Author Topic: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant  (Read 52895 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
« Reply #165 on: May 07, 2009, 04:09:27 PM »
Quote from: "Ursus"
Quote from: "Ursus"
Perhaps more relevant to the perspective of the average kid is the fact that Hyde School sees the whole process of character development as being innately difficult and obligatorily fraught with painful soul searching. "No pain, no gain." [A particular Helen Keller quote that is plastered throughout Hyde's literature also comes to mind, but I can't seem to find it at the moment...] Hence the "Hyde experience" is filled with seemingly arbitrary tasks and group sessions that can sometimes feel like a veritable gauntlet of confrontation and humiliation.
   
Found that Heller Keller quote, bold emphasis mine:

    "Character
cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, ambition inspired, and success achieved."
    -- Helen Keller[/list]
    http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quote ... 01340.html[/list]

    Well,  I don't know about that.  I think the experience of loving some one risking yourself and putting your faith in them and having that pay off is both a pleasurable and character building experience.   So score a hit for the S of J. and a maggies drawers for Helen and Joe.

    Go in Peace my child
    My the love of our Saviour protect you
    Farther Tim
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #166 on: May 08, 2009, 06:54:38 AM »
    Joe has no more use for love and fidelity than a bear would know what to do with a toilet.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #167 on: May 08, 2009, 11:09:47 AM »
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Joe has no more use for love and fidelity than a bear would know what to do with a toilet.

      Well, I am not sure that is true either.  While I disagree with Joe on many things, he is one of God's creations, and the wisdom of God surpasses man's ability to comprehend.  So what is Joe's purpose in God's plan? God only knows. Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

    You Brother in Christ's Love
    Fr Tim
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #168 on: May 08, 2009, 11:20:02 AM »
    Much like the wisdom of the toilet surpasses the bear's ability to comprehend.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #169 on: May 15, 2009, 10:44:46 AM »
    Quote from: "Fr Tim O'Leary S.J."
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Joe has no more use for love and fidelity than a bear would know what to do with a toilet.

      Well, I am not sure that is true either.  While I disagree with Joe on many things, he is one of God's creations, and the wisdom of God surpasses man's ability to comprehend.  So what is Joe's purpose in God's plan? God only knows. Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

    You Brother in Christ's Love
    Fr Tim

    "You'll have to forgive us Jews for being a little nervous. Two thousand years of Christian love have worn down our nerves."
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #170 on: May 15, 2009, 02:55:56 PM »
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Quote from: "Fr Tim O'Leary S.J."
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Joe has no more use for love and fidelity than a bear would know what to do with a toilet.

      Well, I am not sure that is true either.  While I disagree with Joe on many things, he is one of God's creations, and the wisdom of God surpasses man's ability to comprehend.  So what is Joe's purpose in God's plan? God only knows. Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

    You Brother in Christ's Love
    Fr Tim

    "You'll have to forgive us Jews for being a little nervous. Two thousand years of Christian love have worn down our nerves."

    No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!  

    your from the Passion Play in Oberammergau,

    Father Tim
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #171 on: May 21, 2009, 12:19:12 PM »
    Quote from: "Father Tim SJ"
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Quote from: "Fr Tim O'Leary S.J."
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Joe has no more use for love and fidelity than a bear would know what to do with a toilet.

      Well, I am not sure that is true either.  While I disagree with Joe on many things, he is one of God's creations, and the wisdom of God surpasses man's ability to comprehend.  So what is Joe's purpose in God's plan? God only knows. Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

    You Brother in Christ's Love
    Fr Tim

    "You'll have to forgive us Jews for being a little nervous. Two thousand years of Christian love have worn down our nerves."

    No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!  

    your from the Passion Play in Oberammergau,

    Father Tim

    Talking about faith today is a frightening business. Just the word evokes assassins, the cut throats of women and defenseless babies in villages, bombs and flares that fall killing hundreds of human beings, walls going up, suicide bombings, temples blown to pieces, cities devastated, lives extinguished with cruelty and cynicism. But in the past few centuries it wasn’t like that. Something, perhaps reason, had reined in the homicidal fury that had previously taken possession of those who professed a faith, through slaughters, stakes, tortures, rendering repugnant precisely that motion that had raised man up man from an animal state. So is it all starting over?

    Giorgio Pressburger, Prologue to “Sulla fede”
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #172 on: May 21, 2009, 12:42:29 PM »
    There is a difference between faith and tribalism.  The shia and the sunnis killing each other is not much different then soccer hooliganism.  That is hard to tease out especially for Jews and Christians.  All the stories after the creation story are based on this tribe and how God chose the tribe and let the tribe smite the enemy when they obeyed god and let the enemy carry them of to Babylon  when they were bad.  God tell stories in the current vernacular.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #173 on: May 21, 2009, 01:46:09 PM »
    If you are saying that the difference between faith and tribalism is the difference between tolerance and intolerance, I disagree. If you're tracing tribalism to ancient Judaism, I disagree with that too.

    To start with the second claim: Israel was a chosen nation, not a universalizing faith. The ancient Jews didn't ever try to conquer and convert the nations. That's not part of Judaism. So there's never been intolerance of other religions on the part of Jews. According to Judaism, the nations have always been eligible for divine favor. In fact, living by the covenant only made it harder for Jews than for the nations to remain in divine favor. So I don't agree with the apparent claim that Judaism, because it is a tribe, is intolerant.

    On the other hand, I don't agree with the other apparent claim that faith is tolerant. Unlike Judaism, Christianity and Islam are universalizing religions. In Christian and Muslim eyes, other religions are damned: in those religions there is an afterlife and salvation and members of other faiths are not saved: they go to hell. That sort of mentality leads to intolerance, and worse.

    I don't think you can root intolerance out of Christianity and Islam without radically altering those religions into something new. The intolerance is built into the very term "New Testament." I suppose that Islam is the New New Testament; you Christians simply didn't understand your Gospels. Do you accept that? Well, that's how a Jew feels when he hears the words New Testament. If Christianity and Islam were ever freed of their intolerance toward other religions, I doubt you could even call the result Christianity and Islam anymore.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #174 on: May 21, 2009, 02:43:18 PM »
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    If you are saying that the difference between faith and tribalism is the difference between tolerance and intolerance, I disagree. If you're tracing tribalism to ancient Judaism, I disagree with that too.

    To start with the second claim: Israel was a chosen nation, not a universalizing faith. The ancient Jews didn't ever try to conquer and convert the nations. That's not part of Judaism. So there's never been intolerance of other religions on the part of Jews. According to Judaism, the nations have always been eligible for divine favor. In fact, living by the covenant only made it harder for Jews than for the nations to remain in divine favor. So I don't agree with the apparent claim that Judaism, because it is a tribe, is intolerant.

    On the other hand, I don't agree with the other apparent claim that faith is tolerant. Unlike Judaism, Christianity and Islam are universalizing religions. In Christian and Muslim eyes, other religions are damned: in those religions there is an afterlife and salvation and members of other faiths are not saved: they go to hell. That sort of mentality leads to intolerance, and worse.

    I don't think you can root intolerance out of Christianity and Islam without radically altering those religions into something new. The intolerance is built into the very term "New Testament." I suppose that Islam is the New New Testament; you Christians simply didn't understand your Gospels. Do you accept that? Well, that's how a Jew feels when he hears the words New Testament. If Christianity and Islam were ever freed of their intolerance toward other religions, I doubt you could even call the result Christianity and Islam anymore.
    >  If you're tracing tribalism to ancient Judaism

    It is tribal, the Pentateuch is the story of tribes. It is based on the us vs them dialectic (and after all isn't that what the fighting is all about) .   Tribalism is not by it's own nature intolerant.  The Quakers for example are a tribe, but tolerant.  My assertion is that once you have established Red Sox vs Yankees for example you have the potential for intolerance.  It is my belief that a faith that brings you to enlightenment, helps you see you in the other and vice versa.  So notions like the fundamentalist assertion that you must accept Christ and spread the word of Christ are gross distortions and only aid in the continuation of the gash on the body of humanity that Christ seeks to heal.  It is in fact anti Christian.

     >I don't think you can root intolerance out of Christianity

    Well I would stipulate to that if you are defining Christianity as the historic organizations that killed folk for thing like being Jews.  Christianity as a true understanding of the teachings of Christ is not intolerant any more then Judaism is intolerant.  Christ was a Jew.  When he said "no one get to the father except though me"  what he was saying was he was a physical manifestation of the presence of the father.  You can no more get to the Father with out going through Christ then you can go to temple with out walking between the pillars that hold the door.  When you begin to look at the saying of Christ especially from an unadulterated source, like the Gospel of Thomas, in that light, they really starts to make sense.  At least it did for me. YMMV

    >Islam
    I don't know shit about Islam so I can't comment.  

    go in Peace my son
    Fr Tim
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #175 on: May 21, 2009, 03:29:09 PM »
    Certainly Judaism is tribal in the sense of being composed of tribes. And I suppose there's an inevitable us/them distinction if for no reason other than that monotheism distinguished the Jews from all the other contemporary religions which were polytheistic. So the potential for intolerance was there, but Judaism as I said does not see itself as superior to other religions. The "chosen people" refers not to some sort of superiority complex but rather to the covenant with God whereby God "chose" the Jews of all peoples to occupy the land of Israel and guaranteed them that land in exchange for their continuing obedience according to the Torah. That's what the fighting is about – not intolerance of other religions.

    Learning to see yourself in the other and the other in you is good ethics and is a vital component of Judaism and Christianity. Hillel wrote: "What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow; that is the whole law (Torah): all the rest is interpretation." Christ said: "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you." However, that ethic is a necessary but not sufficient condition for Christianity.  Chrisitanity has a salvationist framework. In other words, if I don't accept Christ as the messiah, I will not be saved. That's intolerant.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #176 on: May 21, 2009, 04:38:03 PM »
    Quote from: "Hyde Guest"
    Certainly Judaism is tribal in the sense of being composed of tribes. And I suppose there's an inevitable us/them distinction if for no reason other than that monotheism distinguished the Jews from all the other contemporary religions which were polytheistic. So the potential for intolerance was there, but Judaism as I said does not see itself as superior to other religions. The "chosen people" refers not to some sort of superiority complex but rather to the covenant with God whereby God "chose" the Jews of all peoples to occupy the land of Israel and guaranteed them that land in exchange for their continuing obedience according to the Torah. That's what the fighting is about – not intolerance of other religions.

    Learning to see yourself in the other and the other in you is good ethics and is a vital component of Judaism and Christianity. Hillel wrote: "What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow; that is the whole law (Torah): all the rest is interpretation." Christ said: "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you." However, that ethic is a necessary but not sufficient condition for Christianity.  Chrisitanity has a salvationist framework. In other words, if I don't accept Christ as the messiah, I will not be saved. That's intolerant.

    > In other words, if I don't accept Christ as the messiah, I will not be saved. That's intolerant.

    Christ at the son of god messiah is a product of the council of Nicea http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicean_creed.  There are a number of other valid views of Christ.  As I eluded to before the phase from John " no one can get to ...."  is read by the fundamentalist as accept Jesus or burn in Hell.  That is not the view of all Christians.  As I said before it is as simple as " do you want to go through the door?  you have to pass by the door jams."  Just what that door is, I can't and won't say.  I have no view of what happens to you if you don't do it.  I do not believe that there is only one way to pass though.  I do not believe you need to accept Christ to do it.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #177 on: May 22, 2009, 02:24:47 AM »
    You suggest that we separate between ethical teachings and the more intolerant aspects of religion, and I respect that. If more people took your view, people of different faiths might start to converge. Take the teachings of Hillel and Christ mentioned above. Hillel says that we must not do bad deeds and Christ says that we must do good deeds. The two ethics are similar: the Christian command “be kind to your neighbor” could be translated to the Jewish commands “don’t walk your dog on your neighbor’s lawn,” “don’t blast the stereo after 11 pm,” etc. The Christian ethic perhaps allows for positive acts of kindness, such as charity and self-sacrifice, in a way that the Jewish ethic doesn’t, while the Jewish ethic has greater specificity and clarity. Each of the two codes of behavior is incomplete by itself and a person could benefit by adhering to both.
       
    I would add, however, that your belief that Christ is not the messiah, or that this belief is a later amendment to Christianity, is your private faith and not representative of your religion. Messianism was introduced by the Hebrew prophets several centuries before Christ. Isaiah, Ezekiel, and others foretold of an anointed one of the Davidic line who would bring about a resurrection of the dead and usher in an age of everlasting peace and prosperity called “the world to come.” This promise of a golden future was a nice way to keep Jews from despairing and abandoning their faith as one foreign power after another conquered Jerusalem and defiled the Temple. Then Christ came along and proclaimed himself the messiah. The Jews rejected his claim. For one thing, Jews don’t believe in an afterlife – this goes back to ancient Judaism’s abhorrence of the Egyptian and Canaanite cults of the dead; in contrast, Jahweh had no relationship with the dead – and Christ was saying that he first had to die in order to return as the messiah. Reread Christ’s sermons, Father Tim! Don’t make me quote all the passages that read “I will come like a bolt of lightning from east to west,” and “I say to you sinners, it would be better if you had never been born.” Already twenty years after the crucifixion Paul was busy contriving Christ’s genealogy to David and preaching that the world would end in his own lifetime, a claim reiterated by all the church fathers till, around the fourth century, Christians became skeptical that the Second Coming was imminent and postponed the event indefinitely. The Nicene Creed of 325 which you cited doesn’t even mention the messiah, but the Constantinopolitan Creed of 381 “looks for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come,” ideas which, believe me, weren’t invented there. It is unimaginable how differently history would have played out if Christ had settled for being a great teacher instead of the messiah.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #178 on: May 22, 2009, 07:22:42 PM »
    >that your belief that Christ is not the messiah

      I don't believe that he was not  or that he is, it is just not essential to my faith.   There are a number of things in the New testament that are of dubious origins, some things that only make sense when view in another context.  "The Kingdom of God is at Hand"  does that mean the end is near?  That was the conclusion that the Paulites come to.  What he was saying is "He I am. I am the Kingdom of God"  I think there is more Paul then there is Jesus in the Bible.  If you think of Christ as a manifestation of God and recall the reason the Jews don't saw the name of God then it is really hard to justify linear thought about Jesus.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Warning about Hyde School from an educational consultant
    « Reply #179 on: August 25, 2009, 06:38:58 PM »
    Quote from: "guesttttttt"
    My former step-daughter went to Hyde and the most dangerous thing I found about Hyde  was how easily she got away with manipulating and dishonesty and in spite of being called out on it, she continued.  She accused her father of physical abuse and her mother called her out on it as an absolute lie, I called her out on it, her dad was devastated over the accusation, and nobody at the "session" seemed to be worried that she just lied, was caught dead to rights, and moved on as if nothing had happened.

    Now, several years after graduation, her life skills learned at Hyde have allowed her to flunk out of community college after 3 semesters (and 6 earned credits), had her hooked up with addict after addict, fired from many jobs due to attendance issues (how can you work and drug at the same time), several pregnancy scares, and a general lack of morals. What that kid needed (and still needs) was consistant steady parents (not one self absorbed mother and alcoholic absentee father) and counseling to help with her self esteem.


    Did Hyde work for her - no. Why? Because Hyde is just a place for parents to dump the kids they cant handle (She has a choice - Foster care or Hyde) and buy them a very expensive high school diploma. Or it is for parents who buy into the hype and beleive it is a life altering place for their child.  Did Hyde let her down?  No more than her parents did.  

    Now as far as the cult like atmosphere.  Oh yes, it existed when we were there. Parents who express disaticfaction are treated poorly and forget about the cost and the fact that they also strong arm you for an additional "donation".  Smart kids can play the system and get by and the smart parents (who didnt want Junior living back home) play the system as well.  

    And it is absolutely true that if your child runs away Hyde does tell you not to let them back home.  The Gaulds are very full of themselves and Ken and Laura are just as bad. Hardly knew the McCrans (not sure of the spelling but Duncan and his wife) because I personally dropped out of the Hyde parent program then because of what I saw as its absolute failure to do any good.
    They are the opposite of who they pretend to be. The truth and harmony principle always made me laugh.
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