Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: mental torture made me li on October 21, 2004, 10:38:00 PM
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[ This Message was edited by: mental torture made me like this on 2005-06-19 09:23 ]
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My principles did not get Lost . That is why I spent most of my time in Straight on the floor, hungry, thirsty, quiet, sitting on my hands, lacking medical care, not seeing my own reflection, no extras, etc.. and fighting those who's principles were lost. I often wondered why most caved.... Cause yea, would you restrain a classmate ? Funny thing is had we all banded together then , we could have beaten Straight...< snickers>
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hi withdraw. I would like to know what it was that gave you the strength and determination to do that, how you kept from giving in -- did you know something about Straight before you went in? Was it something about the way you were raised, or people in your life?
Myself I responded as predicted by the master plan: sit someone on front row when they come in and pretty much ignore them for three days, and they will come around...* I think I was having a hard time with everything before I was put in Straight, and then there was this incredible mental pressure, and if I just gave in and believed that it was all my fault, as they were saying in Straight, that I had problems (instead of incredibly creative ways of coping with my life as I knew it -- bad home scene, etc) -- if I just gave in, it would be an answer and a relief to have an answer and a relief to acknowledge how rough things were in my life...
I really really wish that I had been like you, Withdraw. It still causes me pain to know that I gave in. This is part of dealing with all of the pain caused by my time there.
*the master plan I speak of is a known brainwashing technique, which I read in an old senate(?) document on Wes's site a long time ago, maybe I will dig it up again so other people can find it.
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Im not real sure, I have always been a very rightous person. I do not bend easily. So I in turn had alot of negative feelings about myself because I didnt "give in" . Everyone around me was so I figured there was something wrong w/ me. Staff use to tell me " you know a normal person w/o a drug problem would just give in and conform" So many Lies ! But for whatever the reason I just couldn't let them take my soul. Funny looking back now, They did take alot of it tho. Just being there watching it all go on, somehow messed me up pretty bad. Then to get out and no one could understand what I was saying about straight just led me to disassociate from it . Like it was a bad dream. I have so much compassion for the people who were in there. I still feel their pain along w/ mine. I will never forget the horror. Like I've posted beofre, I didn't wanna hurt other people in there, so in that I did "give in" I couldn't just randomly lash out. Sometimes today I wish I did just keep running for the door no matter who it hurt.
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Hey anon, I'm glad you said that. I've been reading some posts of people that are apparently stronger willed than I and they boast about how they refused to participate. For me, I felt I had to survive, and for me I new "resistance was futile"
My pain and the pain of many on here stems from what we had to do to survive, and how that burned us also. In fact, After my first month they reamed me for telling the truth...now my life was hell day AND night. They would keep me awake and the military showers and worst of all the disdain everyone had for me. It felt like a bad acid trip. I was never the same again. No, I was not strong enough to resist it. I was beaten. I was detoxing from PCP and alcohol for christ's sake!
You're not alone.
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well y'all, I hate to say this, but I did give in. I went in at 17, turned 18 six days after I "enrolled". Was threatened with a court order if I did not enter willingly. I was told that I could leave when I turned 18. To my disappointment, I was not allowed to leave. So on my 6th day (my birthday), asked to leave was told no and promptly bolted for an exit. Of course I was gang tackled and restrained on the concrete floor by 5 goons. These assholes then got to fuck w/me for about 2 hours or so while I was pinned to the ground. That was the beginning of my 37 day fight. It tried to bolt one more time and then just settled into being a jerk as we were called back then. To break me, the staff sent a few guys further along to fuck with me non stop. I got to sleep on a terrazo floor for that 37 day period with just a sheet. No pillow, blanket or mattress. I was put on food rations, and a mind fuck. My oldcomer's loved to kick me to wake me up. One of 'em even would beat off in front of me and told me it was cause he loved himself so much.....YUCK! Around day 40 on my first phase, I realized that many many kids were not going home and I got scared that I'd waste away. So, I played the game and went home on my 57th day, if I remember correctly.
Why did I give in? I wanted to go home, go back to school, sleep in a bed, eat decent food and and drink water at home, I got tired of being beat up in group, at my oldcomers house and at the drop offs. I remember being at the 85 day jerks house as a drop off and his asshold brother would beat me with a pillow while he put baseballs or someother very hard objects in the pillow case. I knew that I would be treated far better at my house, so I gave in. I fucking hated that place.
BTW - the 85 day jerk was ALWAYS good to me. He actually tried to protect me from his evil brother. Thanks Bob - I will always be indebted to you.
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On 2004-10-21 23:07:00, Withdraw wrote:
"Staff use to tell me " you know a normal person w/o a drug problem would just give in and conform" So many Lies !"
You're right, there were so many lies. You know if you had given in right away they would have told you that you were full of it then too, trying to manipulate your way out. It didn't really matter what approach you took, it was always wrong at first.
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I never thought of it before as days, but on 180+ days ,I was still on day ZERO w/ no T&R and still on consequences. Now after posting and getting out some of the anger, it's kinda funny to me in a weird way . I did beat them in the way I had to-to survive also.I remember I felt so bad for some of my host families and some of my Oldcomers, It musta been a huge Pain in the butt to have me as a newcomer on constant watch and consequences,LOL. Although there were alot of staff and some oldcomers who got off on the fact they could and were encouraged treat me badly and no one cared. =(
Because I hardly spoke, I was often Thinking alot " What made these people want to treat me and so many others badly, They didn't know me. I didn't have a drug problem." Ya ' know I dont even recall anyone who was way Hardcore drug users in Straight, but I hear some of you say you were. I can respect that. It was so very confusing and has hanged the way I think of complete strangers. I know the deep,dark,abusive ways of humans all to well.
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Doh! That Anon post was me, But I am sure most of you knew that ..
PS. I cant edit my spelling error in the anon post on ** Changed * instead of hanged. last paragraph, lol
Peace![ This Message was edited by: Withdraw on 2004-10-22 18:38 ]
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dear Withdraw, that is interesting that you had time to think. I guess by not playing the game at all, you were not concerned with being good all day, either looking the right way, thinking about what you were going to talk about, how to respond to someone else, etc.
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Actually by like 5 months of being un responsive to their program, most had just let me do whatever , as long as I wasn't running or hurting someone. Like they all just gave up on me. That was the best time in Straight, I was all alone in a big crowd, but people stopped picking me out.I had alot of time in my head, and no one cared. Cept the weekly review I was always stood up during that.I'd usually yell back , get thrown to the floor, then it was time to go to the host house. I just became so disascoiated by that time, it no longer mattered what they did to me. Although now I know that time in there has left me not quite right....
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Withdraw, do you remember a misbehaver named Kelly that was in while you were there?
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I'll take that as a yes... J/k.. :lol:
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[ This Message was edited by: mental torture made me like this on 2005-06-19 09:24 ]
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I wish sometimes now that I hadnt complied at all. Although, I still remember how some of those kids became so far removed and how painful the looks on their faces were after months and months of being on the floor. As much as I wish I could have been "stronger" than the program....but there is still a deep painful sadness I observed in that choice that I may have avoided to some degree.
My reasons for complying were very simple. I wasnt a drug user by any stretch really, however, I was very lonely and had just come out of 8 years of insane tyranny under my stepfather. I WANTED to make things right with and for my mother. I loved her very much when it came down to it, and I saw this as a chance to make it all right. Little did I know that SHE was actually just as fucked as I was....not to mention at the very least 80% responsible for my survival mode behaviour previous to Straight. It took me 9 long months to realize that I had indeed changed and healed, but that the situation around me in the Program continued to degenerate.
When I ran away, it wasnt because I was FOS or even because I wanted to leave the program, I wantd to suceed at something for once....at the time, I really wanted to be happier, period. But I saw that what I believed in had all been a bunch of lies. I dont attribute my compliance as weakness. I had spent the better part of my life not compliying. I saw it as an honest attempt at healing that I knew I sorely needed. Too bad the choice of environments was so terribly wrong.the war on drugs is but one manifestation, albeit a very dramatic one, of the great moral contests of our age -- the struggle between two diametrically opposed images of man: between man as responsible moral agent, 'condemned' to freedom, benefiting and suffering from the consequences of his actions; and man as irresponsible child, unfit for freedom, 'protected' from its risks by agents of the omnicompetent state.
--Thomas Szasz
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Pietra, I know those people. Kim S, right? Ran away with Heather together once. Kim ended up being a roomate with my step sis after straight in Colorado.
Jill...was she African American? I remember her having as really hard time, like us all.
[ This Message was edited by: shady grove on 2005-09-20 16:15 ]
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Jill...was she African American?
You mean black? :grin:
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Sorry no content from last post...I typed it , I really did.LOL, it went Poof!
No, I dont remember that name Kelly . There was a Kelly R.
When I was in Straight , Yep I thought of those who Complied as ~weak~.. then I grew up. I realized that we all did what ever it took to survive, knowing as individuals it was the best way for us. Like I said before I often "gamed " with the thought of there being something wrong w/ me because I could not comply... Sure I look back now and realize in small ways I had complied,and mostly removed myself from what was going on.
In the end I have great Honor for all of us who endured Straight however we had to.
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Actually kind of a dark brown/mocha. However, many americans with skin of this melanotic content prefer the term "African American", so oblige them. Is that so wrong?
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hey shady grove, don't know Kim's last name, but I hope that she was doing alright when you saw her in Colorado. Heather F. -- is that who you are thinking of?
did I mention this was springfield 87? I can't remember.
Jill who I am thinking of was not African American.
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Actually kind of a dark brown/mocha. However, many americans with skin of this melanotic content prefer the term "African American", so oblige them. Is that so wrong?
Whatever; I'd say the term is innacurate at best. (How about mixed or mulatto if that's the case?) Many blacks prefer the term "black" and find "African American" to be cumbersome, pretentious, and just silly, so I oblige them.
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just call me Pale American, or more accurately, Pale and Blotchy American. mixed paleness/blotchiness. That's why I have a bag over my head.
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I think at first I thought the misbehaviors were stronger than everybody else, and then I changed my mind, not really changed my mind, but just started to forget what I really thought about everything. I started really trying to work the program and became convinced I would die if I left. Now I think it's not really about being strong or weak, at all. You do what you need to do to survive.
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So your point is some people like African American and some like black.
OK so you mean they, like the rest of the world can have different opinions?
So your saying all ethnic people are not the same after all? (Oh no I added a third term didn't I)
Wow and to think I would have NEVER known that unless you shared...Thanks soooooo much!
Love YOU Froderick!!
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Thanks anon! :grin:
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If "resistance is futile" I must have wasted 7 months fighting only to be removed to the psych ward to decompress. How long was the average phaser and family in the program? I took the shorter, harsher path to the endgame. Few did.
If your idea of "survival" includes doing harm to a peer (restraint,etc.) and turning your home into a prison for other kids, then you have no honor or personal integrity. That is collusion, not survival. There is no gray line here.
I'm not claiming superiority or trying to be arrogant; I am proud that I didn't fall into ranks with a clan of mindfucked snitches. I was fortunately gifted with 3D vision(ie. mindset):
1)Determined
2)Decisive
3)Deliberate
I saw through the program BS from day one and didn't fear the consequences of my resolve. They had no leverage on me and knew it. So did I. Jason
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hi misbehaver,
I am interested in what your family was like. Did they withdraw you, or did Straight send you on? Did they back you up at some point when they realized how bad it was? Did you already know other people who had been in Straight, and so have some insight into the place when you first walked in?
Also, what happened to you in Straight as a result of, I am presuming, sitting still and refusing to "motivate"?
(When I was in, there was a point at which several "misbehavers" were allowed to sit there, doing nothing, but they had to sit several chairs apart and in the back row.)
I am just trying to understand what gave you this 3D vision and not other people.
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I was adopted and used that fact to become a manipulative shithead. How many parents would let Santa bring their 14 yr old son a .45?
I got outta control and scared my folks; they thought Straight was the only rehab tough enough to kick my ass. It did. I was plenty miserable, but still 1)Determined (to fight). I did.
I was not pulled, but dragged to a psych ward after being threatened with transfer to Boston.
2)Decisive (get nasty fast or be sent to a place where my parents couldn't be manipulated). I planned and executed my exit from the program.
{see older post "Live at Last"}
Become 3)Deliberate and make it happen realtime. It worked and the psych staff were caring and helpful as I "decompressed" and returned home. So much for being court ordered.
That's the extent of my 3D vision. Kick ass, get home. No omnipotent guidance. My parents played into the staff's hand until they realized it was OVER. It was as though our family had been unburdened of some great shame or disgrace.
Early on, I was a regular on the floor and took some cheap shots, later I could see that most of the phasers/host homes were as miserable as I was. They kinda let some MBer's "relax"; one fine exec staff member even gave me a back rub during exec rap. I was on my way out. Game over.
Funny thing, being sent to my own home as a newcomer (seeing my home as prison) only strengthened my will. That experience, among others, forged me into the man I am. Jason
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I was fifteen years old and had been on the street for 2 years. You're damned right I had no honor or personal integrity. I had no idea what the concepts were. Straight would have been a great place to teach me these things, but alas, I digress...
I was thrown in an environment of intense peer pressure, of which most succumb. Kudos for not. You're a brave person.
There is a gray area, however, there always is. Everyone of us kept our integrity and true selves somewhere hidden. We all had our private forms of rebellion.
For me, it was never allowing myself to become violent to others no matter how mad or hurt I was. I do not beleive in hurting others and I never intentionally did. As a misbehaver, I simply turned into an eel when I was angry. How's that for the high road?
I briefly tried to work the program and move on off first phase. This was a cummulutive total of 2 months out of the 22 months I was in there. Anytime I got off first phase, fear gripped me unitl I ran away. I couldn't make the program work for me like so many around me could. Sure I yelled at people, desperately trying to believe I meant it and they deserved it, but everyone knew I was a faker. For those I traumatized, the guilt still haunts me.
But when you're scared and alone and really do want some kind of help, going along with the group is a form of survival. Beats being stood up in front of 200 people, half of them female and have someone tell everyone that you're like a crab louse, or that you masturbate, or that you're a pervert, etc.
Humiliation may be one of the most effective brainwashing techniques. Look at abu ghraib prison.
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S.G., maybe you're correct about a "grey area" in Straight. There were some kids who'd misbehave, change, move on and cop out; then do it all over again and again and... Never seeming to be accepted by either peer group. Chameleons.
I'm not saying that at 15 I had a strong grasp on the concepts of honor or integrity. What I did know is that if something felt wrong, it probably was. I got that feeling from day one at Straight. I didn't care if they stood me up 20 times a day and tossed insults, I felt morally superior and derived strength from that fact. What were they gonna do? Toss me into a caldron and boil me alive? I just didn't fear them and fear was a large part of what kept kids and their families anchored to the program. Jason
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Well, call me a snitch if you like...however, I very rarely ever restrained anyone, maybe two or three times. I was the target of several physical attacks from kids which I did not come away from unscathed.
And I didnt have a host home of my own.....I was from out of town and my host sister took great satisfaction in using me as slave labor in her house (one of the deciding factors of my escape).
Anyway, I dont see honor in integrity in either choice. Being in that Program period left zero room for either of the concepts.
I saw plenty of misbehaving kids who made life a hell for good hearted kids, and many mean spirited kids make life hell for good hearted misbehavers.
Straight used our adolescent ability to manipulate and connive as a weapon, a tool of fear....and misbehaving was no small part of that dynamic.
Infidel: In New York, one who does not believe in the Christian religion, in Constantinople, one who does.
--Ambrose Bierce
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I have to agree the strenght in knowing I was not going to conform kept me alive. It was about integrity and honor, I would stand up and say that over and over. I guess that is why they finally kinda ~let me rot~, I also didnt spend over 6 months in there, so what I did worked to get me out. either way I was left scarred forever.
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The insight you were able to have in there was really awesome. I think I might've actually thought there was a boiling cauldron somewhere. They put me on those 7 consequences after I was in there a month, and I tried to get in line real fast. But it wasn't b/c they were all that bad, I just hated having everyone I passed as I was going to piss look at me as like I was dogshit. And then stand me up and tell me so. And this was all b/c I was BEING honest. After a month I remembered that the night before I went in straight I used my asthma inhaler as a makeshift bowl to smoke pot in. It ended up in the med cart b/c it was in my coat when I was admitted. When I told them, the wole place freaked out b/c "i brought drugs in this sacred place".
Took me in a room, told me to sit, then pulled the chair out. Then the screaming, one guy after another. Big guys. I kept saying I was sorry, but they wouldn't listen. I had no idea what I did wrong. "This guy brought drugs into your group! What do you have to say to this guy?"
I think that set me up for a mind fuck that has never ended. I actually went in there reluctantly with the resolve that I would try to get help. Might as well, I needed it and I was here. This is the kind of help I began to receive. If my dad only knew.
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Hi Geoffrey, that is awful to think about what they did to you. I do not know what was going on with other people when they were able to get in someone else's face and yell at them like that. I tried it once, more like from across the room, but I totally had no clue what to say except what I had heard other people say. I don't think I was good at that part.
So, I wonder if the guys who yelled at you were totally doing it because they felt put on the spot in there and had to make a good show. Can you imagine one of them saying "um, guys, can we chill out a little here? guys? okay, well, I'm not really into this, so I'm going to step out." I mean, can you imagine?
Or, they might have been really really mad. Who knows. Maybe some people were better yellers than me because they got yelled at more at home.
I hope it doesn't seem like I am just talking around what is probably an awful memory for you. More in my next post.
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Talk away. It's fine. I finally got the nerve up to start yelling. I would pretned to be pissed off. This was when I thought, "ok, I'm gonna make myself do this. Again, I wanted help. I was crazy. Yes, to get out also, but it was now almost 2 years. I had created a little familiar institutional environment for myself, but I wanted a change. So I would confront. I found I had to just stop thinking about what I was saying, kinda like inprov in theatre. And just say it as loud as possible. But the staff knew I didn't know what I was doing. They would often sit me down in mid-rant. I was jelly the whole time in there, everyone knew this wasn't me.
But you bring up something that I have mentioned before. These evil, twisted, monstrous guys that were screaming at me, were children also. In fact, I bet many had been screamed at in the beginning. (I'm finding out on fornits' that they had). So how can I be angry? I mean I am, but I also remember that they were victims, too. This is a tough concept for many on this forum, so I'll not press it.
And yes. To answere your original question, we are just weird.
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but weirder in large numbers