Author Topic: Challenge for Wilderness Supporters  (Read 21132 times)

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Offline TheWho

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« Reply #195 on: June 24, 2006, 02:32:00 PM »
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On 2006-06-24 11:29:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
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On 2006-06-24 11:28:00, TheWho wrote:


If you are new here and have time, read up on the seed or straight threads. They are not places you would want your kids to go to."




I'm not new and I"m all too familiar with Straight. The place almost killed me."


Sorry to hear that, there seems to be many here like yourself.  It amazes me that places like that are allowed to still continue and stay in business
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #196 on: June 24, 2006, 02:35:00 PM »
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On 2006-06-24 11:32:00, TheWho wrote:


Sorry to hear that, there seems to be many here like yourself.  It amazes me that places like that are allowed to still continue and stay in business"


What you really don't get is that these programs today aren't really any different.  They use the same techniques and tactics to break the kid down.  It's an absolutely necessary part of the TBS/RTC.  They can't funciton without it.  They try to pass it off as the kinder, gentler version (and it may be, at least physically) but it's the same shit in a different wrapper.  Look into Gilcrease and his seminars.  I keep telling you that the VERY FUNDAMENTALS of behavior mod (and that's all this is, you can try and spin it as being a good thing but it's not) are dangerous.  The FUNDAMENTALS.  You can't put a pretty new wrapper on it and expect different results.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #197 on: June 24, 2006, 02:37:00 PM »
They also use the same fucking shell game when people start to speak out (witness WWASPS and SCL right now)

These places are fundamentally no different than Straight.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #198 on: June 24, 2006, 02:38:00 PM »
Who, again: you are a pick of shit. STFU.
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Offline TheWho

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« Reply #199 on: June 24, 2006, 03:06:00 PM »
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On 2006-06-24 11:30:00, Anonymous wrote:

"WHO, don't be giving people advise. GO THE FUCK away."


Look, my advice and posts are on the same level as yours.  If you want me gone ask Ginger to PM me privately or she can ask me publicly to leave and I will, its her forum and her business and I will resect that.  You should also !!
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Offline Nihilanthic

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« Reply #200 on: June 24, 2006, 05:34:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-06-24 12:06:00, TheWho wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-06-24 11:30:00, Anonymous wrote:


"WHO, don't be giving people advise. GO THE FUCK away."




Look, my advice and posts are on the same level as yours.  If you want me gone ask Ginger to PM me privately or she can ask me publicly to leave and I will, its her forum and her business and I will resect that.  You should also !!"


Hey, Who...

Name a good program.

Any, good program.
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DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline TheWho

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« Reply #201 on: June 24, 2006, 06:39:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-06-24 14:34:00, Nihilanthic wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-06-24 12:06:00, TheWho wrote:


"
Quote


On 2006-06-24 11:30:00, Anonymous wrote:



"WHO, don't be giving people advise. GO THE FUCK away."







Look, my advice and posts are on the same level as yours.  If you want me gone ask Ginger to PM me privately or she can ask me publicly to leave and I will, its her forum and her business and I will resect that.  You should also !!"




Hey, Who...



Name a good program.



Any, good program."


There is a place in western Massachusetts that has had a book written about it and is considered one of the better TBS?s its called ?The Academy at Swift River? or ASR.  You can check out their web site for more info.  I had a daughter who attended a few years ago and is doing very well.  I have heard from many graduates who still keep in touch and parents also.

Another program in which I have had some experience with is SUWS of the Carolinas.  Its a wilderness program 3 weeks plus.


Here are the links:

http://www.swiftriver.com/

http://www.suwscarolinas.com/

Here is a good read on ASR/TBS's if anyone is Interested.  It is a little dated now, but will give you some good insight on what goes on inside some of the better places.
http://davemarcus.com/



[ This Message was edited by: TheWho on 2006-06-24 16:31 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #202 on: June 24, 2006, 07:48:00 PM »
naming a "good" or "better" place/program here is really just seeting it up to be attacked without any other reason

no place/school/program is perfect, but asking/expecting a dependant to do something reasonable (clean their room, do homework before partying, be polite and courteous, whatever), and imposing consequences for failure to comply doesn't constitute abuse.  yeah, some consequences like whipping would be abusive, but separating a raging kid from his peers until he calms down is not abusive

getting wet in the rain when you were given means and opportunity to stay dry is no cause for yelling abuse either

the places Who named have value for many, but that won't stop the bashing.   but since they were already targets of bashing here no real damabe is done.  I'd hardly add a new name to the list, though there are many
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #203 on: June 24, 2006, 08:09:00 PM »
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On 2006-06-24 15:39:00, TheWho wrote:


There is a place in western Massachusetts that has had a book written about it and is considered one of the better TBS?s its called ?The Academy at Swift River? or ASR.


Considered by whom to be "one of the better"?
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Offline TheWho

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« Reply #204 on: June 24, 2006, 09:13:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-06-24 17:09:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-06-24 15:39:00, TheWho wrote:



There is a place in western Massachusetts that has had a book written about it and is considered one of the better TBS?s its called ?The Academy at Swift River? or ASR.



Considered by whom to be "one of the better"?"


From what I have read here, people I have spoke to in the industry, my own experiences.

Also if you read some of the experiences people have had at Straight and seed threads here at fornits and then compare them to the experiences from say ASR or Carlbrook threads you will see a huge difference.  The later are changing and evolving.  ASR has had the opportunity to experience an excellent success rate.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #205 on: June 24, 2006, 09:43:00 PM »
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On 2006-06-24 18:13:00, TheWho wrote:


From what I have read here, people I have spoke to in the industry, my own experiences.

Then make that clear.  When you say it's 'considered to be' you infer a credibility it hasn't earned.  People in the industry are operating under the either misguided or malicious belief (financial and the sadists that are bred in and attracted to these places) that these places are therapeutic or effective in building kids self esteem or life skills or whatever new name they come up with.  There is not and never has been one shred of proof that there are any long term benefits and, as is coming more and more to light, damage is done to the psyche.  Some never recover.

Quote
Also if you read some of the experiences people have had at Straight and seed threads here at fornits and then compare them to the experiences from say ASR or Carlbrook threads you will see a huge difference.

Funny you should mention that.  I spent two years in Straight.  I've read the Carlbrook and ASR threads.  It's nothing but different wrapping.  Those two might not be as physically abusive as Straight was or Spring Creek or Tranquility Bay, but believe me.  The more I read the more it disturbs me.  You can't fuck with these kids like that.  I saw a lot of physical abuse but the worst, the stuff that lasted with me and really fucked me up for damn near 20 years was the isolation.  They fuck with your instincts.  They turn kids against each other on a level that you cannot comprehend.  The kinds of stress these kids are under is absolutely unbelievable.  You're ripped away from everything that ever made you feel safe and secure.   I'm telling you the idolation, feeling like I wasn't part of the world anymore.  When I tried to go back in my friends (who were all doing much worse things than I was) had all grown out of their stupidity and moved on to become productive, happy people.  I never did feel like I fit back in.  I couldn't fit in with other people either because of the intense experience I went through.  I thought of that when the ASR employee said that the kids have a maturity level beyond their peers.  That's true in one sense and false in another.  I didn't have the opportunity to find my own way, I had it drilled and consequenced and phase dropped and started over into me, so I lacked that maturity but I had been through something that none of them could even begin to imagine and that gives you the kind of maturity that just feels old and tired.  Funny thing is, I honestly didn't realize this for about 10 years.  I tried so hard to please my father that I didn't realize what had happened to me.  It wasn't until someone showed me a website dealing with cults (on an unrelated matter) that the pieces of the puzzle began to fall into place.  Now I knew why I never felt right.  Now I knew why I struggled so much when everyone around me seemed to be able to cope so well.

 
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The later are changing and evolving.  ASR has had the opportunity to experience an excellent success rate.


Really?  Do you have anything to back that up other than exit or follow up surveys done by the schools?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #206 on: June 24, 2006, 11:40:00 PM »
The Who is a troll.

He's here because he's frantically trying to justify having stuck his daughter in ASR.

He's so loud and vociferous because he's trying to convince himself, not us.

That, and he obviously likes the attention.

Julie
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #207 on: June 24, 2006, 11:53:00 PM »
Spot on Julie.  Have you noticed too that whenever an anon calls him on his loads of shit he starts saying 'you must be new'.

 :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #208 on: June 25, 2006, 12:02:00 AM »
The WHO isn't even a good troll, at that.  Keeps stepping in his own shit.  

WHO - take a lesson.  TROLLING 101 - never step in your own shit.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #209 on: June 25, 2006, 12:10:00 AM »
I don't think he ever had at daughter in a program. Doubt if her ever even had a daughter.
Believe he thinks a program is a quick way to make money; and he may just be sick enough to actually like messing with kids. Weird guy.
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