Author Topic: This is fucking with my head  (Read 1998 times)

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Offline MammaBird

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This is fucking with my head
« on: November 01, 2006, 12:28:02 PM »
Okay, so this guy who's "in recovery" has become a part of my group of friends over the past few months.  He's not the only recovering type I hang out with, but he is the only one that talks about it constantly.  

  SO the other day he said "Straight didn't really hurt you" (Jason "Rar" from Ann Arbor, who in the fuck are you and what are you telling people?) and I obviously took issue to this.  I told him that in no uncertain terms.  He ran away.  A friend gave him shit.  He claims that he can tell that even though I have it under control right now, I'm an alcoholic, and in 15 years everyone will see what he's talking about.  This opinion based not on my actual drinking patterns, but on a "gleam" he saw in my eye when people were talking about beer.

   Okay, this is fucking with my head.  I KNOW Straight hurt me.  I got counseling for this shit.  I know I'm not addicted to anything but cigarettes.  I know that while I do sometimes choose to abuse alcohol, it's infrequent and it affects my life minimally.  I know you  can't diagnosis alcoholism based on  eye gleams.  But okay, I was brainwashed into believing I was an addict when I was 13 and having someone saying this shit to me again is just driving me insane.  Even though I know I'm okay, and I think Straight was evil and insane, and I think people who view everything in the world through the lens of the 12 steps are fucked, I suppose part of me will always fear that I'm a heroin addict even if I've never done heroin and just in denial about it.   And having someone around who's constantly accusing me of being full of shit and urging me to get honest  is putting me right back there.

  Other freinds say he's just "off" about this shit and it's not worth getting this upset about.  And he's clearly an intensity junkie, in the way so many people who are addicted to 12 step meetings are, and thinks that anything that isn't  a high-drama gut-wrenching confession is full of shit(I would know about that, I was one of those people about a million years ago).  But I AM upset.  

  Okay I just needed to say that somewhere.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2006, 12:48:19 PM »
You should let this ass know that if he was following his own program, he would not be in yours!!!

Let's pull some straight shit here - He's just saying that because he's trying to get the focus off the "gleam" in his eye when the people were talking about drinking!!!!  

You went into straight when you were 13.  How the hell can anyone diagnose an in immature child as being an alcoholic??  You had not yet learned responsibility, let alone how to handle drinking.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2006, 01:27:19 PM »
Sorry you have to deal with this guy.  If I's you, I'd be tryin' not to knock the fucker out.  Just for bein so up in my business that he thinks he can judge me like that.  I mean I aint really there so I can't say, but I wouldn't want that cat around if he's gonna throw somethin' as personal as $tr8 right into your face like that.  That's pretty arrogant and rude.  Was he in the program himself ??  How the fuck does he know ?!?!.  Anyway, I wouldn't like that either.  Fuck Him.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline Gah

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2006, 08:07:38 PM »
I don't give good advise but maybe you should tell the person that if they are that concerned than they need to stay away from such horible influences. If you have the charectoristics of an adict than you should really look out for whats best for your lil friend. I think the person is playing oh what's the word? Headgames? lolol I dunno, I would prolly sit the person down and analyze them and show them how to work every step and show them that I could prolly turn circles around them in a 12 step program. They wanna push you into it, go ahead, they will prolly wish they had'nt
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Offline Anonymous

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2006, 08:07:55 PM »
Tell him to fuck off next time you see him.  Offer him a cola drink you have previously spiked with vodka, then laugh and tell him he needs to go get a new white chip.  He's obviously an asshole, don't worry about anything he has to say.  A "gleam in your eye", huh?  SOunds like when Miller Newton "diagnosed" me as a druggie by looking for marijuana residue in my eyes.  Tell him he isn't welcome at your house unless he's going to bring booze and drink it with you.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Antigen

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2006, 08:48:01 PM »
I know just what ya mean, Mamabird. When I get that kinda rap from people, it does yank on some deeply tied strings in my heart. Think about it. Against our will, the people we all remember talking that shit came between us and our families and even our own selves to some degree. That's terrifying on a primal level. I don't think it's a dysfunction or sign of some fucking damage that we're sensitive to that shit. It's just plain old self preservation. In my experience, people who talk like that are fucking dangerous, frightening people. Others might not pick up on it or understand why, but they are and we all around here damned well know it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2006, 09:03:25 PM »
That's right!...

Fuck them muther...(shut your mouth...)

God is in you.

You don' need nobody ta tell ya nothin!

Fuck Authority!!!  There is none.  No external authority!

It is you... It is you..ou..ou....

Preesure drop...Oh pressure...gonna drop on you...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline starry-eyed pirate

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2006, 09:40:06 PM »
Don't let it fuck with you.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end.  People are not commodities.  When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.

Offline Antigen

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War of minds, battle for control of the consensus trance.
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2006, 11:42:10 PM »
Man, this has got me trippin now. What am I afraid of, really? I guess I'm not so much afraid anymore and I don't get anywhere near as upset about this shit as I used to. I used to almost rage and panic frequently. Now I guess I'm more about staring the monsters down and daring them to spook me than fearing them. This is one abyss that can give as good as it gets wrt staring back into me.

I'm not sure yet, but I think this takes less energy and has the potential to be a whole lot more fun.

When I started looking into drug policy reform, I didn't know it would lead me back to those sadistic lunatics that I thought I'd left in the dark and dusty corner of the early `80's part of my mind. I only knew that it spooked me and outraged me and I wanted to do something about it, if only to muck rake and get people pissed off enough to slip and say what they really think. Hey, find something you're good at and ya stick with it, eh? Sorry. Really.... anyway

But knowing now how much influence Program affiliated people really have on all of our lives and how hidden right out in the open it has always been and how much shit I've eaten over the years simply because I fucking see shit that people around me don't see or won't see..... that pisses me off more than almost anything. The only thing I can think of right now that pisses me off more than that is how insidiously and how successfully these mindfuckers come between us and our children. See, I'd made peace w/ my dad--I guess you could say we met halfway and shook hands--and I'd written off my mom, resigned myself to probably never really belonging among my family and determined never to let any of that bullshit come between me and my kids, NO! They had one good thing out of me. I may not be rich or particularly tightly wrapped all the time. In fact I sometimes have a hard time getting along with myself. But the one thing I could give them was to never let that shit come between us. But I didn't see em coming, in large part because of all that shit eatin. Everybody told me that was paranoid shit right there, thinking things like Peer Counseling, Citizens On Patrol and DARE were more frightening than just stupid.

And just now it hit me, the simplified, stripped down to the very most basic conundrum. If I tell my kids everything they want to know about whatever they want to know about, then they have to deal with the vile slander and evil lies that attend kids who did rehab instead of highschool. That's a lot to ask of a kid, isn't it? I mean, I sort of think I understand now why people like my grandfather may have europeanized their names and turned catholic. But if I don't tell my kids the truth about the serious shit, then we're just not really being real with each other, are we? It's a double bind, there is no right answer, it's the perfect mindfuck.

And as I stare into the abyss and it keeps giving as good as it gets (kickin' my fuckin' ass here lately some days) I find that them who scream the loudest and get the most bent out of shape about denying the damage and the influence are the more scared and less hopeful among us. All that contrived 'positivity'  ::puke:: is worse than rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. It's a whole lot more like ... like reaming some kid a new asshole, not because you're mad at him, but just because that's what you have to do and you assume everybody's in on the deception--we're just humoring the lunatics, right?--and then discovering that the poor little kid is not fucking capable of saying this or changing that or any other damned act of volition we're all demanding of him. The poor fucker is catatonic and what I just did was take part in making him so and didn't even see it.... and how many other times did I think we were all pretending to save our asses--that if it got really serious someone would call no mas--when really I had used all the power of influence God or the Fates or the Tao or whatever have given me to fucking break some soul. And how breaking it is, friends, when everyone around you, everyone you love and who loves you, denies what we see.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes

Offline Anonymous

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2006, 12:49:43 AM »
Tell him that the first step is accepting that you can not come along for the ride with him.
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Offline Antigen

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2006, 01:48:48 AM »
Ask him what the first and most impotent rule is
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"Don\'t let the past remind us of what we are not now."
~ Crosby Stills Nash & Young, Sweet Judy Blue Eyes

Offline Anonymous

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2006, 01:33:29 PM »
He's not a former straightling, but he's been around the industry.  For adults, not teens.

 I've avoided talking to him for the last couple days, I can handle it now.  And yes, I cannot wait to throw a bunch of 12 step rhetoric back into his face.  It  never even occured to me to that, mostly I've been focusing on telling him that the 12 steps are a seriously inappropriate lens to view the world through.

  Thank you guys, I so needed someone to get that.  I feel so much saner.
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Offline Anonymous

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2006, 01:46:37 PM »
Here's some ammo for you.  This guy is fantastic and his research is impeccable.  Check out his "letters" section too.  Lots of great info and a whole lot of laughs.

http://www.orange-papers.org/

http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-propaganda.html
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Simple truth...
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2006, 09:48:07 AM »
...is that alcohol will sneak up on you and bite you real hard if you abuse it, especially when combined with the deep seated fucked up self doubt that comes from being in a place like Straight. Leave it alone sister. i,m not telling you what to do, just honestly trying to help. I escaped from Straight in my underwear in the middle of the night from Tampa, and I still have dreams about being beltlooped to this day. And the honest thing for me about the twelve steps, is they are real and good and very helpful and I needed them to get me sober, but what sucks is that I had to sit and look at them for eight hours a day and associated the word Program with having someone grab me by the back of my pants, so could not use the steps for years, and as a result almost died from alcohol and drugs. As for what people say, well, you should know from being in Straight and even just living here in this really stupid country that, hey, people say stuff. What Straight really fucked us all up on, is telling us that what other people said and thought really mattered, at all. Fuck him and everyone else for that matter. Follow your heart, and don't forget that as long as the sun still rises, there is an oppurtunity for change. Good luck.
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Offline Anonymous

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This is fucking with my head
« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2006, 03:37:08 PM »
Well I didn't even have to fuck with him, I said stop and he said "I apologize.  I will never go there with you again."

 Apparently my best friend really laid into him and made him feel like shit a couple of days ago. Yay!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »