Author Topic: Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage  (Read 23079 times)

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Offline odie

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #45 on: February 22, 2006, 10:36:00 AM »
Quote
On 2006-02-22 06:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

" Sorry about your friend but suicide and murder are 2 completly different things. TOo bad you guys are so vengful and cant carry on a conversation youve proved your points again and again that being you have no idea what your talking about so take care stay clean and keep comming back.

"

And just would you call the incident about 5 years ago in California where a kid was in Daytop, told them he was contemplating suicide, ran away from the facility, and killed himself?
Keep coming back? LOL I stopped going to those religious cults ages ago.

...it is worth discussing radical changes, not in the expectation that they will be adopted promptly but for two other reasons. One is to construct an ideal goal, so that incremental changes can be judged by whether they move the institutional structure toward or away from that ideal. The other reason is very different. It is so that if a crisis requiring or facilitating radical change does arise, alternatives will be available that have been carefully developed and fully explored."

http://lfb.com/?stocknumber=103&code=10247' target='_new'>Milton Friedman

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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #46 on: February 22, 2006, 12:14:00 PM »
You cant blame Daytop because the kid split and killed himself. Once he splits he's are on his own. I saw a suicide attempt while in there and the person was immediately moved to psychiatric care and properly handled. Obviously if your a junkie your already suicidal but you wouldnt understand that having never been one.
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #47 on: February 22, 2006, 12:21:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-02-22 09:14:00, Anonymous wrote:

" You cant blame Daytop because the kid split and killed himself.

Oh yes you can!  If a kid actually DID have a problem before entering Daytop it's just made worse.  If they DON'T have a problem before entering, they do when they leave.

 
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Once he splits he's are on his own.

What about all those wonderful things he took away from Daytop??

 
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Obviously if your a junkie your already suicidal

Not true at all.

 
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but you wouldnt understand that having never been one."


You have no idea who you're talking to. Hooked for eight years, physically, ended it with NO help from a fucking program.
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Offline odie

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #48 on: February 22, 2006, 12:34:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-02-22 09:14:00, Anonymous wrote:

" You cant blame Daytop because the kid split and killed himself. Once he splits he's are on his own. I saw a suicide attempt while in there and the person was immediately moved to psychiatric care and properly handled. Obviously if your a junkie your already suicidal but you wouldnt understand that having never been one."

Are you serious or what? Daytop was told by the kid that he was thinking about suicide and they did nothing to prevent it. To use the lame excuse that just because he didn't kill himself on the facility they are not at fault is pure ignorance. They had an ethical obligation to do something but did not.

They know that it is human nature to take up causes whereby a man may oppress his neighbor, no matter how unjustly. ... Hence they have had no trouble in finding men who would preach the damnability and heresy of the new doctrine from the very pulpit.
--Galileo Galilei, Italian astronomer

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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #49 on: February 22, 2006, 02:09:00 PM »
Again if your a junkie and you know its bad for you and can kill, you then your suicidal if you continue to use it knowing you can die. I was there for 3 years if I had a quater for everyone who said they were gonna kill themselves  i'd make bill gates look like a homeless person.
 You guys are miserable , still using junkies too bad.
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #50 on: February 22, 2006, 02:28:00 PM »
Wow...you really are something. What have you done with your life since you left? Married? Kids? job?

Or just still a junkie w/out a needle?
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Offline Troll Control

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #51 on: February 22, 2006, 02:45:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-02-22 11:09:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Again if your a junkie and you know its bad for you and can kill, you then your suicidal if you continue to use it knowing you can die. I was there for 3 years if I had a quater for everyone who said they were gonna kill themselves  i'd make bill gates look like a homeless person.

 You guys are miserable , still using junkies too bad.  



"


Dude, you're just an idiot, plain and simple.  You haven't made a single intelligent point to illustrate your position.  All you do is come on here and call clean and sober people "still using junkies."  It sounds like a pure projection to me.

BTW, why is your self image so poor that you an only feel good by trying to make others feel bad?  You're pretty pathetic, man.
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #52 on: February 22, 2006, 03:12:00 PM »
I Agree man...You seem angry at life and take it out on people you don't know. What gives you the right to call other people miserable junkies?
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #53 on: February 22, 2006, 03:28:00 PM »
Im not angry at all except that you folks may be preventing someone from getting treatment they need and deserve. Your trying to tell people that getting NO help is better then going into daytop...??? What kind of logic is that...It better to be just about ANYWHERE then be out there "runnin" (that means still using drugs for all you "counselors" out there). And now that Ive looked around these boards a little I see its a pro-using sight and thats too bad. And yes Im very successful with a wife and children with a LARGE house, built in pool fireplace etc so I have done lots since Ive graduated. Your the ones that are angry and projecting, im calling it as I see it I was there 3 years from entry to graduation, Im not some fly by night splitee posting comments cause they could face their demons and existensial fears. It'll be 20 years w/out DOPE and I do mean Dope in June of 06. 20 Years you cant argue with that.
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #54 on: February 22, 2006, 03:41:00 PM »
So you got some big management job with the degree you earned in Daytop...that what gives you your "I'm better than all of you" attitude.
I feel sorry for your wife and kids...a big house with a pool can't make up for living with someone's angery uncompassionate outlook on life.
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Offline odie

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #55 on: February 22, 2006, 03:54:00 PM »
We aren't saying not to seek treatment. We are saying that Daytop over the years abused and humiliated people by their techniques. How can we believe that all this has somehow changed when you have the same people running things that were in charge way back when you were there? I'll give some examples of the techniques that were used that you may be familiar with.

1. Having grown men carrying around 6 foot baby rattles and confronted on why they act like a baby because they may have over reacted to someone.

2. Having women working in the garden using only hoes as a symbol that they acted like ho's.

3. Depriving people of sleep by forcing them to stay in marathon groups for 3 days facilitated by staff that were only clean sometimes a few more months then they were.

4. Shaving heads.

5. Having people move rock piles from one end of the facility to the other.

These are only a few of the techniques used by untrained, unqualified staff to "help" people with their substance abuse problems. I personally knew staff that went home at night just trying to think of ways to fuck with peoples minds. Most of these counselors eventually relapsed anyways which always became an embarassment to those who actually cared and were doing the right thing.

Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.

--Mark Twain

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Offline Troll Control

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #56 on: February 22, 2006, 05:35:00 PM »
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So you got some big management job with the degree you earned in Daytop...


I have serious doubts that this is even true.  I mean this guy admits he's still a junkie, just without the needle.

What does that leave?  A feeble-minded, weak, projecting, denying, lying loser with an attitude problem.

I bet this guy even has a hard time getting himself dressed in clean clothes and taking care of basic hygiene needs.  If he was successful and secure he wouldn't need to come on here and pretend to be better than people who actually DO have their shit together.
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #57 on: February 22, 2006, 05:37:00 PM »
So not true there you guys go again no defense so you attack. tsk tsk tsk.
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Offline Troll Control

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #58 on: February 22, 2006, 05:44:00 PM »
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On 2006-02-22 14:37:00, Anonymous wrote:

"So not true there you guys go again no defense so you attack. tsk tsk tsk."


Defense for what?  I have nothing to defend myself for.  I've helped hundreds of clients learn to live a better way WITHOUT abusing and humiliating them.  What's to be defensive about?

I really do think that you just don't have the cognitive horsepower to understand that.  You have a very weak mind that isn't really capable of higher thought and reasoning.  It's that simple.  You're just too ignorant to know any better or to realize that there is REAL treatment that REALLY works without the abusive bullshit.
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Offline Anonymous

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Swan Lake 86-87 by Savage
« Reply #59 on: February 22, 2006, 06:03:00 PM »
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On 2006-02-22 12:28:00, Anonymous wrote:

 Your trying to tell people that getting NO help is better then going into daytop...???

Yep.

Quote
What kind of logic is that...It better to be just about ANYWHERE then be out there "runnin" (that means still using drugs for all you "counselors" out there).

You're assuming that anyone that uses drugs is "running".  Why would you assume that?


 
Quote
And now that Ive looked around these boards a little I see its a pro-using sight and thats too bad.

No, it's a pro-freedom site.  There are people here who think drugs should be legalized and people who don't.  Both sides of the issue are discussed.  Obviously you have a problem with the concept of debating an issue.

 
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And yes Im very successful with a wife and children with a LARGE house, built in pool fireplace etc so I have done lots since Ive graduated.

Goody for you, me too.  But I've got all that and more all the while being able to enjoy a drink or two or a joint or two.  Sorry if you can't handle that.

 
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Your the ones that are angry

yes, we get quite angry at the abuse of teenagers.

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im calling it as I see it

No, you're calling it as you'd like to see it.

 
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I was there 3 years from entry to graduation, Im not some fly by night splitee posting comments cause they could face their demons and existensial fears.

Guess the academic part of Daytop wasn't exactly top notch huh?

 
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It'll be 20 years w/out DOPE and I do mean Dope in June of 06.

you say that like you're the only one who ever accomplished that.  You're not and tons of us do it every day without benefit of a program.

 
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20 Years you cant argue with that.  "


No, I can't argue with the fact that you've been off dope for 20 years but I can argue what caused this change.
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