Charging Parents as Accomplices

[Anonymous]

The who wants studies to back the programs are bad mentality?  Sorry, but victims and there parents don't charge the programs thousands of dollars per month for the privilege, there is no money in the survivor side of this, so there is no one interested in paying for studies that support that side of things.  Parents are being robbed for the promise of help for their children, and a percentage of that money goes into priming the pump for the next bunch of parents the industry plans to dupe and then rob.  Of course Who can find a bunch of Surveys and Studies to back his point of view, the industry bought and paid for the results.  Here in realityland, survivors and parents are donating their own time and money without any promise of a payoff at the other end.  If you look at this with a little common sense, obviously the people who are not getting a payoff have less reason to be untruthful.  We don't get anything from this, but the abuse of people who don't want the stories told.  Parents like Pitbull mom have no reason to be untruthful, can you say the same for yourself Who?

[TheWho]

Thanks for the link,Niles, it states that the burden of proof lies on the shoulders of the one making the claims, which is you.  Lets go look at the post again.

Niles wrote:

But it seems [/u]

1.    Most parents just knee jerk into sending their kids away for treatment.
2.   That Ed Cons make up problems.
3.   The vast majority of children in programs don't need any help at all.

Again its only fair you hold yourself to the same standards.  So you need to defend these 3 positions, they were not made by any program , they were made by you.



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[Anonymous]

[TheWho]

The who wants studies to back the programs are bad mentality?  Sorry, but victims and there parents don't charge the programs thousands of dollars per month for the privilege, there is no money in the survivor side of this, so there is no one interested in paying for studies that support that side of things.  Parents are being robbed for the promise of help for their children, and a percentage of that money goes into priming the pump for the next bunch of parents the industry plans to dupe and then rob.  Of course Who can find a bunch of Surveys and Studies to back his point of view, the industry bought and paid for the results.  Here in realityland, survivors and parents are donating their own time and money without any promise of a payoff at the other end.  If you look at this with a little common sense, obviously the people who are not getting a payoff have less reason to be untruthful.  We don't get anything from this, but the abuse of people who don't want the stories told.  Parents like Pitbull mom have no reason to be untruthful, can you say the same for yourself Who?

Yes I can.



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[Anonymous]

[Nihilanthic]

Thanks for the link,Niles, it states that the burden of proof lies on the shoulders of the one making the claims, which is you.  Lets go look at the post again.

Niles wrote:

But it seems [/u]

1.    Most parents just knee jerk into sending their kids away for treatment.
2.   That Ed Cons make up problems.
3.   The vast majority of children in programs don't need any help at all.

Again its only fair you hold yourself to the same standards.  So you need to defend these 3 positions, they were not made by any program , they were made by you.



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The industry is the one making the claims. We're saying they need to prove them.

They have not. They claim they provide treatment and will prevent a child from being "Dead insane or in jail" and that without their treatment they would most definitely end up in such a situation.

Additionally ed-cons are the ones saying the children have problems, but they can't prove they do, as they can't diagnose anything.

And, finally, just because a parent THINKS something doesn't mean its real, and they're not proving anything is wrong with their children.

Nice try.

Billions of dollars, thousands of educated professionals (supposedly) and thirty years and they still can't even back up the most fundamental part of what they do with anything but subjective nonsense!

[TheWho]

Lets see you back your claims up for a change.  The industry didnt make them, you did, Niles... get moving and set an example.

So again, show us the studies which concluded that:

1. Most parents just knee jerk into sending their kids away for treatment.
2. That Ed Cons make up problems.
3. The vast majority of children in programs don't need any help at all.


These are your words, not anybody elses.



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[Nihilanthic]

If they can't back up their claims, then what I said they are doing has to be what they are doing!

Either they're backing up what they say, or they're spewing nonsense.

The burden of proof is on the industry, and no matter of linguistic bullshit is going to change that.

#1 is true if #2 and #3 are true.

#2 is true unless EdCons are doctors and actually diagnose children and teenagers. EVERY EdCon I have seen is nothing more than a salesman or saleswoman.

#3 is true unless the programs can prove they need help. They have not.

  :roll:

[Anonymous]

[TheWho]

If they can't back up their claims, then what I said they are doing has to be what they are doing!

Either they're backing up what they say, or they're spewing nonsense.

The burden of proof is on the industry, and no matter of linguistic bullshit is going to change that.

#1 is true if #2 and #3 are true.

#2 is true unless EdCons are doctors and actually diagnose children and teenagers. EVERY EdCon I have seen is nothing more than a salesman or saleswoman.

#3 is true unless the programs can prove they need help. They have not.

  :roll:

Wrong again, Niles:

Here read your own words (programs didnt say this you did):


So again, show us the studies which concluded that:

1. Most parents just knee jerk into sending their kids away for treatment.
2. That Ed Cons make up problems.
3. The vast majority of children in programs don't need any help at all.


These are your words, not anybody elses.



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[Nihilanthic]

I don't need to repeat what I just posted.

You need to learn to understand it.

[TheWho]

I don't need to repeat what I just posted.

You need to learn to understand it.

Thought you would come up empty.  

Just remember dont impose standards on others that you are not willing to live up to yourself.

Now dont flip out and start posting porn because you stepped in it, Niles.



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[Rachael]

The parents typically work very hard with local services and exhaust every option before choosing to place their child outside the home.  Don’t be fooled by what some say here, it is a very difficult decision.  Any parent that has kids and are faced with these decisions know what I am talking about.



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Well, you are partially right. My mother did do the rounds with local counselors, psychiatrists, detox centres and drug rehabilition programs (real ones). She took me to every one she could find, and every one told her that I was perfectly fine, so she had to find an appropriately money-oriented program that wouldn't care about that niggling little detail that I didn't have a problem. Lucky her, she found one right in town - and only $150/day (plus the mandatory galas to raise money, fundraising drives and hitting up your more powerful friends for more).

[TheWho]

The parents typically work very hard with local services and exhaust every option before choosing to place their child outside the home.  Don’t be fooled by what some say here, it is a very difficult decision.  Any parent that has kids and are faced with these decisions know what I am talking about.



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Well, you are partially right. My mother did do the rounds with local counselors, psychiatrists, detox centres and drug rehabilition programs (real ones). She took me to every one she could find, and every one told her that I was perfectly fine, so she had to find an appropriately money-oriented program that wouldn't care about that niggling little detail that I didn't have a problem. Lucky her, she found one right in town - and only $150/day (plus the mandatory galas to raise money, fundraising drives and hitting up your more powerful friends for more).

Rachael, I apologize if you have covered this many times over and I missed it.  But why did your mother think you had a problem if all the professionals in town thought you were okay?  I remember you saying you had high grades and all and you were not really big into substances (Drugs alcohol), why the detox?  She must have been hooked onto some notion that made her not believe the pros.  I missed that part of it, I guess.



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[hanzomon4]

The parents typically work very hard with local services and exhaust every option before choosing to place their child outside the home.  Don’t be fooled by what some say here, it is a very difficult decision.  Any parent that has kids and are faced with these decisions know what I am talking about.



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Well, you are partially right. My mother did do the rounds with local counselors, psychiatrists, detox centres and drug rehabilition programs (real ones). She took me to every one she could find, and every one told her that I was perfectly fine, so she had to find an appropriately money-oriented program that wouldn't care about that niggling little detail that I didn't have a problem. Lucky her, she found one right in town - and only $150/day (plus the mandatory galas to raise money, fundraising drives and hitting up your more powerful friends for more).

Rachael, I apologize if you have covered this many times over and I missed it.  But why did your mother think you had a problem if all the professionals in town thought you were okay?  I remember you saying you had high grades and all and you were not really big into substances (Drugs alcohol), why the detox?  She must have been hooked onto some notion that made her not believe the pros.  I missed that part of it, I guess.



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I would guess that notion she was hooked on was "I'm a crazy bitch", perhaps MBP aka Crazy bitch disorder...