Author Topic: SAY HELLO TO OUR STRUGGLING TEENS TROLL  (Read 29238 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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SAY HELLO TO OUR STRUGGLING TEENS TROLL
« Reply #135 on: August 03, 2005, 05:21:00 PM »
"You really don't know who you are messing with, do you? I don't know about the other posters here, but I'd love to take you on. You see, I no longer have anything else to lose. Do you?"

Several posts back someone directed this statement to Karen....

Gee, I wonder if someone said that to me, would I take it as threatening?? Would most people? Would it be a "threat" under the law due to its implications---which go to intent just like words do?  I ask the questions---leave it to you to mull over the answers.
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Offline Troll Control

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« Reply #136 on: August 03, 2005, 05:53:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-03 12:59:00, Anonymous wrote:

"In that last re-post of Karen Austins' info you knew enough to have xxx'ed out part of the phone number---that shows you are learning that you can't go around transmitting other people's info falsely.



Listen, it doesn't make any difference if there are lots of question marks or the way the original anon poster tried to be clever in how it was phrased: this, in the law, is just trying to "veil" his intent.



Any reasonable person on a jury who saw that post would conclude that the anon's intent (which is what matters here) was to make angry people call that number: hence he would be screwed because he was taking action to bring harassment to an innocent person.  

"

You people are tripping.  I can tell you, from first-hand knowledge, that a case like this will never be brought by a prosecutor.

I've been stalked and harassed DIRECTLY.  I've had emails sent to me containing death threats.  I've had my personal information put out on the web, even on sites maintained by the perpetrator.

The newest and latest laws simply don't cover this kind of behavior, and likely won't in the future.  Also, the burden of proof is so high that you just won't make a case.  

I'm an information technologist and when I thought I REALLY HAD THE GOODS, including IP addresses and MAC adresses, along with ISP trace logs, it took the DA about 30 seconds to tell me to forget about about it.  I've been pursuing the case for OVER TWO YEARS and haven't yet gotten any resolution.

New laws regarding the tort side of things have been RELAXED, not strengthened.  One's first amendment right allows them to post their thoughts about anyone, good, bad or ugly.  As long as it's just their opinion, you have no recourse. Just have a look at what's posted all over the net about George Bush, the most powerful man on earth.  There's not been even a single case brought, much less won.

Aside form those facts, I believe this website is hosted in Canada.  Good luck getting an international subpeona honored for what, at the VERY BEST, would be a class E misdemeanor, and damn near impossible to prove to boot.  

In addition, if the offensive poster doesn't live in your state, then you have no recourse whatsoever at the state level.

You say that if "angry" callers contacted  the person whose number was posted that the poster would be on the hook for "harassment."  That's not true.  It could only be considered "aggravated harassment" if and ONLY IF the person who was called had reasonable fear for his or her PHYSICAL SAFETY.  No jury will ever hear this case anyway, so even that's moot.

Ask yourself this:  What federal prosecutor is going to try an interstate/international case of what amounts to a pissing contest?

Your name and phone number are listed in the directory and that's public domain.  Any information you revealed about your particulars on the internet, intentionally or not, is also public domain.

Please, give it a rest.  You're not going to sue anyone.  The cops aren't going to arrest anyone.  You're just a blowhard who feels like you can push people around with "legalese."

It makes you feel weak that you were so thoroughly obliterated by an "angry teen" that you've gone into la-la land looking simply to control the dialogue.  Good luck with that...
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #137 on: August 03, 2005, 06:01:00 PM »
What part of THIS IS NOT KAREN don't you get?
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Offline Troll Control

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« Reply #138 on: August 03, 2005, 06:15:00 PM »
Ok, so you're not Karen.  You're a Karen-like troll.  Who cares?  

The argument is the same.  What do you have to say about the principle, dummy?  Your ARGUMENT DOESN'T HOLD WATER whoever you are.   :roll:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #139 on: August 03, 2005, 06:31:00 PM »
You seem to still think I'm Karen,---"obliterated by an angry teenager" as you put it.  I am not Karen:though in point of fact I don't see why you think she's been obliterated by anyone---somebody pointed out that she posted here as well as at another site---oh well---it's hardly obliteration---in my books at least. Maybe I'm missing some nuance but that would be my view of it anyway

I happen, for reasons of my own employment, to be at the computer terminal a lot today, and because I watch this site sometimes, I thought I'd give my opinion on this very rude and  intrusive thing that was done in posting the information of that poor woman whose name resembled the "Karen" that you folks are currently demonizing on this thread.

Dysfunction, you may be a nice enough person,  but I don't think you know the law.
Of course, I'm not personally going to sue anyone as you state in your post---nothing's been done to me.

I am guessing that it upsets you if people here consider the possiblity that there are legal consequences to their actions here---perhaps that comes from your working in the information industry and seeing the law increasingly regulate you.

You say: look at what's posted about George Bush: good lord man, I know personally of a situation in which someone posted that they would like to (not that they would, but that they would like to) kill George Bush and the secret service were at that person's home in less than twelve hours.

That doesn't mean that everyone who says dangerous threatening things is going to get whacked.  It's going to depend on the circumstances, where it happened, your own personal clout in terms of political/legal/law enforcement contacts.  But you are making it way too simple in the way that you say the law is now.  It's not that simple, it's a vast frontier of possible applications in many different federal/state juristicions.  

As for foreign law, I don't know about Canada, but internet law--in terms of behavior, threats, etc--is even stricter in some countries than here---in the UK for example, existing laws are flexible enough to emcompass on-line stalking and email harrassment. In the UK, the Telecommunications Act of 1984, section 43, for example, makes it an offence to send by means of a "telecommunications systems" (which as defined includes computers) a message or other matter that is "grossly offensive or is of an indecent, obscene, or menacing character".  

So I don't know about Canada---but your blanket statement about international law does suggest to me that you are getting outside of your area of expertise.

I repeat: if I were this poor woman and if I had been harrassed, I would go to a lawyer (not an IT type) and find out my rights and exercise them.  Maybe bringing to the attention of certain members of the House in Washington who have an interest in a test case if necessary, just to be sure that I had that clout that always helps.

Sorry you were not able to get the courts to attend to your own stalking situation---don't know the details or where it happened of course, hope you can raise the heat on that DA (go to the right congressman, whatever) you may still be able to pull if off if you obtain good, I mean really expert, legal advice in this very new area of the law.
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Offline Troll Control

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« Reply #140 on: August 03, 2005, 06:42:00 PM »
You're just spinning your wheels again.  You are equating this behavior with a threat to kill the president?  I think everyone knows it's a federal felony to threaten to assassinate the president.  That's simply NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT and not at all germane to the matter at hand.

There are no increased efforts to censor free speech on the internet.  You have it exactly backwards.  I work in IT and am well abreast of the law in that area.  You obviously are not.

Let me reiterate:  there has been no crime committed here.  EVEN IF THERE WERE, you'd be unlikely to find a prosecutor to take the case.  Even then, if you did, you'd be hard pressed to prove that the poster's motive was to bring PHYSICAL HARM by proxy to the the alleged "victim."

I never made any blanket statement about any international law.  Where did you read anything like that in my post?  I simply said good luck in getting records subpoenaed from another country when, at best, it would be a very low-level misdemeanor IN THIS COUNTRY.  

You couldn't even get your OWN ISP's logs subpeonaed with this as "evidence," much less get international cooperation.  

What you fail to see in your terrible and baseless argument is that the laws of the UK or Canada don't apply here.  Last I checked we don't enforce UK telecomminications law in the U.S. of A. now do we?

If you live in the UK and so does the "perpetrator," then bully for you.  Have a go at it.  If you live here and they live there, or even if their ISP is there-good luck.  You'll need it.

You're living in a fantasy world where congressmen get involved in people's personal lives.  Get a grip already.  

Your next featured article: "The Karen Austin Schiavo Case" - Congress Makes Controversial Move to End Bulletin Board Pissing Contest between Angry Teen and Control-Freak Adult...

What are you smoking, lady?   :smokin:  

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-Arnold Schopenhauer[ This Message was edited by: Dysfunction Junction on 2005-08-03 16:00 ][ This Message was edited by: Dysfunction Junction on 2005-08-04 04:48 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #141 on: August 03, 2005, 07:00:00 PM »
To others who want to take action against cyberbullies: there are indeed congressmen who involve themselves in pushing these kinds of cases due to a perception that the law must catch up with the technology in order to protect Americans. These reps can be located fairly easily by internet search on the pertinent subject

As well, remember that for tort relief (civil, not criminal court), it doesn't have to be either a crime or a physical threat:emotional distress is enough.

Wish you the best--in my experience at least, if you fight for your rights, you'll do alright.  Got to go now, and good luck to you
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #142 on: August 03, 2005, 07:44:00 PM »
Quote
What are you smoking, lady?


I'm wondering the same thing! Got any more to share?

 :lol:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #143 on: August 03, 2005, 08:52:00 PM »
The emotocons always seems to  ::heart:: help when words fail one, don't they?
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Offline webcrawler

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« Reply #144 on: August 03, 2005, 09:16:00 PM »
Well said Dysfunction Junction  :wink: (Notice the use of the emoticons) :lol:

This whole thread is ridiculous. No one is going to be jailed for posting a phone number. The jails are over crowded already and I seriously doubt a posting is enough to get some "pain and suffering" money from a civil suit.

The parents come over here from ST and say vulgar and cruel things as anons and once they get a dose of their own medicine all of a sudden we're all bitter and nuts over here.

Really, shouldn't these parents be doing something to repair their relationships w/ their kids instead of trolling? Shit (yes 4 letter word) I bet the majority of them are in their 40s doing this crap.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #145 on: August 03, 2005, 09:39:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-08-03 15:31:00, Anonymous wrote:


You say: look at what's posted about George Bush: good lord man, I know personally of a situation in which someone posted that they would like to (not that they would, but that they would like to) kill George Bush and the secret service were at that person's home in less than twelve hours.






I once said fuck George Bush and nothing happened :???:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #146 on: August 03, 2005, 10:25:00 PM »
I say hide the fertilizer and the u-haul.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #147 on: August 04, 2005, 08:24:00 AM »
Vulgar and cruel?  You must be confused.  Loking back on this thread and others, I
think all of the vulgarity and cruel speech has been on the side of the bashers.  But maybe it's time to let it all die.  

Here's a story that, if it isn't true, ought to be:

Dolly Parton was asked if she was offended when people called her a dumb blonde.  Not a problem she said.  "I know I'm not dumb, and I know I'm not a blonde."

I know I didn't send my kid to an abusive program.  Feel sorry for the parents and kids who were victimized.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #148 on: August 04, 2005, 09:40:00 AM »
Was joking CHILL!!
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #149 on: August 04, 2005, 09:58:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-08-04 06:40:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Was joking CHILL!!"
First where u talking to me if so I was locked up for 4 years in one of those programs.I know very well what it feels like. There is just no point crying over spilt milk. Or I prefer to veiw it as an egg shell.  Words spoken- like egg shells broken can never be put back togather again.
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