Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Troubled Teen Industry
Second Nature Wilderness Program
Anonymous:
as a program attendee of many programs i would have to say second nature is a great program IF YOU HAVE THE MONEY. They do not abuse their kids because they are smarter than that in that the longevity of their program relies on not abusing kids. And dont tell me I dont know what I am talking about because I went there and am brainwashed. That is not true. I think there are some great things about second nature and some bad things too. The staff are mostly hippies that actually want to help and they freeze in the winter and bake in the summer. I got to talk about things in a safe environment. I was given choices which I cannot say for other programs. Do good kids get sent to the wrong programs, absolutely. Does second nature help in the long run? only if you have the money to send your kid to an after care where they can be kept from temptation.
a lot of time its the parents that create an unstable home
TheWho:
--- Quote from: "slowmotion" ---as a program attendee of many programs i would have to say second nature is a great program IF YOU HAVE THE MONEY. They do not abuse their kids because they are smarter than that in that the longevity of their program relies on not abusing kids. And dont tell me I dont know what I am talking about because I went there and am brainwashed. That is not true. I think there are some great things about second nature and some bad things too. The staff are mostly hippies that actually want to help and they freeze in the winter and bake in the summer. I got to talk about things in a safe environment. I was given choices which I cannot say for other programs. Do good kids get sent to the wrong programs, absolutely. Does second nature help in the long run? only if you have the money to send your kid to an after care where they can be kept from temptation.
a lot of time its the parents that create an unstable home
--- End quote ---
Slowmotion, thank you for the honest account. The majority of the staff members are really great people who want to help kids, but there is always that one person who gets into a power trip which reflects badly on staff as a whole.
I have spoken to many kids who are struggling due to instability at home. Just getting them free from those bad dynamics can be enough to get them on the right track again. The follow-up is critical.... if the child returns to the same environment (if that was a contributing cause) then the effort could prove fruitless, whether it be old friends, old habits, family dynamics or child’s medical needs/medication... as you mentioned the after care plan is crucial to the success of the program.
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Anonymous:
after care is a scam in itself. the reason second nature works is because it is an unsustainable short term process. are there good schools "after cares" and programs? i mean thats debateable. when you talk about non abusive transition living your talking the most expensive places. the staff at second nature has freedom of choice meaning that the owners the directors dont check up on staff because they dont like to go get dirty.
If your parents are the ones abusing you physically is talking about it in the desert or in the woods a terrible thing. Is talking about abuse hurtful no, is breaking an individual hurtful, yes
im not defending second nature by any means. I think this whole wilderness program/ after care is a complex subject.
if the parents dont change nothing for the kids will change.
the only wilderness program i endorse is Monarch Family Healing. Why do I endorse them?
Because the parents can come at any time. The kids are allowed in the city and asked not to run away. The parents have therapy. Thats right the parents are involved in 1/3 the therapy and the kids spend a week with them every three weeks.
They speak out against the bs in the ed consoltunt game, they are part of the congressional investigation on ethics. They helped to start the investigation. They almost went out of business and are still struggling because they are standing up for what is ethical. If you speak out against the people who refer kids how do you get kids? From parents who have their kids back home, not as perfect angles, more as a family that comunicates better. They deal with kids who recover from being in programs.
They refuse the use of pain restraints. Their theory is yeah kids will be kids when they go back home, they ll drink theyll "relapse" thats what kids do. there number one goal is to get kids home because they believe programs cause abandonment and attachment issues. there are no "ear shot" rules, no nark people out. they just took their kids to help in New Orleans.
Wilderness can work to help people get in touch, it can help to heal people. Like anything put in the wrong hands it can be destructive.
Kids are brainwashed, brainwashed by the media, their peers who copy the media. I could go on and on and ive totally digressed off the second nature subject.
TheWho:
--- Quote from: "slowmotion" --- after care is a scam in itself. the reason second nature works is because it is an unsustainable short term process. are there good schools "after cares" and programs? i mean thats debateable. when you talk about non abusive transition living your talking the most expensive places. the staff at second nature has freedom of choice meaning that the owners the directors dont check up on staff because they dont like to go get dirty.
If your parents are the ones abusing you physically is talking about it in the desert or in the woods a terrible thing. Is talking about abuse hurtful no, is breaking an individual hurtful, yes
im not defending second nature by any means. I think this whole wilderness program/ after care is a complex subject.
--- End quote ---
I guess I viewed aftercare as a little more general i.e. seeing a therapist locally once the child gets home. Moving on to a TBS I agree is debatable and depends on the individual child. There are harsh and abusive programs out there and these are the ones we need to keep kids away from.
--- Quote ---if the parents dont change nothing for the kids will change.
--- End quote ---
Especially if the home environment is part of the problem, which in some cases it is. The better programs will address the family situation and ask them to work on the issues which come up during the child’s stay or deemed to be a problem so the child does go back to the same environment.
--- Quote ---the only wilderness program i endorse is Monarch Family Healing. Why do I endorse them?
Because the parents can come at any time. The kids are allowed in the city and asked not to run away. The parents have therapy. Thats right the parents are involved in 1/3 the therapy and the kids spend a week with them every three weeks. They speak out against the bs in the ed consoltunt game, they are part of the congressional investigation on ethics. They helped to start the investigation. They almost went out of business and are still struggling because they are standing up for what is ethical. If you speak out against the people who refer kids how do you get kids? From parents who have their kids back home, not as perfect angles, more as a family that comunicates better. They deal with kids who recover from being in programs.
They refuse the use of pain restraints. Their theory is yeah kids will be kids when they go back home, they ll drink theyll "relapse" thats what kids do. there number one goal is to get kids home because they believe programs cause abandonment and attachment issues. there are no "ear shot" rules, no nark people out. they just took their kids to help in New Orleans.
--- End quote ---
That is good to hear….I found “SUWS of the Carolinas” to be beneficial and not abusive towards the children (some kids found it to be harsh) They don’t involve the parents as much as Monarch Family Healing, but they are involved and work towards getting families closer together. They don’t use restraints that I am aware of and utilize therapists which are paid separately (independent) from the program, which I liked.
They never talked about the kids going back to drinking and smoking as normal… but for me this wasn’t a big issue anyway, but it is good to be realistic.
--- Quote ---Wilderness can work to help people get in touch, it can help to heal people. Like anything put in the wrong hands it can be destructive.
Kids are brainwashed, brainwashed by the media, their peers who copy the media. I could go on and on and ive totally digressed off the second nature subject.
--- End quote ---
Good post, slowmotion , thanks
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Anonymous:
--- Quote from: "Lain the Odd" ---That's the basic idea with Second Nature.
My particular ordeal began with being kidnapped and shipped there as so many. My crime consisted entirely of.. being sad. I still love the idea that taking a depressed transsexual and shipping her to Mormon Utah, minus what few comforts did exist and plus sadistic staff and insane 'therapeutic' ideas were going to make it better.
As noted, the therapist (who was everyone there's therapist) was around at most once a week. This in contrast to the therapist I had at home, who I saw once a week, liked, and respected, and if something came up I needed to talk about he could usually be on call within a few hours at most.
I won't get into the gory details, but staff were every bit as sadistic as any other program, only they really weren't allowed to beat people up randomly - bad PR, I guess. They were perfectly happy with mind games, and those were about the extent of the "therapy".
Now, they get paid for processed meat turned over to more 'long-term' programs, so throughout this they were buttering up my parents to make me such afterwards, of course. They did, the 2 other places and 2 stints at Second Nature gave me PTSD, and that's a story for you.
Conclusion: While I don't doubt the value of doing so, I don't even need to trash Second Nature with its obvious faults and false advertising (which, I will confirm, is false as they come). My argument is a bit simpler: It DOESN'T WORK.
--- End quote ---
sad
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