Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Teen Challenge

A Few Websites To Read Other's Thoughts on Teen Challenge

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Antigen:
Aw, thanks for your concern. But really, I'm fine. Not losing it at all. Actually just sort of enjoying another beautiful Spring day and trying to nail down a paying gig or three before I go play for a couple of days.

You're right. I'm almost completely ignorant of TC, except for the obvious cultish bullshit that anyone can see and having had a couple of friends over the years who either went through it or have friends and loved ones who have. It would be rather silly of me to waste my time and money "researching" an organization by buying their own propaganda, wouldn't it? No, I've found it works a whole lot better to just be patient and ask around till a fair number of people who have actually had some dealings with the organization have had a chance to tell their stories, compare notes and come to some understanding with one another about just what manner of beast chewed them up and spit them out. You'll get there. Don't worry! Just keep on going....  :rofl:


--- Quote ---The truth is she is someone who doesn't believe in residential drug treatment and tha tis what is driving her attacks against Teen Challenge.
--- End quote ---


Except for Delancy Street. I find that rather odd. I don't know a whole lot about DS either, as ppl just haven't chattered that much about it. But I expect we'll be finding out more about it as time goes on. All the best to ya! Oh, btw, while we're all making friends and getting to know one another I wouldn't want you to feel left out. Here are a list of names of people like minded to you who have posted to this site and who you might look up and make some friends too.

The Seed:
John Underwood
Thom (aka Arrogant Bastard... my brother, btw)
Ft. Lauderdale (everybody knows who this is, but we're not supposed to speak his name... starts with a T)

Abundant Life Academy:
Craig Rogers

Oh, well, that's about all I have time to think about right now. Maybe somebody else can suggest a few friends for you so you won't be so all alone at this party.

hanzomon4:

--- Quote from: ""Firebird81"" ---Also, Antigen's Ghost, what do you think is an effective way to help people cure their drug addiction? I've been browsing your site and see nothing that offers alternate solutions to helping addicts. What I see see is a general position that all residential rehabs are cults or cult-like---largely because they are reisdential and have rules. So, the military is also a cult, then......
--- End quote ---


No, most programs that operate share a bloodline that leads back to Synanon. Synanon is a cult and most programs conform to a few if not all of the tactic types of thought reform. Whether you see it are not TC has a lot of power over their wards and it appears that TC's main goal is to gain more followers(proselytize?). The question becomes is this about religion or rehab. In the questions I asked about the program you never said anything about providing medical care for addicts withdrawal symptoms. The power balance between the program and the court appointed clients is troubling because it takes treatment and turns it into a convert or go to jail situation.

There's nothing wrong with a Christian run rehab but the priority must be given to rehabilitation which must be based on science. Faith can be incorporated, and included but in no way does it replace science in regards to rehabilitation. The information you've given us reads like a policy manual. I have read many policy manuals and what actually goes on in program is usually quiet different.

When I have time I'll ask more questions.....

Firebird81:

--- Quote ---No, most programs that operate share a bloodline that leads back to Synanon. Synanon is a cult and most programs conform to a few if not all of the tactic types of thought reform.
--- End quote ---
But Teen Challenge was around BEFORE Synanon and started over 3000 miles away in the projects of Spanish harlem. It is not based on any model that aims to tear the individual down and then rebuild them into anything. It is based solely on introducing people to the Christian life and discipling them.


--- Quote ---The question becomes is this about religion or rehab.
--- End quote ---
Well, now THAT'S a great question! And the answer is this--both. Teen Challenge was founded on the belief of the restorative power of Jesus Christ. They believe He is the great healer and free someone from the bonds of addiction. They also believe in the great commission, where Christ told his disciples to go into the world and preach the Word, reaching out to others---yes, prosyletizing. But will you give me that prosyletizing is pretty much a common practice thruout Christianity? The program curriculum is based on applying Biblical principles to to help overcome life's problems and daily struggles. So, yeah, it's about both.


 
--- Quote ---In the questions I asked about the program you never said anything about providing medical care for addicts withdrawal symptoms.
--- End quote ---
No medical care is provided for withdrawal. Speed freaks and crackheads tend to sleep it off for a couple days, while heroin an barbiturate addicts have to go thru full withdrawal and TC will make them do it cold turkey if they do so in the facility. Someone is usually assigned to provide whatever assistance they need and most centers will hook them up with the chocolate fix (sweets tend to help take the edge off). Obviously sometimes a heroin withdrawal can be life threatening, so an addict tha thasn't kicked before and has been using large amounts would be better served going into detox first.

 
--- Quote ---The power balance between the program and the court appointed clients is troubling because it takes treatment and turns it into a convert or go to jail situation.
--- End quote ---
This is a recurring concern, and I DO see the potential for abuse of said power, but in all my years with TC I never saw more than 10% of students in the entire program who were court ordered. Most TC students are genuinely seeking help from addiction. And I can also say with full certainty tha tit is not a policy of Ten Challenge to hold jail sentences over the heads of any student. That doesn't mean that some hot-headed staff member hasn't shot his dumb mouth off, but it's not a part of the program and is not supposed to happen.

There's nothing wrong with a Christian run rehab but the priority must be given to rehabilitation which must be based on science. Faith can be incorporated, and included but in no way does it replace science in regards to rehabilitation. The information you've given us reads like a policy manual. I have read many policy manuals and what actually goes on in program is usually quiet different.

When I have time I'll ask more questions.....[/quote]

Firebird81:

--- Quote --- No, I've found it works a whole lot better to just be patient and ask around till a fair number of people who have actually had some dealings with the organization have had a chance to tell their stories, compare notes and come to some understanding with one another about just what manner of beast chewed them up and spit them out. You'll get there. Don't worry! Just keep on going....  :rofl:
--- End quote ---
Fair enough, and I will point to the very topics Karly keeps pointing everyone to. There are a few who complain in those topics and quite a few more praise what TC has done for them or a family member. I have no doubt whatsoever that will continue play out in that manner.


--- Quote ---Except for Delancy Street. I find that rather odd. I don't know a whole lot about DS either, as ppl just haven't chattered that much about it. But I expect we'll be finding out more about it as time goes on.
--- End quote ---
Delancey street seems to be very politically connected in San Francisco. What little I have been able find out suggests that they are similar to Phoenix house. But then again, that's going more on a couple of internet postings.


 
--- Quote ---All the best to ya! Oh, btw, while we're all making friends and getting to know one another I wouldn't want you to feel left out. Here are a list of names of people like minded to you who have posted to this site and who you might look up and make some friends too.

The Seed:
John Underwood
Thom (aka Arrogant Bastard... my brother, btw)
Ft. Lauderdale (everybody knows who this is, but we're not supposed to speak his name... starts with a T)

Abundant Life Academy:
Craig Rogers

Oh, well, that's about all I have time to think about right now. Maybe somebody else can suggest a few friends for you so you won't be so all alone at this party.
--- End quote ---


I am here for one reason. The truth is, Michael, KArly and anyone on this site who espouse their position are not going to hurt Teen Challenge. It is too large, too old and has far too many success stories. It has been openly endorsed by 4 sitting Presidents, countless Governors, mayors, congress members from both parties, celebritiess and community leaders. I am not here to protect Teen Challenge.

My concern is that people looking for help may be naively turned away from a great program that can offer help and has to so many people. Drug addiction is a plague of the worst kind to thhose who must endure it. It's one thing to warn people of an abusive organization. But in the case of TC, that is not an accurate portrayal.

In any event enjoy t he Spring day. Summe ris coming and it's gonna be hot and sweaty out here.

Antigen:
Man, nothing like a walk on a beautiful spring day! Dawg killed and burried a groundhog way down on a steepish part of riverbank. She's the proudest! I'm feeling much better now too.


--- Quote ---My concern is that people looking for help may be naively turned away from a great program that can offer help and has to so many people. Drug addiction is a plague of the worst kind to thhose who must endure it. It's one thing to warn people of an abusive organization. But in the case of TC, that is not an accurate portrayal.

--- End quote ---


Dude, I believe you believe what you're saying, but that's the basis for every single Synanon/Oxford type cult scapegoats and dehumanizes their critics. When my brother let me stay with his family till I was legally free of Straight, my mother described it as the time Jim tried to kill Ginger. She was completely serious! Hysterical. And I've stood so accused by a long line of combative Stepcraft practitioners and other people who put way too much stock in advice from their invisible friends.

It's ok to have an invisible friend if you want. But it's important to remember humility--that your idea of the nature and intent of your invisible friend is mostly the product of your imagination even if the invisible friend itself does turn out to be real as anything on judgement day, your imagination can rather often be inaccurate.

That's the first trouble with coercive rehab. To put it in pschrink-speak, a therapeutic relationship must rest on trust. Coercion destroys trust. Therefore there is no such thing as coerced therapy.

In the words of a poet, coerced therapy is about like coerced intimacy. There's a word for it. It's a felony.

In practical terms, you could go your whole life brutally traumatizing vulnerable people and never even know you're a monster. All you have to do is dismiss and discredit anybody who tries to present evidence of it to you.

The second trouble with the entire idea is the very basis of it's stated mission. Forced treatment seeks to "cure" the "disease" of addiction. But addiction is not a disease. That was just some bullshit Bill Wilson and his drinkin and skirt chasing club came up with, probably more to hook into the popularity of patent medicines and treatments at the time than any other reason. Remember that this cult got it's start during the daze of L. Ron Hubbard, the Chittaquas, spas and Dr. Linda Hazzard's miraculous starvation cure.

If anybody wants good advice and a broad range of strategies to best deal with a dope habit, you could do worse than to ask RTP2003 or others you find around here or look into Maia Szalavitz's book,  Recovery Options: The Complete Guide.  There are also groups like rational recovery and temperance (not abstinance) movements here and there. If you look hard enough, you'll find a very broad range going back as far as hairless monkeys like us started scratching figures on rocks. This is not a horrifying plague that threatens to destroy all of civilization. Morbid or even just troublesome addiction usually effects somewhere between 1% and 4 or 5% of any given population. The only correlation we know of is stress level. Even water buffalo in Vietnam would chow down on the wild hemp when the shelling started then go back to their usual water fare soon after it stopped.

Right now, in modern day America, we're right at about %3, which is right where we started prior to the Harrison Narcotics Act.

But my biggest trouble with forced treatment is that, in this case, it is forced upon us by our government through grant funding, judicial mandate and free-handed spending on propaganda. "Our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer."

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