Second Nature Wilderness Program

[Lain the Odd]

That's the basic idea with Second Nature.

My particular ordeal began with being kidnapped and shipped there as so many. My crime consisted entirely of.. being sad. I still love the idea that taking a depressed transsexual and shipping her to Mormon Utah, minus what few comforts did exist and plus sadistic staff and insane 'therapeutic' ideas were going to make it better.

As noted, the therapist (who was everyone there's therapist) was around at most once a week. This in contrast to the therapist I had at home, who I saw once a week, liked, and respected, and if something came up I needed to talk about he could usually be on call within a few hours at most.

I won't get into the gory details, but staff were every bit as sadistic as any other program, only they really weren't allowed to beat people up randomly - bad PR, I guess. They were perfectly happy with mind games, and those were about the extent of the "therapy".

Now, they get paid for processed meat turned over to more 'long-term' programs, so throughout this they were buttering up my parents to make me such afterwards, of course. They did, the 2 other places and 2 stints at Second Nature gave me PTSD, and that's a story for you.

Conclusion: While I don't doubt the value of doing so, I don't even need to trash Second Nature with its obvious faults and false advertising (which, I will confirm, is false as they come). My argument is a bit simpler: It DOESN'T WORK.

[Buddha22]

Just one answer to consider.


kids at programs like where you sent your kid, have rules about talking down about the program to their parents.basically, if they say anything bad about the program over the phone, or by mail, they will get severely punished for it.  

programs like those are infamous about their abusive treatment methods. like isolation, verbal,psychological, and physical abuse.

I will be typically not surprised if its an unlicensed facility with untrained staff members.

[Anonymous]

The therapists at Second Nature are excellent- the best I have encountered.  They are highly trained and many are PhDs.  The kids are not punished for trashing or bad-mouthing the program and their letters to parents are not censored.  It works well for many kids.
The kids at wilderness have reached the point where they won't GET in the car for the parents to take them to see a therapist.

[Anonymous]

[TheWho]

My argument is a bit simpler: It DOESN'T WORK.

Correction:  It didnt work for you!!



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[Che Gookin]

Of the 6 or so kids I knew at 3 springs who went to Second Nature it didn't work for them either.

[TheWho]

Of the 6 or so kids I knew at 3 springs who went to Second Nature it didn't work for them either.

Well, TSW, I don’t think you would expect to.  Many times the reason a child may move on to a residential or Therapeutic program is because the wilderness was not effective for them.  So many of the kids who were successful would have gone directly home after their wilderness experience.
 Other times the wilderness experience is used as an assessment period to determine what may be the best next step for the child, i.e. going home, going to a TBS, boarding school etc.



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[Che Gookin]

That is funny that you should mention that because of the 6 all of them were there on the reccomendation of Second Nature.

>>>>

[Lain the Odd]

So many of the kids who were successful would have gone directly home after their wilderness experience.


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In the immortal words of Lex Luthor: WRONG!

NOBODY went home from Second Nature. It didn't matter in the least how "successful" or not they were. In two durances, nobody went home, because they wouldn't have gotten more cash from it.

...of course, it didn't really matter because none of them were successful. They just created new problems and passed them off as such.

[TheWho]

That is funny that you should mention that because of the 6 all of them were there on the reccomendation of Second Nature.

>>>>

Yes, that is usually how it works.  Many of the kids attend wilderness before going onto a program.  I know that when ASR had a wilderness portion all the kids were required to attend the wilderness portion prior to moving on to the main campus, so that doesnt surprise me.



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[Oz girl]

The therapists at Second Nature are excellent- the best I have encountered.  They are highly trained and many are PhDs.  The kids are not punished for trashing or bad-mouthing the program and their letters to parents are not censored.  It works well for many kids.
The kids at wilderness have reached the point where they won't GET in the car for the parents to take them to see a therapist.

This seems a common argument. it may be true. I can remember on one of the seasons of brat Camp the therapist seemed genuinely smart and helpful in direct contrast to the naievety and gross stupidity of the on the ground staff. (gee we twisted that girls arm for 20 minutes and she is still pissed at us. go figure) but what is the point of  single competent adult if they only see the kid once a week? Afterall no phd trained adult on a good salary is going to spend 5 days a week shitting in the woods and most dont.

[Anonymous]

Fuck Second Nature.

I sat through their sales, the duration of wilderness, their eve of transition lectures when the Mormons spout their craziness. They are run by Mormons. Look where they are located in the middle of nowwhere in Duchense, BumfuckUtah.

they told us that our daughter who didn't do drugs or drink, was straight-edge and therefore in DANGER. Straight-edge in Salt Lake City is a baaad thing apparently. Gangs are violent and most are straightedges in Mormon country didn't you know.  WTF? Also, if you don't eat meat in Second Nature you are labelled as a control freak/anorectic/eating disorder and need a TBS.  Therapy was once a week and otherwise young men or women are in charge of your child.

Thankfully, we got out of the cycle of kidnapping/wilderness/TBS, brainwashing.

[psy]

Fuck Second Nature.

I sat through their sales, the duration of wilderness, their eve of transition lectures when the Mormons spout their craziness. They are run by Mormons. Look where they are located in the middle of nowwhere in Duchense, BumfuckUtah.

they told us that our daughter who didn't do drugs or drink, was straight-edge and therefore in DANGER. Straight-edge in Salt Lake City is a baaad thing apparently. Gangs are violent and most are straightedges in Mormon country didn't you know.  WTF? Also, if you don't eat meat in Second Nature you are labelled as a control freak/anorectic/eating disorder and need a TBS.  Therapy was once a week and otherwise young men or women are in charge of your child.

Thankfully, we got out of the cycle of kidnapping/wilderness/TBS, brainwashing.

Holy shit.  It's a sane program parent !

::jawdrop::

[Che Gookin]

Someone preserve this one in a jar of brine!

[Lain the Odd]

Fuck Second Nature.

I sat through their sales, the duration of wilderness, their eve of transition lectures when the Mormons spout their craziness. They are run by Mormons. Look where they are located in the middle of nowwhere in Duchense, BumfuckUtah.

they told us that our daughter who didn't do drugs or drink, was straight-edge and therefore in DANGER. Straight-edge in Salt Lake City is a baaad thing apparently. Gangs are violent and most are straightedges in Mormon country didn't you know.  WTF? Also, if you don't eat meat in Second Nature you are labelled as a control freak/anorectic/eating disorder and need a TBS.  Therapy was once a week and otherwise young men or women are in charge of your child.

Thankfully, we got out of the cycle of kidnapping/wilderness/TBS, brainwashing.

Yeah.. that's the basic idea. Sometimes they come up with some ridiculous pretense for a problem as mentioned above.. sometimes if the parents buy into it they don't even go that far, just "they need it, now get us our referral cash!" And despite whatever they may say about their religious affiliations or lack thereof, they ARE Mormons and DO push that in their beliefs and practices.