Winning The Culture War

[Che Gookin]

I have zero faith in the ability of legislature in the area of passing effective regulations against TBS programmes. I've seen their ability to change to meet the new circumstances first hand. Congress will put on a big song and dance whilst programmes snigger and make a few superficial changes.
 

My thoughts on this calls for a long term war against the very roots of the problems. Or at least the part of the problem I believe that can be addressed in the area of the incredible ignorance that exists in our population to this very day. This is despite the fact that numerous websites, forums, books, and now movies exist.

Time and persistence will help reduce this ignorance in our society. Thoughts ideas and suggestions are being called for to address this matter. I've already started on a writing project of my own, put on hold due to my current vacation, but it will be finished.

IDEas biatches..

and not just Oh lets let Maia deal with it.

come on people.. takes an entire damn army not just one soldier.

[Ursus]

A MAJOR obstacle in trying to oust the Troubled Teen Industry has to do with the fact that it is a real money maker.  This has resulted in its being absorbed by the more pervasive, prolific, and highly entrenched substance abuse industry.  Witness CRC Health Corporation's acquisition of Aspen Educational Group in September/October of 2006.  Prior to branching out in the Residential Treatment arena, CRC Health was, and still remains, perhaps the largest non-government substance abuse provider in the United States.  "Non-government" may be in name only.  The former Director of the White House Office of Drug Control Policy, General Barry McCaffrey, is a prolific spokesperson for CRC Health's eGetgoing project, and on CRC's Board of Directors.

The financial markets have noticed, and are now involved in the buying and selling of these companys and institutions as viable, and lucrative, commodities.  Witness Bain Capital LLC's acquisition of CRC Health Corp. for $720 Million, a deal announced in October of 2005, and finalized in February of 2006.  Bain Capital, incidentally, was co-founded in 1984 by presidential candidate Mitt Romney.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bain_Capital

Legislation ain't gonna do shit when the seemingly sanctioned sources of finance are involved on this level.  Welcome to the New World Order.

[Che Gookin]

My original point about legislation being about as useful as a fart in the win just reinforced.. thank you Urusus.

However, what is it you suggest be done?

My growing focus will be to build the .info net even larger than it is now once I get back to korea, and to do some low level article writing.

Hopefully someone might notice the material that is on the .info net and make some intelligent choice regarding their children.

[Froderik]

Thank you for starting this thread, TSW. I share in you skepticism.

An idea: Aside from the positive side-effects of decriminalization, effective medication and a potential dent in alcoholism, the legalization of marijuana (and possibly other illicit substances) would make a statement of incredible gravity. Of course, it would take more than mere legislation to make this happen, but could perhaps be brought about in other ways (ask psy about this). However, if this law could eventually be passed, it would effectively be saying to us as a nation: "Looks like we {the government} was wrong about this thing all along. Looks like we really didn't know what was best for you, after all. Maybe people should think twice before believing what they are told to believe about something."

Programs are all about control. The legalization of pot would be a statement against the need for arbitrary control, and an admission that our government is capable of an error in judgement. Perhaps this notion would trickle down into other aspects of society...

[Che Gookin]

Hmm something more direct... perhaps an e-zine of sorts? Fornits is full of capable writers.

Message is spread..

following is gathered...

etc.

[Ursus]

Legislation is not entirely hopeless, TSW, but it is very slow in its coming.  You need to get people involved who are good at that sort of thing, and those people are generally not very versed in the TT industry.  And it can only do so much, but would it certainly help solidify that steps forward are more difficult to reverse.  Note that I said "solidify," not "ensure."

Frod's comment re. decriminalization of marijuana raises interesting historical context, as some people believe it was through the emphatic efforts of Hearst, Dupont, and one other company whose name escapes me at the moment, that marijuana ended up being criminalized in the first place.  Enlisting the self interests of the Federal Bureau of Narcotics clinched the matter and the rest is history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_hist ... ted_States

In the 17th century hemp was encouraged by the government in the production of rope, sails, and clothing; however, hemp use declined in the late eighteenth century. In the late nineteenth century, marijuana became a common ingredient in medicine and was openly sold at pharmacies.[2]

In 1916, United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) chief scientists Jason L. Merrill, Lyster H. Dewe, and Jason L. Merrill created paper made from hemp pulp, which they concluded was "favorable in comparison with those used with pulp wood in USDA Bulletin No. 404."[3] Jack Herer, in the book "The Emperor Wears No Clothes" summarized the findings of Bulletin No. 404:[4]

USDA Bulletin No. 404, reported that one acre of hemp, in annual rotation over a 20-year period, would produce as much pulp for paper as 4.1 acres of trees being cut down over the same 20-year period. This process would use only 1/4 to 1/7 as much polluting sulfur-based acid chemicals to break down the glue-like lignin that binds the fibers of the pulp, or even none at all using soda ash. The problem of dioxin contamination of rivers is avoided in the hemp paper making process, which does not need to use chlorine bleach (as the wood pulp paper making process requires) but instead safely substitutes hydrogen peroxide in the bleaching process. ... If the new (1916) hemp pulp paper process were legal today, it would soon replace about 70% of all wood pulp paper, including computer printout paper, corrugated boxes and paper bags.[/list]
These findings by the USDA triggered opposition from William Randolph Hearst and DuPont, as hemp was a direct competitor with products they produced. Some marijuana researchers believe marijuana would not have been criminalized if not for Hearst and DuPont's influence (See the DuPont and William Randolph Hearst section for further information).[/color][/list]
From introductory comments by David Solomon to the full text of The Marihuana Tax Act of 1937:
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/hem ... taxact.htm

The popular and therapeutic uses of hemp preparations are not categorically prohibited by the provisions of the Marihuana Tax Act of 1937. The apparent purpose of the Act is to levy a token tax of approximately one dollar on all buyers, sellers, importers, growers, physicians, veterinarians, and any other persons who deal in marijuana commercially, prescribe it professionally, or possess it.

The deceptive nature of that apparent purpose begins to come into focus when the reader reaches the penalty provisions of the Act: five years' imprisonment, a $2,000 fine, or both seem rather excessive for evading a sum (provided for by the purchase of a Treasury Department tax stamp) that, even if collected, would produce only a minute amount of government revenue. (Fines and jail sentences were f urther increased to the point of the cruel and unusual in subsequent federal drug legislation that incorporated the Marijuana Tax Act. It is now possible under the later version of the Act to draw a life sentence for selling just one marihuana cigarette to a minor.) One might wonder, too, why a small clause, amounting to an open-ended catchall provision, was inserted into the Act, authorizing the Secretary of the Treasury to grant the Commissioner (then Harry Anslinger) and agents of the Treasury Department's Bureau of Narcotics absolute administrative regulatory, and police powers in the enforcement of the law. The message becomes entirely clear when, having finished the short text of the Act itself, one proceeds to the sixty-odd pages of administrative and enforcement procedures established by the infamous Regulations No. 1. That regulation, not fully reproduced here, calls for a maze of affidavits, depositions, sworn statements, and constant Treasury Department police inspection in every instance that marijuana is bought, sold, used, raised, distributed, given away, and so on. Physicians who wish to purchase the one-dollar tax stamp so that they might prescribe it for their patients are forced to report such use to the Federal Bureau of Narcotics in sworn and attested detail, revealing the name and address of the patient, the nature of his ailment, the dates and amounts prescribed, and so on. If a physician for any reason fails to do so immediately, both he and his patient are liable to imprisonment-and a heavy fine. Obviously, the details of that regulation make it far too risky for anyone to have anything to do with marijuana in any way whatsoever.

Regulations No. 1 was more than an invasion of the traditional right of privacy between patient and physician; it was a hopelessly involved set of rules that were obviously designed not merely to discourage but to prohibit the medical and popular use of marijuana. In addition to the Marihuana Tax Act and Regulations No. 1, the Bureau of Narcotics prepared a standard bill for marihuana that more than forty state legislatures enacted. This bill made possession and use of marihuana illegal per se, and so reinforced the federal act.[/list]

All this underscores my premise that it is ultimately and primarily through economic self-interests that any legislation gets passed; in the above case, in a not necessarily progressive direction.

What economic self interests can be better served by criminalizing the TT industry?  The climate in this country, not to mention the world, seems to be currently moving towards more restriction and control, not less.

[Anonymous]

i agree with the legalization of marijuana being a huge social statement which would indirectly lead to more regulation of the tbs industry, but i think it will also polarize and radicalize the population, the people who are still brainwashed by anslinger propaganda will turn into radicals - you'll see alot more crazy parents screaming "oh will anyone think of the children blaaah...". i think we need to wait a few years untill that generation just dies [it's about time!], then it shouldnt be a problem. i think once our generation hits the house weed will most definitely become legal.

i think what we can start doing is educating parents, starting when their kids are in preschool about these institutions. bring it up at PTA meetings, etc. warn other parents about the potential danger. use the whole dateline NBC technique of using fear to spread the word. show them that these institutions are scary - show them that the institutions can do way more damage than any drug.

also hand out flyers at middle and high schools. inform kids of the potential threat. show them where to go and what to do if someone they know has been sent away. personally, even when i got back from hla, the kids at home had no idea where i was, or what the place was like. no matter how much i tried to explain what it was like they simply could not fathom it, they could not belive me, they still think i'm a liar and that these places are too illegal to exist. educate the populace.

another great idea is a parent boycott. if you know of a parent who has sent their kid away, who is away at the moment, boycott them. dont talk to them, refuse to let them in your house. make their lives miserable. have the kid's freinds hold protests outside the house (this actually worked once!!!!). if they come into your store or resturant, kick them out. cut them off on the road. be rude. throw salt on their lawn (maybe write out "child abuser" in salt on their lawn.  prank call them. throw trash on their yard. graffiti their house. make their lives miserable. if you can, try to get the whole town in on the shunning.

the only reason continue to send their kids away despite the warnings is a combination of desperation and because it's socially acceptable, almost even a fad. "johhny and sue down the block sent their kids away, why cant we?" i remember a few years ago i was on the bus and some women were talking about treatment centers, one had their kid at casa by the sea and the other was considering sending her daughter to P.V. well, i raised a big fuss, i screamed "child torturers", and gave the entire bus a quick summary of what Casa by the sea is, and that this woman sent her own daughter there. the whole bus started staring at them, giving them dirty looks, one guy even came up and spit on one of the woman....the woman then ordered the bus to stop, they got off, and as it was pulling away i saw one of them collapse in tears.  make it so that it's not socially acceptable for parents to send away kids. make it so that it's roughly as acceptable as branding your kids with an iron - and the industry will die.

[Anonymous]

i remember a few years ago i was on the bus and some women were talking about treatment centers, one had their kid at casa by the sea and the other was considering sending her daughter to P.V. well, i raised a big fuss, i screamed "child torturers", and gave the entire bus a quick summary of what Casa by the sea is, and that this woman sent her own daughter there. the whole bus started staring at them, giving them dirty looks, one guy even came up and spit on one of the woman....the woman then ordered the bus to stop, they got off, and as it was pulling away i saw one of them collapse in tears.  make it so that it's not socially acceptable for parents to send away kids. make it so that it's roughly as acceptable as branding your kids with an iron - and the industry will die.

I would of loved to see that!  

[Ursus]

...the only reason continue to send their kids away despite the warnings is a combination of desperation and because it's socially acceptable, almost even a fad.

Undeniable fact.  Nay, not even socially acceptable, but even a perverted form of status symbol, in cases where the institution in question costs big bucks.

Kind of reminds me of Jacques Tati's last film "Playtime."  There's a scene in a restaurant, which -- due to the owner's greed -- opened before the construction of building was even complete.  Predictably, the building begins to fall apart around them, since everyone has just got to attend this new, hip, and happening place.  Throngs of people are lined up at the door, clamoring to get in, pushing and conniving their way past the bouncers at the door.  In fact, part of the reason the building is falling apart is due to the shoving and other physicalities that people resort to in their goal of entrance, and the owner's greed in allowing too many of them in, more than the restaurant could even have accommodated once the building was complete.

One particular destination within this restaurant is the pinnacle of desirability, a seating area where the paint on the chairs has not yet dried.  The wrought iron design is that of a crown, and when people sit down, the design gets imprinted on their backs.  This imprint of the crown then becomes a status symbol, and everyone wants to become one of "the elite," branded by the crown. One of the customers sets up his own little fiefdom, accepting or denying access to this table (with the wet crown chairs) based on how much others suck up to him.  By this point, food is but incidental to the experience.  Things get violent, and all ends in a brawl...

[Anonymous]

I don't think it's as socially acceptable as you all think. Most parents tell their "real friends" their kid is at boarding school or something like that. Most families are embarrassed of their so called troubled teen, that is one reason they like these programs, they can make their kid disappear very quickly with no questions asked. Of course having your kid kidnapped from their room and taken to forced brainwashing sessions is not socially acceptable, not to anyone who has an inkling of knowledge of the reality of such a situation. These parents know what they are doing is wrong, they feel it in their gut. But they let whatever program salesperson 'talk them into it', in other words, confirm a terrible idea. They communicate with each other online, have support groups, even meet in person to wallow in self pity about how difficult their life is. What could they possibly mean, their life has not changed at all, but for the better, if their child was really troubled and they are getting help, why the worry- they should be happy, right? They are trying to escape the obvious fact that what they did was cruel, and use many means to do so. Including, volunteering to be brainwashed in parent seminars in certain programs and/or volunteer to market and even work for the program. They need to believe that which is not true. A lot of kids keep it secret when they get home too, who wants to explain to people where you had been, as if explanation is worthy of such a strange and surreal experience in human depravity.

[Froderik]

i think what we can start doing is educating parents, starting when their kids are in preschool about these institutions. bring it up at PTA meetings, etc. warn other parents about the potential danger. use the whole dateline NBC technique of using fear to spread the word. show them that these institutions are scary - show them that the institutions can do way more damage than any drug.

also hand out flyers at middle and high schools. inform kids of the potential threat. show them where to go and what to do if someone they know has been sent away. personally, even when i got back from hla, the kids at home had no idea where i was, or what the place was like. no matter how much i tried to explain what it was like they simply could not fathom it, they could not belive me, they still think i'm a liar and that these places are too illegal to exist. educate the populace.

another great idea is a parent boycott. if you know of a parent who has sent their kid away, who is away at the moment, boycott them. dont talk to them, refuse to let them in your house. make their lives miserable. have the kid's freinds hold protests outside the house (this actually worked once!!!!). if they come into your store or resturant, kick them out. cut them off on the road. be rude. throw salt on their lawn (maybe write out "child abuser" in salt on their lawn.  prank call them. throw trash on their yard. graffiti their house. make their lives miserable. if you can, try to get the whole town in on the shunning.

These are all excellent ideas!

the only reason continue to send their kids away despite the warnings is a combination of desperation and because it's socially acceptable, almost even a fad. "johhny and sue down the block sent their kids away, why cant we?" i remember a few years ago i was on the bus and some women were talking about treatment centers, one had their kid at casa by the sea and the other was considering sending her daughter to P.V. well, i raised a big fuss, i screamed "child torturers", and gave the entire bus a quick summary of what Casa by the sea is, and that this woman sent her own daughter there. the whole bus started staring at them, giving them dirty looks, one guy even came up and spit on one of the woman....the woman then ordered the bus to stop, they got off, and as it was pulling away i saw one of them collapse in tears.  make it so that it's not socially acceptable for parents to send away kids. make it so that it's roughly as acceptable as branding your kids with an iron - and the industry will die.

Yeah!!!! ::hehehmm:: ::rocker:: ::bwahaha2::

[Anne Bonney]

i agree with the legalization of marijuana being a huge social statement which would indirectly lead to more regulation of the tbs industry, but i think it will also polarize and radicalize the population, the people who are still brainwashed by anslinger propaganda will turn into radicals - you'll see alot more crazy parents screaming "oh will anyone think of the children blaaah...". i think we need to wait a few years untill that generation just dies [it's about time!], then it shouldnt be a problem. i think once our generation hits the house weed will most definitely become legal.

I hope and think it may come about, or at least start, even sooner than that.  It's not just the stiff in the suits though.  It's their benefactors...Big Pharma.  

i think what we can start doing is educating parents, starting when their kids are in preschool about these institutions. bring it up at PTA meetings, etc. warn other parents about the potential danger. use the whole dateline NBC technique of using fear to spread the word. show them that these institutions are scary - show them that the institutions can do way more damage than any drug.

also hand out flyers at middle and high schools. inform kids of the potential threat. show them where to go and what to do if someone they know has been sent away. personally, even when i got back from hla, the kids at home had no idea where i was, or what the place was like. no matter how much i tried to explain what it was like they simply could not fathom it, they could not belive me, they still think i'm a liar and that these places are too illegal to exist. educate the populace.

another great idea is a parent boycott. if you know of a parent who has sent their kid away, who is away at the moment, boycott them. dont talk to them, refuse to let them in your house. make their lives miserable. have the kid's freinds hold protests outside the house (this actually worked once!!!!). if they come into your store or resturant, kick them out. cut them off on the road. be rude. throw salt on their lawn (maybe write out "child abuser" in salt on their lawn.  prank call them. throw trash on their yard. graffiti their house. make their lives miserable. if you can, try to get the whole town in on the shunning.

the only reason continue to send their kids away despite the warnings is a combination of desperation and because it's socially acceptable, almost even a fad. "johhny and sue down the block sent their kids away, why cant we?"

:nworthy:  :nworthy:

i remember a few years ago i was on the bus and some women were talking about treatment centers, one had their kid at casa by the sea and the other was considering sending her daughter to P.V. well, i raised a big fuss, i screamed "child torturers", and gave the entire bus a quick summary of what Casa by the sea is, and that this woman sent her own daughter there. the whole bus started staring at them, giving them dirty looks, one guy even came up and spit on one of the woman....the woman then ordered the bus to stop, they got off, and as it was pulling away i saw one of them collapse in tears.  make it so that it's not socially acceptable for parents to send away kids. make it so that it's roughly as acceptable as branding your kids with an iron - and the industry will die.

 ::roflmao::  ::roflmao::  ::rocker::  ::rocker::  ::cheers::  :nworthy:  ::drummer::  ::drummer::  ::bwahaha::  ::bwahaha::  ::rocker::  ::roflmao::

[Anonymous]

i remember a few years ago i was on the bus and some women were talking about treatment centers, one had their kid at casa by the sea and the other was considering sending her daughter to P.V. well, i raised a big fuss, i screamed "child torturers", and gave the entire bus a quick summary of what Casa by the sea is, and that this woman sent her own daughter there. the whole bus started staring at them, giving them dirty looks, one guy even came up and spit on one of the woman....the woman then ordered the bus to stop, they got off, and as it was pulling away i saw one of them collapse in tears. make it so that it's not socially acceptable for parents to send away kids. make it so that it's roughly as acceptable as branding your kids with an iron - and the industry will die.

Please tell me this was caught on camera. Someone needs to Youtube this.

[3xsaSeedling]

It's the mentality that keeps all these 'kid farms' open.
moneymoneymoneymoneymoney
:flame: This is the kind of stuff that really sets me on fire. :flame:
'We've' created a disposable society where it's easier/cheaper to just replace what doesn't fit our plans.  
Sadly some children have fallen victim to this thinking, and are then used as examples for the whole.
We don't need 'better places':  we NEED BETTER PARENTS.          

::poke::
I do enjoy watching 'the poking of TheBear'
One of these times, ::poke::  TheBear is going to turn around and take that stick ::poke:: , and ...
I'll enjoy watching that alot more   ::seg::

[TheWho]

another great idea is a parent boycott. if you know of a parent who has sent their kid away, who is away at the moment, boycott them. dont talk to them, refuse to let them in your house. make their lives miserable. have the kid's freinds hold protests outside the house (this actually worked once!!!!). if they come into your store or resturant, kick them out. cut them off on the road. be rude. throw salt on their lawn (maybe write out "child abuser" in salt on their lawn. prank call them. throw trash on their yard. graffiti their house. make their lives miserable. if you can, try to get the whole town in on the shunning.

the only reason continue to send their kids away despite the warnings is a combination of desperation and because it's socially acceptable, almost even a fad. "johhny and sue down the block sent their kids away, why cant we?" i remember a few years ago i was on the bus and some women were talking about treatment centers, one had their kid at casa by the sea and the other was considering sending her daughter to P.V. well, i raised a big fuss, i screamed "child torturers", and gave the entire bus a quick summary of what Casa by the sea is, and that this woman sent her own daughter there. the whole bus started staring at them, giving them dirty looks, one guy even came up and spit on one of the woman....the woman then ordered the bus to stop, they got off, and as it was pulling away i saw one of them collapse in tears. make it so that it's not socially acceptable for parents to send away kids. make it so that it's roughly as acceptable as branding your kids with an iron - and the industry will die.

Boycott or shunning wont work IMO.  You need to try to get involved on a personal level and try to help instead of getting into someones face.  When my daughter attend ASR there were people who disapproved of our decision and some were outspoken and wanted to know what circumstanced and actions we took prior the decision etc.  But they see now that it was a good one, she is doing well and has moved on with her life.  Some of the people who questioned our decision have children who are not doing that great, one of which is in prison, another who is so heavily into drugs it seems to have taken over his life, cant keep a job or an apartment.  But there are kids that made it thru, don’t get me wrong.  It’s a tough call…….

 My point is that we cant go around telling other people how to raise their kids or when to seek outside help and boycotting them because they don’t do what we think is right.

I have a neighbor whose child would greatly benefit from outside help, local therapist maybe, but she will not hear any of it.  I think a little advice is good, maybe information in the mail.  But I don’t think writing Graffiti all over her house or shunning her would benefit her or her daughter.