Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > World Wide Association of Specialty Programs and Schools (WWASPS)
Genreal Discussion on the WWASP Parent's BBS??
AtomicAnt:
--- Quote ---On 2005-11-21 18:51:00, Anonymous wrote:
"QUOTE: Turning the parents against the kids does not mean alienating the parents. You make no sense to anyone capable of critical thought. They convince the parents that their children will lie to them about the way they have been treated. It works and voids the clients' only protection from abuse, since they cannot contact anyone else outside the facility.
But turning the parents against the kids WOULD have the effect of alienating them. Think about this: the kids have already lost all trust. No one could make that happen if the child's behavior didn't support such a conclusion. And those kids lying to Mom and Dad at home don't change overnight and suddenly become honest. No one has to tell Mom and Dad about that, either. There's a very real possibility the kids will lie, but the parents can check it out any time they want. Here's how:
Parents can pop in any time they want. Yep, it's discouraged because frankly, it wasn't working for them to ask how high when the kids said to jump. But the fact is, parents keep all parental rights, and can see or talk to their kids on demand, with or without notice. The guardianship the programs assume includes only the right to make emergency decisions, and never supercedes the parental rights. NEVER.
--- End quote ---
I am sure this is legally true, but not practical. There is no witness to the abuse and the teen with a reputation for lying therefore needs more protection, not less, as the abuser is well aware that the parents don't trust the teen. Also, the abuser can easily convince the parent that the poor kid is lying. Flying to Jamaica to investigate the teen's complaint is also unlikely. Let's face it, it boils down to the word of the teen vs the word of the staff or other teen committing the abuse.
--- Quote ---
So maybe they're worried and can't get there right away? They can call CPS or even local law enforcement for a welfare check.
--- End quote ---
In Jamaica, these authorities have no jurisdiction. Even the USA, they cannot investigate private, unlicensed facilities. Law enforcement needs a warrant.
--- Quote ---
And don't forget (if you're even aware) that in most programs, parents control the kids' mail. They make the call on who can write, and where they'll send letters the kids write. "
--- End quote ---
Based on reports here and in news articles, a feature of WWASP programs is that the mail (and other forms of contact) are controlled by the program, not the parent. The program monitors the teen's mail and can censor it and even punish the teen for writing negative statements about the program.
I am not convinced there is adequate protection.
Anonymous:
--- Quote ---On 2005-11-21 23:58:00, AtomicAnt wrote:
"
--- Quote ---
On 2005-11-21 18:51:00, Anonymous wrote:
"QUOTE: Turning the parents against the kids does not mean alienating the parents. You make no sense to anyone capable of critical thought. They convince the parents that their children will lie to them about the way they have been treated. It works and voids the clients' only protection from abuse, since they cannot contact anyone else outside the facility.
But turning the parents against the kids WOULD have the effect of alienating them. Think about this: the kids have already lost all trust. No one could make that happen if the child's behavior didn't support such a conclusion. And those kids lying to Mom and Dad at home don't change overnight and suddenly become honest. No one has to tell Mom and Dad about that, either. There's a very real possibility the kids will lie, but the parents can check it out any time they want. Here's how:
Parents can pop in any time they want. Yep, it's discouraged because frankly, it wasn't working for them to ask how high when the kids said to jump. But the fact is, parents keep all parental rights, and can see or talk to their kids on demand, with or without notice. The guardianship the programs assume includes only the right to make emergency decisions, and never supercedes the parental rights. NEVER.
--- End quote ---
I am sure this is legally true, but not practical. There is no witness to the abuse and the teen with a reputation for lying therefore needs more protection, not less, as the abuser is well aware that the parents don't trust the teen. Also, the abuser can easily convince the parent that the poor kid is lying. Flying to Jamaica to investigate the teen's complaint is also unlikely. Let's face it, it boils down to the word of the teen vs the word of the staff or other teen committing the abuse.
--- Quote ---
So maybe they're worried and can't get there right away? They can call CPS or even local law enforcement for a welfare check.
--- End quote ---
In Jamaica, these authorities have no jurisdiction. Even the USA, they cannot investigate private, unlicensed facilities. Law enforcement needs a warrant.
--- Quote ---
And don't forget (if you're even aware) that in most programs, parents control the kids' mail. They make the call on who can write, and where they'll send letters the kids write. "
--- End quote ---
Based on reports here and in news articles, a feature of WWASP programs is that the mail (and other forms of contact) are controlled by the program, not the parent. The program monitors the teen's mail and can censor it and even punish the teen for writing negative statements about the program.
I am not convinced there is adequate protection."
--- End quote ---
I won't respond to comments about Jamaica or other out of country facilities, because I have no experience with that. But please check your facts on law enforcement and other investigations here in the states. Law enforcement can indeed go and ask about the child. They can ask to see them and talk to them. If the program wants some documentation, they can require that, but I have never heard of any doing so.
As far as practicality, that's not the issue for schools here in the USA. Surely if you felt your child was being maltreated, simple practicality would not take priority!
According to the laws of at least three states I looked at (most are available online), CPS has the authority to investigate abuse complaints no matter who owns or runs the school.
And basing your ideas about the mail handling on reports here and in the news is a mistake. Read the policies and procedures of the individual schools.
I am speaking from my own experience. You are absolutely mistaken about how this works.
Anonymous:
No the person is not mistaken. Yor assertion doesnt make it fact.
When I called CPS after my child came home, the relative of the relative who worked there in the remote down in no where land, wasnt interested in what I had to say.
Because you say so doesnt make it true.
Anonymous:
--- Quote ---On 2005-11-18 13:57:00, Antigen wrote:
"Well what have they got to hide? If the program works so good, they why do they have to spend so much time and effort putting down dissenting views?
--- End quote ---
I will ask you to take a look at if it doesn't work, why are the schools full? Why are there forums like this that are intended to discredit what does work? You forget that it's not the program itself that works, it's the out of control teen that has to buy into it. The program is the vehicle not the results. These type of forums serve the purpose by using fear to control.
If a kid doesn't want to buy into it, there are a hundred ways to maintain control of mum and dad...even when they're in the program. Gotta love it.
PHX
Anonymous:
--- Quote ---I will ask you to take a look at if it doesn't work, why are the schools full?
--- End quote ---
because there are plenty of program shills out there, like you, referring other parents in exchange for thousands of dollars in cash or services to these hell-holes. just because something is prevalent, does not make it right.
--- Quote ---If a kid doesn't want to buy into it, there are a hundred ways to maintain control of mum and dad...even when they're in the program.
--- End quote ---
you are insane. the control goes ONE way. the parents are under control by their own unjusitified fears... only to be played upon by WWASP officials.. such as yourself. go back to your hole, troll.
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