Suicide at AAA

[Anne Bonney]

Many parents do thank the schools...if you look at how a child is as they enter and then look at the path they are on when they leave and the productive lives they go on to lead, you would thank the school also...... there is an extremely high rate of suicide and homicides in the public sector for the age range of these kids........  these public schools are a safe haven for them to thrive and grow in.

This is not my opinion, the numbers support this.

Show me number of independent, long term, clinical research that indicates that ANYTHING the programs do has been successful.  Not parent exit surveys.  

Parents thank the programs for turning their kids into obedient little drones that 'carry the message'.  Don't kid yourself by thinking any different.  Parents have absolutely no idea what really happens behind closed doors.  That's why the communication between parent and child is so restricted.  Especially at first.  Can't have these kids 'manipulating' their parents with the truth now, can we?  They need to be sufficiently 'washed' before programs can trust them to be around people without immediate supervision.

[hanzomon4]

Many parents do thank the schools...if you look at how a child is as they enter and then look at the path they are on when they leave and the productive lives they go on to lead, you would thank the school also...... there is an extremely high rate of suicide and homicides in the public sector for the age range of these kids........  these public schools are a safe haven for them to thrive and grow in.

This is not my opinion, the numbers support this.

Ass, parents thanked Straight parents thank WWASPS... Hell even if the kid says they were raped the parents still thank the fucking school.

And your Stats or BS for many reasons, one of which is numbers. The number of kids in Public school is much higher then the number of kids in Private prisons, this plays to your employers advantage in any stats you provide for them. Second as Anne has pointed out the reason kids die in programs is not the same reason kids die in Private Prisons. I.E. not many kids die in school because they are called fakers and denied medical care, not many are forced to humiliate themselves to the point of wanting to commit suicide, or die because of forced marches in crazy ass temps for crackerjack therapy.

Again Shut up.....

[Anonymous]

You do not know nothing about the mother of the boy that hung himself.  I heard she did not want him sent out there anyway.   She wanted him near home.  By, what I've heard, there are about 10 things that AAA did wrong.  They also lost a son in a car wreck in 2003, he was 16.  This son is 17 and they can not disclose what all went wrong.  The mother wants to bring it out in the open and take AAA to court so another parent does not have to live go through the anguish she is going through.  Nothing is finalized the last thing I heard.  She has no more children so instead of putting her down say a prays for her.  She needs them!!

[hanzomon4]

You do not know nothing about the mother of the boy that hung himself.  I heard she did not want him sent out there anyway.   She wanted him near home.  By, what I've heard, there are about 10 things that AAA did wrong.  They also lost a son in a car wreck in 2003, he was 16.  This son is 17 and they can not disclose what all went wrong.  The mother wants to bring it out in the open and take AAA to court so another parent does not have to live go through the anguish she is going through.  Nothing is finalized the last thing I heard.  She has no more children so instead of putting her down say a prays for her.  She needs them!!

If you know her have her get in touch with PitBull Mom, she last her son in another Aspen program this year. You can email her at [email protected]. Good luck and you got my prayers.

[TheWho]

Many parents do thank the schools...if you look at how a child is as they enter and then look at the path they are on when they leave and the productive lives they go on to lead, you would thank the school also...... there is an extremely high rate of suicide and homicides in the public sector for the age range of these kids........  these public schools are a safe haven for them to thrive and grow in.

This is not my opinion, the numbers support this.

Ass, parents thanked Straight parents thank WWASPS... Hell even if the kid says they were raped the parents still thank the fucking school.

And your Stats or BS for many reasons, one of which is numbers. The number of kids in Public school is much higher then the number of kids in Private prisons, this plays to your employers advantage in any stats you provide for them. Second as Anne has pointed out the reason kids die in programs is not the same reason kids die in Private Prisons. I.E. not many kids die in school because they are called fakers and denied medical care, not many are forced to humiliate themselves to the point of wanting to commit suicide, or die because of forced marches in crazy ass temps for crackerjack therapy.

Again Shut up.....

No I wont shut up, as long as the truth is not being heard or is being distorted….
I do you know why the kids are committing suicide?  If you have this information you should pass it along to the parents, not here on fornits, because many of them do not know themselves and would like answers.

Many more kids are dying in the public sector, thousands and thousands each year.  The TBS industry losses maybe 1 per year or less.  Of course they are a smaller number as compared to the public sector, parents know this.  But if you compare all the at-risk children who are placed in a TBS setting and the rate of death is extremely low then that is saying something.

Give credit where credit is due… the numbers do not lie.  TBS are a safe alternative for at risk youths and it is proven over and over again….. are there kids that they wont be able to reach?  Of course… they cant save them all but they wish they could.

[hanzomon4]

Many parents do thank the schools...if you look at how a child is as they enter and then look at the path they are on when they leave and the productive lives they go on to lead, you would thank the school also...... there is an extremely high rate of suicide and homicides in the public sector for the age range of these kids........  these public schools are a safe haven for them to thrive and grow in.

This is not my opinion, the numbers support this.

Ass, parents thanked Straight parents thank WWASPS... Hell even if the kid says they were raped the parents still thank the fucking school.

And your Stats or BS for many reasons, one of which is numbers. The number of kids in Public school is much higher then the number of kids in Private prisons, this plays to your employers advantage in any stats you provide for them. Second as Anne has pointed out the reason kids die in programs is not the same reason kids die in Private Prisons. I.E. not many kids die in school because they are called fakers and denied medical care, not many are forced to humiliate themselves to the point of wanting to commit suicide, or die because of forced marches in crazy ass temps for crackerjack therapy.

Again Shut up.....

No I wont shut up, as long as the truth is not being heard or is being distorted….
I do you know why the kids are committing suicide?  If you have this information you should pass it along to the parents, not here on fornits, because many of them do not know themselves and would like answers.

Many more kids are dying in the public sector, thousands and thousands each year.  The TBS industry losses maybe 1 per year or less.  Of course they are a smaller number as compared to the public sector, parents know this.  But if you compare all the at-risk children who are placed in a TBS setting and the rate of death is extremely low then that is saying something.

Give credit where credit is due… the numbers do not lie.  TBS are a safe alternative for at risk youths and it is proven over and over again….. are there kids that they wont be able to reach?  Of course… they cant save them all but they wish they could.

Proven my ass, The decades of abuse from these programs says that it don't work. The folks with  ptsd and the ones in the ground show that it don't work. All the times your wonderful CEDUs closed down and changed names to avoid it's past screams "It don't work". The APA made a statement: It don't work. Nothing but programmie shrills like you say that it does work. Everything else including common sense says that locking kids up makes them worse, add crackerjack therapy and well.....

Why do program kids kill themselves??? Ummm... Read Psy's benchmark site he explains it all pretty well. If you would listen to what folks said around here without interjecting the shit you are paid to spout you would know already.

If you don't want the truth distorted take my advice, Shut up.......

[TheWho]

Hanzomon4 wrote:

The folks with ptsd and the ones in the ground show that it don't work

You should read more outside of fornits, ptsd existed long before TBS’s came into existence and the other I think we can conclude the public sector is much more dangerous, especially, for children at risk.

Why do program kids kill themselves??? Ummm... Read Psy's benchmark site he explains it all pretty well. If you would listen to what folks said around here without interjecting the shit you are paid to spout you would know already.

Why do 1,500 kids kill themselves each year in the public sector?  These are kids that have never seen, been near or had the benefit of attending a Therapeutic boarding school, that’s over 100/month.  Now take these same at-risk kids and put them into a therapeutic environment and those numbers go away.  We see thousands of kids graduate each year and get back on track and lead productive lives and are not statistics of death like they may have been….yes, a few cannot be reached, but dam Hanzo who is paying you?  I dont get paid for my opinions (well, at least not on fornits), lets not blame the schools for this…these kids come in with preconditions, Ptsd, depression, cutting themselves etc.



...

[hanzomon4]

Hanzomon4 wrote:

The folks with ptsd and the ones in the ground show that it don't work

You should read more outside of fornits, ptsd existed long before TBS’s came into existence and the other I think we can conclude the public sector is much more dangerous, especially, for children at risk.

Why do program kids kill themselves??? Ummm... Read Psy's benchmark site he explains it all pretty well. If you would listen to what folks said around here without interjecting the shit you are paid to spout you would know already.

Why do 1,500 kids kill themselves each year in the public sector?  These are kids that have never seen, been near or had the benefit of attending a Therapeutic boarding school, that’s over 100/month.  Now take these same at-risk kids and put them into a therapeutic environment and those numbers go away.  We see thousands of kids graduate each year and get back on track and lead productive lives and are not statistics of death like they may have been….yes, a few cannot be reached, but dam Hanzo who is paying you?  I dont get paid for my opinions (well, at least not on fornits), lets not blame the schools for this…these kids come in with preconditions, Ptsd, depression, cutting themselves etc.



...

There you go again......

Kids don't get ptsd from learning science, however they do get ptsd from being forced to talk about rapes and participate in life steps, psychodramas, and confrontational group qwack therapy. Get your head out of your employers ass.

Your numbers mean nothing. More suicides happened in the public sector then in Abu ghraib. According to your logic Abu ghraib must be a safe place. Remember your industry has no independent evidence to back up the claims you throw around. Your employers only have claims and and bunch of hurt survivors that you try not to listen too when they say you abuse kids. Your industry also has decades of proven abuse stemming from when you tried the same shit you are doing today. Yes parents the crap they pass off as cutting edge therapy is the same stuff they have been successfully sued over renamed.

[TheWho]

Honzomon4 wrote:

Your numbers mean nothing. More suicides happened in the public sector then in Abu ghraib. According to your logic Abu ghraib must be a safe place.

I really don’t know if the people there were at risk of suicide before they went in…I don’t believe they would be considered high risk in this area, so I don’t see how we can compare.  The kids going to TBS, for the most part, come from a high-risk group, so we need to take this into consideration.

 

Remember your industry has no independent evidence to back up the claims you throw around.

I haven’t seen much in the way of studies being reported or supporting your claims either.

Your employers only have claims and and bunch of hurt survivors that you try not to listen too when they say you abuse kids. Your industry also has decades of proven abuse stemming from when you tried the same shit you are doing today.

So what does your boss say, how would you know what my boss says or if I even have a boss and if he is even interested in the TBS industry.

Yes parents the crap they pass off as cutting edge therapy is the same stuff they have been successfully sued over renamed.

The parents are not going to make a decision on their kids future based on an angry internet site.  They will call a few schools and ask to speak to some parents who had kids attend and get a feel for if it is the right fit for their child.  Then take a trip over and meet some of the kids who are locked in their cells… oh wait, I am sure they will let them out before you arrive to make a good appearance and then pre-program them to say they are happy there.  Lets be honest!!

Sorry, a little late night humor……we don’t see enough of that around here.

[MOMMABEAR]

you know at this point the one fact that we should all be able to agree on is this:    the 17 year old child that we are currently talking about had two parents who loved him very much the fact that they had already lost their only other child only increased their desperation to save him. even though the parents may not have agreed on where to get him help they did agree that he needed help. this was a wonderful ,caring and loving young man who did not do drugs was not a bad kid he was just very sad and very unhappy and no body knew how to fix the problem because no one was sure what the problem was. after several threatened and attempted suicides the decision was made for him to go to aspen achievement academy because according to what they advertise they would help him learn what the issues were and how to deal with them while they were keeping him safe from himself and others. SO I GUESS THE QUESTION IS WHAT PART OF THEIR ADVERTISING WAS INCORRECT THE PART WHERE THEY WOULD HELP HIM OR THE PART WHERE THEY WOULD KEEP HIM SAFE? I would have to say in my opinion they failed on both parts rather they have helped other kids is not even the question or the point. The point is they failed horribly on this child and now everyone who had ever had the pleasure of knowing him must now suffer for their failure to provide what they advertised. I'm not talking out of my ass i know this child very well. Also parents dont take out loans for thousands of dollars to get their children help if they dont truly believe they are doing the right thing. If they had all of the information before they make these choices then they would also know the risk involved. this will only stop when cases like this stop being swept under the rug so that people know children are being mistreated and dying right under our noses. All of this is happening at the places that are supposed to help them and protect them.

[hanzomon4]

^Can read that who?

Oh, and your late night humor is not that far off the mark from what has been reported by survivors of programs, even your CEDU-Aspens. You are such a loon, regardless my fun with you is over now.

[Anonymous]

CAPTCHA-- field corpses  :rofl:

From Wiki

It is not my intent to become involved in an argument over the proper use and definition of the word "detainee". However, this debate has been recently brought to my attention, and I feel the need to contribute. As an Aspen Achievement Academy "alumni" or survivor, the question of whether or not I felt like a "detainee" has been posed to me. The answer to that question is "yes". This is my story:

I ask that any parent thinking about enrolling their child in The Aspen Achievement Academy, to please reconsider. As a former student of the program myself, this request stems from my first hand experiences in the program. Please be for warned that the organization’s advertisements are misleading. I did not see any of the literature provided to my parents until after my return from Utah. After the initial review of a videotape, and several pamphlets provided by the program, I was disgusted. Aspen did not accurately portray itself. My parents were shocked when I came home and they saw the evidence in my backpack, and heard my stories. They had no idea what they had really signed me up for. According to advertisements for the Aspen Achievement Academy, the program resembled a rugged, yet therapeutic summer camp experience. In reality, this could not have been farther than the truth.

It has been nearly twelve years since I spent those two months in the Utah wilderness, and my experience there still haunts me to this day. The extensive neglect that my fellow students and I experienced was unacceptable. I’ll never forget May 11th, 1994. It’s a date that will trouble me for the rest of my life. That morning two strangers awakened me at 5 am. They ordered me to get up and get dressed "because I was going to Utah for a long time". I told them "I couldn’t go to Utah; I had to go to school that day!" However, as it turned out I had no choice. After a lengthy physical struggle with these people, I found myself forced onto a second rate airplane (who’s ever heard of “Morrisâ€

[Anonymous]

Also interesting to note, Aspen is the largest employer in Wayne County.

Wayne County's Largest Employers
Annual Averages 2006

Company  -  Industry  -   Employment
Aspen Ranch Residential Care 100-249
Aspen Achievement Academy Outpatient Care Center 100-249
Wayne County School District Public Education 100-249
Federal Government Federal Government 100-249
Passages to Recovery Educational Services 20-49
Brown Brothers Construction Heavy Construction 20-49
Royal's Market Grocery Store 20-49
Wayne County Local Government 20-49
Wayne Community Health Centers Health Care 20-49
Harward & Rees Commercial Construction 20-49
State of Utah State Government 20-49
GarKane Power Association Electric Utility 10-19
Capitol Reef Inn and Café Accommodations/Restaurant 10-19
Café Diablo Restaurant 10-19
Wonderland Inn Accommodations 10-19
Jackson Excavation Site Preparation Contractor 10-19
Sunglow Family Restaurant and Motel Accommodations/Restaurant 10-19
Torrey Day's Inn Accommodations 10-19
Chuckwagon General Store General Merchandise Store 10-19
The Rimrock Restaurant Restaurant 10-19
Fremont Express Restaurant 10-19
Red Cliff Restaurant Restaurant 10-19
Taft Travel Plaza Gas Station/Convenience Store 10-19
Capitol Reef Resort Accommodations 10-19
Stan's Burger Shak Fast Food Restaurant 10-19
Source: Utah Department of Workforce Services, Workforce Information
Updated May 2007.

[Anonymous]

you know at this point the one fact that we should all be able to agree on is this:    the 17 year old child that we are currently talking about had two parents who loved him very much the fact that they had already lost their only other child only increased their desperation to save him. even though the parents may not have agreed on where to get him help they did agree that he needed help. this was a wonderful ,caring and loving young man who did not do drugs was not a bad kid he was just very sad and very unhappy and no body knew how to fix the problem because no one was sure what the problem was. after several threatened and attempted suicides the decision was made for him to go to aspen achievement academy because according to what they advertise they would help him learn what the issues were and how to deal with them while they were keeping him safe from himself and others. SO I GUESS THE QUESTION IS WHAT PART OF THEIR ADVERTISING WAS INCORRECT THE PART WHERE THEY WOULD HELP HIM OR THE PART WHERE THEY WOULD KEEP HIM SAFE? I would have to say in my opinion they failed on both parts rather they have helped other kids is not even the question or the point. The point is they failed horribly on this child and now everyone who had ever had the pleasure of knowing him must now suffer for their failure to provide what they advertised. I'm not talking out of my ass i know this child very well. Also parents dont take out loans for thousands of dollars to get their children help if they dont truly believe they are doing the right thing. If they had all of the information before they make these choices then they would also know the risk involved. this will only stop when cases like this stop being swept under the rug so that people know children are being mistreated and dying right under our noses. All of this is happening at the places that are supposed to help them and protect them.

Can ANYONE post a link to any news article about a 2007 suicide at AAA? I cannot find it anywere on the net, only an attempted suicide some years back. I keep seeing posts by Mommabear about a suicide at AAA but I cannot find any proof that it happened. I am trying to help out Pitbull Mom by collecting EVERY news article about EVERY documented abuse or death at EVERY ASPEN program, so she will have it for Youth Care's upcoming licensing hearing in regards to her son's death in June from medical neglect. She has posted on many forums, but very few people have stepped up with documentation that can help. It seems that a lot of people have time to bitch and moan about abuse, but when it comes time to actually DOING something concrete, very few take the time to step up and help with verifiable information that can be used in court.

Come on people - STEP UP TO THE PLATE HERE.  a young boy died. Let's help mom get those bastards.

Psy, if you're reading  this, PLEASE go to Draper.

And everyone PLEASE ignore The Who, it just junks up the threads and keeps people from reading on.

[TheWho]

PLEASE ignore The Who, it just junks up the threads and keeps people from reading on.

Hey, that was uncalled for...we have been sitting thru all your posts and bumps, why not PM people instead of bothering us.