Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: ` on March 18, 2005, 01:35:00 AM
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I still really don't understand, I really don't get what happened to me in Straight. I mean, what did they do to turn me into a Straightling. Did they do something that made me literally psychotic, or was I before and that made me extremely weak in there? Did previous abuse and neglect make it harder for me to see what was so wrong there? Has anyone else experienced paranoia to the extent that they would rather be homeless than live in an "exposed" place? I would like to figure this out because i seem consistently able to screw my life up and never get anywhere and also because i know this question is fairly central to everything i mean the way i have experienced my life and the way i conceive of myself. i mean, if i have a mental or emotional problem, or whatever, and you know, i think that feeling like you don't (or can't) exist is kind of a mental problem, then what happened, or was I always like this and Straight just made everything more painful. if someone reads my post and sees themself in them and the crashing and you found a way out of that it might help me.
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For god's sake, girl, get a diagnosis and collect some crazy pay.
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Hello FKA,
I see some things I've known in your post. I hope to be able to respond to you. I'm starting my workday now, and I'll need time for a careful reply to post back to you.
You exist! yes, you do. Breathe deep.
A bishop keeps on saying at the age of eighty what he was told to say at the age of eighteen.
--Oscar Wilde
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On 2005-03-18 06:15:00, Erinys wrote:
"Hello FKA,
I see some things I've known in your post. I hope to be able to respond to you. I'm starting my workday now, and I'll need time for a careful reply to post back to you.
You exist! yes, you do. Breathe deep.
A bishop keeps on saying at the age of eighty what he was told to say at the age of eighteen.
--Oscar Wilde
"
:nworthy: I was just about to post something very similar. Hang in there, I've felt that way many times.Applying computer technology is simply finding the right wrench to pound in the correct screw.
--Bastard Administrator
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On 2005-03-17 22:35:00, formerly known as wrote:
"I still really don't understand, I really don't get what happened to me in Straight. I mean, what did they do to turn me into a Straightling. Did they do something that made me literally psychotic, or was I before and that made me extremely weak in there? Did previous abuse and neglect make it harder for me to see what was so wrong there? Has anyone else experienced paranoia to the extent that they would rather be homeless than live in an "exposed" place? I would like to figure this out because i seem consistently able to screw my life up and never get anywhere and also because i know this question is fairly central to everything i mean the way i have experienced my life and the way i conceive of myself. i mean, if i have a mental or emotional problem, or whatever, and you know, i think that feeling like you don't (or can't) exist is kind of a mental problem, then what happened, or was I always like this and Straight just made everything more painful. if someone reads my post and sees themself in them and the crashing and you found a way out of that it might help me."
Yes. I hate the idea of anyone "official" knowing where I am. I'm scared of my life suddenly being taken away. Ever since my daughter was born I've feared someone would try to take her from me. Ever since Straight I've had anxiety and fear about simply existing. There has seemed to be a strong negative self-judgement that has followed me though the years, like I have to be something, or I'm nothing.
Not to mention, Straight hammered the nails into the coffin for my mother and I. We have never had a relationship since. I'm not sure if Straight did this or not, my mother being the control freak that she is, was doing a pretty good job of making me fear/hate her long before Straight, and Straight being my second ?treatment,? my first being at a ?wilderness therapy? place, aka a bootcamp.
Incarceration for years when you've done nothing illegal, and you are just a kid, fucks with your head.
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[ This Message was edited by: ..... on 2005-06-02 16:58 ]
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On 2005-03-18 06:56:00, Morli wrote:
Ever since my daughter was born I've feared someone would try to take her from me.
Happened to me. Over-zealous program 'grandparents' (to my kids, they were mine and my ex's folks) hired an attorney who waw partners with a Straight board member. Those kis were gone before I even knew what happened.
Not to mention, Straight hammered the nails into the coffin for my mother and I. We have never had a relationship since. I'm not sure if Straight did this or not, my mother being the control freak that she is, was doing a pretty good job of making me fear/hate her long before Straight,
Same here,except its my dad. I tried for years and years to be 'good enough' for him. Somehow I never was and now we haven't spoken in years. Sad thing is when he cut me out of his life, he also virtually cut my kids out too. Ain't tough love grand?? :roll:
Men seldom, or rather never for a length of time, and deliberately, rebel against anything that does not deserve rebelling against.
--Thomas Carlyle
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St. Pete Straight
early 80s
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Sorry about your kids, Cayo Hueso.
I think for me my dad was a lot like the staff members at straight, always angry, and he never had anything positive to say. I think that I went into straight already feeling somewhat insecure and that was absolutely the last place I should have been sent. It took all of those insecurities and magnified them by 1000, and left ideas in my head that have taken me years to sort through. I think I understand what you're saying.
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On 2005-03-18 10:38:00, JMA wrote:
"Sorry about your kids, Cayo Hueso.
Thanks, I got 'em back :smile: (and they're all grown up now :cry:) , it was all just a bunch of bullshit. Amazed me how much power Straight and anyone connected with them wielded. There were not even abuse allegations!!! I had left my husband, his parents owned the house we rented, my dad pulled the 'tough love' shit and wouldn't let me live with him til I could get on my feet. The basis for taking the kids was that I had no permanent place to live.
I always knew that Straight fucked me up, but I didn't realize the depths of it and how many areas of my life it reached into until I started talking to others who were there, especially talking with others who were there at the same time, in the same program. It's like a cancerous tumor that has tentacles speading out everywhere.
You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war.
--Albert Einstein
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I had a long boring post ready to go. But perhaps I am not qualified to comment.
I eluded captivity and the damage that the others have spoken of. I am grateful, but in this case, diminished, because I escaped the experience that informs your terror.
I do know the feeling of hiding, I do know the choice of rejection of the trappings of prosperity for the sake of my freedom. And there is a kind of freedom there!
I'm beginning to run on again... but I wanted to respond. It does matter to me!
Perhaps this is just a silly ritual, but the next time I come to a place where road and water meet I will pause, and think of you, and send prayer/energy/coppercoin, (whatever word you choose, means some part of me - let go) along the tide to you.
Love you - Stand up! (or take a nap, or a drink or do whatever you like! You deserve it!)
No synonym for God is so perfect as Beauty. Whether as seen carving the lines of the mountains with glaciers, or gathering matter into stars, or planning the movements of water, or gardening - still all is Beauty!
-- John Muir
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Love you - Stand up!
Love ya, have a seat! (You deserve it!)
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If I show up.
Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
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Oh, you'll show up allright.....we'll see to that, won't we Fucktard?
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We sure will, Virgil. My SIBS hacker has his IP logged already..
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On 2005-03-18 11:45:00, Erinys wrote:
I eluded captivity and the damage that the others have spoken of.
I think I remember reading that you had a sibling in the program. How did you manage to avoid being dragged in too?
Apologies if I have you mixed up with someone else, happens to me frequently. Ya know the whole 'short term memory loss' thing. :wink: We must create an atmosphere where the crooked cop fears the honest cop, and not the other way around.
Frank Serpico
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Ya know the whole 'short term memory loss' thing.
..which is a typical side-effect of drug abuse..
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On 2005-03-18 12:10:00, Dr. Miller Newton wrote:
"Ya know the whole 'short term memory loss' thing.
..which is a typical side-effect of drug abuse..
"
Give it up Newt!! You've been exposed for the sham and freak that you are! Man of god MY ASS!!!!! :rofl: How's the health btw?? You looked really, really bad at the hearing!!! Blood pressure must be skyhigh by how red you were!!!!:lol: Hope its a slow and painful demise!!We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately.
-- Ben Franklin At the signing of the Declaration of Independence, July 4, 1776.
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Just be sure you get the right individual. Last person tried to finger the ISP owner for a rehab program drew back a bloody stump.
...to disarm the people (is) the best and most effective way to enslave them...
-- George Mason
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Yes, I had a sister in Straight. I was "invited" for a "visit"
while I was in college. "The whole family needs to be involved and supportive"
I just happened to catch a news story about Fred Collins. "Lost" my plane ticket. (the blessing of the short-term memory thing)
Also lost the support, financial and otherwise, of my family, for a few years. I managed on my own.
My sister was not so fortunate, she was terminated from Straight, diagnosed as schizophrenic, and now is maintained on medication and SSI, and stalled at a very unhappy 13.
If once [the people] become inattentive to the public affairs,
you and I, and Congress and Assemblies, Judges and Governors,
shall all become wolves. It seems to be the law of our general
nature, in spite of individual exceptions.
Thomas Jefferson to Edward Carrington, 1787
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I'm glad for you but really sorry about your sister. It was bad enough for any of us, but for the ones who came in that had true psych problems.....I just can't even imagine. :cry:
Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
--Denis Diderot, French encyclopedist
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Hope its a slow and painful demise!!
Not if I can help it!! ::stab:: ::stab:: :grin:
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On 2005-03-18 10:38:00, JMA wrote:
"Sorry about your kids, Cayo Hueso.
I think for me my dad was a lot like the staff members at straight, always angry, and he never had anything positive to say. I think that I went into straight already feeling somewhat insecure and that was absolutely the last place I should have been sent. It took all of those insecurities and magnified them by 1000, and left ideas in my head that have taken me years to sort through. I think I understand what you're saying. "
My dad was the exact same way...
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On 2005-03-18 10:48:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"Thanks, I got 'em back :scared:
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On 2005-03-18 14:07:00, Morli wrote:
"My dad was the exact same way... "
We still have trouble talking. I guess it's a sad fact that probably won't ever change.
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My mother and I don't speak at all. I tried last year and it ended in disaster.
I don't have parents, but that's really the way it's always been...
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On 2005-03-19 16:14:00, Morli wrote:
"My mother and I don't speak at all. I tried last year and it ended in disaster.
I don't have parents, but that's really the way it's always been..."
I know how you feel :sad: . I haven't spoken to my mother in probably almost a year and my father on rare occasions. I was like that after straight too and have gone through phases of wanting to be in touch with them, and then not being able to at all. Sometimes it's just too hard.
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My mother, in the past year has been selfish and vindictive, while staying in total "Christian" denial about all of it. She thinks she is this supreme being that doesn't have to be accountable for the things she says and does. For example:
-- She withheld a gift she bought for me for on Christmas, and sent me an email telling me how she bought me something but didn't send it, because in her mind I didn't deserve it?
-- She sends inappropriate emails to my 13 year old daughter complaining about me.
-- She lies, she's manipulative, she's a control freak, she uses guilt as her weapon, and Christianity as immunity.
-- She asked me to send her a cat by crating it and putting it on a 14 hour bus ride to Dallas/Ft Worth. :roll:
-- She was calling me drunk and crying all the time until I told her never to call me again drunk. So she stopped calling until something terrible happened that she could cry to me about, or made something up.
I can clearly see now why she sent me away all those years. She can?t handle anything on her own, she?s like a child who has to be told what to do. But don?t tell her something she might not like hearing or she?ll get mad and throw sand, then pout in the corner on the sandbox.
I know that last year I may have mentioned that I was going through some "reconciliation process" with my mother, but a lot changed after she came up to visit me. I realized that there really was no room in my life for someone who makes me feel the way that I do when I'm in any sort of contact her. It sucks but that's the reality of it.
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On 2005-03-22 06:52:00, Morli wrote:
"-- She withheld a gift she bought for me for on Christmas, and sent me an email telling me how she bought me something but didn't send it, because in her mind I didn't deserve it?
I can clearly see now why she sent me away all those years. She can?t handle anything on her own, she?s like a child who has to be told what to do. But don?t tell her something she might not like hearing or she?ll get mad and throw sand, then pout in the corner on the sandbox.
I know that last year I may have mentioned that I was going through some "reconciliation process" with my mother, but a lot changed after she came up to visit me. I realized that there really was no room in my life for someone who makes me feel the way that I do when I'm in any sort of contact her. It sucks but that's the reality of it."
thank you for the excellent description of my mother. :lol:
(sorry for laughing. it's a habit, me & my brother sometimes find the subject hilarious.)
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Sure, no problem. I like to help people! :grin:
My sister and I joke about it too, but now that she's approaching 65, it's just plain pathetic.
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On 2005-03-22 06:52:00, Morli wrote:
"My mother, in the past year has been selfish and vindictive, while staying in total "Christian" denial about all of it. She thinks she is this supreme being that doesn't have to be accountable for the things she says and does. For example:
-- She withheld a gift she bought for me for on Christmas, and sent me an email telling me how she bought me something but didn't send it, because in her mind I didn't deserve it?
-- She sends inappropriate emails to my 13 year old daughter complaining about me.
-- She lies, she's manipulative, she's a control freak, she uses guilt as her weapon, and Christianity as immunity.
-- She asked me to send her a cat by crating it and putting it on a 14 hour bus ride to Dallas/Ft Worth. :smile: .
My mother did the same thing with one christmas present, except she whipped out my present like in September, gave it to me and explained that I might as well take it because she wouldn't be speaking to me anymore. I just took the present and ended up getting another one at Christmas, when of course she was in fact still speaking to me. :roll: :roll: :roll:
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I was there I think....
arms flapping
chockers for lunch...
pall meadow .....
listening to jim morrison while I bagged
groceries at albertsons the mall in
Pinellas park....
naw it was just a dreammm..........
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fight on my birthday once because i was cutting the apple pieces for the pie too small, or too big, I can't remember.
i call her up (obligatory occasional phone call) and she goes into extended descriptions of what she had to eat or else some health problem. YAAWNN.
i brought up that incident where i broke my foot and she made me sit and wait, and she said "you broke it because you were late for school again." mmm hmm. i sure learned my lesson.
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On 2005-03-17 22:35:00, fka wrote:
"I still really don't understand, I really don't get what happened to me in Straight. I mean, what did they do to turn me into a Straightling. Did they do something that made me literally psychotic, or was I before and that made me extremely weak in there? Did previous abuse and neglect make it harder for me to see what was so wrong there? Has anyone else experienced paranoia to the extent that they would rather be homeless than live in an "exposed" place? I would like to figure this out because i seem consistently able to screw my life up and never get anywhere and also because i know this question is fairly central to everything i mean the way i have experienced my life and the way i conceive of myself. i mean, if i have a mental or emotional problem, or whatever, and you know, i think that feeling like you don't (or can't) exist is kind of a mental problem, then what happened, or was I always like this and Straight just made everything more painful. if someone reads my post and sees themself in them and the crashing and you found a way out of that it might help me."
i know what u mean, it's like our whole lives, from the time we are little kids we are socially conditioned(some might even call it brainwashed) to believe that America is the land of the free and the home of the brave. We are constantly told how lucky we are to live in a country where individuals rights are protected by a constitution and yet in the end it was all lies, the whole thing is a set-up. i know that, legally, costitutoinal rights don't kick in 'till the age of 18 but am i somehow less of a human being at the age of 16, if anything i am even more vulnerable at 16 than 18. When my naive parents signed me into the straight program and then refused to see me when i immediately requested a withdrawal conference i was left w/no way in hell to defend myself, even my own parents abandoned me. The betrayal by country and family was complete. Everything i had been raised to trust and respect turned on me w/a coldness i had never imagined. i was imprisoned w/out due process, i had no legal representation, i was never charged w/a crime(except later when i finally got so desperate that i stole a truck from where i had been working on 3rd phase, but that was 13 months after my intake, and so at that point i became court-ordered. Even then when my probation officer came to the building to check on me and asked me privately if i was o.k., if i wanted out he could get me out, i was so paranoid, so sure it was a trick, a set-up to get me to reveal myself that i just told him i was fine. in reality i was a wreck.)
After 23 months in straight i finally graduated. For years afterward i remained extremely paranoid. i was homeless off and on for years. At tmes i lived in my car. i made slow and steady progress toward improving my situation just by perserverence. Eventually i bought a brokendown shack in a flood plain for $500. It was a small little place w/a roof that leaked everywhere but over my bed, no electric and no running water. i used a woodstove for heat but the place was so drafty i was usually half frozen by dawn. i lived ther for about 5 years. It was real ROUGH. i was suicidal too. i thought about suicide all the time. The only thing that kept me alive was the love of my 5 year old daughter, who didn't live w/me, and knowing that she would need me around. Somehow i'm still here on this ground. Praise jah.
3 years ago i inherited my grandmothers' house in New Castle, PA, where i presently live. i still have alot of trouble dealing w/people(refer to my posting "the truth as i see it").
Straight was a gang rape. It was a betrayal of the most intimate kind. The very people and institutions who were supposed to protect us from harm delivered it upon us instead . The U.S government is just an organization of criminals, and what i learned from straight is that if they want you they'll come and get you. Yeah, i'm paranoid but i have good reason to be. Ever read 1984 by George Orwell. Dig it.
i admire your courageous honesty and your passion.
Who are the shins? Do u work w/ the horses on the farm? How do you feel about horse racing? Did u catch the Kentucky derby today?
"...send me dead flowers..."
-agana
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I dunno about everyone else but im so perinoid, I can not live in the same place for long and foil placed on the inside of my windows is great for all the people that try and look inside my home. My gaurd dog almost took down our neighbor.
My dream home is a house with an 8 ft brick wall around it with razor wire above it oh and when someone rings my door bell, a computerized voice comes on and tells me the hight, weight, sex, and hair color of the person.
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I never knew how lucky I was. I always thought I had it worse than most because my family got mired in this mindfuck when I was just 6 or 7 years old. But really that saved me a lot of trouble. That and having my dad around like an angry, leprichaun/mime; speaking and acting out subtle and not so subtle comentary on the whole thing. That's not to say that he never tasted the kool-aid. He did sometimes. But other times he spit it out and cursed it. That helped immensely and I doubt he even knew it.
See, by the time I landed on front row, none of this bullshit was a shock. I had had the luxury of taking my sweet time, too young to be the focus of it, watching more or less from the sidelines and secretly, privately drawing my own conclusions. It all sucked. And I didn't quite understand it all.
But none of it was a shock, except for two things that both came much later. First, when I found out how many of the big name, celebrity drug warriors have direct ties to The Seed, Straight and DFAF that set me back on my ear for a good long while. I had, by then (around `99 or so) come to terms and made peace w/ the idea that I was a touch paranoid, but the rest of the world was more-or-less ok. I often think I liked it better that way. Just how deep does this rabit hole go, anyway?
So next I started trying to contact other Program ppl. And I gradually discovered how many of them were so damaged by the whole thing and how much we all have in common. I didn't know what I was watching and what I took part in.
Again, I liked it better when it was just me. I can handle it. I can make the best of it. The world my kids inherit was still more-or-less OK, even if I wasn't exactly on top of my game wrt making my place in it. I'd just do my best to mitigate the damage done to me, try not to let it touch them and they'll improve on my work.
But this way, the way it really is, I owe a huge debt. If I had understood it just a little better back then, I would have played it differently. I thought everyone else either got brainwashed and it was their problem or, like me, just put up w/ the bullshit till they could make a break for it and let it all roll off.
So then I started looking for some way to make it all make sense. And I found it. It's simple, really. Brilliantly so. This problem of ours is no different from so many other times and places in history. The Nazis did it to their people (and I've since found out that the Büsh dynasty was very much involved in providing financial, political and material support to them at the time) The Holy Roman Catholic Church has a centuries long history of doing just about the same thing in Europe. The Shining Path cult in doing just about the same thing in So America; has been for some decades.
The simple truth is that the `50's never happened. The ideal "traditional" nuclear social/ecconomic unit was fiction. For thousands of years, people have lived, loved, fought and died despite all this fucked up shit. Some people know it and get along, others get along by studiously avoiding thinking about it. But, all in all, we get along.
Never mind how crazy you think you are. Just check out the lunatics around you! By comparison, you're probably quite sane.
They used to burn witches. Today we laugh at them. Today we jail people for marijuana. Tomorrow they'll laugh at us.
--Robert "Rosie" Rowbotham
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The reply posted 3 above here as anonymous is actually starry-eyed pirate, fomerly "agana". i just wanted to take credit and /or responsibility for my words.
_________________
If you would have justice in this world, then begin to see that a human being is not a means to some end. People are not commodities. When human beings are just to one another government becomes obsolete and real freedom is born; SPIRITUAL ANARCHY.