The Reality of Fornits

[Anonymous]

Here it is: Fornits fucking scares everyone.

It's not a matter of "you're scaring the parents off Milk/TSW/anon army/RB/pick your poster". It's not us saying things to them that make them go away. It's the atmosphere of this place, the sickness and foulness of the industry, and the resulting rage and contempt of the posters here. People don't want to walk into a firefight. For parents not involved in this industry, it's much easier, much simpler, and much more logical to never post here, and never consider sending their kid anywhere again, and put the entire concept right the hell out of their minds.

This is where the trolls come in. Since we don't have enough real parents on this site, we've apparently had to make some up.

This is also the reason that Struggling Tards is so underpopulated: because everyone on that site is visibly fucking insane. Seriously, what kind of parent is going to pal around wih the likes of mose? Who's gonna hear "we don't allow public program discussion" and not smell a HUGE fucking rat? You'd have to be dumber than mud. Consider how much traffic Lon claims to get (which may have a passing resemblance to the amount of traffic he does get). Consider the size of his board. If parents were in any way attracted, and this was in any way "mainstream" as I hear so often claimed around here, he'd have many times the population of Fornits. BUT HE DOESN'T. Think on why.

This is actually the important statistic, the one that the ed-cons will never report. How many people hear "well, we can take your kid off your hands for $12,000 a month" and run? How many people stop at "parental contact has to be limited"? How many people take a look at ISAC or Fornits and go "Oh sweet Jesus, this is sick!" and never come back? Consider Exhausted's reaction. Consider the reaction of any sane person to this. How many times have we heard "Well after reading this site I'm definitely not going to send my kid to ___..." Yeah! And for every one person who posts that, there's a couple hundred that don't!

You don't have to take my word for it. Post about Fornits on otherwise neutral forums that you might frequent. Odds are nobody will reply. Why? It's not a matter of belief or disbelief. It's the fact that this is too goddamn sick to talk about. Normal people, and by normal people I mean those who aren't connected to this in any way, sure as hell don't want to be.

This is a good thing. The more parents we scare off, the better. They ought to be fucking scared. They ought to grab their kids and run like all the devils of Hell are after them. Parents, if you don't think you should be scared, you obviously haven't read enough Fornits.

And for all the parents out there still reading this, lemme give you a nice little taste of what these people have in store for your child (copied from actual testimony on the CEDU board):

The other thing I remember hearing was "potty please". At night, you would have to ask staff permission to go to the bathroom, by standing there and going "potty please"? One poster on here said that the staff would a lot of times ignore you for a while. I think you even had to put on special boots.

I think I might have read that somewhere before... in bad perverted fiction.

[Antigen]

Permission to speak freely?

[Anonymous]

Hey, I'm just here to tell people things they don't want to hear.

[Ursus]

Despite what you say, I think what gets a lot of parents right off the bat is a superficial one.  They feel affronted by the language.  I get some of this on the Hyde board.  I post a well-worded piece, and I get responses thanking me for my thoughtful discussion, alluding to a refreshing contrast with more coarsely stated sentiments (from other posts).  But when I let it rip, employ vulgar humor and disrespectful verbage, they are silent.  Maybe this is just Hyde, I'm not sure.  I've been posting Anon for several months prior to joining, so I have a wee better sense of this than my paltry few dozen official posts might indicate, although certainly not even approaching the same league as you and the other regulars.

I think the rawness and lack of Moderators on fornits scares a lot of parents.  It feels to them "out of control", much as they feel freaked out by their "out of control" teenagers.

It's the atmosphere of this place, the sickness and foulness of the industry, and the resulting rage and contempt of the posters here.

But then, fornits isn't a place where concerned parents can come commissurate about what the hell to do with their errant offspring, is it?  That is really the mindset of ST.  I wish to fully acknowledge the genuine concern that most any parent has expressed there, but what it really boils down to, if that is where you feel most at home, when all is said and done, is it's all about controlling the little bastards.

There are some parents who come here, where it is less an issue of control, and more an issue of what can I do to help shephard my child through this transition to adulthood with the least amount of damage and hopefully the most amount of support.  For them it is more of a soul-to-soul issue.  And those parents stay.

[Antigen]

Well, yeah, it gets ugly as hell sometimes. And you're right, the whole concept and purpose of these fora is quite different from that of ST. ST is born of the program and all about parents supporting each other's martyrdom and sometimes passive sadism. Fornits is all about letting anybody with any interest in the troubled parent industry or toughlove hategroup speak freely. Of course that scares hell out of program people. It's their worst nightmare.

If they're looking for someone to sell them The Answer® all packaged up neat-n-tidy like with a clearly printed price tag, there's always Struggling Turkeys. If, on the other hand, they want insight from a broad range of people w/ varying degrees of firs-hand experience with the Program, then maybe we can help them out. I've been surprised to find some parents starting to come around here actually researching the programs they're considering for their kids. I tell ya, folks, it restores a little of my faith in my own generation.

The purpose, right from the beginning, was just as simple as having an ongoing discussion sans the censorship so that we, the program vets, can get a start on figuring out wtf happened to us and what to do about it. Whether that be on a personal level or public policy and cultural influence just depends on how you're geared. This is also a resource for authors and journalists, lawyers and pshrinks, program vets looking for old friends (these places don't usually issue year books or hold 10 year reunions, ya know) and anyone else who finds a need to understand this phenomena.

I'm betting we'll be seeing more and more folks like Oz Girl and COvergard and others with enough foresight to see their own interest in this topic before their local community turns into something like Florida where Brother Jeb came through with his promised $100 million in juvenile rehab contracted through DFAF, resulting in the internationally acclaimed Martin Lee Anderson Snuff Flick.

I don't always win my bets, though. Often, but not always. Any takers? I got two beers out of LEAP jumping the Algore/Hillary team on sensible drug policy. ;-)

[Antigen]

So I got to thinking about stats.

Reported period Month Feb 2007
First visit 01 Feb 2007 - 00:00
Last visit 09 Feb 2007 - 17:49  
Unique visitors *4680
Number of visits 12886 (2.75 visits/visitor)
PagesHits 189973 (14.74 pages/visit)

Anybody got any idea what the stats look like for Struggling Turkeys? I'm guessin' the market defines this style of conversation as inherently more useful than the other in the same way the net routes around censorship like damage.

[Ganja]

I'm betting we'll be seeing more and more folks like Oz Girl and COvergard and others with enough foresight to see their own interest in this topic before their local community turns into something like Florida where Brother Jeb came through with his promised $100 million in juvenile rehab contracted through DFAF, resulting in the internationally acclaimed Martin Lee Anderson Snuff Flick.

I don't always win my bets, though. Often, but not always. Any takers? I got two beers out of LEAP jumping the Algore/Hillary team on sensible drug policy. ;-)

First of all, fuck that dipshit Al Gore and that pants-suit wearing corrupt bitch Hilary Clinton. Just wanted to get that out of the way. YEAH, where are the rioting black folks when you need them? :lol: That's horrible what happened to that kid. An outrage; where are the black cries of protest about that??

[Ganja]

So I got to thinking about stats.

Reported period Month Feb 2007
First visit 01 Feb 2007 - 00:00
Last visit 09 Feb 2007 - 17:49  
Unique visitors *4680
Number of visits 12886 (2.75 visits/visitor)
PagesHits 189973 (14.74 pages/visit)

Anybody got any idea what the stats look like for Struggling Turkeys? I'm guessin' the market defines this style of conversation as inherently more useful than the other in the same way the net routes around censorship like damage.

Not only that, their forum is just plain BORING.

[Oz girl]

I hope more people from Overseas come to this site as well. Part of the problem I have had explaining this industry to anyone I know particularly family is that its existence is hard to actually comprehend.

for example here were some of my mothers initial comments

Oh it cant be that bad otherwise the child would complain too much when they come home for xmas and summer holidays.

Drug rehab lasting for 3 years or more. Dont be silly. The parents would eventually pull the kids because of the school they would have missed.

But schools cant strip search students. It is against the law

i think a camping trip with some sensible no nonsense adult counsellors sounds ideal. The kids get away for a week or 2 i assume.

[Ganja]

Does AC/DC play a lot over there, Oz Girl?

[Antigen]

First of all, fuck that dipshit Al Gore and that pants-suit wearing corrupt bitch Hilary Clinton. Just wanted to get that out of the way. YEAH, where are the rioting black folks when you need them? :lol: That's horrible what happened to that kid. An outrage; where are the black cries of protest about that??

Thanks for that. Whew! I feel better now too.
Well, the Rainbow Coalition did do their song and dance for a short while. Didn't hang around long, though, did they? I'm guessing it's because Martin wasn't a choir boy, he was a regular boy. They don't actually represent real people. They represent imaginary people invented by the likes of Bill Cosby, Oprah Winfrey and a long line of delusional pedagogs on who's shoulders they have stood and lunch ticket they have fed. That's how come they're so fond of people like Dr. Phool and James Fray.

[Ganja]

*Sigh* Yeah.....

[the sunday stealer]

If they're looking for someone to sell them The Answer® all packaged up neat-n-tidy like with a clearly printed price tag, there's always Struggling Turkeys.

   

[the sunday stealer]

Consider the size of his board. If parents were in any way attracted, and this was in any way "mainstream" as I hear so often claimed around here, he'd have many times the population of Fornits. BUT HE DOESN'T. Think on why.

'Cuz most people don't want to discuss their private issues in public? Lon is a fag and his website sucks? Take your pick.

Then take a look at the size of this industry, it's trends and growth and then tell me with a straight face this ideology and it's practical implementation are not mainstream thinking. The only reason people don't want these places built around them, is because they are afraid of the kids, which is a reason why these places exist in the first place.

When a crowd of screaming people are stomping and yelling with all their emotion at a 12 year old girl on stage on the Maury Povich show that she's a whore and needs boot camp, it's hard to believe it's a minority.

If you don't believe me, try this experiment. Request information packets from the worst programs you know about, wwasps, cedu and other less known ones. Then take them to a professionally licensed psychologist or psychiatrist and tell them you are thinking of sending your kid away. What do you think they will say in most cases after reviewing the literature?

Sure if people knew the truth, and I mean the whole nitty gritty truth with hidden camera action of seminars and abuse and all that, then yes they would object. As it is presented today, and that is what matters most, it is still a legitimate and even noble cause. It's seen as the next organic option when your teen gets out of step, it has embedded itself into American culture deeply.

[Ganja]

Sure if people knew the truth, and I mean the whole nitty gritty truth with hidden camera action of seminars and abuse and all that, then yes they would object. As it is presented today, and that is what matters most, it is still a legitimate and even noble cause. It's seen as the next organic option when your teen gets out of step, it has embedded itself into American culture deeply.

Ugh.  :evil:  ::noway::  ::eek3::  ::puke::