Author Topic: The Real Problem Is ...  (Read 14077 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #30 on: April 20, 2006, 11:22:00 PM »
Doesn't it take someone QUALIFIED to do a "clinical intervention"?  Then why do the minimum wage staff, who'd otherwise be at McDonald's, get to decide who to chuck into isolation and for how long.  If only all of these rich parents knew about the low-wage trash banishing their kids from view of others.  Yeah, I'd sure feel empowered if an ignorant hick threw me in a hallway sized room for a few days, weeks or months.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #31 on: April 20, 2006, 11:26:00 PM »
"By staying relatively calm for half an hour, the student shows a willingness to act in a safe manner, and heads back to wherever he was before that."

No, they show you that you're the ones in charge for the time being and totally submit to your will, which is what you want when you send them there.  This means that any child who continues to stick up for him/herself will not be allowed out of confinement.  That is not empowerment, it is abuse.  It doesn't matter how many horses and beaches you put on the brochure, it's still bullshit.

"The exception? Some kids want to stay and relax; that's OK. Some also go there at their own request, for a time-out."

Huh?  I spent three years there and never saw anyone want to go in there.  Again, bullshit.  Like saying an abused wife was asking for it.
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Offline CCM girl 1989

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« Reply #32 on: April 21, 2006, 02:25:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-04-20 08:32:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Bad puppy, someone rubbed your nose in too much poo, I think.



"Did they also end the practice of emotionally disturbed kids giving consequences to other emotionally disturbed kids?"





Why do you assume the kids at the school are all emotionally disturbed? And do you understand that a "consequence" is just losing points? Do you know about the body of research that fully supports A. increasing privileges and responsibility in increments proportional to quality of performance and B. peer tutoring?



"Do you deny that mail to parents are censored?"



Absolutely. What you're confused about here is the level of parent/family involvement. Letters to and from parents are completely private. The only exception is if the PARENT sends a copy to the therapist or family rep.



"Do you deny that education is self paced which is another way of saying no classroom teaching?"



Again, absolutely. Self-paced is your term, and refers only to the speed with which a student completes something.  Self-guided describes an individual plan for every child, something private schools have been striving to create for about twenty years. The student gets to run the show, and that's as it should be. Your assumption here seems to be that the teacher is not available. This has no relation to reality.





"Do you deny that isolation is used for punishment?"



Isolation is not used. Period. It is "intervention"--by clinical definition a completely different animal.



"That purple room looks mighty small and uncomfortable for a three day or longer stint."



Intervention looks like this: a student who is escalated goes to the intervention room, accompanied by staff. They can choose to stay escalated, but most are happy to try other available means of handling things: have a therapist come over and talk, have a staff they feel confortable with come over and talk, have an upper status student (one or a few) come over and talk. If they just don't want to talk, that's OK too.



By staying relatively calm for half an hour, the student shows a willingness to act in a safe manner, and heads back to wherever he was before that. The exception? Some kids want to stay and relax; that's OK. Some also go there at their own request, for a time-out.



Bottom line? It's up to the student, every step of the way. That isn't isolating, it's empowering.  









"


I know exactly who this is! ANYWAY!!!! Okay let's break it down......yes a consequence is basically losing points............but, when you work so hard to make levels and some inmate is wanting revenge on you for whatever reason........and they have the power to make your life a hell, and take away what little priveleges you've been working so hard to acheive, well, it's devistating!!! You'll never know this until you've been through it.


As far as the censorship of mail goes......you were not allowed to communicate with friends. When you wrote letters to your parents telling them what was really happening there........they were terrified, and contacted your therapist......he then maybe asked for copies? Then you are confronted with the fact of you trying to manipulate, therefore receiving some sort of punishment.

Self-paced versus self-guided? Whatever, puhleese do I even need to go there? A 2 year old can figure that one out!!!!


As far as requesting confinement....or time outs? Um..........don't know? I never once requested such a thing.........nor did anyone I know of. I would go there kicking and screaming, Nooooooooooooo!

Do not try to get me into your line of thinking. I am not buying this whatsover, and nobody else is for that matter.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
f you were never in a program, or a parent of a child in a program, then you have no business posting here.

Offline MightyAardvark

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« Reply #33 on: April 21, 2006, 04:30:00 AM »
CCM girl, would you mind talking to me about your time at Cross Creek?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
see the children with their boredom and their vacant stares. God help us all if we\'re to blame for their unanswered prayers,

Billy Joel.

Offline Badpuppy

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« Reply #34 on: April 22, 2006, 08:18:00 PM »
CM Girl since you have an idea who responded to my questions does this person actually have a degree? Does he understand that he admitted the reliance on underage troubled youth to run a reform school?  I'd hope somebody with a graduate degree would realize this is grossly inapropriate and a practice unaccptable by any mental health organization in the United States. I have a feeling he wants to run a far away from this as he can but I will give him a chance to respond before going into the issues of education fraud, and his asinine defense of a lack of meaningful pedagogy as well as absurdity of thinking that ANYONE would feel empowered as a result of  coercion imposed by a four foot wide coffin.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2006, 01:35:00 AM »
I think it's that loser Kelly from Myspace.  The one pro-WWASPie.  Watch out if you go to her group, she'll kick you out if you dare speak the truth.  She ought to be raising her kids and spend less time trying to gain 15 minutes of online fame as the Sole Troll with a Role.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2006, 02:26:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-22 22:35:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I think it's that loser Kelly from Myspace.  The one pro-WWASPie.  Watch out if you go to her group, she'll kick you out if you dare speak the truth.  She ought to be raising her kids and spend less time trying to gain 15 minutes of online fame as the Sole Troll with a Role."


 :nworthy:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2006, 03:11:00 PM »
If they say that student's mail to the parents isn't censored then they're lying!  I was told that it was my job to look over any mail that a student was sending out and look for any phone numbers, threats of any kind(suicide, violence, etc).  If there was, we were to turn it over to the Rep.  If there wasn't anything then we sealed the envelope and put our initials on it.  Some family parents didn't follow that rule and just sealed them, others got off on reading the letters and would tell other staff about them.  If that isn't censoring, I don't know what is.

I also recall having basket searches done on my family while we were having group in the room next door.  One of the girls could hear them through the door and they were laughing as they read her journal!  Not only was it jr.staff that was doing it but their was a staff person with them laughing also.  When I stood at the door and listened I could hear them also.  I took this information to the Shift leader, but nothing was ever done about it.

How was this girl ever supposed to trust anyone again and feel comfortable putting her thoughts down in a journal???

Do they censor the students mail at SCL??? Hell yes!
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Offline Badpuppy

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« Reply #38 on: April 23, 2006, 08:43:00 PM »
Thanks so much Anon for exposing another WWASP lie. It is ,of course, ILLEGAL to monitor letters to parents. This cannot be waived by a contract signed by the parents. PARENTS, IF YOU HAVE A CHILD IN A WWASP FACILITY TAKE THEM OUT NOW. ANY FACILITY INCLUDING JUVENILE DETENTION IS A BETTER CHOICE. At least the length their stay will not be subject to arbitrary and capricious whims of other troubled children. At least they will receive classroom teaching, not the fraudulant pretense of "self guided study" "Self guided study" in WWASP terms is a euphemism for education fraud as was found at The Academy of Ivy Ridge. How is it possible for a child to learn Algebra and Science without classroom instruction? How many children can weigh the contents of a text and hierarchically determine with no classroom instruction, the questions that should be asked. Self guided study isn't education, it's abdication. Where is the curriculum? Where are the course choices? NO PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL IN THE UNITED STATES SIMPLY HANDS OUT A BOOK WITHOUT SOME ELEMENTARY CLASSROOM ATTEMPT TO TEACH ITS CONTENTS. And that is without the additional factor that many kids were poor students. In what education universe is it possible that no classroom instruction is better than classroom instruction. No classroom instruction is a sick and pathethic gimmick to rob students of the skills they need to advance educationally, and compete for jobs in a competitive marketplace.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #39 on: April 24, 2006, 05:47:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-23 17:43:00, Badpuppy wrote:

"Thanks so much Anon for exposing another WWASP lie. It is ,of course, ILLEGAL to monitor letters to parents. This cannot be waived by a contract signed by the parents. PARENTS, IF YOU HAVE A CHILD IN A WWASP FACILITY TAKE THEM OUT NOW. ANY FACILITY INCLUDING JUVENILE DETENTION IS A BETTER CHOICE. At least the length their stay will not be subject to arbitrary and capricious whims of other troubled children. At least they will receive classroom teaching, not the fraudulant pretense of "self guided study" "Self guided study" in WWASP terms is a euphemism for education fraud as was found at The Academy of Ivy Ridge. How is it possible for a child to learn Algebra and Science without classroom instruction? How many children can weigh the contents of a text and hierarchically determine with no classroom instruction, the questions that should be asked. Self guided study isn't education, it's abdication. Where is the curriculum? Where are the course choices? NO PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL IN THE UNITED STATES SIMPLY HANDS OUT A BOOK WITHOUT SOME ELEMENTARY CLASSROOM ATTEMPT TO TEACH ITS CONTENTS. And that is without the additional factor that many kids were poor students. In what education universe is it possible that no classroom instruction is better than classroom instruction. No classroom instruction is a sick and pathethic gimmick to rob students of the skills they need to advance educationally, and compete for jobs in a competitive marketplace. "


This did too-did not is tiresome. I've seen it, you haven't. You have no personal experience to draw upon, and your reasoning is out of whack. For instance, in your ignorance of educational theory, you hold up as an example the public school system that has so far failed at least 8000 kids--that's why they go to scl. Has it occurred to you that some big plot to rob kids of skills would hardly be profitable?
 :wave:
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Offline Programmie-Trans 9000

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« Reply #40 on: April 24, 2006, 05:51:00 PM »
ACTIVE MODE ENGAGED

TARGET ACQUIRED

Quote
Some baghead really meant to say...

I'm going to go with the tried-and-false "you don't know what you're talking about" "argument" again. You obviously understand education in a way that I never will, but I'm going to attack you anyway. For instance, I'm going to blame the public school system again, which, despite its faults, is not an organized attempt to defraud parents and harm kids as SCL is. It's obviously occurred to you that if we hired real teachers, we wouldn't be making nearly as much money.


TRANSLATION COMPLETE
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Y ONLY DRIVERS ARE MASS DRIVERS, BITCH.

Offline emaree

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« Reply #41 on: April 24, 2006, 08:31:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-04-24 14:47:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2006-04-23 17:43:00, Badpuppy wrote:


"Thanks so much Anon for exposing another WWASP lie. It is ,of course, ILLEGAL to monitor letters to parents. This cannot be waived by a contract signed by the parents. PARENTS, IF YOU HAVE A CHILD IN A WWASP FACILITY TAKE THEM OUT NOW. ANY FACILITY INCLUDING JUVENILE DETENTION IS A BETTER CHOICE. At least the length their stay will not be subject to arbitrary and capricious whims of other troubled children. At least they will receive classroom teaching, not the fraudulant pretense of "self guided study" "Self guided study" in WWASP terms is a euphemism for education fraud as was found at The Academy of Ivy Ridge. How is it possible for a child to learn Algebra and Science without classroom instruction? How many children can weigh the contents of a text and hierarchically determine with no classroom instruction, the questions that should be asked. Self guided study isn't education, it's abdication. Where is the curriculum? Where are the course choices? NO PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL IN THE UNITED STATES SIMPLY HANDS OUT A BOOK WITHOUT SOME ELEMENTARY CLASSROOM ATTEMPT TO TEACH ITS CONTENTS. And that is without the additional factor that many kids were poor students. In what education universe is it possible that no classroom instruction is better than classroom instruction. No classroom instruction is a sick and pathethic gimmick to rob students of the skills they need to advance educationally, and compete for jobs in a competitive marketplace. "




This did too-did not is tiresome. I've seen it, you haven't. You have no personal experience to draw upon, and your reasoning is out of whack. For instance, in your ignorance of educational theory, you hold up as an example the public school system that has so far failed at least 8000 kids--that's why they go to scl. Has it occurred to you that some big plot to rob kids of skills would hardly be profitable?

 :wave:  "


You're so retarded. The public school system fails occasionally not for lack of education, but because students don't want to do the work. The problem at WWASP schools is that the kids who want to get the full knowledge a true high school would offer get a fucking outdated book and multiple choice tests. I AM drawing on experience, and you're dumber than a bucket of nails if you think the "education" children receive there is anything other than pathetic. Oh wait, you probably are. You went to a program and still defend it...
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----

\"They say evil prevails when good men fail to act. They should say evil prevails.\"
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Offline 69

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« Reply #42 on: April 24, 2006, 09:06:00 PM »
Our teachers would hand us back our multiple choice test with the wrong ones marked. So all you had to do was go back, memorize the ones you got wrong, and repeat that process until you got a passing grade. I became very skilled at sleeping with my head behind a book though.

Theology: The effort to explain the unknowable in terms of the not worth knowing.
--H. L. Mencken, American publisher

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Offline 69

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« Reply #43 on: April 24, 2006, 09:08:00 PM »
Quote

This did too-did not is tiresome. I've seen it, you haven't. You have no personal experience to draw upon, and your reasoning is out of whack. For instance, in your ignorance of educational theory, you hold up as an example the public school system that has so far failed at least 8000 kids--that's why they go to scl. Has it occurred to you that some big plot to rob kids of skills would hardly be profitable?


Ummm yeah, right. I've seen it, and I didn't find one single thing factually wrong with his statement. Is that why you respond the way you do, because you cannot argue the facts you simply choose to try and discredit those who disagree with you?

Marijuana in its natural form is one of the safest therapeutically active substances known to man. By  any measure of rational analysis marijuana can be safely used within the supervised routine of medical care.
http://www.masscann.org/quotes.htm' target='_new'>Administrative Law Judge, Francis Young,  DOJ/DEA

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Offline Badpuppy

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« Reply #44 on: April 24, 2006, 10:08:00 PM »
Your arguements reflect your total ignorance, lack of education, and incoherent logic. But you have an excuse--your self guided study at SCL. Are you actually claiming that students prosper more without classroom teaching than with classroom teaching? That students best prosper in algebra, english, and science when the teacher says I'm never teaching anything but I will answer your questions." This logic is among the most specious reasoning I have ever enountered. In fact it doesn't even rise to that level. It is simply BIZARRE. It is only surpassed by your assumption that it takes more money not to teach, than it does to teach. Harvard Yale and Columbia find their recruits in all kinds of public and private schools, including schools with low performance, but they seem to have missed Spring Creek Lodge. But we do know something about their graduates. And that is that on average three out of four will graduate to a psychiatric hospital or penal institution. And as to what you perceive as my lack of erudition in educational philosophy every recognized professional educational association in America, including those representing private schools, affirms the need  for an active pedagocical approach (classroom teaching). So tell me what educational credentials do you possess, besides your worthless SCL diploma? I am waiting to be ASTOUNDED by your vast knowledge of educational philosophy, practice and procedures. I won't even go into the asininity of your comment about your ancedotal experience. The victims of this education fraud are in many posts as well as in court testimony, and speak more eloquently than I can about the mindnumbing, boredom, and misery of their pedagoical experiences at SCL. Hopefully you will never put your children or any child, through the betrayal and treachery of a WWASP facility.
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