Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Daytop Village
DAYTOP Did Me Great Harm in the Long Run
psy:
--- Quote from: "SEKTO" ---That place was as traumatic as the eleven months that I later spent in Iraq in '05.
--- End quote ---
That speaks volumes. How parents can send their kids into such environments never ceases to amaze me.
--- Quote ---Their goal is to make you dependent on DAYTOP (or by extension, on groups in general) by reinforcing your identity as an addict and generally "broken" person.
--- End quote ---
I think that's probably the longest lasting portion of the damage right there. Learned helplessness. I tend to think that the vast majority of people in this sort of "treatment" would have grown out of their behavior had they not had a "fuckup" identity drilled into them.
--- Quote ---They'll make it so you are dependant on DAYTOP, or else some other group.
--- End quote ---
Interesting you include "some other group". If you're referring to what I think you are, i'd tend to agree. Institutionalized 12 steppery performs a forced conversion function as a front group for the 12 step religion as a whole. You might find this chapter of this book (link) by Charles Bufe interesting. It's a controversial viewpoint that some are very opposed to but personally I think it makes a lot of sense.
--- Quote ---After I got out of that place (it took me a year and a half to graduate) me and all of my Daytopian buddies all fell off the wagon together big-time. I never partied so much or so hard in my life as I did with other Daytopians.
--- End quote ---
Must have been easy when you believed you were powerless. In my cynical opinion this learned helplessness performs a "return to sender" function: programming a person to self destruct without the group. You can only function as a member. Further, you naturally try to help others you see as who you were before the cult (everybody, since history is revised). They turn you into a deployable agent of the cult... a missionary of sorts.
--- Quote ---I am a little angry with my parents for putting me in that place, but they didn't know. We thought that it was a good thing at the time.
--- End quote ---
That's why I believe education on this subject is so important. If most parents truly realized what they were doing was not in the best interest of their kids, they wouldn't. Personally I don't blame people for what they do in ignorance (including my parents), but I admit it did take time for me to get past my resentment.
psy:
--- Quote from: "SEKTO" ---She'd make fun of me relentlessly, telling me how phony and plastic and shallow that she thought I was.
--- End quote ---
Different groups call it different things. In the group I was in they used to say you were wearing "masks". Metaphorically, they would encourage you to cut off your own face (believing it to be a mask) and replace it with what they wanted... but their mask never seems to stick for too long without a milieu (or compatible milieu) to support it. The scars, however, I would argue last a lifetime... self/identity doubt, etc...
--- Quote ---She once humiliated me in front of the entire "DAYTOP family" in morning meeting by making me dance around in a silly fashion while everybody laughed at me. And all in the name of helping me to "overcome my issues."
--- End quote ---
Most programs listed on this site have some form of this or another. Some have marathon LGATs where humiliating "skits" are performed in a ritualistic fashion in addition to what you just described.
--- Quote ---They'd verbally abuse and humiliate us, a bunch of teenagers, and teach us to do the same to one another. Incredible.
--- End quote ---
Many programs on this site recruit from within. My guess is that they were grooming you for staff. Did Daytop recruit staff from within?
SEKTO:
--- Quote ---Interesting you include "some other group". If you're referring to what I think you are, i'd tend to agree. Institutionalized 12 steppery performs a forced conversion function as a front group for the 12 step religion as a whole. You might find this chapter of this book (link) by Charles Bufe interesting.
--- End quote ---
No, I was not specifically referring to Bill (though he and I used to be buddies; DAYTOP would take us to Bills' place once a week or so), but groups in general, all kinds, whether religious groups, military groups, self-help/recovery groups, whatever. They are all basically the same. I got used to groups and got to the point of believing that that was a good and normal and even superior way to go about my life.
In a sense, if you've seen one cult, you've seen 'em all.
I have been in a religious cult, visited and mingled with several different religious communities and various communes, (some cultic, some not), DAYTOP, AND the Army (which I consider to be cult too, but at least you get paid and get some benefits) all in an effort to re-create the phony sense of "community" that I experienced as a teenager in DAYTOP.
That's what it comes down to, doesn't it? Learned helplessness. Exactly what I need to hear.
--- Quote ---Must have been easy when you believed you were powerless. In my cynical opinion this learned helplessness performs a "return to sender" function: programming a person to self destruct without the group. You can only function as a member. Further, you naturally try to help others you see as who you were before the cult (everybody, since history is revised). They turn you into a deployable agent of the cult... a missionary of sorts.
--- End quote ---
The Daytop Philosophy, recited like a prayer or mantra every morning before Morning Meeting, programmed us to be group-dependent, taught us groupthink right away. Here it is:
I am here because there is no refuge.
Finally, from myself.
Until I confront myself in the eyes
and hearts of others, I am running.
Until I suffer them to share my secrets,
I have no safety from them.
Afraid to be known, I can know
neither myself nor any other, I will be alone.
Where else but in our common ground,
can I find such a mirror?
Here, together, I can at last appear
clearly to myself not as the giant
of my dreams nor the dwarf of my fears,
but as a person, part of a whole,
with my share in its purpose.
In this ground, I can take root and grow,
Not alone anymore as in death,
But alive to myself and to others.
SEKTO:
--- Quote ---Many programs on this site recruit from within. My guess is that they were grooming you for staff. Did Daytop recruit staff from within?
--- End quote ---
Bingo. They most certainly did. Most of the staff there were DAYTOP grads themselves. There were some that were not grads, but the organization certainly did recruit potential new counselors from among the persons going through the program. The director of the place even offered to fly me up to NYC to go through DAYTOP internship and counselor-training and the whole nine. I went to college instead.
--- Quote ---Interesting you include "some other group". If you're referring to what I think you are, i'd tend to agree. Institutionalized 12 steppery performs a forced conversion function as a front group for the 12 step religion as a whole. You might find this chapter of this book (link) by Charles Bufe interesting. It's a controversial viewpoint that some are very opposed to but personally I think it makes a lot of sense.
--- End quote ---
Hmmm, I'll study this out and will get back with you with my thoughts on it soon. Thanks.
psy:
in the group I was in the played Kenny Rogers "Tell it All Brother" on repeat in an LGAT during the "disclosure circle" portion.
Perfect song for what lifton called the cult of confession
here is a link to the song (not recommended for CEDU vets):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpPcoVrmDHY
Imagine being in a sleep-deprived state wit that played on repeat for hours... being surrounded by everybody pouring their hearts out all around you, confessing to everything included but not limited to rape, bestiality, even murder. Obviously some of it was probably exaggerated (if you've ever confessed to belong, you know what I mean), but that just made the group effect stronger. Suffice to say they got it all from you. Different groups have different implementations, but you're right... once you've seen one cult, you've seen them all. The general tune is the same: Thought reform + origin + group power structure.
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