Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Daytop Village
DAYTOP Did Me Great Harm in the Long Run
Anonymous:
--- Quote from: "SEKTO" ---
--- Quote ---Interesting you include "some other group". If you're referring to what I think you are, i'd tend to agree. Institutionalized 12 steppery performs a forced conversion function as a front group for the 12 step religion as a whole. You might find this chapter of this book (link) by Charles Bufe interesting.
--- End quote ---
No, I was not specifically referring to Bill (though he and I used to be buddies; DAYTOP would take us to Bills' place once a week or so), but groups in general, all kinds, whether religious groups, military groups, self-help/recovery groups, whatever. They are all basically the same. I got used to groups and got to the point of believing that that was a good and normal and even superior way to go about my life.
In a sense, if you've seen one cult, you've seen 'em all.
I have been in a religious cult, visited and mingled with several different religious communities and various communes, (some cultic, some not), DAYTOP, AND the Army (which I consider to be cult too, but at least you get paid and get some benefits) all in an effort to re-create the phony sense of "community" that I experienced as a teenager in DAYTOP.
That's what it comes down to, doesn't it? Learned helplessness. Exactly what I need to hear.
--- Quote ---Must have been easy when you believed you were powerless. In my cynical opinion this learned helplessness performs a "return to sender" function: programming a person to self destruct without the group. You can only function as a member. Further, you naturally try to help others you see as who you were before the cult (everybody, since history is revised). They turn you into a deployable agent of the cult... a missionary of sorts.
--- End quote ---
The Daytop Philosophy, recited like a prayer or mantra every morning before Morning Meeting, programmed us to be group-dependent, taught us groupthink right away. Here it is:
I am here because there is no refuge.
Finally, from myself.
Until I confront myself in the eyes
and hearts of others, I am running.
Until I suffer them to share my secrets,
I have no safety from them.
Afraid to be known, I can know
neither myself nor any other, I will be alone.
Where else but in our common ground,
can I find such a mirror?
Here, together, I can at last appear
clearly to myself not as the giant
of my dreams nor the dwarf of my fears,
but as a person, part of a whole,
with my share in its purpose.
In this ground, I can take root and grow,
Not alone anymore as in death,
But alive to myself and to others.
--- End quote ---
No, I was not specifically referring to Bill (though he and I used to be buddies; DAYTOP would take us to Bills' place once a week or so), but groups in general, all kinds, whether religious groups, military groups, self-help/recovery groups, whatever. They are all basically the same. I got used to groups and got to the point of believing that that was a good and normal and even superior way to go about my life.[/list]
SEKTO, can you tell us about Bill? Are you talking about Bill Wilson?
SEKTO:
Bill Wilson, yes. Those were veiled references to AA and AA culture.
psy:
--- Quote from: "SEKTO" ---Bill Wilson, yes. Those were veiled references to AA and AA culture.
--- End quote ---
@guest: See also "friend of bill" (not clinton)
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... 20Bill%20W.
It's used as code language to speak to AA members without alerting those who are not AA members or don't know the super sekret "lingo"/slang. I've even seen it used in movies (one example: "pay it forward").
See some more 12 step loaded language by the same user:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/author.p ... Step+slang
(just a fraction of what there is out there)
Anonymous:
Interesing reading so far. And the only reason I'm reading it is that guess what I was in Daytop Texas in the early 90's and some of what is said in the original post is either puposely fabricated or the delusional memories of a self admitted pothead. I've gotten through the first 3 pages of this thread and while some of it actually factual, I just hate when people make crap up to serve their own self interests. :soapbox:
psy:
--- Quote from: "odie2" ---Interesing reading so far. And the only reason I'm reading it is that guess what I was in Daytop Texas in the early 90's and some of what is said in the original post is either puposely fabricated or the delusional memories of a self admitted pothead. I've gotten through the first 3 pages of this thread and while some of it actually factual, I just hate when people make crap up to serve their own self interests. :soapbox:
--- End quote ---
What isn't factual, specifically?
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