Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: Anonymous on December 27, 2004, 10:22:00 PM
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I am an attorney, and the reason no firms will take your case is because you are fighting a losing battle. It is absolutely hopeless. Yes, hopeless. And, Mel Sembler has much too much influence and power to ever be bothered my your alledged allegations.
The best thing you all can do for yourselves is give up and get over your troubles. I was in a similar program, Pathway Family Center, and if I would have held petty resentments against the program, I never would have made it through an undergraduate degree and law school.
Yes, bad things happened in Pathway, and even though Pathway is more recent than Straight, there is virtually no chance of any attorney winning in court. In regards to Straight, you have even less of a chance because of the years that have gone by. Also, Mel's son and grandson were both in similar programs, and Mel, using this fact to back up his testimony, will claim he did not know of the abuses that occured in Straigh or any other programs he may have been affiliated with, and he will claim that he would never have subjected his familiy to these abuses; the Judge WILL believe him...trust me.
In regards to prosecuting former staff members of your programs, you have to remember that they will claim you were all abusive, drug using, lying, irresponsible adolescents. They will claim that any "abuse" was used to necessarily restrain violent clients. The only possible way to get your programs, staff or administrators of programs into court would be if somebody died or had serious physical injury while in a program; and this injury/death must be within the last, oh, say 3 years to be safe. Surely no more than 5. I'm not sure what the statute of limitations is on abuses in your respective states, but the ones I'm familiar with are no more than 5-7 years. Claiming any kind of mental abuse is extremely hard to prove and will be a waste of money.
What happened to us is terrible, but you all need to move on. Don't let these programs ruin your lives anymore than they already have. Can't you see that you are doing yourselves no justice by sticking in this forum and bitching day in and day out? You are fighting a losing battle and wasting your lives. Move on and forget. Do something better with your lives.
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I wonder how long before someone calls this guy a "Semblerite?"
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Glad you arent my lawyer...
Due to the sheer magnitude of the evil doings of the likes of Miller Newton, Mel and Betty Sembler, and the open spawns today, there most certainly will be a case. While it may not be as obvious to lawyers such as yourself but it is obvious to many victims. Victims will always be victims, the question is if they will be honored with the justice due to them. Incidents such as wrongful death, caused by the modality used at straight inc and other coercive treatment facilities currently treating adolescents, (for hire by parents) has a longer statute of limitations. Also, seriously and nonetheless criminal and abusive policies causing permanent or even temporary physical/psychological wounds, damage, trauma or the like, may encourage potential lawsuits. Survivors of this type of treatment must have hope. Until the last program that uses these methods is closed, the statute of limitations will never expire for everyone.
At the very least, the treatment modality itself is a viable target, thus the programs that use it will close when the modality is banned.
:cool:
key word: hope
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In her first post, Anonymous writes:
"I am an attorney, and the reason no firms will take your case is because you are fighting a losing battle. It is absolutely hopeless. Yes, hopeless. And, Mel Sembler has much too much influence and power to ever be bothered my your alledged allegations." -end
You're an attorney? Lmbmfao.
Well, shit man, I'm motherfucking Jesus Christ if you're spelling is thaaaaat bad: "...influence and power to ever be bothered 'by' your 'alleged'...". A bar passing attorney would at the very least know how to spell alleged, you ninny.
Welcome aboard; troll! ::heart:: ::heart::
::heart:: ::heart:: ::heart:: [ This Message was edited by: Animals on 2004-12-28 01:51 ]
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I know. "Alledged allegations"????????? WTF?? :lol: :lol:
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No hope?
http://www.fornits.com/anonanon/article ... 320-10.htm (http://www.fornits.com/anonanon/articles/200003/20000320-10.htm)
Look, I don't care if the Semblers ever shed a tear or suffer any hardship for what they've done. All I want is to help prevent them and others like them from doing more of the same. Lawsuites are good for that ( http://www.fornits.com/anonanon/article ... 320-10.htm (http://www.fornits.com/anonanon/articles/200003/20000320-10.htm) ). Investigative journalism is helpful ( http://www.newtimesbpb.com/issues/2004- ... ature.html (http://www.newtimesbpb.com/issues/2004-12-09/news/feature.html) and http://straightkids.com/ (http://straightkids.com/) ). Fiction based on reality might be helpful ( http://www.amandacraig.com/pages/journa ... _clean.htm (http://www.amandacraig.com/pages/journalism/come_clean.htm) ) The industry has used daytime talk for recruiting for years now and, finally, Montel comes around w/ the up-shot; shooting the first of two (at least) episodes on Straight and other similar programs.
And through discussions like this one, we've crossed paths w/ other folk who have had remarkably similar experiences. Here we have a chance to compare notes, get some insight into what happened to us and figure out how to help make the situation a little better for our kids and grandkids.
You're probably not there yet. That's fine. You're young. Civics, to you, is a career course not a personal matter of responsability. When you see your kids trot off to school and contemplate just what system we have in place to educate and protect them as they grow up and away from your sheltering arms, then it'll start to dawn on you just how personal civics really is.
"Distrust all in whom the impulse to punish is powerful."--Friedrich Nietzsche
War is God?s way of teaching Americans geography.
--Ambrose Bierce (died 1914)
_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
Seed sibling `71 - `80
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
10/80 - 10/82
Anonymity Anonymous
Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps.
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All you have to say about my statement is criticize a word I accidently misspelled? Wow, you truely are a bunch of nonsensical morons. I tr to help, but of course , you stick to your guns thinking you can make a diference. When you do, I'd love to hear about it, but wait, there are about 10,00 pages of your bitching rubbish, and what do you know, you have accomplished nothing...yet? Yeah right. Antigen, you're right, I am young, but I have moved past my issues with treatment, and I know live a pretty damn good life. Maybe you should think about doing the same. You are all making fools out of yourselves. I saw the petty "protests" you have set up (at holocaust museums for God's sake?, and it seems that you have all accomplished nothing in your lives, nevertheless the courts.
Insult me if you like, but just for the record, I graduated from St. John's Law School, and I make 86,00 dollars a year, which is damn good for only practicing for three years. I also graduated in the top 5% of my class, am married to a beautiful woman, and I have never lost a case. What do you do for a living animals? Let me guess, you research "abusive" treatment centers and seek to dedicate your life to closing them down. Yawn.
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Oh, just to save you the trouble I spelled the word "difference" the wrong way. I guess I am a really shitty attorney. Bye.
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no, it wasn't the mis-spellings for me. It was the use of the words "alledged allegations". No atty. I have EVER worked for, even the ones right out of school would say anything like that.
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What year did you graduate, Mr. 86,00 ? lol.
No, I don't close down institutions, I go and find people who've been in one or two of them who've forgotten how to spell and keep talking shit about degrees that they don't have. Once I find them I rag on them cos it makes me feel better about my yawning life. :smile:
I think you're not an attorney, maybe you wish you were one. I imagine most attorneys probably don't bother coming here once they see some of the vile smarm and happenstance on the boards, maybe not. So like, what year did you graduate at 5% of the top of your class at St. John's? I know a few attorneys from there - maybe we could figure out if you're being facetious.
Any person who makes 86,00 (you misprinted this number, along with the number 10,00) should probably take some of those composition and English classes I keep talking about that are available for rehash at your local community college. Generally speaking, the credits cost less than they would at St. John's or major colleges and would do any attorney some good especially if their defendant were burdened by the responsibility of showing properly spelled proof on paper. For real, children and criminals have been sent back into bad situations simply because the attorney forgot to compose a sentence correctly. Check that mess, luv.
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On 2004-12-28 13:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
I graduated from St. John's Law School, and I make 86,00 dollars a year, which is damn good for only practicing for three years. I also graduated in the top 5% of my class, am married to a beautiful woman, and I have never lost a case.
What area(s) of law do you practice or specialize in?
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Is that 10.00 pages and 86.00 a year? WOW, you really ARE Perry Mason!! :lol: :lol:
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Antigen, you're right, I am young, but I have moved past my issues with treatment, and I know live a pretty damn good life. Maybe you should think about doing the same. You are all making fools out of yourselves.
What makes you think that the little you may know about me through what I post here tells you one hundreth of what my life is about?
I'm actually pretty busy, but this is an area of interest of mine at least equal to heirloom gardening (which can reach obsessive levels, if you know some dedicated gardeners)
And I didn't mean to insult you. Don't know why you'd take anything I said as an insult, unless you lump me together w/ other posters. I don't know most of these people any better than you do. And I respect that you have finished law school and started a family and career. Some days I wish I had been more ambitious. Other days, I'm glad I haven't been. No judgement on that.
That you're young and have a lot to learn is a given. You're young. Everyone who's young has a lot to learn. It's a given.
That you think that your experience and knowledge so far is adequate to instruct people twice your age who have your experience and then some in some areas (of contention) is raw hubris. I'm only schoolin' ya', son. No offense intended.
You say there is but one way to worship the Great Spirit. If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it?
--Chief Red Jacket, Seneca Indian Chieftain
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I seriously doubt this guy is a lawyer..and what does you having "A beautiful wife" have to do with your credibility?
If you were telling the truth youd post your real name...or at least a user name to stand behind your comments..
But you arent and you dont therefore my point is moot...
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Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Freedom has a thousand charms to show, That slaves, howe'er contented, never know.
William Cowper, a British Christian poet & hymn writer (18th century)
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So attorney. . . how can you say what you do without knowing the "fullness" of the straight holocaust? What do you know about the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO) Act, Title 18, United States Code, Sections 1961-1968. What do you know or not, about colusion between government (state and federal) with the Straight, Inc corporation? This racketering allowed straight to remain up and running, despite the proven cases of child abuse, et al for over 17 years?
Remember Trent Lott? Big guy, now small guy. Sembler will get his. We will get our case heard. I have watied 25+ years.
The question is "where does the money come from"? That known fact is soon to be revealed. It is coming.
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One more!! It should be: "and I NOW live a pretty damn good life", NOT "KNOW." duh.
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On 2004-12-27 19:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I am an attorney, and the reason no firms will take your case is because you are fighting a losing battle. It is absolutely hopeless. Yes, hopeless. And, Mel Sembler has much too much influence and power to ever be bothered my your alledged allegations.
The best thing you all can do for yourselves is give up and get over your troubles. I was in a similar program, Pathway Family Center, and if I would have held petty resentments against the program, I never would have made it through an undergraduate degree and law school.
Yes, bad things happened in Pathway, and even though Pathway is more recent than Straight, there is virtually no chance of any attorney winning in court. In regards to Straight, you have even less of a chance because of the years that have gone by. Also, Mel's son and grandson were both in similar programs, and Mel, using this fact to back up his testimony, will claim he did not know of the abuses that occured in Straigh or any other programs he may have been affiliated with, and he will claim that he would never have subjected his familiy to these abuses; the Judge WILL believe him...trust me.
In regards to prosecuting former staff members of your programs, you have to remember that they will claim you were all abusive, drug using, lying, irresponsible adolescents. They will claim that any "abuse" was used to necessarily restrain violent clients. The only possible way to get your programs, staff or administrators of programs into court would be if somebody died or had serious physical injury while in a program; and this injury/death must be within the last, oh, say 3 years to be safe. Surely no more than 5. I'm not sure what the statute of limitations is on abuses in your respective states, but the ones I'm familiar with are no more than 5-7 years. Claiming any kind of mental abuse is extremely hard to prove and will be a waste of money.
What happened to us is terrible, but you all need to move on. Don't let these programs ruin your lives anymore than they already have. Can't you see that you are doing yourselves no justice by sticking in this forum and bitching day in and day out? You are fighting a losing battle and wasting your lives. Move on and forget. Do something better with your lives. "
Im glad you are all cool and stuff now because you have a wife and family and an electronic tollway pass....but, as far as I am concerned, if some woman can win millions for spilling hot coffee on HERSELF these days.....well, stranger things have happened.
Tell me you have never defended someone who was guilty, or helped to convict someone who was innocent? I am willing to bet your manager slippers and your wife's junior leauge cookbook that you have done both. When a religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its professors are obliged to call for help of the civil power, 'tis a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.
--Benjamin Franklin, American Founding Father, author, and inventor
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On 2004-12-29 18:53:00, Carmel wrote:
Im glad you are all cool and stuff now because you have a wife and family and an electronic tollway pass....but, as far as I am concerned, if some woman can win millions for spilling hot coffee on HERSELF these days.....well, stranger things have happened.
Tell me you have never defended someone who was guilty, or helped to convict someone who was innocent? I am willing to bet your manager slippers and your wife's junior leauge cookbook that you have done both.
Carmel, he's not represented anyone who was guilty or helped to convict someone who was innocent because he's not an attorney.....the guys a fake. "Alledged allegations"....that still cracks me up. :lol:
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Hey, ass. Why are you stick on the term "Alleged allegations?" These words are used together all of the time you fucking idiot. I think it's great how someone will post something semi-intellegent on this site, and everyone will take their turn pointing out stupid ass shit. I am a court reporter (yes, it is a crummy job), but I hear people use the phrase "alleged allegations" all of the time.
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Animals, compared to this 'attorney' you surely must know you don't quite add up. Get a life.
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On 2004-12-31 15:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I hear people use the phrase "alleged allegations" all of the time. "
Well then they would be idiots too. Look up redundant in the dictionary.
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How about this. The guy is who he says he is; a fairly young lawyer. Still idealistic and out to make a big and lasting impression on the world w/ his relatively recently acquired degree and bar#.
All he said was that a lawsuit is not going to end w/ the Semblers on the front page in handcuffs on the way to take up residence next to Martha Stewart. And that's true. The Semblers could buy, sell and trade options on Mrs. Steward in a single day.
But that doesn't mean that 1) lawsuits are not worth pursuing or that 2) lawsuits are the only thing worth pursuing.
I don't see what everyone's all upset w/ each other about. We can discuss this if you want or not if it's uninteresting to you.
No worries
:wave: All I ask is equal freedom. When it is denied, as it always is, I take it anyhow.
--H.L. Mencken
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yes, all you idiots are arguing about a stupid phrase (which I have heard and one that would not fall under redundancy) instead of taking on anything the lawyer really said.
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"Alleged" and "allegations" do not meant the same thing.
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this is wrong. we already understood what Anonymous Fake Attorney was saying. Her composition was false. The fake attorney's point is being faithfully crucified because the fake attorney can't even spell correctly or use accurate composition - that anyone is accustomed to by real life lawyers. Even the tense that she used was wrong, her whole demeanor in the first post was serious and not sarcastic, trying to analyze certain facts. But the improper use of irony and accidental use of the terms 'alleged allegations' is just dumb on her part.
See the base word for each term: 'Legate'. The words are no different but merely in adjective and noun usage, this being based purely on her form and style.
Indeed, its point seemed to be that we should all grow up and bla bla bla and that Sembler somehow is not still a child abuser. But it would be anything that hasn't already been written over a hundred times by those who are too scared to ID themselves or give any checkable, reliable references here. Top that off with horrendous writing skills and you get the same trolls that I like to pool myself in with and vuala: more smarm and crap for the masses!
Final Grade: Z
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Animals, you are not smart, but you are a loser, so keep your head up.
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how cute, like a child with no name or family, for a loser to say to someone else when they can't even ID themselves. Back your name calling up with a name, nutmouth.
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You failed to answer my question about RICO. RICO tolls the statute of limitations. He is not untouchable. We will have our day. As I said earlier, I have waited 25 years (now 26 and a few days). I won't have to wait much longer. Thats a fact, ain't it Maria and Englander. We will eat your lunch. And at the next hearing, Maria, I will snap more and more pics of you.
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On 2004-12-31 16:08:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2004-12-31 15:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I hear people use the phrase "alleged allegations" all of the time. "
Well then they would be idiots too. Look up redundant in the dictionary. "
I guess it could be correct, if he were talking about allegations that he wasn't sure had been made. Alleged allegations. Or what about alleged allegations that were also alleged themselves???
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On 2004-12-27 19:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I am an attorney, and the reason no firms will take your case is because you are fighting a losing battle. It is absolutely hopeless. Yes, hopeless. And, Mel Sembler has much too much influence and power to ever be bothered my your alledged allegations.
This would imply that there was a question as to whether or not allegations have been made. As you can see, they obviously have.
Good point Jane. Now all resident grammar nazis (only kidding, self included) can relax. :smile:
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Monty Python or Dr. Seuss?
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Seuss of course.
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Oh, what the hell. I'm in the mood.
"I am an attorney, and the reason no firms will take your case "
1. It has not been factually established that "no" firms will take our "case".
2. I believe our "case" is inaccurate -- it should be our "cases."
"is because you are fighting a losing battle. It is absolutely hopeless. Yes, hopeless. "
3. It is unprofessional for a lawyer to make such a statement regarding a case that they have not thoroughly researched.
"And, Mel Sembler has much too much influence and power to ever be bothered my your alledged allegations. "
4. Bigger men have been brought down before.
" In regards to Straight, you have even less of a chance because of the years that have gone by."
5. I don't think you have done your homework.
" Also, Mel's son and grandson were both in similar programs, and Mel, using this fact to back up his testimony, will claim he did not know of the abuses that occured in Straigh or any other programs he may have been affiliated with, and he will claim that he would never have subjected his familiy to these abuses; the Judge WILL believe him...trust me.
6. Considering the unprofessionalism of your other "legal" advice I am not inclined to trust your opinion in the matter.
"In regards to prosecuting former staff members of your programs, you have to remember that they will claim you were all abusive, drug using, lying, irresponsible adolescents. They will claim that any "abuse" was used to necessarily restrain violent clients. "
7. This may be accurate, but then again, there are many former staff members who regret their involvement in Straight and in the abuse that went on there, who I believe will testify on our behalf. Also, I believe there are many clients who will testify under oath as to the circumstances surrounding restraints.
"The only possible way to get your programs, staff or administrators of programs into court would be if somebody died or had serious physical injury while in a program;"
8. There have been many suicides, and several known cases of serious and lasting physical damage.
"and this injury/death must be within the last, oh, say 3 years to be safe. Surely no more than 5. I'm not sure what the statute of limitations is on abuses in your respective states, but the ones I'm familiar with are no more than 5-7 years. Claiming any kind of mental abuse is extremely hard to prove and will be a waste of money."
9. It is clear that you have not done your homework.
10. Regarding the rest of your advice, which was of a more personal nature, I would only say to each his own.
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I thought I had animals pegged as the biggest idiot, but you take the cake.
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Your anal birth must have hurt your mom awhile back, eh? Go ahead, deny it.
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I'm thinking he was hatched. The egg probley did come out of a chickens ass. :rofl:
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Art. 12.05. [183] [231] [221] Absence from State and time of
pendency of indictment, etc., not computed
(a) The time during which the accused is absent from the state shall
not be computed in the period of limitation.