General Interest > Open Free for All
Safe Harbor www.alternativementalhealth.com/
Paul:
[I started this thread in the wrong section. I believe it should be here instead - Paul]
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?So ... 07&forum=9
generally use drugs as a first practice
Posted: 2005-06-14 23:15:00 There is no forced medication in the State of California in county mental health system's,
nor the prison systems.
In rare cases, only in involuntary treatment
situations, after a Reese Hearing is there
any "forced" medication.
All patients sign an informed consent document.
If they don't want meds, they don't receive any -
period! End of story.
---
If Wendy, or you Deborah, or any of the Anti-crowd
would do some actual activity like helping people,
attending meetings, and understanding the programs then you would know that the programs being discussed are "programs" not medical protocols.
Frankly, it is hard to spend time on this issue with you. There is so much content out there on
what evidence based practices are and the documentaion of medications and the protection of
consumers to make their own choices that if you
want to keep ignoring these facts, then you are
simply a useless gadfly!
Perhaps I will post my question once again, in a new topic ... has Deborah helped anyone at Fornits?
View Profile of Paul Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Post URL: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=D#109930
Paul
A regular around here
Joined: 2005-03-30
Posts: 163 "Paul does not speak for Safe Harbor."
Posted: 2005-06-14 23:08:00 Wow, what a profound statement!
View Profile of Paul Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Post URL: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=D#109929
Paul
A regular around here
Joined: 2005-03-30
Posts: 163 Posted: 2005-06-14 23:05:00 I just noticed this post from you Deborah:
Paul, you said:
Safe Harbor is having a non medication conference
in June. I offered to get the folks at Safe Harbor going with the Mental Health Services Act for funding, but they where not interested. I tried ...
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... =40#102890
Safe Harbor was interested in the taxpayer approved fund for improving the mental health system in California. I spoke to the president and one of the board members. They declined furthur help when I let them know that only evidence based practices are to be funded. Apparently they did not have proof that their non-pharma solutions worked or they would have asked for money.
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... 190#108648
****
Why would you "try? to set them up with MHSA funds if you knew the funds only go to ?evidence based practices?, or as Wendy understood, to ?government-run agencies??
How is "evidence based" defined? To your knowledge, is there any ?evidence based? alternative (non-drug) treatments, other than therapy?
I contacted Wendy at Safe Harbor and here is her response, which I post with her permission. As you will read, her understanding is that the funding had nothing to do with "evidence-based practices." :
Paul does not speak for Safe Harbor. He had suggested a possible funding source to myself and Dan Stradford, president of Safe Harbor. I personally checked out the government funding possibility; however, from what I found, it is only for government agencies, not private nonprofits like Safe Harbor. As the fundraiser for Safe Harbor, we of course, would love funding, but this idea suggested by Paul was a dead end unfortunately.
It has nothing to do with "evidence-based practices." (Paul never mentioned this to me personally. He simply sent me the URL's to check out.) This is government money for government-run agencies, which generally use drugs as a first practice. Safe Harbor is trying to change this of course, and move government agencies toward nondrug alternatives. There is some interest in the area, and we are continuing to push for nondrug treatments and practices.
For information about Safe Harbor, please check our Web site at AlternativeMentalHealth.com, contact me at safeharborproj@aol.com. Thanks.
Wendy Bolt
SAFE HARBOR
787 W. Woodbury Rd., #2
Altadena, CA 91001
---
I "tried" to set them up per a request from a mother, who is also a doctor who desperately wants
her son off of medications.
Dan said, oops, via email, stated he was interested.
I never dialogued, oops, emailed with Wendy, I don't know who she is.
I don't this she researched Prop 63, or she could not have made this statement:
"I personally checked out the government funding possibility; however, from what I found, it is only for government agencies, not private nonprofits like Safe Harbor."
If she, or Dan would have asked me, or anyone for a clarification for something they did not understand in the new California law there is plenty of availability to have it explained.
They didn't asked, they made an incorrect assumption and most likely the "evidence based" part of the law scared them off.
Deborah, how is it that you, the Scientologist, Safe Harbor and the other anti-psychiatry folks
are so turned off by "evidence based"?
Paul:
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Paul:
When people want help in a non-pharmaceutical
treatment plan for mental health care I refer
them to Safe Harbor as well at Naturopathy.
Many programs are not evidence based, it doesn't
mean that they should not still be utilized. It
just means that the organizers have not chosen
to put their program under scrutiny and for
those funding sources that require validity and
fidelity measures via evidence based practices
non-evidence based practices would not qualify.
Deborah:
Pauly,
You appear so wishy washy.
How can you make comments such as this:
They didn't asked, they made an incorrect assumption and most likely the "evidence based" part of the law scared them off.
Deborah, how is it that you, the Scientologist, Safe Harbor and the other anti-psychiatry folks
are so turned off by "evidence based"?
And then claim to refer people to them?
If there was any confusion on the part of Safe Harbor in the understanding of the Proposition, why didn't you follow up and explain? Better yet, when you CONTACTED THEM why didn't you spell out the criteria for funding? You do seem to enjoy wasting people time and attention.
First you erroneously accuse me of never citing Safe Harbor- as if I've some kind of organized alternative mental health clearing house- then divulge that they didn't qualify for the funds because they are not 'evidence based'... and now that you refer to them. :rofl:
It sometimes feels like I'm interacting with more than one person... sure they got your dx correct?
Really Paul, you don't make sense. Your positions, points, intention is not clear.
Deborah:
Why did you duplicate this topic here Paul? The discussion in THI was just fine. In addition to wasting people's time and attention, you also waste bandwidth. Ginger, should move it back to THI.
Rather than duplicate it here... you can read Wendy's final comment in the origianl thread.
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... 210#110296
Hear this Paul, "Final" means that I am no longer the go-between. If you have something to about or to her, you have her contact information.
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