herself for those mistakes you say you made because you didn't know how to be a good parent for her.

I have been reading your blog, or I was until I started talking to Katie, I reached out to her because what I heard of "your side of the story" made me sick to my stomach. I really have to ask you what kind of parent treats their daughter with such disdain, regardless of the mistakes she's made in the past she is still your daughter and is deserving of your love. Yes, Katie made some bad decisions, but constantly berating her about them and refusing to give her any respect really escalated her self esteem problems. Don't you realize that the cycle never ends if you keep blaming her and refuse make any changes. You and Dianne talk a lot about how Katie doesn't take any accountability, well what about you? Do you really think you hold no responsibility in how miserable Katie grew to be? Honestly, Dianne was not a good fit for your family, she is too harsh and hateful and that is not the kind of mother Katie needed. You know she really needed you after she lost her mother, and its not hard to realize that this all started when you chose your wife over your daughter. I know how Katie felt, I came from a household where my stepmother made my life miserable as well and I acted out too because as a child you don't have the proper tools to deal with those emotions. Its your parents who are supposed to teach kids how to deal with their but instead you chose to fuel the fire with more hate and anger. Do you know what would have made all the difference in Katie's teen years? If you and Dianne would have taken some parenting classes and learned how to work with a child with depression. She had, (and still has) special needs but you spent so much time judging and punishing her that you actually made her depression worse and that depression, her misery and loneliness is what caused her to cut herself act out and hang out with friends that had similar problems. Stop blaming your child and be a man, take some responsibility and try to show her the love and attention she has been crying out for, she needs it and she deserves it.

Another reason I have to bring your parenting (and logic) into question is because despite the fact that she has a serious and crippling depression, you sent her to a program. A program that promises to change you child for you so you don't have to deal with it anymore. It WAS incarceration, she was not allowed to leave or even speak to anyone outside the facility beside you for 3 years... thats what we call here on earth a private prison. The way the program operates, even in the seemingly "non-abusive" schools, is not conducive to treating mental disorders, that fact is even stated in their contracts. The "therapists" work for the program and follow an oppressive agenda that is not approved by any medical or psychological association. The staff is not qualified to be working with special needs kids, regardless of if some of them call themselves "therapists", If they are not following proper medical procedures then they obviously don't know what they are doing. The whole program is an improper procedure, They strip children of their basic human rights, they use physical (and violent) restraint and isolation quite often as a punishment for "not following rules" instead of in accordance with federal law. They verbally, mentally and emotionally abuse the students in order to create the "tough love" environment and they cut too many corners when it comes to your children's safety and well-being. I don't understand, regardless if you felt you had no other option, why this kind of program would have even been considered for a severely depressed little girl. My guess is that getting her out of your home was more important then actually helping Katie and that is why so many of us are upset with the way you justify your actions.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
[size=150]When Injustice Becomes Law
...Rebellion Becomes Duty...[/size]




[size=150]WHEN THE RAPTURE COMES
CAN I HAVE YOUR FLAT SCREEN?[/size]

Offline NeilW

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Re: blog of a program parent
« Reply #254 on: April 10, 2009, 07:09:07 PM »
Quote from: "Guest"

Thanks, It seems someone has already grabbed my name.  I am not sure what I said to upset that person.  I guess it is pretty funny, but it does show why you need to register if you want to protect what you say.  I will post as a guest for awhile until I can come up with a different name.

NeilW

You don't give up do you, troll!! Ha,Ha,Ha... I'm flattered that you want to be me, but give it a rest.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »