Author Topic: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School  (Read 18822 times)

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Offline Ursus

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Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
« Reply #30 on: January 20, 2009, 03:40:09 AM »
Quote from: "Guest"
One of the reasons why desperate parents (and desperate kids) sometimes do benefit from Hyde or stay at Hyde for as long as they do is because life at home is not pretty. The yelling in seminars can seem appropriate compared to the yelling at home, and having an environment that is fairly predictable can provide stability to a family that has completely fallen apart. If the home life is bad enough, Hyde can be the first place where people feel safe and feel cared for. There are faculty who take a true interest in the kids, and there is a feeling of a community in which, attacked or not, every person exists. I'm saying this because I went to Hyde when my family life was horrible. We had many issues, some of which my family dealt with semi-privately in seminars, and some of which we did not deal with at all.

I left Hyde with different problems, some of which developed there or were exacerbated by that environment. I became even more self-critical. I felt ashamed about every little mistake I made and took criticism too personally for many years. It made me fear public scrutiny and try to proactively avoid "mistakes" that would bring me negative attention, even if I disagreed that those decisions were mistakes... That said, Hyde was the best alternative for me at the time if the alternative was living at home. I cannot say what would have happened if I had gone to another program. I can say that I was living in a private hell at home. My family pathologized me, blamed me for everything, and verbally abused me. If I had not gone to Hyde, I would have gotten pregnant, run away from home, or killed myself-- I was that miserable. For me, Hyde was my great escape. My parents only let me go because the parent program assuaged their guilt for sending me away.

I am grateful that Hyde did not pepper me with psychological labels. I do not see myself as damaged goods now, although I have sought the help of mental health professionals from time to time to make sure I am dealing with my issues. I think that if I had been in an environment that called me a crazy kid, it would have been just another attack on a person who was already under fire. I found seminars helpful if my family talked about their reactions to things and not specifics. When families end up discussing specifics, some of these topics are inappropriate for that environment, but no one was told to gauge that boundary, which is and was scary. I do see that for some people, it was a totally unhealthy environment, and even for people who benefitted from Hyde, there are some definite negative effects. I would not send my own kids to Hyde, and yet it is a place to which I feel eternally grateful... it is a strange dichotomy, but I feel that if I ever have kids, I won't treat them badly enough that they need Hyde to be their safe space.

Hyde's current state makes me really sad. I think that it is useful to talk about character issues. It is not useful to be forced to share every self-examination in a public forum, but the questions Hyde raises could be helpful in and of themselves. I am angry at Hyde for forcing me to be in an environment that was intensely drug-focused-- I am not an addict of any kind-- and that made big dramatic displays all of the time as a crisis-focused school.

I do think that the ethics are appropriate for high school students, that having students participate in sports & performing arts is a good opportunity for raising a balanced kid, etc. I like that there is a tight-knit community within Hyde of people who do really care, and for me, my experiences with those people were much more common than the ones with the overly-aggressive faculty. It really is a love-hate relationship. I think I will always feel conflicted about Hyde. It is a strange place, for sure. I wish that Hyde would deal with its gross-oversights in its application of its own principles so that people could benefit from what it has to offer, instead of needing to recover from it afterwards. I also think that I would not be who I am today without having had to struggle through all of the moral nuances it intentionally and unintentionally provides.

Thank you for your post. It is clear that you put a great deal of time and care into making it. It certainly took me back to that nightmare of punitive "self-reflection." I can't say I agree with everything you say, but then, I'm sure you don't agree with my take on Hyde School in every detail, either!

In light of everything you've been through, including your home life before Hyde School, you might find this thread recently posted in the Straight, Inc. forum to be of some thought-provoking use...

Could you please expand on the following a bit more... I wonder whether the focus on drugs per se (as opposed to it along with a host of other forms of juvenile delinquency) has become more intense or indiscriminately school-wide than it used to be. Perhaps Hyde School takes in more students with alleged "drug issues" than it used to?

    "I am angry at Hyde for forcing me to be in an environment that was intensely drug-focused-- I am not an addict of any kind-- and that made big dramatic displays all of the time as a crisis-focused school."[/list]
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #31 on: January 21, 2009, 12:09:46 AM »
    Quote
    Could you please expand on the following a bit more... I wonder whether the focus on drugs per se (as opposed to it along with a host of other forms of juvenile delinquency) has become more intense or indiscriminately school-wide than it used to be. Perhaps Hyde School takes in more students with alleged "drug issues" than it used to?

    "I am angry at Hyde for forcing me to be in an environment that was intensely drug-focused-- I am not an addict of any kind-- and that made big dramatic displays all of the time as a crisis-focused school."

    Perhaps the early years of Hyde may have had busts that consisted of lying, sex, and smoking, but in my days, students were getting busted for real drugs on more of a regular basis. In conversation, I learned about more drugs, like ecstasy, LSD, etc. I remember kids getting busted for huffing. There were lots of groups for alcoholics... It was hard to get through school without being accused of being an alcoholic... and many kids were quite proud of their drug track record. Even after graduating, it was common to hear of kids who did not make it, who died or got into major trouble as a result of drug use. The administration tacitly explained this by saying that Hyde prepared kids to have their lives together by age 30, or something strange like that. But what of the kids who don't make it? How much do people become negatively impacted when all of the delinquents congregate in one location and swap trade secrets? How many kids lost their innocence by being around such talk and dangerous activity? If your kid was a normal kid, would the typical Hyde kid be a good or bad influence?

    Our parents sent us to Hyde because they believed in something good: in the hope that there might be a better type of school that could meet our needs in a way that a public school could not. We were not thriving at home. We needed something different. The true believers at Hyde, those who come back as alums, really seem to believe in their utopia. They needed someone to yell at them in a way that they could hear. They zealously dole out the same medicine that worked for them because it made them better people... at least from their perspective. There still needs to be a place for those who do not respond well to "abuse" but who also do not respond well to public school. Many people on this site have identified schools that were a better alternative, but that does not tell us two things: 1.) How do we separate Hyde-appropriate kids from Hyde-inappropriate kids if their admissions staff clearly does not have a very good weeding out process? 2.) More importantly, what qualities make a good school for kids who are somewhere between a public school and a wilderness program, (or even for kids who just aren't satisfied with all that is cruel and impersonal about mainstream education?)

    I would like to know sincerely where we disagree and what you would recommend we change about education for kids who are like who you were.
    « Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

    Offline Ursus

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #32 on: January 25, 2009, 03:43:49 PM »
    Quote from: "Guest"
    Perhaps the early years of Hyde may have had busts that consisted of lying, sex, and smoking, but in my days, students were getting busted for real drugs on more of a regular basis. In conversation, I learned about more drugs, like ecstasy, LSD, etc. I remember kids getting busted for huffing. There were lots of groups for alcoholics... It was hard to get through school without being accused of being an alcoholic...

    Okay, in my day, from what I remember, it was alcohol, pot, hash, shrooms, maybe some acid if you were lucky or well-connected. Cocaine and heroin were generally only accessible by an older age bracket or those more deeply committed to the perceived state of teenage rebellion. Huffing and poppers were part of the scene too, I guess, but Ecstasy and Meth hadn't become available yet. Maybe that was the particular environs I grew up in; I have no doubt that other of my Hyde classmates had somewhat different backgrounds.

    That said, from what I remember, the "big drug issues" at Hyde back then were mostly alcohol and pot. Joe's lectures/seminars/school meetings or wherever he would occasion to pontificate were primarily focused on those. AA lingo and slogans permeated everything. That's where I learned most of them. I'm guessing that that aspect hasn't changed much. Some kids did go off campus to AA meetings in Brunswick back then, but it sounds like this extracurricular activity has been ramped way up these days. Do they still show that 1936 cult classic, Reefer Madness, or, going a bit off-topic here, Cool Hand Luke?

    Quote from: "Guest"
    Even after graduating, it was common to hear of kids who did not make it, who died or got into major trouble as a result of drug use. The administration tacitly explained this by saying that Hyde prepared kids to have their lives together by age 30, or something strange like that. But what of the kids who don't make it? How much do people become negatively impacted when all of the delinquents congregate in one location and swap trade secrets? How many kids lost their innocence by being around such talk and dangerous activity? If your kid was a normal kid, would the typical Hyde kid be a good or bad influence?

    By age 30? What a hoot! This is like Hyde School simultaneously absolving themselves of any mishaps that occur or misdeeds committed in the first years post-Hyde, as well as taking credit for normal growing up and biological and psychological development that occurs afterwards! Kinda arrogant, dontcha think?

    Do you know of kids who died in their first several years post-Hyde? I guess if they didn't reach that 30-year mark, their "character development" hadn't "reached its full potential" yet, probably due to their "lack of commitment." Hence, Hyde School is not at fault. And if they're past 30, then they've passed the warranty period. Sorry, outta luck here, it's all their own fault now, certainly not Hyde's.

    Here's another thought, in response to your mention of the potential negative impact of adolescents "swapping trade secrets." What about the negative impact of being informed that "you have a problem," which may, in fact, be nothing more than teenage experimentation? Moreover, what about the negative impact of the way that kind of moral judgment is meted out and remedial action is "taught" at Hyde School?

    Personally, I think that by far the best "drug-education" a kid can get is a thorough bias-free scientific introduction to how the various substrates affect one both physiologically and psychologically (and both pro and con). That way a kid can be forearmed with the knowledge to make an informed choice, and to experiment wisely, if he/she chooses to do so. That may well sound or even be naive on my part, but it worked for me.

    It seems to me (an ignorant armchair psychologist) that as far as "unwise" experimentation goes, the primary underlying causal elements usually have to do with personal problems plus poor self-image, etc., and putting kids through a punitive emotional wringer filled with reasons for more self loathing and disrespect only delays said excess, it does not prevent it. It might even make such endeavors even worse or more extreme than they might have been otherwise. After all, now... they're due to "lack of character," a "bad attitude, "not reaching one's potential," being "a loser, not a leader," or whatever other florid permutations of similar concept that the ever-evolving Hyde lingo is of late... (Btw, what is it of late, or at least, while you were there?)
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #33 on: January 26, 2009, 09:36:13 PM »
    Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School:

      If you interview at Bath walk along the road by the frog pond.  There are two stones with woman's names.  One is the founders wife.  Ask the staff about the other woman.
    « Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #34 on: January 28, 2009, 11:50:54 AM »
    Quote
    Here's another thought, in response to your mention of the potential negative impact of adolescents "swapping trade secrets." What about the negative impact of being informed that "you have a problem," which may, in fact, be nothing more than teenage experimentation? Moreover, what about the negative impact of the way that kind of moral judgment is meted out and remedial action is "taught" at Hyde School?

    I do think that the labels people give kids at this age linger into adulthood. That is one area in which Hyde is simultaneously helpful and not helpful. Hyde does not believe in tailoring its curriculum to your particular psychological diagnosis, which I think is helpful. Many kids get stuck with labels early because their acting out in their families. Some of this acting out is not a sign of being crazy. It is a sign of not being crazy. It is crazy to act normal in a crazy family. It is good that Hyde does not reinforce the societal message that the misbehaving kid needs more meds. Maybe this kid needs a break from Mom and Dad!

    It is not helpful, however, that they do as you said: they give kids new labels, like "smiling zero." This was my particular favorite. It was a label given to a child that was hiding by not getting in trouble, not showing leadership, and avoiding the spotlight. It felt similar in nature to the student-coined term "NUP" (No Unique Potential.) This was what the loser kids were called. There was little to stop this. It was not a self-esteem builder, but then again, every school has cruel kids... Having cruel names is not unique. It is more intense, however, at Hyde due to the emphasis on constructive criticism. Just like the correlation between spanking and child abuse, encouraging kids to be intensely critical of each other increases the unproductive criticism that is closer to abuse.

    Hyde claims that it does not give people labels, and that confronting the attitude is not the same as criticizing the person. However, some of the "bad attitudes" criticized were personal. They amounted to the person's values and differences of opinion. Hyde claims to help kids develop their potential and their individualism. People like Mr. Cox and Mr. Duethorn did give kids philosophical foils that they could use to analyze their opinions and thoughts. However, this mission ran counter to the overall mission of creating temporarily well-behaved kids. How often were our attitudes confronted so that the group would be better behaved, and not so that we could develop our character?! I think of the quote, "Well-behaved women seldom make history." It is one thing to get students to behave for the sake of expediency. It is another thing to teach children to behave in the name of character development. True critical thinking rarely walks in the path of the majority. This is why Hyde can feel like brainwashing. We have to do what they say and believe in it at the same time. That is really weird.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #35 on: January 28, 2009, 11:51:50 AM »
    As far as the grave thing is concerned, I am curious. Can you tell me more, or is it just another ghost story, like the polio victim ghosts in the mansion? That was something fun at Hyde... so much folklore, conspiracy theory, etc.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #36 on: January 29, 2009, 01:46:32 AM »
    Quote from: "Guest"
    As far as the grave thing is concerned, I am curious. Can you tell me more, or is it just another ghost story, like the polio victim ghosts in the mansion? That was something fun at Hyde... so much folklore, conspiracy theory, etc.

    More on the Michelle Correa memorial stone here:

    viewtopic.php?f=43&t=20746
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    Offline Anonymous

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    « Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #38 on: February 10, 2009, 03:00:16 AM »
    Are they planning on putting more stones there? I can think of a few names.
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    Offline Ursus

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #39 on: February 12, 2009, 09:30:57 PM »
    Quote from: "Guest (the real one)"
    Quote from: "Guest"
    As far as the grave thing is concerned, I am curious. Can you tell me more, or is it just another ghost story, like the polio victim ghosts in the mansion? That was something fun at Hyde... so much folklore, conspiracy theory, etc.
    More on the Michelle Correa memorial stone here:

    http://fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=20746
    Quote from: "Guest (the real one)"
    http://www.minionsweb.com/images/hyde/92correa.jpg

    Thanks for the pic of Michelle's stone.

    As far as Guest's question about the graves is concerned, were you perchance referring to grave-digging (by students)? If so, more on that in the Cool Hand Luke thread, here:

    viewtopic.php?f=43&t=25904&p=318916#p315958

    You might find some more material by doing a search of just the Hyde forum for grave* (with asterisk to include both singular and plural forms, as well as any compound descriptives there may be).
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #40 on: February 13, 2009, 07:43:57 AM »
    The two strands -- gravedigging and memorial stones -- come together in Michelle. Back in '74, Michelle and a few Hyde friends went on a joyride that went terribly wrong: the brakes of the car gave out while she was roaring down Highway 1 and she threw the car into reverse to bring it to a grinding halt. The group was taken back to Hyde and told to start digging 6x2x6 foot pits. Michelle is thus the only Hyde student who both dug her own grave and was honored with a memorial stone.
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #41 on: February 13, 2009, 12:40:00 PM »
    Quote from: "Full circle"
    The two strands -- gravedigging and memorial stones -- come together in Michelle. Back in '74, Michelle and a few Hyde friends went on a joyride that went terribly wrong: the brakes of the car gave out while she was roaring down Highway 1 and she threw the car into reverse to bring it to a grinding halt. The group was taken back to Hyde and told to start digging 6x2x6 foot pits. Michelle is thus the only Hyde student who both dug her own grave and was honored with a memorial stone.

      The thing about Michelle and the stone is that she was Joe's/Hyde's big success story.  She was a wild child.  When she starred as Helen Keller in "The Miracle Worker"  she did not have to act to throw those tantrums.  Joe saw him self and the hyde process in the role of Anne Sullivan.  The Irony was that Michelle was at deep level unchanged by the experience.  She was troubled for the rest of her life and died in, "not a good place."  So Hyde has set a memorial stone to one it's most spectacular failures.  The other queer thing is that that stone is so close to Blanche's stone.  They were both woman on the short side, slender, dark complected, long black hair and lived right in Joe's blind spot.  If anyone from back then reads this and it hurts your feelings I am sorry but it is the truth. and you know what JC said about the truth.  Free yourself baby.

    Go in peace
    Fr Tim
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    Offline Anonymous

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    Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
    « Reply #42 on: February 13, 2009, 05:43:00 PM »
    Michelle was an amazing person and she acclimated herself very quickly at Hyde. She had many friends who loved her very much.

    I knew her parents from the regional meetings. Gracious, charming hosts from the city’s most affluent suburb. Where were they in her hour of need? Hey, your daughter’s living in a Boston slum! Hey, your daughter’s husband is beating the shit out of her again! Hey, your daughter’s shooting up again! Hey, your daughter wants to be a dancer at the age of forty-two! Hey, your daughter’s committing suicide!  

    Why did Michelle die?

    Because family-based character education does not address real family dysfunction.

    Because between the ages of fourteen and twenty Michelle lived in a highly structured environment. Then she was released into the world and was unable to make the right choices.
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    Offline Ursus

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    Re: Michelle's stone
    « Reply #43 on: February 14, 2009, 12:23:03 PM »
    There is a brief shot of Michelle's stone in this...er..."enthusiastic" YouTube clip:

      Hyde Homecoming Reunion
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGj-p6jK87w
      Fall 2008 montage of Hyde's Homecoming/Reunion Weekend[/list]

      I liked the cardboard mock-up of Joe, though...somehow it doesn't look a whole lot like him here:

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      Offline Anonymous

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      Re: Advice to Parents Considering Hyde School
      « Reply #44 on: February 14, 2009, 06:47:47 PM »
      Quote from: "FC"
      Michelle was an amazing person and she acclimated herself very quickly at Hyde. She had many friends who loved her very much.

      I knew her parents from the regional meetings. Gracious, charming hosts from the city’s most affluent suburb. Where were they in her hour of need? Hey, your daughter’s living in a Boston slum! Hey, your daughter’s husband is beating the shit out of her again! Hey, your daughter’s shooting up again! Hey, your daughter wants to be a dancer at the age of forty-two! Hey, your daughter’s committing suicide!  

      Why did Michelle die?

      Because family-based character education does not address real family dysfunction.

      Because between the ages of fourteen and twenty Michelle lived in a highly structured environment. Then she was released into the world and was unable to make the right choices.

        Hyde gave her an identity that she could not care into the real world.  When the stone was dedicated a group sang "For a Dancer"  by Jackson Browne and changed the lyrics from

      And somewhere between the time you arrive
      And the time you go
      May lie a reason you were alive
      But youll never know

      to

      And somewhere between the time you arrive
      And the time you go
      Will lie a reason you were alive
      And  youl've got to know know.

      While I am not a fan of Mr Browne's lachrymose navel gazing I would have to say that it really distorts the notion that we pass our passion and love for live from generation to generation, and if there is a time when your place in that dance has some special significance you will probably never know it.  The wisdom of God surpasses the ability of Man to understand it ... except at Hyde.  At Hyde you have to know it.  Of course Hyde is the place that quotes Jesus without attribution and appends cute little tag phrases.  I hope that make you miserable Joe.

      Via con Dios
      Fr Tim
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