Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Teen Challenge

Trying to figure out your angle

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Antigen:
That's really not a compelling argument, Firebird. All these programs say the same thing and they're all lying.

OverLordd:
Ok, you say she was alowed to leave. Lets look at the options here to support that she was not really coerced. She was allowed to leave you say. Ok, so her parents were suposed to come down and get her? What if they wouldent? They were trying to force her into the program anyway. Was staff going to drive her home? Or was she just alowed to walk out? gee, a 16 to 17 year old girl in the middle of a major city, without any resorces, sounds safe dose it not? She was forced to go because of the options presented to her.

She was a homosexual, and a wiccian. A alternative religion if there ever was one.

Your Assemblies of God, your not main line, your pentacostal. Dont you dare compair Assemblies of God to Baptist of Lutheran. You believe in laying hands on healing, you believe in speaking in tongues, thats all herticial at worst, self deception at best. Those gifts ended at the end of the apostolic era, when there were no more apostles to continue the gift. While you do follow the main points theologically, largely your a bunch of snake handelers.

As for your last snide comment, I do believe God has killed people in both the old and new testaments, again and again, conistantly condeming those that do wrong. God gets angry, and I can to.

BuzzKill:
///You believe in laying hands on healing, you believe in speaking in tongues, thats all herticial at worst, self deception at best. Those gifts ended at the end of the apostolic era, when there were no more apostles to continue the gift. While you do follow the main points theologically, largely your a bunch of snake handelers. ///

I would like to respectfully disagree overlord.

Those who say the gifts came to an end are only reaching for an excuse for their lack of them. Their faith is often luke warm, at best.
See Rev. 3 and the letter to Laodicea.

Those who say the gift's of the Holy Sprit only came to those whom the Apostles touched - the laying on of their hands - are just wrong. Read the book of Acts. Read Paul's first letter to the Corinthians. In I Corinthian's chapter 13 for example, you'll read about when the gifts shall end - and it has not yet come to pass for any of us  

In Chapter 14 Paul outlines the various gifts - tell us to ask for them - even the best of them - He dose not say find an apostle and have him lay hands on you - He says if you want the Holy Sprit to provide you with His gifts - Ask.

In Acts you'll read how whole groups had the Sprit fall upon them and how gentiles were also blessed.

The gifts from the Holy Sprit are as Biblical as the message of Salvation. Would you say the fruits of the Sprit have ceased? I think not - so why would the gifts?

Still, I will acknowledge that there is a great deal of false teaching among some A of G and Pentecostal groups. I think they do sometimes approach heresy - sometimes they produce false prophets and teachers - as evil in their motives and teaching as any cult leader. I often fear that the sprit let loose upon their congregations is not at all Holy.

This is why I advise people not to assume any teacher or preacher is to be believed. Read the Book yourself, and take from it what understanding  the Sprit provides. Ask for understanding before you open the Book - and know that each time you do this, your understanding will increase. In this way a believer can go from milk to meat.

A good Biblical teacher can be invaluable - but you should never assume any man has the whole truth; or is free from mistaken notions.

I will go on to add, if you can find a Messianic Jew who understands the Jewishness of the Biblical text - and who can explain the various interpretations of the Greek and Hebrew - you will have found someone worth listening to. Not that they too don't make mistakes - but they can help a great deal in understanding the deeper meanings of many passages.

Michael Kincheloe:
Those gifts ended at the end of the apostolic era
--------------------------------------------------------------
Absolutely true. I Corinthians says that miracles will cease, tongues will cease, and knowledge will fade away. This does not mean knowledge per se, but the kind of knowledge that the men who wrote the Bible are said to have received from above. Joseph Smith claimed to have received this kind of knowledge, but that's another subject entirely.

BuzzKill:

--- Quote from: ""Michael Kincheloe"" --- Joseph Smith claimed to have received this kind of knowledge, but that's another subject entirely.
--- End quote ---



2 Corinthians 11

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.



Galatians 1:8

8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!

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