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Offline Lars

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Former students - Our worst experiences
« on: November 26, 2005, 03:48:00 PM »
I'd say the worst things I experienced there were...

1.  FLCs/Family Weekends.  

2.  Performing Arts

3.  Lousy academics

4.  Sleep deprivation & the lack of free time to pursue anything not part of Hyde's program

5.  Abusive/condescending/hypocritical faculty

6.  "Brother's Keeper"

7.  Public (in front of the whole student body) ridicule and humiliation and school meetings there in general

8.  Wrestling and other sports where the emphasis on running/calisthenics until you puked ruined what could have been fun experiences

9.  2/4, attitude trips & other "attitude adjustment" activities involving pointless exercises.

10.  Joe Gauld & the folks who really drank the Kool-Aid[ This Message was edited by: Lars on 2005-11-26 12:50 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2005, 04:16:00 PM »
Lars,

Who are you?
It would really help us understand your postings!
I can't remember from your other posts...did you graduate?

Thanks!
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Offline Lars

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« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2005, 04:39:00 PM »
I spent a summer then three years at Hyde and graduated in 1990.  I went to college and law school at Arizona State.  I spent five years as a public defender and now have my own practice out in AZ.

I hadn't really thought much about Hyde for several years until one day I googled "hyde" and found this site.  Sure brought back some lousy memories.  But it's good to see that others feel the same way I do about the place.  

Just got my pitch for the "annual fund."  It went straight into the wastebasket.  I only give money to ASU - I loved it there and they gave me quite a bit of academic scholarship money.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2005, 05:13:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 12:48:00, Lars wrote:

"I'd say the worst things I experienced there were...



1.  FLCs/Family Weekends.  



2.  Performing Arts



3.  Lousy academics



4.  Sleep deprivation & the lack of free time to pursue anything not part of Hyde's program



5.  Abusive/condescending/hypocritical faculty



6.  "Brother's Keeper"



7.  Public (in front of the whole student body) ridicule and humiliation and school meetings there in general



8.  Wrestling and other sports where the emphasis on running/calisthenics until you puked ruined what could have been fun experiences



9.  2/4, attitude trips & other "attitude adjustment" activities involving pointless exercises.



10.  Joe Gauld & the folks who really drank the Kool-Aid[ This Message was edited by: Lars on 2005-11-26 12:50 ]"


Your experiences are very similar to those reported by many other Hyde students our family has had contact with during the past several years.  We've had several Hyde kids visit our home and we've spoken with quite a few, in depth, during FLCs and family weekends.  We've heard countless stories that are very consistent with your experiences years ago.  I'm struck by the consistency of Hyde students' reports of (to reiterate your list) destructive FLCs, lame performing arts, inferior academics, sleep deprivation, abusive/condescending/hypocritical faculty, brother's keeper that bordered on the abusive and hypocritical, public shaming and humiliation, pointless exercises and mindless 2-4 activities, and . . . Joe Gauld.  

Other Hyde students and parents we've encountered repeat this list and add one other major Hyde horror: So many of Hyde's students enter the school with overhwhelmingly complex mental health problems.  A very common complaint (one that should scare off any parent considering Hyde) is that Hyde simply doesn't believe in providing on-campus mental health help for kids whose problems at Hyde (emotional crises, behavioral challenges, "attitude" issues) are a direct result of their psychiatric needs.  Hyde throws these kids a bone by agreeing to refer them to a handful of counselors in the local communities (Bath and Woodstock).  The families and educational consultants we've spoken to are shocked by Hyde's lack of interest in genuine mental health services and superficial contact with the kids' therapists.    Many have come to the conclusion that Hyde is accepting the wrong kinds of kids given its model.  The fact that Hyde accepts so many deeply troubled kids without providing appropriate supportive services is dreadful. Might it be that Hyde is so concerned about enrollments and cash flow that it's taking in kids who don't really belong there?

Joe Gauld's (and other Hyde staff's) belief that all this misbehavior stems from "attitude" problems is incredibly naive.  Some kids at Hyde may benefit from so-called attitude adjustments, but I bet they're few and far between.  Without question, Hyde is out of step with nationally recognized approaches to these sorts of struggling teens.  Hyde seems to wear their out-of-step approach like a badge of honor.  Hyde doesn't seem to realize that the school is surrounded by legions of people who view this as Hyde's badge of shame.  

I suppose Joe Gauld feels a sense of pride in his invention.  What he seems not to realize is that many regard his arrogance and self-centered, cocky demeanor as delusional: the epitome of denial.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2005, 05:31:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 13:39:00, Lars wrote:

"I spent a summer then three years at Hyde and graduated in 1990.  I went to college and law school at Arizona State.  I spent five years as a public defender and now have my own practice out in AZ.



I hadn't really thought much about Hyde for several years until one day I googled "hyde" and found this site.  Sure brought back some lousy memories.  But it's good to see that others feel the same way I do about the place.  



Just got my pitch for the "annual fund."  It went straight into the wastebasket.  I only give money to ASU - I loved it there and they gave me quite a bit of academic scholarship money."


The fact that you Googled Hyde and found this website is VERY significant.  There has been so much recent dialogue about Hyde on this website that it now shows up on Page 2 when you Google Hyde.  That is the strongest possible evidence that word about Hyde is getting out (for quite some time this website was much farther down in the Google listings for Hyde).

Any parent considering the school who Googles Hyde is likely to find this website.  If you're one of those parents, I would encourage you to read as many postings as possible, focus especially on the thoughtful comments, stay away from the angry diatribes that seem impulsive, and come to your own conclusions about Hyde.  I think that any reasonably objective, thinking parent would read these postings and decide to avoid Hyde completely.  I can't imagine reading the credible commentary here and even bothering to call Hyde to inquire, much less fill out an application and go for a visit.

Parents who are searching for a school for your struggling teen:  Please find a skilled, well informed, and principled educational consultant who knows the landscape.  There are some terrific  schools out there, and Hyde isn't one of them.  Any educational consultant who encourages you to seriously consider Hyde is waving a big red flag.  I strongly recommend finding a highly recommended educational consultant who knows better.
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Offline Lars

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« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2005, 05:48:00 PM »
"Other Hyde students and parents we've encountered repeat this list and add one other major Hyde horror: So many of Hyde's students enter the school with overhwhelmingly complex mental health problems.  A very common complaint (one that should scare off any parent considering Hyde) is that Hyde simply doesn't believe in providing on-campus mental health help for kids whose problems at Hyde (emotional crises, behavioral challenges, "attitude" issues) are a direct result of their psychiatric needs.  Hyde throws these kids a bone by agreeing to refer them to a handful of counselors in the local communities (Bath and Woodstock).  The families and educational consultants we've spoken to are shocked by Hyde's lack of interest in genuine mental health services and superficial contact with the kids' therapists.    Many have come to the conclusion that Hyde is accepting the wrong kinds of kids given its model.  The fact that Hyde accepts so many deeply troubled kids without providing appropriate supportive services is dreadful. Might it be that Hyde is so concerned about enrollments and cash flow that it's taking in kids who don't really belong there?"


Glad you brought this up - it should have been number one on my list, although it came into play on several of the things I listed.  They used to call me "Lazy Larry" at Hyde.  But I wasn't lazy, I was suffering from major clinical depression and anxiety disorder.  Granted, they didn't know that - it didn't get diagnosed until I was older.  But I don't think it would have mattered to them.  They were either clueless or deliberately ignorant about these things.  As I pointed out on another post, the faculty were absolutely shocked when I aced the SATs.  They had no idea that I was that intelligent.  In fact, it should have clued in everyone, including my parents, that another school would have better served my needs.  

They couldn't allow someone to simply learn the material and get good grades, you had to be a "leader" in class.  What a crock of shit.

I wasn't kidding when I talked about how much I loved college.  It wasn't just the great weather, the beautiful girls & the parties, I really enjoyed SCHOOL for the first time after I survived Hyde.  I enjoyed going to class, getting to take the ones that interested me and not having to be a "leader."  I learned in the real world that real leadership is something different than what Hyde tries to indoctrinate.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2005, 05:59:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 14:48:00, Lars wrote:

""Other Hyde students and parents we've encountered repeat this list and add one other major Hyde horror: So many of Hyde's students enter the school with overhwhelmingly complex mental health problems.  A very common complaint (one that should scare off any parent considering Hyde) is that Hyde simply doesn't believe in providing on-campus mental health help for kids whose problems at Hyde (emotional crises, behavioral challenges, "attitude" issues) are a direct result of their psychiatric needs.  Hyde throws these kids a bone by agreeing to refer them to a handful of counselors in the local communities (Bath and Woodstock).  The families and educational consultants we've spoken to are shocked by Hyde's lack of interest in genuine mental health services and superficial contact with the kids' therapists.    Many have come to the conclusion that Hyde is accepting the wrong kinds of kids given its model.  The fact that Hyde accepts so many deeply troubled kids without providing appropriate supportive services is dreadful. Might it be that Hyde is so concerned about enrollments and cash flow that it's taking in kids who don't really belong there?"





Glad you brought this up - it should have been number one on my list, although it came into play on several of the things I listed.  They used to call me "Lazy Larry" at Hyde.  But I wasn't lazy, I was suffering from major clinical depression and anxiety disorder.  Granted, they didn't know that - it didn't get diagnosed until I was older.  But I don't think it would have mattered to them.  They were either clueless or deliberately ignorant about these things.  As I pointed out on another post, the faculty were absolutely shocked when I aced the SATs.  They had no idea that I was that intelligent.  In fact, it should have clued in everyone, including my parents, that another school would have better served my needs.  



They couldn't allow someone to simply learn the material and get good grades, you had to be a "leader" in class.  What a crock of shit.



I wasn't kidding when I talked about how much I loved college.  It wasn't just the great weather, the beautiful girls & the parties, I really enjoyed SCHOOL for the first time after I survived Hyde.  I enjoyed going to class, getting to take the ones that interested me and not having to be a "leader."  I learned in the real world that real leadership is something different than what Hyde tries to indoctrinate.



"


Perhaps in your case Hyde didn't know about the clinical depression and anxiety issues since they were diagnosed post-Hyde.  But, Hyde certainly DOES know that lots of the students who currently enroll there have significant psychiatric diagnoses.  Hence, Hyde's inattention to these issues and unwillingess to provide professional services seems negligent to me.  Since you have a law degree, might you comment on this?  Does it seem that Hyde's willingness to accept kids with major mental health diagnoses without providing any professional services to address these issues comes close to negligence?  A number of people on this website have raised this issue.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2005, 06:07:00 PM »
Does Gauld ever hold forth on how professional psychiatrists don't know what they're doing?

There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is
proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in
everlasting ignorance- that principle is contempt prior to investigation.
--Herbert Spencer

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Offline Lars

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« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2005, 06:13:00 PM »
"Perhaps in your case Hyde didn't know about the clinical depression and anxiety issues since they were diagnosed post-Hyde.  But, Hyde certainly DOES know that lots of the students who currently enroll there have significant psychiatric diagnoses.  Hence, Hyde's inattention to these issues and unwillingess to provide professional services seems negligent to me.  Since you have a law degree, might you comment on this?  Does it seem that Hyde's willingness to accept kids with major mental health diagnoses without providing any professional services to address these issues comes close to negligence?  A number of people on this website have raised this issue."

I forgot to put in a previous post that prior to joining the public defender's office, I spent a year working in a law firm that specialized in personal injury & medical malpractice.  The guys I worked for were assholes, but it was a high powered practice and I learned quite a bit about nasty civil litigation.  Frankly, I think that Hyde is very lucky that it haven't gotten nailed in a lawsuit.  However, what you need to go forward with one is serious injury or death.  If some kid gets killed or kills him or herself there they could be in very big trouble.  I suspect they keep a very large liability policy just in case.  I believe that they have been extraordinarily negligent over the years.  I mean punitive damages kind of negligent (and those are rarely awarded, despite what the tort reform people will tell you).  But so far as we know, they've been lucky.
[ This Message was edited by: Lars on 2005-11-26 15:14 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2005, 06:47:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 15:13:00, Lars wrote:

""Perhaps in your case Hyde didn't know about the clinical depression and anxiety issues since they were diagnosed post-Hyde.  But, Hyde certainly DOES know that lots of the students who currently enroll there have significant psychiatric diagnoses.  Hence, Hyde's inattention to these issues and unwillingess to provide professional services seems negligent to me.  Since you have a law degree, might you comment on this?  Does it seem that Hyde's willingness to accept kids with major mental health diagnoses without providing any professional services to address these issues comes close to negligence?  A number of people on this website have raised this issue."



I forgot to put in a previous post that prior to joining the public defender's office, I spent a year working in a law firm that specialized in personal injury & medical malpractice.  The guys I worked for were assholes, but it was a high powered practice and I learned quite a bit about nasty civil litigation.  Frankly, I think that Hyde is very lucky that it haven't gotten nailed in a lawsuit.  However, what you need to go forward with one is serious injury or death.  If some kid gets killed or kills him or herself there they could be in very big trouble.  I suspect they keep a very large liability policy just in case.  I believe that they have been extraordinarily negligent over the years.  I mean punitive damages kind of negligent (and those are rarely awarded, despite what the tort reform people will tell you).  But so far as we know, they've been lucky.

[ This Message was edited by: Lars on 2005-11-26 15:14 ]"


Thanks for the clarification.  That makes sense.  I imagine it would take a suicide event or a major assault by a Hyde student to generate that kind of lawsuit.  However, several people have commented (on this website) that Hyde recently settled a major lawsuit that arose out of a faculty member's harassment of a student.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2005, 10:32:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 14:31:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2005-11-26 13:39:00, Lars wrote:


"I spent a summer then three years at Hyde and graduated in 1990.  I went to college and law school at Arizona State.  I spent five years as a public defender and now have my own practice out in AZ.





I hadn't really thought much about Hyde for several years until one day I googled "hyde" and found this site.  Sure brought back some lousy memories.  But it's good to see that others feel the same way I do about the place.  





Just got my pitch for the "annual fund."  It went straight into the wastebasket.  I only give money to ASU - I loved it there and they gave me quite a bit of academic scholarship money."




The fact that you Googled Hyde and found this website is VERY significant.  There has been so much recent dialogue about Hyde on this website that it now shows up on Page 2 when you Google Hyde.  That is the strongest possible evidence that word about Hyde is getting out (for quite some time this website was much farther down in the Google listings for Hyde).



Any parent considering the school who Googles Hyde is likely to find this website.  If you're one of those parents, I would encourage you to read as many postings as possible, focus especially on the thoughtful comments, stay away from the angry diatribes that seem impulsive, and come to your own conclusions about Hyde.  I think that any reasonably objective, thinking parent would read these postings and decide to avoid Hyde completely.  I can't imagine reading the credible commentary here and even bothering to call Hyde to inquire, much less fill out an application and go for a visit.



Parents who are searching for a school for your struggling teen:  Please find a skilled, well informed, and principled educational consultant who knows the landscape.  There are some terrific  schools out there, and Hyde isn't one of them.  Any educational consultant who encourages you to seriously consider Hyde is waving a big red flag.  I strongly recommend finding a highly recommended educational consultant who knows better. "


Yes, the fact that this website is now very high in the rankings when you Google Hyde School is very significant.  As you suggest, anyone who Googles Hyde is probably going to find these important and compelling postings about all the problems at Hyde.  Lots of people are getting information about Hyde from this website, which is reflected in the prominent Google placement.

I imagine this is deeply troubling to the folks at Hyde.  For decades Joe Gauld and company have been obsessed with control -- controlling students, controlling parents, controlling all the spin about Hyde.  Now, perhaps for the first time in Hyde's history, Joe G. and his crew are losing control.  This website has opened the floodgates; many people who have had terrible Hyde experiences and brutally painful encounters with Joe Gauld, et al. are FINALLY having their uncensored say and Hyde can't put a stop to it the way they put a stop to anything they don't like that happens on campus.  The horse is out of the barn; I doubt that Hyde can do much to control the spread of bad news about the school.  Perhaps Hyde is getting a taste of its own medicine.

I think it's just fascinating that if you Google lots of other schools that enroll very similiar students (Island View, Carlbrook, Oakley School, King George, White Mountain and many others) it's very hard to find any evidence of the kind of intense anger, frustration, resentment, and distress that we're seeing on this website about Hyde.  Try it and you'll see what I mean.  Hyde seems to be in a class by itself.  One wonders if this kind of public relations nightmare is generating any anxiety among Hyde staff.  Is the Hyde/Joe Gauld denial so powerful that even this overwhelmingly negative press doesn't lead them to sit up and take notice?  If I were running Hyde right now I'd be worried about the numbers of people who may discover this website when they Google Hyde and who decide, as a result, to avoid the school like the plague.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2005, 12:35:00 AM »
Not just regular harassment.  It was sexual harassment of a teacher touching a young girl in an innappropriate way.  He was also verbally abusing some of the girls in a sexual way!
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2005, 04:17:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 15:07:00, Antigen wrote:

"Does Gauld ever hold forth on how professional psychiatrists don't know what they're doing?

There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is
proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in
everlasting ignorance- that principle is contempt prior to investigation.
--Herbert Spencer


"

You better belive he does!
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Offline tommyfromhyde1

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« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2005, 04:20:00 PM »
Sorry, that last was me. forgot to log in

Redemption: Deliverance of sinners from the penalty of their sins through the murder of their deity against whom they sinned.
--Ambrose Bierce

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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2005, 11:26:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-26 13:39:00, Lars wrote:

"I spent a summer then three years at Hyde and graduated in 1990.  I went to college and law school at Arizona State.  I spent five years as a public defender and now have my own practice out in AZ.



I hadn't really thought much about Hyde for several years until one day I googled "hyde" and found this site.  Sure brought back some lousy memories.  But it's good to see that others feel the same way I do about the place.  



Just got my pitch for the "annual fund."  It went straight into the wastebasket.  I only give money to ASU - I loved it there and they gave me quite a bit of academic scholarship money."


You are one of the fortunate ones Lars!  Very few graduates of Hyde are able to go on to Law School.  Hyde's education is so poor that most kids are lucky to get into a Community College!  I always get a kick out of Hyde's PR materials that brag about a 98% acceptance to college!  They don't tell the WHOLE story or even close to it!

Consider yourself lucky Lars.  You did make it through Hyde in spite of those wacko's, and you did move on even though they caused you a lot of emotional distress.  I hope you were able to forgive your parents.  I now understand how clueless my parents were and how they were so desperate they hung onto the hope that Hyde was everything they said they were!  My parents are so embarassed they got sucked into the Cult that they don't tell anyone about their experiences.  It is as though those 2 1/2 years never existed!  Rather than being angry at my parents, I feel sorry for them and the embarassment they live with.

The ones I feel the most sorry for are the Hyde Cultists!  I remember one family who turned their lives over to Hyde then finally broke away and moved to California.  They were so lost without Hyde, they were drawn back in again.  I don't call this a committed family, I call them pathetic and sad that they couldn't survive in the real world, but instead had to go back to their leader, Joe Gauld!
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