Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones => Topic started by: CEDU IS A CULT on August 22, 2004, 11:52:00 AM
-
I was just exploring one of the worst memories at CEDU.
I remember in the SUMMIT (6 day workshop) Rudy was playing some crazy loud music. He had paired us all off with our best friends. My partner was a guy named Sean.
He started giving the same old speech he'd been pounding into our heads over the last 2 days- screaming into our ears "Do NOT hold back!! You MUST give 100 percent for this to work! Don't rip yourself off by not going ALL the WAY!!" It was all very intense and we were buying it hook line and sinker.
Then we paired off and I was instructed to bring my right hand back as far as I could. On the count of 1...2...3...and the word commence- I was to strike Sean as hard as I could slapping him in the face. (I guess he was trying to say this was how we treat eachother)
I was fucking in a panic. I didn't want to hit my best friend, but everyone else was prepped and ready to do it. We were all panicking and scared shitless. I had heard rumours from older students that the Summit had a really insane moment- but to trust Rudy and do whatever he says because it was worth it!
Was I really going to have to strike my buddy?
So here came the countdown to the mental mind fuck.
1...2...3.......................(Noooooooo!!!!!)
"give your partner a hug."
Okay, so you're saying no harm, no foul.
Wrong. I swear to you and I really believe I speak for most of us that were there. If Rudy had said commence, with no doubt in my mind, I would have struck Sean with ALL my might.
And I knew it, too. I knew right then, that Rudy had me and all the others.
I knew the power they had even over me.
I went up to my dorm and had a cigarette. It was crazy.
-
That is messed up! The funny thing is I know we would have all done it. The "right" thing to do would be to say piss off but we wouldn't dare. It's scary to think of how we can be compelled to do something we don't believe in when we are in an oppressive, controlled environment that coerces us to dispense with individual; values in favor of group think.
That is probably the key reason I split.
-
I too remember that. I have yet to look through the notebooks to explore more about some of the moments. In fact, even in a theraputic environment like a shrink office I have resisted exploring the full extent of control over us in workshops such as the summit. For years I have adhered to the never-say-shit-promise I gave. I see now that it is out of financial protection for the school to do this. Stolen workshop. The chop shop chop shop. Over the last month or two I have been knowledgeable about the existance of this site I have already quickly flown the gammut of emotion. I want to fly away from it and not go straight in. 'At's funny to me because I go straight into every other conflict in my life. Action. I guess some of that originated with my CEDU "re-education". I need so badly to know that we're not alone in our assessments as grads. I feel guilty a bit stabbing CEDU in the back. And now I need to explore that in itself.
Thanks for being as longlastingly upset as me!
-
that's fucked!
i went through a summit all by myself (i got in trouble the night before my peer group's summit) so i never did that... i just remember having to write my own obituary and read it to my peer group. oh, i also liked the part where they told me to decide which friends i should kill if they were on a sinking boat. cute.
-
yea, i didnt like writing the obituary either. it made me feel like i was dead already... :scared: i hated that workshop, and i didn't like day 4 when you had to get all dressed up and "use your contract" to complete the strech.
Bureaucracy defends the status quo long past the time when the quo has lost its status
--Laurence J. Peter
-
I didn't complete the program so I only went through one propheet. What do you mean by getting all dressed up to use your contract?
-
the staff give you a "roll" to play i.e. mine was Miss. America. so i had to dress up like i was doing a Miss. America pagent, and i had to do a swim suit compition (even though i was the only one competing :wink:) and i had to give a speech on why i was "beautiful", and why i should be Miss. America. and so you have to "use your contract" to get through the stretch<- that's what me being Miss. America was. so basically they make you be some one and you have to do what that character would do.
Fresh beauty opens one's eyes wherever it is really seen, but the very abundance and completeness of the common beauty that besets our steps prevents its being absorbed and appreciated. It is a good thing, therefore, to make short excursions now and then to the bottom of the sea among dulse and coral, or up among the clouds on mountain-tops, or in balloons, or even to creep like worms into dark holes and caverns underground, not only to learn something of what is going on in those out-of-the-way places, but to see better what the sun sees on our return to common everyday beauty.
-- John Muir
-
But why? What was the purpose? What were soem of the other roles people were asked to play? Was the purpose to stretch how you see yourself?
-
some of the other roles... one of my friends was "peter pan". (the staff saw him as being irresponsible), and since peter pan lost his shadow... peter pan was "irresponsible" (i was Miss. America because the staff thought that i didn't think i was "beautiful"... and everyone knows that Miss. America's are beautiful...) some one else was "exlposive pooh", the staff thought.. (and so did i at times) she had anger problems, so her character was basically a phyco winne the pooh bear. some one else was "King Author" the staff thought he had trouble being a leader and to be a king you have to lead, so that's why he got that roll. does that make sense?
for nothing can keep it right but their own vigilant and distrustful superintendence.
--Thomas Jefferson
-
OK. It's weird. I do not like the encounter portion of the propheets or the pressure to have what I call an emotionally facilitated breakthrough in order to progress because a lot of it is coercive and abusive in my view. But I can't decide if some of the workshop portions might be helpful just to stretch your sense of self or if its ALL mindf^&*.
-
i believe that all the profeets and workshops are there to fuck with you... espically the imagine, i and me. i didn't like the dreams either when you had to draw ur nightmere, and then they make you wear it and you have to stand up in front of everyone while staff point out every little fuckin thing you drew on there... then they make you rip it up and throw it away at the end.........
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid
of the dark. The real tragedy of life is
when men are afraid of the light.
--Plato
-
Pixie, what are some of the your experiences with I and Me, Dreams etc. Good, bad, or ugly. I didn't go through them and I want to know what I missed.
-
do you got an e-mail or instant message, cuz we could chat about it through that
I am not a vegetarian because I love animals; I am a vegetarian because I hate plants.
-- A. Whitney Brown
-
yeah... my aim is rubyredlea
-
Shanea,
You got it. Coercive and abusive. It's inappropriate therapy for teens. Even adults for that matter. Unless it was done in a very thoughtful way. One learns how to ACT, but has the real underlying emotion/misbelief been dealt with. I can see where they would like to go with this, but again, it is not done well and not age appropriate. What MIGHT be useful is if the teens performed plays and took a role they weren't comfortable with. There's actually a psych term for this that isn't coming to me. I want to say psychodrama, but not sure that's it.
I do see benefit in contradicting the beliefs one has erroneously adopted about themselves. It's like, how do you help a dog that has been beaten to the point of cowling. Tell it to stand up and act like a bulldog? Some think that a dog that has been that badly abused will can never fully recover. But common sense dictates that you won't 'help' that dog with further mistreatment.
Is it so hard to relate that to humans?
Take for example a kid who has been told he is stupid so often that he begins to believe it- his self esteem severely damaged. I fail to see how role playing a genius is going to be helpful. Learning to ACT smart is not going to suddenly make him 'feel' smart. He may not even know how to play that part, could blunder and feel even more stupid... and humiliated on top of that. Or if his self esteem has really been damaged, the whole exercise will feel humiliating- particularly if it is forced. He will not relate but will go through the motions because he is made to do it. I think the more useful thing would be to point out his brilliance at every opportunity. Find ways to dismantle the misbeliefs. Provide opportunities in which he could see that he indeed was not stupid. This method requires a highly trained staff and a whole different structure. Something used car and furniture salesmen, turned program gurus, wouldn't know anything about. They DO know alot about acting.
I think all these programs would be better off if they sent their staff to be trained in the Montessori method. They need to reinforce the truth and help teens learn to master their environment. That would be MY solution. Turn all BM programs into Montessori high schools. Get some people in there who have been taught how to respectfully assist teens in their journey to adulthood. Who won't subject them to ignorant, unproven techniques and abuse.
Even if their ignorant 'therapy' worked. The rest of the program is disrespectful. How does one come to feel good about themselves when they are treated worse than prisoners?
This discussion reminds me of a story about an indigenous tribe and how they dealt with 'anti-social' behavior. When a member acted disrespectfully they saw it for what it was. The entire tribe stopped what they were doing. They encircled the distressed member and each took turns reminding the member of his/her goodness. Can you fathom that happening in a program? It's the antithesis of what programs do.
-
Deborah: Thank you. Your post is what I've been looking for. I'm at a point in my life where I am trying to find answers and am looking for helpful insight, not cynics and complainers. I am getting my grad degree in education and I really want to help kids. I learn best by example. The role playing scenario you described as not helpful was great as was the anti-social scenario. Too bad society doesn't embrace this stuff. Myself, I have a strange pull between feeling like its better to embrace and accept, and stop trying to fix or label kids, but also wanting to help kids with poor self esteem. I've also got 2 small children I'm raising on my own and I don't want to repeat mistakes. I also am just questionning a lot of conventional wisdom in parenting and seeing there is no black and white answers to everything.
PS: My 4 year old is in Montessori and it's been a real gift.
-
the dreams was one of the few that was tolerable... maybe because it was run by one of my favorite staff members.
i don't know; it was the most chill and i felt it had a purpose.. i mean, we all need our dreams to live.
-
If you have a good experience in any sense it's either because you have a positive outlook, a staff wasn't a total meany, or you experienced something important. That doesn't mean it worked. It means you were spared something and got something. what a bargain!
-
well, what was it supposed to do to work?
it working means that it accomplished its goal... i'm not sure what the goal was, probably to make some sort of change. surely, we were all changed in one way or another (not necessarily in a positive way) after having experienced such events. therefore, should my assumption be correct, it worked!
-
i went to CMS, i hated proheets and workshops. I was made to go through the truth prohpeet 3 times! i hated it. the second time i got in there and just walked out. i walked around campus for about 45 minutes until they found me and forced me to walk back in. this is when they started yelling at me. it was crazy. even my best friends were verbally attacking for "ruin there emotional work" it was all bullshit. when i found out i had to go through it a third time i flat out refused to get out of bed that morning. i just slept in, that is until my team leader came and made me get up and go. it was hell, and once again , i got ripped apart by my friends for " not stepping up, and being the older student they knew i could be" all while the staff just sat back quietly probably chuckling to themselves.
-
On 2004-08-26 18:07:00, **PIXIE DUST** wrote:
"i believe that all the profeets and workshops are there to fuck with you... espically the imagine, i and me. i didn't like the dreams either when you had to draw ur nightmere, and then they make you wear it and you have to stand up in front of everyone while staff point out every little fuckin thing you drew on there... then they make you rip it up and throw it away at the end.........We can easily forgive a child who is afraid
of the dark. The real tragedy of life is
when men are afraid of the light.
--Plato
"
i don't think we did that part!!
-
I too remember that. I have yet to look through the notebooks to explore more about some of the moments. In fact, even in a theraputic environment like a shrink office I have resisted exploring the full extent of control over us in workshops such as the summit. For years I have adhered to the never-say-shit-promise I gave. I see now that it is out of financial protection for the school to do this. Stolen workshop. The chop shop chop shop. Over the last month or two I have been knowledgeable about the existance of this site I have already quickly flown the gammut of emotion. I want to fly away from it and not go straight in. 'At's funny to me because I go straight into every other conflict in my life. Action. I guess some of that originated with my CEDU "re-education". I need so badly to know that we're not alone in our assessments as grads. I feel guilty a bit stabbing CEDU in the back. And now I need to explore that in itself.
Thanks for being as longlastingly upset as me!
::bump::
-
some of the other roles... one of my friends was "peter pan". (the staff saw him as being irresponsible), and since peter pan lost his shadow... peter pan was "irresponsible" (i was Miss. America because the staff thought that i didn't think i was "beautiful"... and everyone knows that Miss. America's are beautiful...) some one else was "exlposive pooh", the staff thought.. (and so did i at times) she had anger problems, so her character was basically a phyco winne the pooh bear. some one else was "King Author" the staff thought he had trouble being a leader and to be a king you have to lead, so that's why he got that roll. does that make sense? for nothing can keep it right but their own vigilant and distrustful superintendence.
--Thomas Jefferson
They cast me as Gwenaviere back in 1976.
-
I was GLENDA THE GOOD WITCH from the Wizard of Oz... and still to this day, I have no idea WHY?!
-
I was Indiana Jane (instead of Jones). The whole thing was obnoxious in and of itself.
-
I was annie oakley. Her apparently outrageous behavior and dirty jokes was supposed to be a stretch for me because I was such a doormat at the school. It made me chuckle to myself, even as a brainwashed older student, because I remember how outspoken and vulgar I used to be before I got there, and I pretty much went back to being that after I left, too.
So, just goes to show how "off base" they were. Oakley was *hardly* a stretch for me. I only had to go up to do my solo stretch once, and the minute I told the joke about life savers being better than men because they come in five different flavors, stacy spit out her water laughing, cranked up that stupid fame song and I didn't have to do it anymore.
I was also supposed to carry around a dead horse that I would kick and beat every so often, so they had that horsie on a stick as one of the supplied props you could dig up. I dragged that thing around by the reins for the whole party, and almost immediately into that exercise, his stick falls out. So I am walking around with a stuffed horse's head, and I'm swinging it around by the reins and smashing it into the floor, which actually felt quite good, since I just kept looking at the horse and thinking "This is RMA, this is RMA, this is RMA. Take that and that and that you stupid pus-filled cunthole of a school."
Even today, I think that is funny. What other place of extreme retardation would make you walk around and beat up on a horse's head?
The one thing that bothered me in the historical sense (because I am incredibly anal about this) is that I don't recall Annie Oakley being that outrageous personality-wise. She was a sharpshooter who actually dressed very femmy and ladylike, and to my knowledge, wasn't really a pistol herself. Now, if they had instead used Calamity Jane, that would make some sense. In fact, I had confused the two in the workshop and conflated them into one person.
I actually have all of the stretches written down in my notebook, because I was supposed to help with the costumes. So I have in detail what everyone was and what they had to do.
-
My stretch drives me nuts to this day. To me, the character thoroughly represents the erroneous 'diagnosis' and ill fated attempt that RMA (and my parents) attempted to treat me with. It absolutely conveys the message that, I'm weak just for being a confused child that survived a defcon 5 divorce.
Having me act like a cartoon character in front of a group? - all the while I was in need of a very specific form of therapy for a very specific condition. Nothing more - nothing less. You don't substitute a root canal for chemotherapy do you? When someone's nearsighted you give them glasses - you don't give them Jock itch cream.
I had condition 'A' and what did RMA do? They gave me the farthest thing from the specific treatment for condition 'A'. Those fucking degenerate untrained staff were playing fantasy land therapy games with me. It's reminiscent of those Nazi doctors performing bizaro experiments purely for recreational & masturabotory purposes.
The fact that it was a big money making comedy to them is criminal.
Thinking about that right now pisses me off so much I feel like clubbing a baby seal.
-
i hate the me i became there, the me they trained me to be, and i am trying t not hate myself anymore.
but its hard, i have so much guilt for the way that i acted towards people there. i hate everything i said, every time i just gave in and did what they wanted. i feel like such a coward.
maybe thats why they gave me cowardly lion, maybe they saw just how much i could have done against them and did nothing, like you said, laughing at me, look how stupid she looks.
god those people were cruel. what made them so cruel? how did they get so crazy? how do i avoid getting that crazy???