Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Who Am I Discovery/Whitmore => Topic started by: Anonymous on March 22, 2005, 09:39:00 PM
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Hello everyone, this is Tori DeGarmo. Right now I am at home in Florida, the Whitmore is traveling south. I took the week to visit my parents and my brother who just got back from Iraq. There are a bunch of misrepresentations, misleading comments, lies, and the questions are endless...What I would like to say is simple. I love my family (my blood and also my close friends that I consider family) as I am sure many of you do too wherever you are. I am a former student of the Whitmore and since have gone back to work- but it's basically helping out, being a good friend, a positive influence...I'm not perfect. No one is- and thats no excuse for abusers out in the world. But nobody I know and devote my time for are abusive. The Sudweeks, myself, or anyone I choose to be around- they all have a lot in common. They are devoted to helping others. The Sudweeks have their flaws- and these are not just theirs alone, its the kids mostly- like in communication. But take this really good example. The students are packing to leave for a travel study trip and some of them ask to call their parents and the other 80 percent choose not to. Now parents left and right are wondering and questioning, all with excellent reason to do so for their childs life is in the hands of those hundreds of miles away. Need for improvement? Of course! And things are being done in everyones power to do so. I am here for anyone who needs answers. (toridegarmo@yahoo.com). There is no abuse. There is lack of communication- but like that of the students not bothering to call their parents-that is solely their responsibility and something that could be talked about between parents and their kids. I am hearing whispering through cracks that some parents are very close to quitting this whole journey- dont quit. Ask, look around for advice- listen to the minority in this case- because I am proof that all is well...and I need your help to get things even better and looking up...
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Why Tori, if the little Caring Parents chat site was open to ALL THE PARENTS of Whitmore, and not just the "elite few who are invited to join" you could have just sent a message on that site!!!!! and had everyone join in for a friendly chat.
Now you probably have a whole bunch of parents really worried. Your might provide more information like:
When did the traveling warriors leave?
What is their exact destination?
How long will they be gone?
Is their fine education continuing..are all the
certified teachers all packed up with them?
Graduation is right around the corner you know!
Are they cleaning up the Sudweeks' hurricane mess, OR are they actually on vacation?
Did any of the "bad, misbehaving kids" get left
behind, and if so---who's watching them?
Who's watching over the defenless horses?
Just what kind of "keeping the family unit
together is going on at the Whitmore...that
parents are not a PRIOITY, and are not given
at least a phone call??? 80% don't call home?
Just how much Kool-Aid was packed for this trip?
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Tori,
What about what happened to Joey? What about Erica? Are you telling us that nothing that the kids who are talking against the Whitmore ever happened? Seems to me, when a business "Whitmore" says that it provides certain services, and they take money for that service, they should provide that service. There should not be "mistakes." No, I think this is a little more than a "communication" problem.
By the way, have you been paid for your employment at Whitmore?
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Doesn't sound like anything new is going on---total lack of communication with parents. Same old thing. It is Easter Week. I would be furious if I had not heard from my child during this holiday week, and before the Sudweeks left for an extended trip.
I would also be very very concerned if the Sudweeks had my child out of the country while a criminal investigation was still underway.
I would also be upset that this forum would be selected as a means of communication for parents with students at Whitmore--there are emails, phones available at the Whitmore. Each child is required to have their own laptop, you know.
Any responsible adult/owner of a school would make it mandatory that each student at least call their parent(s) prior to leaving for an out-of-the-country-trip.
Exactly what LIES, STORIES, are being told, heard? It seems like parents NEED to be talking to each other. Or perhaps they need to be talking to the detective in charge of the investigation there in Nephi, Justin Kimball.
If my son or daughter was still at Whitmore, I would be very concerned.
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YEA RIGHT---Let's blame the kids. That's the way it is done at Whitmore. Blame the kids. What a crock!
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Tori,
What is the deal?
Are you employed at the Whitmore Academy or NOT?
In the same sentence you say you work there, then you correct yourself and say you just help out,.... Do you get a paycheck?
What do you mean trying to blame 80% of the kids for not calling home? IF that many kids decided on their own not to call home---then something very very strange is going on at the Whitmore. It is Easter time, family time, a holy week. REAL family should be foremost on the minds of the kids there.
What's all the problems there with the parents? Sounds like quite a few parents seem ready to pull their children out of Whitmore from your message.
Why isn't Mark or Cheryl Sudweeks making this plea? Why are they depending on a teenage girl, who MAY OR MAY not be an employee of theirs to speak to parents, who just may honestly be concerned about their children?
P.S. I am happy that your brother is home safely from Iraq.
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On 2005-03-22 18:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Hello everyone, this is Tori DeGarmo. Right now I am at home in Florida, the Whitmore is traveling south. I took the week to visit my parents and my brother who just got back from Iraq. There are a bunch of misrepresentations, misleading comments, lies, and the questions are endless...What I would like to say is simple. I love my family (my blood and also my close friends that I consider family) as I am sure many of you do too wherever you are. I am a former student of the Whitmore and since have gone back to work- but it's basically helping out, being a good friend, a positive influence...I'm not perfect. No one is- and thats no excuse for abusers out in the world. But nobody I know and devote my time for are abusive. The Sudweeks, myself, or anyone I choose to be around- they all have a lot in common. They are devoted to helping others. The Sudweeks have their flaws- and these are not just theirs alone, its the kids mostly- like in communication. But take this really good example. The students are packing to leave for a travel study trip and some of them ask to call their parents and the other 80 percent choose not to. Now parents left and right are wondering and questioning, all with excellent reason to do so for their childs life is in the hands of those hundreds of miles away. Need for improvement? Of course! And things are being done in everyones power to do so. I am here for anyone who needs answers. (http://helpyourteens.com/about_us.html (http://helpyourteens.com/about_us.html)
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On 2005-03-22 18:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Hello everyone, this is Tori DeGarmo. Right now I am at home in Florida, the Whitmore is traveling south. I took the week to visit my parents and my brother who just got back from Iraq. There are a bunch of misrepresentations, misleading comments, lies, and the questions are endless...What I would like to say is simple. I love my family (my blood and also my close friends that I consider family) as I am sure many of you do too wherever you are. I am a former student of the Whitmore and since have gone back to work- but it's basically helping out, being a good friend, a positive influence...I'm not perfect. No one is- and thats no excuse for abusers out in the world. But nobody I know and devote my time for are abusive. The Sudweeks, myself, or anyone I choose to be around- they all have a lot in common. They are devoted to helping others. The Sudweeks have their flaws- and these are not just theirs alone, its the kids mostly- like in communication. But take this really good example. The students are packing to leave for a travel study trip and some of them ask to call their parents and the other 80 percent choose not to. Now parents left and right are wondering and questioning, all with excellent reason to do so for their childs life is in the hands of those hundreds of miles away. Need for improvement? Of course! And things are being done in everyones power to do so. I am here for anyone who needs answers. (toridegarmo@yahoo.com). There is no abuse. There is lack of communication- but like that of the students not bothering to call their parents-that is solely their responsibility and something that could be talked about between parents and their kids. I am hearing whispering through cracks that some parents are very close to quitting this whole journey- dont quit. Ask, look around for advice- listen to the minority in this case- because I am proof that all is well...and I need your help to get things even better and looking up..."
Are you telling me that there are parents of current "students" at the Whitmore who are worried and want to speak to their kids before they're taken out of the country are having to come here to find out information??? I'm sorry, but WTF is wrong with you people? All of you. Parents, GO GET YOU DAMN KIDS, RIGHT NOW!! I mean are you fucking kidding me? :scared: Have you called? What are you being told? GO GET YOUR KIDS NOW. Goddamnit people, wake the hell up!! Your kids are being taken out of the country without your concerns being addressed or even a chance to say goodbye. And if this is really true that this is happening, then Suds, PURE et al, how DARE you! This is way beyond a little "communication problem". How fucking dare you!!
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Are you being paid?
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Alana Degarmo is Tori's mother. Tori is the former student who "works" at the Whitmore now, and just posted here.
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What needs to be improved? There is nothing to be offered at Whitmore now except academic schooling. The Sudweeks have NO LICENSE for any treatment facility. Wasn't Tom Hudson hired as the administrator to have the "school" in tip top shape, and running RIGHT? Isn't Bernie Farrow hired there as the "school counselor?" Don't we "hear" that the Sudweeks have hired "certified teachers?" Haven't the Sudweeks built a new School Building? Perhaps things are a bit crowded at the MANSION since the Sudweeks can't house kids down at the Boys House and at the School Building? What is going on there?
What are these parents so worried about?
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Perhaps Alana DeGarma needs to go to Teen Help Industry Thread and read a few of the topics about her friend Sue Scheff, she might find some of that information about her and Whitmore interesting.
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Alana, you say no abuse happened, don't worry. Well a few different people have told of violence, strange rituals and other questionable activity going on at the Whitmore. Here's a short list from memory:
There's whatever happened to a kid named Joey. The incident at the movie theatre. Kids being told that their families either didn't want them or weren't their families anymore--that the Whitmore was now their family, kids getting beat up for calling asking to come home, not enough sleep, coerced daily indoctrination (subliminals), inadequate education, free labour, "Group" called on a kid for whatever reason, going on into the night (add to stress and sleep deprivation), inadequate food (food deprivation used as punishment).
That's not even a complete list. Are you saying these things didn't happen or that it happened but it's ok?
Then there are the things we've seen here in this forum. Kids and possibly others (who knows?) threatening violence and blackmail against any kids who had any complaints about the Whitmore. Then there was the publishing of confidential information about a minor child. That I can tell you came from the same internet account as other posts confirming that they were sitting in a room at the Whitmore (in case we hadn't guessed) --one of them saying they were looking Cheryl right in the face.
You can't tell me that these things didn't happen. Are you saying you're alright with that?
Heroism on command, senseless violence, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism--how passionately I hate them!
--Albert Einstein
_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Seed sibling `71 - `80
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.
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So Tori's mother is a PURE parent volunteer?
:???:
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Ginger,
You forgot to mention the erratic behavior of that Cheryl womman.The trips to the store to buy pills for weight loss.The screaming in the middle of the night.
IMO that would be very scary .
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From personal experience:
Parents I would'nt trust anyone! I especially suggest not TRUSTING someone who is making MONEY from you trusting them. The wolf in sheep's clothing is very convincing. If they truly cared about your child they would insist on you going to the facility your child is in and speaking with them. Look into your child's eyes.The eye's will speak the truth.
Rememeber, laywer fees are costly. Some how some way the money must come from somewhere...From You maybe.
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Seems like Tori's mom is a PURE volunteer.
Just a little tight circle isn't it?
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Where do the lawyer's fees come from?
The "tuition" is close to $4,000 a month per kid.
Then a parent sends out a PLEA to the parents to please send a contribution in your Christmas Card to the poor Sudweeks to help cover the $20,000 lawyer retainer fee for them since they have been so wrongfully accused of child abuse..... How pitiful is that?
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It doesn't really matter what TORI'S experience was, now does it..........If she had suffered the abuse Joey did.......Alanta would sing a different tune..........criminal allegations, civil actions, independent investigations and numerous, similar conclusions.........I SUSPECT A RAT.............POOR SUDWEEKS>>>>>such victims...wake up MS DEGARMO>>>>>>>>>>>>>Tori....grow up......................GATEKEEPER....AMF
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Why is a teenager the spokesperson for the Sudweeks? Don't they have TWO grown daughters on the STAFF at Whitmore? Why aren't these family members who are listed as Teachers speaking to these concerned parents? Why isn't Administrator, Tom Hudson, or the Counselor, Dr.Bernie Farrow addressing the concerns of the Parents? Why is a teenager who is at home on vacation with her family trying to explain the problems going on at Whitmore.
And why is the "explanation" placing the blame on a bunch of kids who were placed at Whitmore because undoubtable they have problems to begin with OR the kids wouldn't be at Whitmore in the first place??????
AND TO THE PARENTS: Why are you sitting back and allowing this to happen? Can't YOU pick up a phone and DEMAND that the control freak Cheryl Sudweeks let YOU speak to your child?
WHY are you allowing people who are under investigation by the Attorney General's office--Mr. John Kimball (yes he is still investigating the Sudweeks, whether the Sudweeks want you to believe it or NOT)....and by the Nephi Police (Justin Kimball...and YES he is still investigating the Sudweeks for child abuse)....So why did you allow the Sudweeks to take your children out of the country while they are still under criminal investigation??? Why?
These are your children. You have the RIGHT to know where they are. The RIGHT to talk to them any time you wish. The RIGHT to have them in school. The RIGHT to know what is going on. The RIGHT to know exactly where they are every minute of every day.
Why do you accept being reported to by a teenager from Florida?
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Degarmo women have their heads in the sand?....NAH, Alana is wiser than that???...proverbs 31 woman?......come on MS Degarmo, (Alana).....don't ring in until the facts (evidence, investigation, hospitial records, police interviews, DPCSS conclusion,
ec tra) are placed on the table for full disclosure...Criminal allegations....YES, furture filing.....probable, civil litigation....time will reveal more............GATEKEEPER......AMF
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On 2005-03-22 18:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
I am hearing whispering through cracks that some parents are very close to quitting this whole journey- dont quit. Ask, look around for advice- listen to the minority in this case- because I am proof that all is well...and I need your help to get things even better and looking up..."
Your proof of what????......A pupet, girl on a leash, mind dead follower, non cognitive employee who has very little information, but alot of imature reaction.........settle down TORI....remember, "what goes on at Whitmore Academy is just like what goes on at any normal home.".....your news quote......distance yourself Alana, the fallout will stink of deceit, lies, MOMMY DEAREST type asylum....
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Proof of what? That your parents put you in a program? Why? Why aren't you in college getting on with YOUR LIFE? That's what your mother should be doing FOR YOU. That's the direction your life should be taking at least. Where's your mother in all this? There's a problem here.
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It doesn't really matter what TORI'S experience was, now does it..........
then
On 2005-03-23 11:03:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-03-22 18:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
I am hearing whispering through cracks that some parents are very close to quitting this whole journey- dont quit. Ask, look around for advice- listen to the minority in this case- because I am proof that all is well...and I need your help to get things even better and looking up..."
Your proof of what????......A pupet, girl on a leash, mind dead follower, non cognitive employee who has very little information, but alot of imature reaction
I don't mean to be insensitive, but it's been months and months. Calm down and look at this dispasionately. Be the adult in charge and let's focus on what to do about this problem.
Yes, I think Tori's experience is extremely important. Was she there to see what happened to Joey? Was what happened to Joey a unique experience, out of character for the Whitmore? I don't think so.
And yet perfectly decent seeming, obviously intelligent ppl like Chris Gentile and Whitmore Alumni seem to view these events quite differently than the more comonly accepted reality.
That is worth discussing. Mom2three is dead on correct. If you're looking for enemies among these teenagers or program 'graduate' staff (who are likely unpaid or seriously underpaid) you're barking up the wrong tree.
How did these kids come to view things like what happened to Joey as mundane or even therapeutic? How could they ever think that threats, blackmail and other forms of intimidation are the morally and ethically right choice in this situation.
Those are the important questions. At least I think these are the important questions.
Our nada who art in nada, nada be thy name. Thy kingdom nada, thy will be nada as it is in nada. Give us this nada our daily nada and nada us our nada as we nada our nadas and nada us into nada but deliver us from nada; pues nada. Hail nothing full of nothing, nothing is with thee.
--Ernest Hemingway, American author
_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Seed sibling `71 - `80
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.
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You are entitled to your opinion.
We have our own. Is that too hard to accept?
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Sounds like you could use a little trip to The Whitmore yourself. Calm down. All is well. I have living proof sitting here next to me.
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Mommie Dearest is alive and well. So are all the kids at the Whitmore. They're having a great trip to Mexico. Bummer, huh?
My mindless little puppet just got a recent grade from the college class she's been taking - she's kicking butt. Another bummer, huh?
Get your facts straight before you rant and rave. Your message sounds a bit over-anxious - perhaps a little Whitmore trip would do wonders for you.
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No the DeGarmo women have personal experience with The Whitmore, unlike many of the morons posting here. Tori is doing great. She was there for a year. I had nothing but great communication with Cheryl, Mark, and yes - the counselors and teachers at The Whitmore.
I'm not saying any program is for everyone. All I'm saying is that this one worked for my daughter. You can question that all you want but it won't change reality. Sorry to disappoint you. :grin:
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no Alana, Tori doing well is not a bummer, in fact it's great for today.......But what about the secrets, lies, deceit, and just plain TRASH the SUDWEEKS are involved in....I'm concerned the afformentioned is accepted as "what goes on in in any normal house"........And wonderful TORI chose to sign on form MORE????.......she, along with countless others observed the NORMAL HOME............hope your an available grandmother someday.......to love your grandchildren, from TORI's NORMAL HOME..................SUDWEEKS are HOLLOW....PERIOD
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On 2005-03-23 15:29:00, Alana wrote:
"No the DeGarmo women have personal experience with The Whitmore, unlike many of the morons posting here. Tori is doing great. She was there for a year. I had nothing but great communication with Cheryl, Mark, and yes - the counselors and teachers at The Whitmore.
I'm not saying any program is for everyone. All I'm saying is that this one worked for my daughter. You can question that all you want but it won't change reality. Sorry to disappoint you. ::puke::
"
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On 2005-03-23 15:29:00, Alana wrote:
"No the DeGarmo women have personal experience with The Whitmore, unlike many of the morons posting here. Tori is doing great. She was there for a year. I had nothing but great communication with Cheryl, Mark, and yes - the counselors and teachers at The Whitmore.
I'm not saying any program is for everyone. All I'm saying is that this one worked for my daughter. You can question that all you want but it won't change reality. Sorry to disappoint you. ::puke::
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On 2005-03-22 20:05:00, mom2three wrote:
"Are you being paid?"
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ALANA.........if you know sooooooo much about LIFE AT WHITMORE, fill us in on the incidents......what about JOEY.......WHAT really happened......does TORI know?........or is what we hear acceptable considering some troubled youth are "just complainers"..........ENLIGHTEN US MASTER PUPETIER
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Tori's mother, you talk like a Whitmore kid, what trailer park down there in Florida do you live in?
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Why don't you send your kid to college--that is the American Dream you know?
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Alana fill us in on the gossip through the cracks. Did you know "DR" Bernie Farrow was fired at Cedar Mountain Academy? Seems he had a bit of problems with his credentials...maybe he needs to be called MR. FARROW. Now Mark and Cherly wouldn't lie to you parents, would they, and tell you this man was more than he is, huh?
Nah, not them!
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Makes one wonder about the Administrator Tom Hudson now, doesn't it? Is he all qualified to be running that fine Private School like Mark and Cheryl say? Surely.
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no, we know the SUDWEEKS are up front and honest....HONEST they are........ok, small lies.......just to some people, ok some employees, ok ok ok....just ONE lie to ???..........sorry.....we won't lie NOW....we had to....you know....LAYWER FEES for the false abuse case.............its not really lies....WE HAVE TO PROTECT OURSELVES......FOR THE GREATER GOOD OF THE CHILDREN.....ya ya....thats good....you can use this angle SUWEEKS...your new spiritual adviser.......SPIN MASTER.....
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Can anyone verify this:
When at Lake Powell, did Cheryl Sudweeks really make the kids wash paper plates to be re-used to save money?
My child swears this is true.
Can you imagine washing paper plates in non-sanitary lake water, and being made to eat off them again, just to save a few pennies?
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Bernie Farrow at Cedar Mountain Academy:
Understand that Sue Scheff was referring kids there at this time too.
Just a tight little group of people who are still doing their thing together, making money off kids! How nice for all of them. How sad for all the kids.
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but Tori said the Whitmore Academy was a normal home.......yelling, screaming, profanity, hey...these are troubled complainers.....group assault IS necessary.......the police blew it WAY out of proportion.......plus, that kid would not go along with the wonderful treatment that I saw work on many of the other COMPLAINERS....OH, ME..no, they did not have to group assault me.....my MOMS ALANA........they need her support.......plus, I need a JOB...see, I am Whitmore TRAINED........here I come JOB MARKET....FROM A NORMAL HOME...................
THE WHITMORE ASYLUM...er ACADEMY......
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Anyone know who is watching any kids that got left behind, who didn't get to go on this trip to --is it Mexico?
And who is tending the horses? The Sudweeks do have a tendency to leave the animals unattended like they did up in Canada. Remember that big lawsuit that resulted in Mark Sudweeks being found guilty of animal cruelty and being banned from owning horses up there!
Maybe they have plumbers at work while they are gone so those poor kids can flush toliet paper down the toliets when they get back...that would be a healthy improvement. Imagine all that soiled toliet paper in unlined trash cans day in and day out. Ugh!
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yeah i can verify that we had to re use plastic bowls and plates a lot. I was there.
When the group went up to Canada and Lake powell this past late Sptember,... the kids of course had their specific duties, such as beach cleanup, kitchen crew, trash man, or whatever it was.... and i was actually assigned with one of the other girls to "dishes" while we were in Canada. We had to wash our plastic plates, bowls, and silver ware in the lake water which we were told not to drink because there were tiny "red bugs" that could give us stomache virus's.
hmmmmm! lets see here folks.... too me any common sense would tell me that if water isn't sanitary enought o drink than why the hell would it be sanitary enough too :eek: ....maybe wash re used old paper plates and bowls, silver ware, etc....etc... that had been eaten off of several different occasions. ???????? I remember washing those plates with the other girl and just thinking to myself, ..." man! this is gross!!!"... but oooooooooooooof course if ne one spoke against it it would become such a huuuuuuuuuGe GROUP issue.
And to save some pennies, that sounded like a sick excuse Cheryl would always come up with. I can understand how "wasting" money is an issue, but that is an issue that we need to all experience and overcome in our lives if we ever have the problem. I know i don't now.
My point clearly is that health hazards and dirty lake water should be looked at more seriously than just "a couple pennies"...
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I may be wrong, but it seems to me this Farrow man and his credentials were in an issue in the WWASP vs Pure trial.
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Bernie Farrow was an issue in the WASP Vs Pure trial-- just shows all this just goes round and round. These people just seem to follow each other. Sudweeks lost (surrendered) their license to the State of Utah during this abuse investigation---then Berinie Farrow is hired as the new "therapist/counselor"...makes you wonder just what is going on. Mark Sudweeks sends out information giving "Dr" Bernie's qualifications. I'm just asking---what is this man's REAL job at Whitmote--- and what is this man's REAL qualifications, since he was fired before because of credential "problems" and who's kiddding who? Parents have a RIGHT TO KNOW WHO IS WORKING WITH THEIR KIDS AT WHITMORE.
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OMG---Then I believe that kids were washing THROW-AWAY-PLATE-AND-EATING-UTINSILS at Lake Powell too!
When my child reported this, I just thought, "surely not."
Cheryl Sudweeks knows NO BOUNDARIES. What a penny-pinching stupid woman to put that many kids at health-risk to re-use disposable plates etc. by washing them in lake water! Gross to boot.
These are the types of things our kids DARED NOT report to us while they were there--and not to mention while WE PARENTS were paying THOUSANDS of dollar per month for these abusive Suds to be taking care of our children PROPERLY and in a healthy manner. Makes me sick!
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If my kid was off with the Suds, I'd have those cell phones of the Suds ringing constantly...you parents DO HAVE THE CELL PHONE NUMBERS, don't you?
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Tori---Are the parents emailing you? Are the kids ok down in Mexico? Why aren't you answering us?
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Alls well Tori? Why no response from you and Alana? Have you, too been shut down by Cheryl?
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My source down in Mexico has not seen the Sudweeks and the kids yet.
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Wow, if they did not take the kids to the place they own down there in Baja--wonder where they took them? Strange, huh?
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Have any of the parents heard from their children since the Suds took off with them for "Mexico," or where ever they went? It does not appear that they went to the place they say they own in Baja.
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Heard that the Suds took the kids to Las Vegas first, and some "problems arose there between some of the kids." Now why would responsible adults think hanging out at Circus Circus with a bunch of underage kids is appropriate? Then went on to Arizona to visit relatives. Also hear some of the kids who are required to sleep UNDER the bus are not too happy. Perhaps they ARE working their way down to Mexico afterall? Who knows???
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On 2005-03-29 09:33:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Heard that the Suds took the kids to Las Vegas first, and some "problems arose there between some of the kids." Now why would responsible adults think hanging out at Circus Circus with a bunch of underage kids is appropriate? Then went on to Arizona to visit relatives. Also hear some of the kids who are required to sleep UNDER the bus are not too happy. Perhaps they ARE working their way down to Mexico afterall? Who knows???"
Circus Circus has an indoor amusement park that is made for underage kids. It has a water ride, bumper cars, food court, spinning rides, etc. There really is nothing inappropriate about taking underage kids to Circus Circus.
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Thanks for the input Cheryl, but it was still inappropriate. The Vegas strip is no place to take at risk youths!! Get a clue.
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Iagree. It was suppose to be a travel study trip for the kids. Seems the Suds can't go near Nevada without feeding their apparent gambling addiction. Did the kids get a hotel room here--or did they get to sleep UNDER the bus again? And what about all the fighting that took place there? JUST WHO was supervising these kids. Usual question. Who is ever supervising these kids?
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On 2005-03-24 15:02:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Can anyone verify this:
When at Lake Powell, did Cheryl Sudweeks really make the kids wash paper plates to be re-used to save money?
My child swears this is true.
Can you imagine washing paper plates in non-sanitary lake water, and being made to eat off them again, just to save a few pennies?"
Was just reading through this discussion, and I can say hat yes that is true. Paper plates, plastic wear, and pots and pans were washed in the lake.
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My daughter says this is true, also.
I can not imagine washing throw-away paper products in lake water, and forcing kids to eat off them again! Just to save money, after the outrageous tutition we parents paid.
Bad enough there was no quality education going on, and group therapy---was led by Cheryl Sudweeks, who is not qualified, in my opinion to have a conversation with a child, much less to lead a "group session."
How about a little respect for the environment?
Placing wastes from paper plates and pot and pans in a LAKE? Do these people have no respect for ANYTHING?
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//How about a little respect for the environment?
Placing wastes from paper plates and pot and pans in a LAKE? Do these people have no respect for ANYTHING?//
Oh I am sure the fishes and turtles enjoyed the scraps. I wouldn't worry to much about adding them to the lake. What I find alarming is the prospect of the fish and turtle poop on the plates.
I wonder - did they use buckets of lake water with soap; or just raw lake water?
I also wonder - why not invest in some camp kits - you know, like the scouts use? The tin plates that clam shell together and hold tin utensils? They aren't costly and in the long run would be far less than even paper plates - which can surely only be re-used a small number of times.
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Yeah, I don't really remember if soap was used or not. If so, THAT would be harmful to the lake water, if not, then that is outright disgusting.
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I can only confirm that clear plastic cups were reused. I have no recollection of paper plates being reused. The cups would be washed out in the house boat sink with complimentary soap that was provided by Lake Powell.
I'm sorry, but wouldnt a paper plate rip if it were washed in lake water? Please get your facts straight, I think that this is a situation that is easily being exagerrated.
Chris G.
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This may not be Earth shattering news on the level of some issues, but it's a detail that helps flesh out the whole story.
If the personal freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution inhibit the
government's ability to govern the people, we should look to limit those guarantees.
--President Bill Clinton
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Please don't question whether my facts are actually that, facts. You were not there when I was there, nor do you know what went on while I was there. I am only telling things as they were, and nothing more.
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The "paper plates" were the styro-foam type ones that were very thick, and YES THEY WERE WASHED IN THE LAKE, and re-used. That is a fact, and no soap was used. Sorry Chris, everything negative about your beloved Whitmore is no an exaggeration.
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Yeah, I don't really remember if soap was used or not. If so, THAT would be harmful to the lake water, if not, then that is outright disgusting.//
Yes it could pollute the lake; altho some soap is considered Bio - friendly and so safe to allow into lakes and rivers.
Of corse the "paper" plates were the "plastic" kind; altho the coated Chinette might hold up for a good wet wipping off, once or twice.
I guess I find the washing of disposable dinnerware more amusing than anything. Apparently no one got sick (or did they?)but anyway - for me its amusing - just the idea of being so cheep you can't relax and enjoy the conveince of not having to do dishes!
If they want the joy of doing dishes then they ought to invest in the camp kits mentioned eariler.
Also a couple small wash tubs they can put over a fire and heat up for the dish water.
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The last trips i went on with the whitmore was at Lake Powell and in canada. I know for a fact that the plates, cups, and silverware { plastic or not} WERE washed in the dirty lake water { supposedly filled with little red bugs according to Sergeant CherRy.
I know because i was assigned the job of washing them with my friend at the time Krissy. It was so gross. Turtle shit floating around as well as fish guts and who knows what else! :scared:
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That is absolutely disgusting! For close to $4,000 per month--- "tuition" I was charged,--that woman could have bought bunches of paper plates, and simply thrown them away!!! Damn, what a penny-pinching _________!