Author Topic: Vulcan Challenge - Fire Element  (Read 6900 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Vulcan Challenge - Fire Element
« Reply #45 on: June 13, 2006, 12:55:00 AM »
way too much is what they agree to. It doesn't seem to you at the time that the isolation will be as extreme as it is. It may be that some parents are intitially glad to get a troubled kid away from the home, the home can be pretty devastated by the child. You assume, wrongly, that while isolated, the kids are getting superb counseling, but they're not as far as I could tell. Some counseling appeared to be good, but for what they charge, it should be as good as it gets.

HLA looked good on paper, but I wish I had looked for negatives at the onset, I usually do. I never would have voted yes.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Vulcan Challenge - Fire Element
« Reply #46 on: June 14, 2006, 07:54:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-06-12 15:29:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Alex, you may blame your parents, but not all parents are crack smoking missing persons. The parent cannot live the child's life, in any case. They should be as involved as possible, and I agree that a lot of the issue is parents "not having enough time to deal with it". But children out of control, and they can be, is a mindbending thing to most parents. You can say you are there until you are blue in the face, the kids rarely tell you what is really up, you have to see behind the scenes, and that is personally invasive. Much of being a teen is exploring boundaries, I explored plenty myself. It seems to me that today the boundaries are often ignored wholesale, and the parents feel helpless.



Places like HLA *appear*to offer the parents a solution. I am not defending it at all...but that is what it looks like when you are in the maelstrom. When the child "acting out" is destroying the family, and all it has and stands for, the parents have to take some action, they must. It is only after your child is incarcerated there, that you begin to understand just how far they go to isolate the child from you. The warning should be in the papers you sign. Sadly, I think many parents want relief so much, they will sign anything, and pray that it works. I know in my case, the child was deeply loved by all involved.



I hope you can understand the anguish a parent can have in the aftermath of this. Would that life be more simple at times.



As for the Vulcan Challenge, I think that kind of approach can work for some, but the persons initiating the requirement need to be absolutely sure it's right for the child involved, because so many kids can be damaged by it as well. I sure would have been, had I been subjected to anything like that. I would have done anything I could to get out of it, I know exactly what you mean, feeling like a "total asshole". Been there.



Once again, highly skilled, caring,empathatic therapists are needed, and my experience was that they weren't there when needed at HLA.



When a 13 yr. old acts out, do you really think it is usually because they want mommy and daddy? I have been thinking about that since you posted it."


As much as I hate to say it, you're entitled to your opinion.
If I didn't really think a 13 year old kid wanted their mommy and daddy when they acted out... I wouldn't have said it.
Also, it's one thing to say you're there for your kid, it's also another to do it. And I'm all for parents going through their kids' stuff to do so. If a 13 year old child has the power to destroy the family..it probabily has nothing to do with the kid.
When I see a minor walking down the street at 11am on a school day dressed like a whore, setting fires, doing drugs or having permiscous sex..I ask myself where are her parents. I'm not like oh look at that fucked up juvenile deliquent, they need to be locked up, they're destroying everything. THEY'RE KIDS!! Where do you think they get it from?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #47 on: June 15, 2006, 12:48:00 AM »
I also feel you are entitled to your opinion,but,  I do not hate saying it. I thank you for posting it, so others can learn.

I also ask "where are the parents?". But, the parents cannot spend 24 hrs a day in close physical contact with the child. At 11AM on a schoolday, they are likely working so the family has food on the table, a roof over their heads, and cars to get them around. Parents have many responsiblities to juggle. Where do I think the kids get it from? The complete society around them , not just the parents, not just the peers. parents try to help the kids make good choices. They were kids once, too. They often have perspective as a child and as an adult.

I have seen parents comfortable with daughters dressed like hookers, but far more parents that told the daughters "no", and why.As for the mini hookers, the kids merely kept clothes elsewhere and changed after leaving home.

I think searching the child's stuff is a last resort. Teenagers need to learn respect for others property, to invade theirs teaches the opposite. I don't wish myself or my children to live in a world of spying.

And last, I am the last person to say "lock them up" I was trying to convey what can lead to a loving parent sending a child to a joint like HLA. I pointed out I was no fan, and I am not. A child screaming at the mother until the mother's head physically shakes, is a truly terrifying thing to behold. It gets to where the mom has stress syndrome, and she cannot parent then. When you love them both, it is very hard, you have to think of all of you, not just one. They are excruciating questions, and good parents try their utmost to never shirk their duties as parents. They sometimes fail, they are human-but they do their utmost. And where's the Dad? often the moms are single, often dad is at work, and often dad steps in, there are many scenarios. Often dad comes home later, and simply cannot believe his wife and child could have had such a thing happen. There are no simple answers.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline RobertBruce

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« Reply #48 on: June 15, 2006, 08:50:00 AM »
But is HLA the right solution?

Probably not.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #49 on: June 15, 2006, 11:47:00 AM »
You're just one excuse after another. Whatever.. this is gay.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #50 on: June 16, 2006, 01:16:00 AM »
No, RB, I do NOT think HLA is the solution. I hate locking up anybody unless injury is resulting.
I don't have the answers, that's my point. I haven't seen that anyone else did, either. You can't just "let kids be kids", society doesn't accept the mayhem that results. You can't expect parents to always do the right thing whatever it is. My best guess would be intensive counseling with caring people, and heavily involved parents. That's mighty hard to ensure. But, there are situations where the parents and children need to be separatedfor any number of reasons. They must be brouight back together as soon as possible, my opinion. HLA seems to delight in maintaining control and separation.

I detest what HLA has done to so many. I personally hope they are held accountable, to whatever extent they can be.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline RobertBruce

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« Reply #51 on: June 16, 2006, 10:08:00 AM »
Amen to that.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »