Coldwater the Movie

[Carey]

This sounds like the words of an attorney to me.
 
I believe right is right and wrong is wrong!  

I believe fact is fact and fiction is fiction!

I do not believe that the end justifies the means!

The way this movie has come about, is wrong!!!

The movie was planned before the story on Ryan and Casa by the Sea broke!

[Anonymous]

On 2003-07-22 23:17:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I cannot overlook the fact that there are thousands of families that have been helped by what WWASP offers.
...
I never hear these stories from graduates. That means a lot to me personally. "

What do you hear from graduates? I've been hosting and posting to forums on abusive treatment for years now. In my experience, there's usually one or two graduates out of a few hundred who hang onto their cult status long after they've gotten over the threat of being sent back. For the most part, people who stay involved with these forums on some level for any amount of time are graduates. People who get out after a short time sometimes stop in, say hi, look for old friends, maybe tell their escape story then we don't hear from them again.

Where are all these successful graduates, anon????Do you have any basis for believing they exist, aside from Ken Kay's assurances that they do?

Antigen

[anon]

[ This Message was edited by: KarenZ on 2003-10-17 09:18 ]

[Antigen]

Carey, I don't understand exactly what you're upset about. Is it that someone might make money on the movie? (or might not, it's a very speculative business)

Is it that you only want media coverage if it's driven purely by altruism? I don't think it exists. Are you afraid it'll turn out to be a soft ball, fluff piece? Well, it might. We never know till we actually see it. But, based on the material I've seen so far, I just don't think that's the direction this project is taking.

And, FWIW, I hope they don't water down the cussing, the blood, the psychotic breaks or the jock itch. I hope they do an unflinching, no holds barred expose. I hope half the people walk out of the theatre shaking their heads saying "Man, what a load of crap! That can't happen." because I know there are some hundreds of thousands of us scattered around the country who can confirm from first-hand experience that it can and does happen every day.

Moreover, I hope they release it with a disclaimer like "Warning, this film may be triggering to certain individuals who have experienced large group behavior modification."

The internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it.
--John Gilmour

_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
American P.O.W. 10/80 - 10/82
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
Anonymity Anonymous

[Carey]

"All I can think to say is, So What?!! What, about any of this, assuming its so, is wrong? You really are not making much sense with your arguments."

Karen you ask what is wrong with this. I am not surprised that this does not make any sense to you.  The problem with this is that the pretense can be seen by outsiders as though everything happened in the way that it did in order to sell a movie.  In a court of law it will lessen the  creditiabilty of those invovled.   I don't see how anyone invovled in this project will be able to tell his or her story in a court of law and be deemed creditable.  Plus, I thinks it will hurt the creditabilty of those who are not invovled too.

[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-07-23 08:54 ]

[Anonymous]

Your only giving them the attention, and thats the right thing to do because all the victims have good intensions.

Obviously you havent made much of a differnece even with the 104 posts you have made, and yet still your the only posting on your hehalf.

We are all very anxious to watch Coldwater, but your gonna have to wait just like all of us.
It's a good thing that they have a real-life surivor because that shows alot.

You say your a writer? Never would have guessed that, your 104 posts of writing makes you look like a fool.

Theres to many victims out there and your not one of them. Dont tell us statements if you havent been there.

We can all see its you who made the message board, get the kid a fan club if you wanna talk about him so much.

Of course you havent made a difference, because were the ones saving and your the one complaining.

[Anonymous]

"What do you hear from graduates? I've been hosting and posting to forums on abusive treatment for years now. In my experience, there's usually one or two graduates out of a few hundred who hang onto their cult status long after they've gotten over the threat of being sent back. For the most part, people who stay involved with these forums on some level for any amount of time are graduates. People who get out after a short time sometimes stop in, say hi, look for old friends, maybe tell their escape story then we don't hear from them again.



Where are all these successful graduates, anon????Do you have any basis for believing they exist, aside from Ken Kay's assurances that they do?


Antigen

 "

Hi Antigen:  

I'm not talking about graduates who hang on to being in a WWASP program.  Most have moved beyond being involved in the program or support groups and don't talk about the past.  It's who they are now and what they are doing with their lives.  Ken Kay has no place in my observations, it's the grads and their families that have shown me the results. WWASP is not Straight or CEDU or Brown school, etc.  The more I learn about the WWASP program through those that have been there, the more I agree with what they do. I don't have a kid in the program.  I have been researching for my thesis...both sides.   I have also registered for the Discovery seminar as non program people are welcome to attend and it seems very similar to another personal growth seminar I'm familiar with.  Hopefully this movie will address the seminars.

[Carey]

I have been trying to talk to Tim with the NY TIMES.  I am trying to find out how it was exactly that he decided to do a story on Casa By the Sea.  He won't respond.  Why?  I don't know.  When people are not willing to answer simple questions I begin to wonder, why?

[Anonymous]

I for one, find it hard to respect the opinion of Karen Z. who according to her website, is a self-proclaimed "professional parent".  What kind of nonsense is this?  Shame on Karen and her group of narrow-minded minions for using this forum to promote their own self-serving agenda and in the process, cast suspicion upon others whose opinion they do not like b/c it does not mirror their own
twisted version of the truth.  God help us all to keep our moral compasses straight for the sake of the children and families caught in this web of deception.

http://www.strugglingteenhelp.com
http://www.helpyourteens.com
http://www.parentdirector.com

[Carey]

[Anonymous]

Carey, Your wrong. Realy though you are!
You have no idea of how much good Ryan has brought.

All of us victims already know he is the lead plaintiff in a class action law suit, his articles have gotton people out of these places.

Go ahead and make a clown out of yourself, people will be crying joy when they see Coldwater.
 
You dont have to put people down in order to feel good about yourself,  Coldwater is going to save alot more kids then your hilarious comments.

Of course knowone is going to support you if you think you can justify or warrant abuse.

For all we know, your another one of wwwasps.

Its not okay to abuse kids carey, and come to think about it, if you realy didnt support Coldwater then you would be supporting abuse.

[Anonymous]

Hey Anon, calling someone a child abuser because they are not 100% convinced about the credibility of the people involved in making this movie is beyond stupid.  Far better to maintain a "let's wait and see" mentality before jumping to any conclusions that may prove embarassingly wrong.

 :rofl:

[Antigen]

On 2003-07-23 11:34:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

Antigen wrote:


Where are all these successful graduates, anon????Do you have any basis for believing they exist, aside from Ken Kay's assurances that they do?





Antigen



 "

Hi Antigen:  



I'm not talking about graduates who hang on to being in a WWASP program.  Most have moved beyond being involved in the program or support groups and don't talk about the past.  It's who they are now and what they are doing with their lives.  

Ok, so who the hell are they and what are they doing with their lives? Simple question. You've as much as stated that you're willing to risk harm being done to your own child at your request and in exchange for your money because you're so certain that there are a significant number of WWASP graduates who are doing so well. So, where the hell are they? Who are they? How do you know they exist?

Ken Kay has no place in my observations, it's the grads and their families that have shown me the results. WWASP is not Straight or CEDU or Brown school, etc.  The more I learn about the WWASP program through those that have been there, the more I agree with what they do.

Wait a second, I'm confused. Just a paragraph ago, you said that all these proud, successful WWASP graduates just had gone on with their lives and have betther things to do than to hang around WWASP. Now you're hobknobbing with them at your weekly TOUGHLOVE hategroup rallies? Which is it?

WWASP is so remarkably like Straight, CEDU, Synanon, The Seed, Elan, SAFE, Pathways, Kids, KHK is tends to blow people away when they find out this shit is still going on.

But don't take my word for it, here it is straight from a fairly prominent horses ass.
Letter from Wm. Cavey
The following is a letter that we recently received from a "Proud Parent of a Straight Graduate".

http://trebach.org/letters/cavey/

I have it on fairly good authority that, when he wrote this letter, he hadn't had significant contact with the Straight graduate of whom he's so proud or with his grandkids, for a number of years. That's extremely common in Program families; most especially when the parents remain actively involved in the Program long after the kid has either gone into hiding or grown up and excised their whack job parents from their lives.

I don't have a kid in the program.  I have been researching for my thesis...both sides.   I have also registered for the Discovery seminar as non program people are welcome to attend and it seems very similar to another personal growth seminar I'm familiar with.

Which one, Resource Realizations? Purification Run Down?

Hopefully this movie will address the seminars."

So then, you're of the opinion that Coldwater is going to be pro-program? Well, if you can get yourself to believe that no kid has ever died in a WWASP program and the world is peopled with grateful, successful graduates, then I suppose you can make yourself believe anything.

We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.
-- Ben Franklin At the signing of the Declaration of Independence, July 4, 1776.

[Anonymous]

"Of course knowone is going to support you if you think you can justify or warrant abuse.

For all we know, your another one of wwwasps.

Its not okay to abuse kids carey, and come to think about it, if you realy didnt support Coldwater then you would be supporting "

How has anything I have said imply that I condone abuse.  Do you think that just because I do not agree with you and others that it means that I condone abuse.  How STUPID can you be?  My God, you are no different then they are with your "its my way or the highway" mentality.  Ryan has the right to do what ever he wants the way he wants...but I don't have to agree with it.  And just because I don't agree with it does not mean that I condone abuse.  

I am not programed by you or WWASP.  I will think independently whether you like it or not.

Quit feeling so threatned by my opinions.  I am not asking you to take them as your own.

Grow up!

[Carey]

The previous post was mine.