Lester Roloffs Rebekah Home for Girls Survivors-Cult-mindcon

[psy]

Wow Laura, I really want you to to grow up and take responsibility for yourself and own up to the actions that lead up to you going there in the first place.

Fixed that for ya.

What about responsibility of those who hurt the kids?  You don't believe it happened but think about the effect of what you're saying if it did.

I am sure it was tough, but sometimes thats what it takes. I dont believe they were the terrors you claim them to have been. Nevertheless, Know this, its people and your own way that failed you, not God. You dont have to suffer, accept Christ into your heart as Lord and Saviour, and forgive others as you have been forgive.

Does release from the program require conversion?  Say my parents are christian, I don't believe, and as a result they send me to Rebekah.  Do you feel it's right to keep me incarcerated until I "find" Jesus?

[Pastor Hicks]

Well i think its sad that you refuse to accept The Lord Jesus Christ as your Saviour. The only one your hurting is yourself. Maybe you have a false idea of who Christ is and your need for Him. Because if you knew who He is, the love He has for you and life offered to you, you would never refuse to "conform." Nevertheless, the choice is yours, you are given a free will, a freedom to choose. But there will be a consequence for the choice you make, as in every other aspect of life. However, once  you die there is no turning back, no second chances, your fate is sealed. Weather by accepting Christ unto salvation or your rejection of Him unto damnation, the choice is ultimately yours.

The way they run the homes may have not been perfect but they were effective. Do you have rules you expect your children to follow? Do you punish them when they break them? If a child refuses to do their chores, or comes home later than told and etc... do you ground them? take something away? stand them in the corner? give a little spanking? Well how much the more should be done to those that are older and in far worse rebellion?   Sometimes extreme circumstance require extreme measures. Proverbs 3:12 "For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth." The purpose of those homes were not to abuse and hate. It was to discipline with a heart of love and true compassion for those lost in sin. Hebrews 12:11 "Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby." Meaning, nobody likes to be punished and often cant see the point in it all, but at its end you are better for it and glad.

Maybe people have failed you, maybe you have seen Christ misrepresented and had some bad experiences with "religion", nevertheless, please understand its people and your own way that failed you and not God.

[Anne Bonney]

[Anne Bonney]

Actually, more appropriate to the good pastor's post....


Men never commit evil so fully and joyfully as when they do it for religious convictions ~~ Blaise Pascal    

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. ~~ Seneca the Younger 4 b.c.- 65 a.d.    

Two hands working can do more than a thousand clasped in prayer ~~ Unknown    

We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes ~~ Gene Roddenberry

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. ~~ Steven Weinberg    

A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death ~~ Albert Einstein
 
Man created God in his image : intolerant, sexist, homophobic and violent. ~~ Marie    

Men rarely (if ever) manage to dream up a God superior to themselves. Most Gods have the manners and morals of a spoiled child. ~~ Robert A. Heinlein    

History teaches us that no other cause has brought more death than the word of god. ~~ Giulian Buzila

[DannyB II]

Actually, more appropriate to the good pastor's post....


Men never commit evil so fully and joyfully as when they do it for religious convictions ~~ Blaise Pascal    

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. ~~ Seneca the Younger 4 b.c.- 65 a.d.    

Two hands working can do more than a thousand clasped in prayer ~~ Unknown    

We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes ~~ Gene Roddenberry

With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. ~~ Steven Weinberg    

A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death ~~ Albert Einstein
 
Man created God in his image : intolerant, sexist, homophobic and violent. ~~ Marie    

Men rarely (if ever) manage to dream up a God superior to themselves. Most Gods have the manners and morals of a spoiled child. ~~ Robert A. Heinlein    

History teaches us that no other cause has brought more death than the word of god. ~~ Giulian Buzila

 :shamrock:  :shamrock:

"Men never commit evil so fully and joyfully as when they do it for religious convictions ~~ Blaise Pascal"

Danny spoke:
One of my favorite poets, so much that I named a cockerspaniel after him, Blaise.
Thanks

Danny

[iJust]

Christ, he is hailed as the one who had an answer to hurting kids and parents. he became like a god to his followers. he is enshrined and kept alive even today, he died in 1982.

I know the type. No person has a right to own an other person. When kids start rebelling it's natural and healthy.  They're figuring things out for themselves.  Amish let their kids go at this age to do what they want for a while.  Kids do drugs, have sex, and so forth.  Usually they come back (pretty fuckin good sucess results).  These nutballs, on the other hand, believe that their kids are their property and they can forceably teach them what they want.  If they disagree they are evil and need to be controlled.  That's not Christianity, that's dictatorship by a theocracy.  It applies to a real family as much as it does to what these moral majority type lunatics try to do to government policy.  He thinks that his religion is right and he has a right to force it onto another free thinking person.  He says he believes in free will but he's violating people's rights to choose and be judged by god if there is one.  He's been, basically, just believing what he's been told without actually figuring out things on his own.  Faith without reason is reckless fucking abandon.  It's best to use the reasoning ability that god gave you, if there is a god.  See.  I'm an agnostic.  There is a distinct difference.  I'm not sure either way.  Whatever the case, I just try to be nice to others and if there is a god, i'm sure he's not an asshole.  Asshole god would definately suck.

[Pastor Hicks]

Wow your irreverence, hatefulness and use of profanity sure put me in my place.

[Oscar]

Paster Hicks:

I am a Christian. I live a country where we cannot enter certain parts of our towns without being threatened by heathens due to the consequences of the war on terrorism. If I forget to shave I may look enough like a biker so members of non-native youth gangs start shooting at me for no reason. Still I remain to live here trying to raise my children. I saw your comments and I want to say:

Maybe Roloff started the home with good intentions.

But the administration of the homes was so poorly executed that many of the teenagers were scared away from everything which had something with Christianity to do. I find it a shame and i must blame the staff.

I also have children of my own. No matter what they do, I would never - never - let them enter a boarding school setting due where they are restricted from whatever they legally can do outside the boarding school. And here in Denmark it means drinking alcohol once they are confirmed, even on their own in shops once they are 16.

If we find the society we are living in dangerous for our children, then it is up to as parents and voters to change our society, not to remove our children from our society and confine them to sub-reality.

In my minds the homes failed to meet whatever purpose they were created for. They made non-believers. I don't know what kind of man Roloff was, but I believe that he wanted to spread the Christian word. What took place in these homes did nothing to do that.

The homes were a failure and it doesn't help the cause that you attack the survivors. It cannot make the abuse go away. The existence of the homes is a dark spot in the history of Christianity.

[Anne Bonney]

Wow your irreverence, hatefulness and use of profanity sure put me in my place.

Wait a minute.....where did you see any hatefulness or profanity?

[TimScrivener]

I was at the Lighthouse home for young men in 1981-1982. I can tell you that most of the people here calling themselves "survivors" of the Roloff homes are deceived by their own self. They cry about the horror of not being able to dress as they please, listen to the music they want, and having to listen to preaching all the time while they were there. The fact is, none of those girls in Rebekah Home came there because they were A students, on the honor roll, or were upright children who were victims of their parents lack of love. They went there because they were in some kind of trouble. The ones that failed to get help are those that refused to get help.
Not every one who was in a position of authority did the right thing all the time. I learned there though that God would take those out of their position if they abused it. There are literally thousands of people in this country that have been helped by the Roloff Homes though the years. This forum provides an opportunity for a few unhappy people to claim to be victims.  I can tell you this, Brother Roloff never abused anyone. Period. You got proof otherwise? BRING IT.
The Homes are still open by the way, still helping people. Many dedicated Christians have sacrificed a lot to help others get their lives right. So there's a few ungrateful people who, rather than acknowledge the love of these dedicated Christians, want to cry abuse because they were made to do things they didn't want to do, it's not surprising. But I say, if there was sooooo much abuse going on there, why is the place still open? Even after many people lied to the authorities and they came out to check it out, it's still open. Think about it.
I happen to go to People's Baptist Church and I work in the Sunday School and Junior Church. It's located at 1355 FM 665. Come check it out for yourself.

[TimScrivener]

Christ, he is hailed as the one who had an answer to hurting kids and parents. he became like a god to his followers. he is enshrined and kept alive even today, he died in 1982.

I know the type. No person has a right to own an other person. When kids start rebelling it's natural and healthy.  They're figuring things out for themselves.  Amish let their kids go at this age to do what they want for a while.  Kids do drugs, have sex, and so forth.  Usually they come back (pretty fuckin good sucess results).  These nutballs, on the other hand, believe that their kids are their property and they can forceably teach them what they want.  If they disagree they are evil and need to be controlled.  That's not Christianity, that's dictatorship by a theocracy.  It applies to a real family as much as it does to what these moral majority type lunatics try to do to government policy.  He thinks that his religion is right and he has a right to force it onto another free thinking person.  He says he believes in free will but he's violating people's rights to choose and be judged by god if there is one.  He's been, basically, just believing what he's been told without actually figuring out things on his own.  Faith without reason is reckless fucking abandon.  It's best to use the reasoning ability that god gave you, if there is a god.  See.  I'm an agnostic.  There is a distinct difference.  I'm not sure either way.  Whatever the case, I just try to be nice to others and if there is a god, i'm sure he's not an asshole.  Asshole god would definately suck.

Parents have a responsibility to teach their kids what they believe is right. Until they are 18 years old parents have this right. I don't care if you call it owning them or what, that's the way it is. If you just let your kid do things you know are harmful to them and don't do everything in your power to help them, then you're not a good parent. You speak of reason but then you imply that we should let our kids do drugs. That's not reasonable, that's stupidity. That's what's wrong with this world now.

[TimScrivener]

I was a Rebekah girl in `82.  I know all of this is true.  We chanted, girls kneeled on salt, no girl had a period for the entire time they were there.  
I can remember a girl being chained to a bed after she ran away.  What a mess!!

Chanted? Wow, how horrible. You mean you were made to memorize Scriptures? That's the chanting you're talking about. No girl had a period for the entire time they were there? Really? Did you check all their bathroom trash cans every day or something? I was on the farm in 82. I think you're not entirely truthful.

[Anne Bonney]

No girl had a period for the entire time they were there? Really? Did you check all their bathroom trash cans every day or something?

As crazy as it sounds, it's more common than you'd think.  Every single girl I was in Straight with (approx 200 over 2 years) stopped having their period about a month or two after getting there and didn't start back up until after they were out.  How much stress, both physically and mentally, does a kid have to endure that it would actually stop her menstrual cycle??

[TimScrivener]

No girl had a period for the entire time they were there? Really? Did you check all their bathroom trash cans every day or something?

As crazy as it sounds, it's more common than you'd think.  Every single girl I was in Straight with (approx 200 over 2 years) stopped having their period about a month or two after getting there and didn't start back up until after they were out.  How much stress, both physically and mentally, does a kid have to endure that it would actually stop her menstrual cycle??

Sorry, but I know about the Rebekkah home and also the Jubilee and I don't believe it. In fact, I know it to be a lie. While some girls may have experienced this due to their own mental or emotional issues, I know that these homes have to supply the residents with feminine products. These are the kind of exaggerated claims people make in an effort to make their accusations of abuse sound more valid.

Again, The Roloff Homes and People's Baptist Church are not a cult. I challenge anyone on here to produce any proof of any of these accusation. I further challenge you to come visit the Church and the Homes for yourself and make your own mind up. Do not accept hearsay as fact. People do lie, especially the type of people who come to these homes for help. You can also visit the website http://www.pbc-roloffhomes.org

[Anne Bonney]

Sorry, but I know about the Rebekkah home and also the Jubilee and I don't believe it. In fact, I know it to be a lie.

I have no idea if it happened there or not.  I was simply stating that it's not all that uncommon in programs due to the extreme stresses the body and mind are placed under.  It happened in my program.

These are the kind of While some girls may have experienced this due to their own mental or emotional issues,

   And it just happened to coincide to the time that they were in a program.

exaggerated claims people make in an effort to make their accusations of abuse sound more valid.

They don't need any exaggeration.

Again, The Roloff Homes and People's Baptist Church are not a cult.

A matter of opinion.

I challenge anyone on here to produce any proof of any of these accusation.

While not proof, the links below can help to identify cult characteristics.

http://www.ex-cult.org/General/identifying-a-cult

http://www.ex-cult.org/General/lifton-criteria

http://www.ex-cult.org/General/singer-conditions

http://www.ex-cult.org/bite.html

Do not accept hearsay as fact.

What you're saying qualifies as hearsay too.

People do lie, especially the type of people who come to these homes for help.

People choose to go there or are sent by their overzealous, hyper-religious parents?