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Messages - corecrash

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1
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 11:14:00 PM »
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After skimming through the thread, I must ask the obvious question. Why do you post here? Are you trying to change the minds of those who speak out against Anchor Academy?



Seriously, if you son is successful and you are both happy with the program, why not just ignore this forum and go live your happy lives together?  Why not just stay out of the muck?

 

First, let me say that your post was very well written and has so much good content. If I may, let me tell you why I even started to post here. I rarely ever post on any forums contrary to be called a troll. .

My wife found this forum and told me to check it out. Therefore, I read the posts and thought I would give a positive outcome to the Anchor story. I was rather taken back by the barrage of name-calling and profanity that followed. I was also taken back by the lack of proof, for this particular program or its staff. I continued to post because I feel it is wrong to unjustly accuse someone without proof while the accusers label any form of success as proof of a deep seeded conspiracy.

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Even before finding Fornits I had decided that the only reason these programs can exist at all is for three reasons. First, teenagers have been stripped of their right to self determination. The laws that are designed to protect them work against them. This industry exists by exploiting the legal loopholes that deny teenagers some of the most basic rights that every adult takes for granted. More and more, teenagers are being infantilised and vilified (unjustly) by society at large. So this is an industry created for the sole reason of exploiting legal loopholes against young people. This industry does not and could not exist for adults simply because as adults, we would not tolerate this kind of treatment. It can only exist by exploiting a population segment that has no voice.



I agree with much of your assertions and certainly think there are many people that are afraid of youth and find it necessary to smoother it. I am not so sure it is as bleak as you seem to think. This is what I believe.

When a child is born, they begin their journey. As they develop, they explore and learn. From day one, it is our job to keep them safe and make sure they stay within acceptable and safe bounds, which can be different for each parent as we do live in a culturally diverse world.  

When the child moves to the next stage of their development, [stage for lack of a better term], the boundaries expand. They move from their play pen to the floor. From the floor to outside and eventually, they can ride their bike down the street, choose their friends, and so on.

Once the child reaches the teen years, they have ideas of right and wrong and can truly think on their own. Some are very intelligent and critical thinkers. Some teens will flirt with the edge of their known bounds just to see what happens, maybe not intentionally. Just because they are a teenager or just because they become a young adult, in my opinion, those bounds do not go away. I live within bounds still to this day and if I go outside of them continually, I'll be forced to stay inbounds. That is how our society works.

What happens then if a teenager begins to go further and further out of their bounds? As adults we loss our self-determination if we do it. Teens are people and I know teens that can think quicker, clearer, and can out wit me.

I do not advocate programs like the one in Florida that beat a kid to death. I also do not support the program that sat on a teenager while he begged for his inhaler and died from suffocation. They should be shut down and only the participants involved should be put behind bars for murder. Nevertheless, I am not going to accuse every single program based on something someone else did in another program. There are good programs and their intention is to help the LOW percentage of teens that need help. I happen to believe that Anchor is one of them because I have only positive proof and zero real negative proof. I have only the assertions of folks that have never even been to Anchor.

We need places for kids and adults for when they continually step beyond the bounds put in place by our society. If not then we have anarchy. Not to beat and murder them but to teach them what the acceptable bounds are and how to explore it.  I also believe that if a parent feels that Christianity is an acceptable solution then they can teach it. The child will untimely decide whether to adhere to it. That is the beauty of salvation. It is based on freewill. If there is a heaven or a hell, you choose freely where you end up.

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Second, there are parents who suffer from the illusion that they can (and should) control every facet of another human being's life. Control of this sort is an illusion, except in controlled prison-like environments.



All forms of control are illusions. That does not mean we settle for anarchy.

I think that you have an accurate picture of some of our society but again I don't think it's that bleak. I do not think everyone hates teens and wants to squash them.

I'm sorry if I misunderstood your general theme, that's what I thought I picked up on. I also do not want to give the impression I know it all. Those are my beliefs and who knows, after this experience they may change.

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This alarms me. That is why I am here. Because it is my resonsibility to speak up when another's rights are being violated.


In attmpt to have this not come across as sarcasm I'd like to say that it alarms me that the staff's rights at Anchor have been violated because many here have already tried and convicted them. [ This Message was edited by: corecrash on 2006-01-18 20:17 ]

2
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 10:12:00 PM »
And here is an example of an intelligent person who opposes programs with evidence and facts and helps parents make an informed decision. That my friends is true compasion.

Post URL: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=0#163956[ This Message was edited by: corecrash on 2006-01-18 19:13 ]

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The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:53:00 PM »
Now this is proof, and this is reason to shut down a facility.

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=9&6

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The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:37:00 PM »
Now if you want to use this forum for what it should be used for, to talk about your experience and how it affected you. To find support in your quest for understanding. I'm all for supporting someone when they are hurt. Giving them kind words when they need to hear it and lifting them up. But you have used this forum for an avenue to slander, and mislead other parents about one specific place that none of you have any empirical evidence about. So lets talk about your experience with the progrm you were in. Lets shut down those places and if and when it has been proven that someone else has commited a crime, then we focus on that problem, at that time.

If you can't identify with that, then you are the troll and you are the psycho and deep down you know it. You all had heated this forum up way before I got here.

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On 2006-01-18 18:27:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Some say Brother Dennis truly believes this trolling is a form of free advertising. Does he really believe he can round up future "cadets" from this forum? What a laugh!"

5
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:25:00 PM »
That, is the funniest thing I've read all day. Did you ever think that my work is based on the computer? Did you think maybe I work 18 hours a day and have the ability to watch the posts and type so fast that I make typo's? lol

You say I'm delusioned? You all really need to take a long hard look in the mirror. Step out of your self and re-read your posts from beginning to end.



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On 2006-01-18 18:14:00, Anonymous wrote:

"ITS NOT A PARENT. USE COMMON SENSE. A PARENT WOULD NOT SPEND THEIR ENTIRE DAYS AND NIGHTS ON HERE ARGUING LIKE THIS. THIS IS THE SAME TROLL WHO TAKES ALL THREADS UP TO 50 PAGES PRETENDING TO BE A PARENT AND RUNNING CIRCULAR ARGUMENTS THAT JUST DEFLECT. THEY CANT SHUT FORNITS DOWN BUT THEY CAN DISTRACT AND TRY TO MESS WITH THIS BOARD THAT WAY. DONT THINK THE PROGRAM EMPLOYEES ARENT HERE.



 ::troll::  ::troll:: "

6
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:18:00 PM »
Preach? When did I preach? The majority of my posts are about my sons accomplishments and asking for proof of what you say is a FACT.

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On 2006-01-18 18:16:00, Anonymous wrote:

"EVEN IF THIS IS A PARENT THEY ARENT INTERESTED IN ANYTHING BUT SPOUTING THEIR PROPOGANDA. THEY ARE A DEFACTO EMPOLOYEE AND RECRUITER LIKE ANY GOOD CULT MEMBER. THEY DONT WANT INFORMATION THEY WANT TO PREACH. LET THEM PREACH TO THEMSELVES.



PERIOD.  





. <-------------------



 ::troll:: "

7
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:17:00 PM »
Yep, I'm not a program employee. I'm a parent. Say what you will. Who is deflecting now? Give me the proof. Not up to the challenge?

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On 2006-01-18 18:14:00, Anonymous wrote:

"ITS NOT A PARENT. USE COMMON SENSE. A PARENT WOULD NOT SPEND THEIR ENTIRE DAYS AND NIGHTS ON HERE ARGUING LIKE THIS. THIS IS THE SAME TROLL WHO TAKES ALL THREADS UP TO 50 PAGES PRETENDING TO BE A PARENT AND RUNNING CIRCULAR ARGUMENTS THAT JUST DEFLECT. THEY CANT SHUT FORNITS DOWN BUT THEY CAN DISTRACT AND TRY TO MESS WITH THIS BOARD THAT WAY. DONT THINK THE PROGRAM EMPLOYEES ARENT HERE.



 ::troll::  ::troll:: "

8
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:15:00 PM »
Let me get this straight. My very first post was very calm and just a simple praise of my son and what my experience was at Anchor. It was not condescending, it wasn't santimonous, it wasn't self righteous. Just a declaration of what I knew to be true.

Immediatly, I was called an idiot, pitiful, and whatever else the posters called me, and you call me a troll? Do you know the definition of a troll? It's one that posts ABUSIVE content in an internet forum. Imagine that, you ABUSIVE. I didn't write the definition.

Of course I'm going to call you out on what I believe to be false but it is pretty dag on comical that when anyone tries to input their experience and it's in direct conflict with your version of what the world is, you resort to name calling and vial profanity.


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On 2006-01-18 17:51:00, Anonymous wrote:

"DONT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH THIS TROLL! HE DOES NOT HAVE A KID IN ANCHOR ACADEMY. ALL THIS PERSON WANTS IS ATTENTION -- DONT GIVE IT TO THEM.  ::troll::  THEY DESERVE YOUR PITY NOT YOUR TIME THEY DISTRACT FROM THE MORE IMPORTANT THREADS ON THIS FORUM. "

9
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 09:00:00 PM »
LOL yea, I don't have a son in anchor. You busted me out. (SARCASM) I love spending my time here letting other parents know that you feel it's a waste of time for me to praise my son. Something all the professionals say we should do and something all of your parents seemed to have failed to do. Are you jealous?


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On 2006-01-18 17:51:00, Anonymous wrote:

"DONT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH THIS TROLL! HE DOES NOT HAVE A KID IN ANCHOR ACADEMY. ALL THIS PERSON WANTS IS ATTENTION -- DONT GIVE IT TO THEM.  ::troll::  THEY DESERVE YOUR PITY NOT YOUR TIME THEY DISTRACT FROM THE MORE IMPORTANT THREADS ON THIS FORUM. "

10
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 08:57:00 PM »
Do you find it sad that my Son is happier than he ever has been? Do you find it sad that he has a much better self-esteem? Do you find it said that he was PAID for work at anchor and can now purchase a car and have pride in his accomplishment?

I do find it sad that you conviently skip over all of that information to make it seem that I made it about me. I didn't make it about me, you did. There are many more posts lifting my son up with pride than stupid posts about music. You find that sad? If so, then you are the abuser. You are the one that would knock him down from off his horse that he worked VERY HARD to get on.

I find it interesting that you say you are concerned for MY SON, but you call him a Stepford child? You say he's crazy because he bought in to it?

NOTE: HERE COME SARCASM..NOT SERIOUSNESS: If Roloff were alive, I'd spend my savings putting him in his school rather than put him in your care!

For the record, my son decided on his own to remove him self from my home. He kept running away. Why? Because I'm a drunk? A crack head? An abuser? I've never hit ones of my kids, ever. It's because he was expected to get C's, smoke outside, not do drugs, and respect his mother and his teachers. Sounds pretty abusvie doesn't it. (SARCASM).  
 


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On 2006-01-18 17:44:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I find it SAD that you think it is OK to send your son off to strangers at Anchor, rather than keep him at home and seek help for him.  I find it SAD that you accept "redshirting" as an acceptable way of punishing children. I find it SAD that you are willing to wait until Brother Dennis or someone else working at Anchor severely injures a child before you "snap" and say to yourself, "hey, if this Brother Dennis guy has always worked in abusive facilities, maybe this isn't a good place to have my own kid." I think it is SAD that you are so full of yourself that you have no real concerns about this boy. No one really cares about your wanna-be-musical-career. People do care about your son. Too bad you don't!"

11
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 08:46:00 PM »
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Judging from your post, you seem really excited by his final triumph over algebra.  Seems like a sorry reason to kid away though.



I know you haven't read all the post but I didn't put my son in Anchor because of his musical tastes or his struggles with algebra. It's in the previous posts

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Anyway, fine - so Anchor only "Redshirts" repeat offenders.  Why do these kids continously break major rules?  Why would the kids worthy of "Redshirting" continue to put up a fight?




According to my son Anchor does not Red Shirt any longer. My son also said that, even in Anchor, people make it out to be much more than it is. He explained that you have to get up an hour early, you do not get dessert, and you do not get second helpings of food but you do get your full meal. I dunno..that sounds pretty evil. (That sarcasm does not indicate that I would in anyway minmize what you went through. Yours and WWFSMD's situation sounds unjust and unneed.

12
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 08:05:00 PM »
You don't find that sad? And you all call me psycho?

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On 2006-01-18 16:50:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
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I watched an episode of Forensic Files not too long ago. The story was about a girl who was close with her mother, seemed to live a nice life. She was the class president and had straight A's. One day she decided to become a crack addict and prostitue her self out. She eventually was murdered. That is tragic and I'm sure that mother to this day cannot figure out what the heck happened. That is a rare situation she was not in and out of state ran and court ordered programs but man it is sad.



You sure you don't work as a program telemarketer? "

13
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 07:50:00 PM »
I didn't claim to be a world renown musician. I was a back alley, long hair, metal wanna be. None the less a musician. You read my statment as arogant but it wasn't, I'm not that good. But, to the point I was making is that I'm capable of listening, looking, and thinking about the music industry.

You say I'm self righteous, sanctimonious, and condescending but have you read your posts? Have you read the posts of all the others? (with the exception of Helena). I also will add it again, I never needed to call anyone a name or spout of profanity to amke my point. You did. [ This Message was edited by: corecrash on 2006-01-18 17:02 ]

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The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 07:38:00 PM »
Helena,

Regarding the link to your post:

I'll never debate with you on that. A parent that drinks them self into a stupor, beats their kids, and then ships them off because they fought back is not what I'm defending and Truly, that is not the argument I brought to the table.

It is possible; however, that good parents have their kids fall in with kids that are a bad influence. YOu can't really control that. It's also possible that most of us were never given a manual on how to raise kids. Even if you do not smoke, drink, do drugs, and beat your kids, you are bound to make mistakes that a teenager could use to justify the thought that their parent is a complete idiot and do whatever they want. No one has figured out why the worst of them do what they do.

My agrument is for the parents who find themself on the edge of falling into a web of dysfunctional justice and penal systems. The parents that tried to do everything they could. My argument is also around whether Dennis McElwrath and his current staff are guilty of the crimes you accuse them of. It's clear the person you responded to had a complete different experience in a different place; However, I can't use that to measure Anchor.

I watched an episode of Forensic Files not too long ago. The story was about a girl who was close with her mother, seemed to live a nice life. She was the class president and had straight A's. One day she decided to become a crack addict and prostitue her self out. She eventually was murdered. That is tragic and I'm sure that mother to this day cannot figure out what the heck happened. That is a rare situation she was not in and out of state ran and court ordered programs but man it is sad.



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On 2006-01-18 16:12:00, Helena Handbasket wrote:

"Corecrash,



THIS is the stuff I'm talking about:



http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=20#67140



It's an old post, but relevant.  All a parent has to do is sign their kid up, invent what they want, and whoosh - you get scooped up.



I'm sure if you look hard enough (I'm a little too busy to post the gory details tonight) - in a nutshell - my mother had me thrown into a a "Therapeutic Community" because she was pissed of that I testified against her for child abuse, then smashed her booze after I found 3 liter jugs of Carlo Rossi after I was returned to her custody a year and a half later.  



Hey, I was being pro-active.  She was quite a mean drunk in those days.  :smile:











It's obnoxious to ask law enforcement to follow the law. That's insulting to every cop.

--John Lovell, lobbyist for the California police chief's association


"
[ This Message was edited by: corecrash on 2006-01-18 16:40 ]

15
The Troubled Teen Industry / Anchor Academy for Boys in Havre, Montana.
« on: January 18, 2006, 06:49:00 PM »
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Yeah, yeah...so's my husband.  With three Emmys to his name.  Big deal.




Definitions of emmy on the Web:

an annual award by the Academy of Television Arts and Sciences for outstanding achievements in television
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

3 Emmys is a fantastic accomplishment. I'm sure the folks that remember that they aren't musicians find it a very big deal.

I sure hope your assertions about Dennis are more accurate than that.
[ This Message was edited by: corecrash on 2006-01-18 15:51 ][ This Message was edited by: corecrash on 2006-01-18 15:51 ]

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