New Better Manifesto

[Che Gookin]

Who are we to attack those who believe in the experiences they went through? A young man or woman who shows up on fornits and claims to have had a good experience is quickly labeled the following:

A) Brainwashed
B) Troll
C) Karen In Dallas in Disguise

With these accusations they are visciously attacked with porn, called all sorts of names, and called traitors.

I've done it before.. to my own shame.

You see I no longer see it important to classify programs as either good or bad. Abuse happens in programs, schools, churches, homes, regulated facilites, public bathrooms, water parks, and just about every single place imaginable. To me the greater issue lies beyond abusive programmes that are privately owned or even good programmes that are privately owned.

The distinction no longer matters to me and to those who feel they had a good experience I encourage you to discuss them.

What matters to me is that I come from a country where dogs have more rights than kids. It amused me to watch the GAO hearing and hear the bit about dogs having more rights and protection than kids. I actually told my group once that hunting dogs have more rights than children in the State of Alabama. I'll be sure to send the congressmen who scored some votes off my material a bill.

It bothers me that a kid can be sent away for treatment without the benifits of due process. It bothers the hell out of me that kids are sent away with no chance to appeal. No chance to explain their case with the help of a representative.

I believe some states, New York if I'm not mistaken, actually has a court for pets.

And we live in a country where kids can be shipped off without a chance at a fair hearing, appeals, and access to advocates?

So that is my thing and I encourage those who feel they have had a positive program experience to share them. Your insight is just as valuable as anyone elses.

Do be prepared for the scat porn and other moronic crap though. Just the nature of the beast.

[psy]

It's one thing to show up on fornits and claim you had a good experience in program.  It's entirely another to show up on Fornits, start defending rapists, calling others names etc., generally being a cunt*, and expecting everybody else (in an unmoderated forum) to be fine and dandy with it.  It just isn't going to happen.  Some people crave drama.  She's one of them. TheWho, on the other hand, is probably paid to post here (or completely and utterly cracked in the head, IMO).

On the other hand, not everybody likes to see images of hard-core bondage porn.  If you want to actually reach parents, especially conservative ones (the majority of program parents), porn isn't going to do it, and it gives Fornits-haters a lot of ammo against us as a collective body (which is how prejudiced, illogical people judge, the entire group by the actions of a single member).  Parents (often) have a hard time accepting the whole "completely unmoderated" thing often, so try and show a little respect, please.  If not for the parents, for any kids they might have.

Stuff said here does influence people's decisions and lives.  The more parent-friendly this forum is, the safer kids are... and some current program parents might come and want to take their kids out.  Sure there are a bunch of trolls on Fornits (and I really wish one in particular would cut it out... please...) but there are real parents who do come here, and steriotypes exist for a reason... (some of those crazy people are real, and they have kids, unfortunately).  Some listen and make decisions, at least get informed a little about the industry.  Some don't, but it never hurts to try.  I know everybody jokes about the internet and "serious business" but what is said here does have real world consequences outside of that normal "serious business" paradigm.  Please respect that.  Let's try and work together on organizing action to fuck these people up rather than bickering**.



*(although normally I would never consider using such language, the circumstances warrant it's usage in that it is the most offensive to the target of the insult(who totally deserves it, given some of the shit she said to some of my friends))

**(even though I do it too, admittedly.  And sometimes it's appropriate, but when it fills the whole page...  come on.. take it to free for all.)

[Che Gookin]

It's one thing to show up on fornits and claim you had a good experience in program.  It's entirely another to show up on Fornits, start defending rapists, calling others names etc., generally being a cunt*, and expecting everybody else (in an unmoderated forum) to be fine and dandy with it.  It just isn't going to happen.  Some people crave drama.  She's one of them. TheWho, on the other hand, is probably paid to post here (or completely and utterly cracked in the head, IMO).

She wasn't always like that.. back when she first started... before you arrived she was a genuinely decent person... It wasn't until she stated that she had a positive experience at Heritage when she was attacked by everyone and their cousin.

This was pretty vile shit to that was flung at her..

Ever since she has just arsed people off as who really listens to her or even tries to sorting out the reasons behind her feelings?

Simple case of marginalization.. we treated her like total shit.. she responded in kind...

On the other hand, not everybody likes to see images of hard-core bondage porn.

Yeah I agree.. which is why I no longer post it.

 If you want to actually reach parents, especially conservative ones (the majority of program parents), porn isn't going to do it, and it gives Fornits-haters a lot of ammo against us as a collective body (which is how prejudiced, illogical people judge, the entire group by the actions of a single member).  Parents (often) have a hard time accepting the whole "completely unmoderated" thing often, so try and show a little respect, please.  If not for the parents, for any kids they might have.

I find this hard to accept at times considering we have a moderated forum here to use. I notice that these parents show up in the dumbest places and when it is suggested that they move to the Q/A they never bother.. or they stay in the TTI and keep slugging it out.. Makes me wonder how many really are parents.

Stuff said here does influence people's decisions and lives.  The more parent-friendly this forum is, the safer kids are... and some current program parents might come and want to take their kids out.  Sure there are a bunch of trolls on Fornits (and I really wish one in particular would cut it out... please...) but there are real parents who do come here, and steriotypes exist for a reason... (some of those crazy people are real, and they have kids, unfortunately).  Some listen and make decisions, at least get informed a little about the industry.  Some don't, but it never hurts to try.  I know everybody jokes about the internet and "serious business" but what is said here does have real world consequences outside of that normal "serious business" paradigm.  Please respect that.  Let's try and work together on organizing action to fuck these people up rather than bickering**.

Our greatest strength is our refusal to comply with the norms. Had we been a pack of sheep like faggots most of us would still be worshipping at the altar of George Miller saying, "OH george.. you get me so hard.. BAAAAAA."

I'm not to keen on organizing for the most part. I prefer smaller groups of 3 to 4 anyway. Larger groups tend to get to clouded with bullshit and the next thing you know you have cafarty which ended up a smaller group that is just clouded with even more bullshit.

*(although normally I would never consider using such language, the circumstances warrant it's usage in that it is the most offensive to the target of the insult(who totally deserves it, given some of the shit she said to some of my friends))

Think back to the shit that has been said to her repeatedly for over a year.

**(even though I do it too, admittedly.  And sometimes it's appropriate, but when it fills the whole page...  come on.. take it to free for all.)

And who really reads it when it is that long?



Now the above purpose of my original post wasn't a commentary about fornits in general.

I do believe plenty of young men and women have positve life changing experiences in programs. I've seen it and other people who post on this forum have seen it. Most of the time we'd rather not say much about it to save ourselves the drama.

Good or bad I do believe that kids deserve without condition the right to due process. No child should be sent away without a hearing to determine the need for it. No child should be without proper representation and nor should they be without appeals to their commitment.

I could expand on this greatly but to keep it short..

I'm not a big fan of any place that doesn't allow access to advocates 24 hours a day.

Nor do I agree with these holistic approaches to treatment that involve stuffing a burning incense stick up your arse whilst praying for 8 hours a day.

[Oz girl]

I would agree with most of the original post. I would say that I fall into the camp that says that there are no good programs based on the fact that incarceration without trial and due process is inherently wrong no matter how benevolent the prison. The things that go on are secondary to this fact.
But you are right here CTD. It is both mean spirited and unnecessary to call anyone who has been through this system names, regardless of how crazy one thinks their ideas are. it serves no purpose. it is demeaning. There is such an irony bitter in attacking somebody on a personal level because you don't like ehat they say about their experieces within a system that often attacks young people on a personal level.

As to the who. He can fuck right off

[hanzomon4]

CCM had just as much of a hand in creating that Heritage mess as the trolls. It started off fine but she lost it after I posted that information from heal. She was so pissed that we were questioning that program. It was after CCM and the who started joking about starting an abusive program that the thread seriously went to shit.

But anyway I agree with what psy said.... All the porn and random slam threads I've never understood and when I first came here and saw that I was totally lost. It took a while to figure out what was going on here and had I not been driven I would have written this place off as downright Bizarre.

[TheWho]

CCM had just as much of a hand in creating that Heritage mess as the trolls. It started off fine but she lost it after I posted that information from heal. She was so pissed that we were questioning that program. It was after CCM and the who started joking about starting an abusive program that the thread seriously went to shit.
But anyway I agree with what psy said.... All the porn and random slam threads I've never understood and when I first came here and saw that I was totally lost. It took a while to figure out what was going on here and had I not been driven I would have written this place off as downright Bizarre.

A little finger pointing going on?

Read back  over the thread.  It was going fine until you and Anne Bonney started in on CCM and then Niles started in on her.

Why Blame every derailed thread on the Who?  Compare what he wrote to what yourself, Anne Bonney and Niles usual flood of hate and porn.

[hanzomon4]

CCM had just as much of a hand in creating that Heritage mess as the trolls. It started off fine but she lost it after I posted that information from heal. She was so pissed that we were questioning that program. [Me?][/color] and Anne Bonney started in on CCM and then Niles started in on her.

Why Blame every derailed thread on the Who?  Compare what he wrote to what yourself, Anne Bonney and Niles usual flood of hate and porn.

My posts from the heritage thread, 1 2 3 4 5

And nope never posted porn or anything I would rate as hateful("Like X poster is gay" threads). Those things are so not my thing, nor do I understand the purpose crap like that serves in ending child abuse.

[Anne Bonney]

A little finger pointing going on?

Read back  over the thread.  It was going fine until you and Anne Bonney started in on CCM and then Niles started in on her.

Why Blame every derailed thread on the Who?  Compare what he wrote to what yourself, Anne Bonney and Niles usual flood of hate and porn.

I think you need to read back over it.  None of those people showed up in that thread until well after CCM started showing her ass.  She's just pissed because she got called on it.


And I haven't posted any porn.  Where have I been hateful?  I've disagreed with her and even told her to fuck off, but hateful?  Show me.

[Anonymous]

A little finger pointing going on?

Read back  over the thread.  It was going fine until you and Anne Bonney started in on CCM and then Niles started in on her.

Why Blame every derailed thread on the Who?  Compare what he wrote to what yourself, Anne Bonney and Niles usual flood of hate and porn.

[Anonymous]

My theory is that there are no good programs because the motivations are all wrong. Its sort of like a politician; no one who actually wants the office is a person who would be good doing it. People might start off running a therapeutic boarding school for good reasons, but they quickly leave and the ones who are running them for the money are all that is left. I am convinced that most of the abuse that you see in residential therapeutic facilities is because people are more interested in money than in the kids. They don't intend to harm the kids, but making a big profit naturally leads to it.

[TheWho]

My theory is that there are no good programs because the motivations are all wrong. Its sort of like a politician; no one who actually wants the office is a person who would be good doing it. People might start off running a therapeutic boarding school for good reasons, but they quickly leave and the ones who are running them for the money are all that is left. I am convinced that most of the abuse that you see in residential therapeutic facilities is because people are more interested in money than in the kids. They don't intend to harm the kids, but making a big profit naturally leads to it.

I agree with this.  I don’t think anyone wakes up in the morning and says to themselves “Lets create a school for abusing kids… lets figure out a way to isolate them from their parents and then just abuse them for the fun of it.  And just to make sure nobody finds out about it we will hire people who have gone to school to get educated in helping children.â€

[Dr Fucktard]

Straight Inc. By the Sea:

The wave of the future in drug treatment.â„¢

[CCM girl 1989]

This is the type of stuff that was being said to me:

Oh god, CMSGirly butthurt AGAIN. Forgot the astroglide or just on the rag?

Honestly. Who are you? You're a WWASPIE survivor and you were put in a litany of other programs and you're projecting your OPINIONS and experiences as a FUCKED UP TEENAGER and acting like that amounts to anything more than the opinions of a program apologetic with a ton of baggage and a habit of projecting your own shit on others, and flipping out if people have any criticism for what you say at all!

Nevermind the fact that the grievances I RESPECTFULLY brought up are 100% WRONG, period, the fact that I brought it up against one of your "approved programs" means you need to flip-out, bitch-out and wig-out and spread estrogen everywhere and PMS all over the thread because I didn't bow down to your fucking opinion.

Need a 50 waahhhhmbulance post again?



Also here is some more:


Because her parents threw her away like the worthless whore she is.



More charming words:


We will do this, we will do that, your credibility, WAH WAH WAH.

Sounds like maybe you need a good, long raping too.

And then after I'm done I'll brainwash you to like it and then you can post on Fornits how nice it was.

I'll tell you this, though: It'll take a lot less time than a couple months! So by ramming my meat into your twisted cunt I'm actually doing a lot less to you than you are to your own daughter.

Funny how that works, isn't it?



Is it okay to speak to me like this because my experiences and opinions are different then yours? I don't think it is. I say it how it is, and if you can't handle somebody being 100% honest with how they feel, and what they went through, then that is your problem.

I get attacked every time I speak out. It gets so tiring having to do the back, and forth. Like I said before, it's a full time job. I don't enjoy the attention. What I do enjoy however is being able to give parents who come on here looking for information, the right information.

Not all programs are bad.

[TheWho]

I say you damn well asked for everything Niles dished out, CCM Girl..time to move on now!  :rofl:

So what you are saying is abuse is okay as long as the kid was asking for it?  If the kids stay in line or keeps their mouth shut they wont get abused.  So it seems the kids have some control over whether or not they are abused.

Interesting point.

[Dr Fucktard]

I truly don't see what the goddam FUSS is all about... I bet I would've fooled around with CCM Girl too if she was willing to blow a crusty old fuck like me! What's the problem with a stiff ol' exec getting a little action? Us Fucktards get lonely once in a while too, you know.....