Picking at scabs.

[Anonymous]

WIth the recent proliferation of online survivor groups for various programs, I would like to hear the opinions of others. Does anyone else find that the inevitable bickering that takes place between survivors (pro and con program views) eventually dominates the discussion? I find this to be true in many, if not most cases. I have also come to the conclusion, that we have been sufficiently divided. Some of us are pro-program and some of us are anti-program. The percentage of each group is irrelevant to this particular topic, because even a small amount of pro-program people who have just as much credibility as those who report abuse, since they also attended said program, shifts the debate and puts those who were abused on the defensive. It seems like a lot of effort that could be put forth towards shutting down abusive programs, or even healing psychologically without so much bickering. I am not complaining, this seems to be the nature of the beast. I am glad there are online forums, but I find myself logging on to them less and less. I feel it reminds me of the program now. The constant bickering, illogical arguments, heated emotional excahanges all remind me of the program, and not in a good way. It seems paradoxical, that coming to these forums and groups helps get over certain things, but in another way it is like ripping a newly healed scab off. How do you feel about it?

[Anonymous]

It's the nature of the beast. Programmie trolls will always show up here, pretending to be everything. There's no one here pro-program but the trolls.

Personally I think it's a good thing. Actual parents occasionally come to this board. When they watch the inevitable interplay of program tards against ex-victims (fortunately, I'm not among them) and those who are supremely pissed off at the whole concept, they're going to realize what's going on. Despite what the trolls say, there is no human being with a shred of sense in his or her head that will send a kid to one of these shitpits after even the most cursory reading of Fornits.

[Anonymous]

The other parents I talk to outside of Fornits--just friends and acquaintances--are all shocked to find out the Programs are out there.

They will have heard about one recent death or another, and then we start talking and they start realizing what's out there.  That's about what happened with me the first time I found out what the Programs were and that they were happening here in America, to kids, where that kind of thing is not supposed to be possible.  Much less legal.

The pro-program people do not have a valid point, despite their personal accounts.

They are like someone who was taking a placebo when their leukemia went into spontaneous remission.  It does happen that way sometimes.

They're like that someone if he then went out and started trying to convince all other cancer patients to take sugar pills as a treatment for cancer, and as a preventative for all types of cancer even if you're well.  Especially if that someone was trying to get people with cancer to take the sugar pills instead of radiation or chemo as prescribed by a licensed oncologist.

Most teens' problems are normal teen problems.  Most teens with serious problems have problems much less serious than cancer.  Most programs are a whole hell of a lot worse than sugar pills.

No analogy is perfect.

Programs don't work.  Programs do not improve any conceivable problem of the human condition except for the program owners' bank balances.

I wind up commenting on something when I check in and read Fornits, but I don't come here to talk or to read the back and forth between real people and program trolls.  I end up doing both, but that's not why I keep coming here.

I come here because when there's real news about this social problem, Fornits is one of the best sources for getting links to the most comprehensive information, and sometimes getting firsthand accounts that no news outlet has.

I check in in case there's any real news.

So sure, the place serves a purpose.

I don't think arguing with the Program trolls serves a purpose, but it's hard not to do it anyway.

I think the survivors who see the Programs for the horrible thing that they are get benefit from talking to each other here.  I think they get benefit from yelling at the Program trolls.  It's like lancing a boil and letting it drain.  It's far from pretty, but it gets the poison out so the body can finally heal from the infection.

Thing is, as you've discovered, after the boil has been drained of pus and starts healing in a healthy way, picking at the scab becomes counter-productive.  For that person.

Which doesn't make it counter-productive for the next person who needs to lance a boil.

The Program trolls don't have a valid position, but they do serve a useful function.  Unwittingly and unwillingly, but they do serve it.

Julie