Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones => Topic started by: Anonymous on April 05, 2004, 03:06:00 AM
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thinking of that crappy, hellish cult. I typed in a search to see if it were still in existence and came upon this... thank you. I realized now that I was not alone and that my thoughts on this cult is not unique.
it has been especially rewarding to read stories from ex-staff, knowing they understand. was anybody there in 1987? is lori still working there? she was horrible. is jill? rudy? mark? pam?
anyway, thanks for letting me know i wasn't alone.
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I am so sorry for your pain. may you see peace again soon with the demise of this awful place.
Stay with us and tell your true "story" for the sake of all who follow you. We must remove the stumbling stone.
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[ This Message was edited by: Jack1963 on 2004-08-01 15:33 ]
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Jack, I can't tell you how helpful your posts are. The Seed/Straight/Kids/etc. programs were a lot different in structure from the CEDU type programs. But they're so similar in certain profound ways. Your giving this kind of detaied description illustrates some of those similarities so well.
We all made stuff up too. You had to if you wanted to advance. And those made up stories were held over our heads and used to maximum effect to humiliate and to isolate us and to coerce compliance.
There are a lot of other similarities in your short account so far. Thanks! Please keep it up!Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/ ... miamithem' (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/040303082X/circlofmiamithem') target='_new'>H. G. Wells
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I just checked the website ? she now has a psychology degree from California Coast College. It is an UNACCREDITED, MAIL ORDER SCHOOL. Her degree credits would not even be accepted by a junior college.
The big boss - Dr. Jim Powell got his Ph.D. at a non-accredited school! It was one of those mail-order schools ? distance learning before there was online college. He met Mel Wasserman at some Synanon thing where Jim was trying to sober up.
Mail order PhDs are not uncommon at CEDU In fact, they are very common at CEDU. Bill Valentine (in charge of parent services PhD) has a mail order Degtee that he braggs about on the CEDU website. I checked. The college doesn't offer the unacredited mail order PhDs anymore.
After meeting him, I couldn't understand how a PhD could be so ignorant - now I know.
CEDU's North Idaho clinical Director Rich Geiger had a mail order PhD in Divinity - he's gone now. Dr Geiger ran clinical services for years. He was in charge during the suicide hanging incident and The riot - go figure.
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[ This Message was edited by: Jack1963 on 2004-08-01 23:15 ]
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Thank you all for your responses. It helps.
In my experience, all of the team leaders were pretty wacko, but some of the new staff seemed sucked in... I often wonder if thet ever got it. I also saw at least one marriage by a median level staff and his new wife suffer greatly as she was attacked and criticised relentlessly and he was manipulated against her. The funny thing was she was a real bright spot there. I always got the impression she was trying to support her husband, but had trouble buying in.
I was hoping someone could tell me what happened to Jim Johnson and Lori (forgot last name) but they headed Vision in 1987 and Jim became diector (I think ) later. Because they were the team leaders, their actions affected me profoundly. Did they ever see the light or are they still there? What about Pam and MArk? It would be helpful for purposes of closure.
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On 2004-04-05 20:00:00, Jack1963 wrote:
Antigen wrote:
Mail order PhDs are not uncommon at CEDU In fact, they are very common at CEDU. Bill Valentine (in charge of parent services PhD) has a mail order Degtee that he braggs about on the CEDU website. I checked. The college doesn't offer the unacredited mail order PhDs anymore.
I didn't write that. I may have quoted someone else. Don't have time go go back and look right now. But I didn't write the above. The problem with the "teen help" industry is that it's a bad "solution" in search of a problem.
Julie C.
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Sorry for the anonymous post, but CEDU is very threatening...
Lori Rist? was in charge of the transition program in Running Springs California - She was a fabulously fine individual before CEDU. The cult brainwashed her with charisma and promises of enlightenment. She worked with Bill Lane - the ex Heroin addict CEDU Executive. That is the only one I know of except Billy - nice guy, who went to work in a program around Bend Oregon.
Lori saw the light and left as director of NWA sometime in the last year - too late to save her marriage.
Her husband (a therapist) Marc worked for BCA and fought the system with Rand Gurley and Jack Clearman for around three years. He fought them furiously to get rid of jump suits, get them unlimited religious privileges, to stop yelling in raps, to change the brainwashing in prophets and to stop them from playing head games on anxious, depressed, bipolar, paranoid, narcissistic and borderline kids. He believed some of the harsh program processes could be helpful for antisocials and non dual-diagnoses severe drug abusers, but not much else.
Rand, Marc Rob, Jack, and Jenny managed to get things under some slight control, but, the staff took the abuse underground and did abuse kids covertly at table assignments, on restrictions and by placing kids they did not like in dorms where they would be abused - or by shunning and tormenting them emotionally through other peers.
The Director, LaTeresa, who has no mental health experience or education, and the staff had an alliance and would not answer e mails from most therapists and would shun them along with any staff who questioned or tried to change anything about the program. This was highly effective for them in not changing anything and feeling righteous and powerful against the evil therapists.
Management then put the therapists in charge of team parent communications. This effectively forced them to either be in constant conflict with the program staff or sell out their ethics and "buy in." This would mean lying to the parents in team meetings under peer pressure, or losing your job. This was a deliberate action by management to make the therapists irrelevant while using them to get state school funding.
All of the above therapists were forced out for not lying, and for trying to protect kids rights, Two clinical directors who did "buy in" were eliminated just to show power.
Eventually they found therapists who would let CEDU control them, and, that is what they have at NWA, RMA, BCA and Milestones now.
What did Lori do to you? I can imagine that, back then, she must have been ve
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Sounds familiar.
On 2004-04-06 13:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Sorry for the anonymous post, but CEDU is very threatening...
Lori Rist? was in charge of the transition program in Running Springs California - She was a fabulously fine individual before CEDU. The cult brainwashed her with charisma and promises of enlightenment. She worked with Bill Lane - the ex Heroin addict CEDU Executive. That is the only one I know of except Billy - nice guy, who went to work in a program around Bend Oregon.
Lori saw the light and left as director of NWA sometime in the last year - too late to save her marriage.
Her husband (a therapist) Marc worked for BCA and fought the system with Rand Gurley and Jack Clearman for around three years. He fought them furiously to get rid of jump suits, get them unlimited religious privileges, to stop yelling in raps, to change the brainwashing in prophets and to stop them from playing head games on anxious, depressed, bipolar, paranoid, narcissistic and borderline kids. He believed some of the harsh program processes could be helpful for antisocials and non dual-diagnoses severe drug abusers, but not much else.
Rand, Marc Rob, Jack, and Jenny managed to get things under some slight control, but, the staff took the abuse underground and did abuse kids covertly at table assignments, on restrictions and by placing kids they did not like in dorms where they would be abused - or by shunning and tormenting them emotionally through other peers.
The Director, LaTeresa, who has no mental health experience or education, and the staff had an alliance and would not answer e mails from most therapists and would shun them along with any staff who questioned or tried to change anything about the program. This was highly effective for them in not changing anything and feeling righteous and powerful against the evil therapists.
Management then put the therapists in charge of team parent communications. This effectively forced them to either be in constant conflict with the program staff or sell out their ethics and "buy in." This would mean lying to the parents in team meetings under peer pressure, or losing your job. This was a deliberate action by management to make the therapists irrelevant while using them to get state school funding.
All of the above therapists were forced out for not lying, and for trying to protect kids rights, Two clinical directors who did "buy in" were eliminated just to show power.
Eventually they found therapists who would let CEDU control them, and, that is what they have at NWA, RMA, BCA and Milestones now.
What did Lori do to you? I can imagine that, back then, she must have been ve
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[ This Message was edited by: former CEDU therapist on 2004-04-06 14:21 ]
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Oh, wow, wow, WOW! God, you're telling my story! I was a therapist there. Geez, this is horrible! They did use us only to get funding. They ignored us and when we have a difference with them, we were threatened with our jobs. Once, I was asked to attend a meeting to "discuss" differences I had with staff treatment of the kids. I went there with my Ph.D. and considerable experience and found that it was an emotional lynching - of me. There was NOTHING in the way of discussion. It was team leaders and administration riding me about how I was not going "with the program." Well, YEAH! No kidding. My understanding was that they wree supposed to follow our direction! What a crock! So glad to be out!
On 2004-04-06 13:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Sorry for the anonymous post, but CEDU is very threatening...
Lori Rist? was in charge of the transition program in Running Springs California - She was a fabulously fine individual before CEDU. The cult brainwashed her with charisma and promises of enlightenment. She worked with Bill Lane - the ex Heroin addict CEDU Executive. That is the only one I know of except Billy - nice guy, who went to work in a program around Bend Oregon.
Lori saw the light and left as director of NWA sometime in the last year - too late to save her marriage.
Her husband (a therapist) Marc worked for BCA and fought the system with Rand Gurley and Jack Clearman for around three years. He fought them furiously to get rid of jump suits, get them unlimited religious privileges, to stop yelling in raps, to change the brainwashing in prophets and to stop them from playing head games on anxious, depressed, bipolar, paranoid, narcissistic and borderline kids. He believed some of the harsh program processes could be helpful for antisocials and non dual-diagnoses severe drug abusers, but not much else.
Rand, Marc Rob, Jack, and Jenny managed to get things under some slight control, but, the staff took the abuse underground and did abuse kids covertly at table assignments, on restrictions and by placing kids they did not like in dorms where they would be abused - or by shunning and tormenting them emotionally through other peers.
The Director, LaTeresa, who has no mental health experience or education, and the staff had an alliance and would not answer e mails from most therapists and would shun them along with any staff who questioned or tried to change anything about the program. This was highly effective for them in not changing anything and feeling righteous and powerful against the evil therapists.
Management then put the therapists in charge of team parent communications. This effectively forced them to either be in constant conflict with the program staff or sell out their ethics and "buy in." This would mean lying to the parents in team meetings under peer pressure, or losing your job. This was a deliberate action by management to make the therapists irrelevant while using them to get state school funding.
All of the above therapists were forced out for not lying, and for trying to protect kids rights, Two clinical directors who did "buy in" were eliminated just to show power.
Eventually they found therapists who would let CEDU control them, and, that is what they have at NWA, RMA, BCA and Milestones now.
What did Lori do to you? I can imagine that, back then, she must have been ve
"
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Actually I don't know if its the same Lori. The one I had lived there and was unmarried with a dog. She was just cruel and demeaning in raps, manipulated my parents, and always treated me like I was lying... and I was one of the few who weren't. She also kept bringing up stuff about my outside life that wasn't true but made me look bad. It wasn't subjective stuff, it was that the very facts were wrong. An innocuous example if she kept saying I lived with my boyfriend, which never happened. THe other team leader spread this whole thing that I was a druggie when I never was a heavy drug user and quit by my own volition months before CEDU and never (17 years later) went back. That his tactic to make me look like a liar and tellmy folks why I needed to stay. THe truth was that he was (by his own admission) an ex-cokehead, so maybe he doesn't know some people are actually capable of honesty or he was just projecting his own shit. Mostly I'm just pissed at how abusive the sessions were, and how they isolated us from our families. The whole culture was founded on distrust, isolation, and cult lingo. I would have preferred people just talking straight and direct.
What happened to Doug and Mona (they weren't there regularly, they just visited when I attended)? Jim Johnson? Mark and PAm? The brothers?
Am I not supposed to use names? I just wonder about old staff, some I liked even if they were a cult. some seemed like they really felt like they were trying to do something.
Thanks for letting me vent. I never ever talk about this experience, because most normal people can't relate and my parents feel too guilty.
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i am an ex BCA student currently filing a lawsuit against cedu for the time i was there...we have several ex students an amazing lawyer and staff testifying for us...if you are interested in becoming part of this please contact me...all ex staff and students are welcome to join. email me at JMG532@aol.com or IM me at jmg532 i am willing to answer any questions u may have as well
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Beware of Chuck Selent working under cover to get staff and ex staff who tell the truth. CEDU is desperate right now, and would love to sic Chuck after you. If you have a legitamate law suit, give us the name of your attorney.
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Can somebody track this moron down? I'm tired of these transparent PIs, ed consultants, staffers, and Lawyers. God, what dumb shit would answer an e mail address with no details. better yet, what asshole, but some CEDU dumb ass, would expect people to fall for this crap.
Post only on the board unless they identify thamselves and you can track them - this is entrapment and is typical CEDU tyranny.
Look, We're not in the for money asshole - were in this to annoy, or, better yet, get rid of CEDU and dumb fucks like you, so you can work a circle K where your low intelligence will appear to have value.
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I agree. This is not about money or plugging our already overloaded court system and filling the pockets of a bunch of attorneys. This is about getting people to make better choices for their kids.
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You are so right. Who the hell is this guy who claims he has a lawsuit going? I have experience with CEDU. Put the name and number of the attorney on this website and we'll be able to contact him. As we still haven't seen that, I'm suspicious. Paranoia: the legacy of CEDU!
On 2004-04-20 10:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Can somebody track this moron down? I'm tired of these transparent PIs, ed consultants, staffers, and Lawyers. God, what dumb shit would answer an e mail address with no details. better yet, what asshole, but some CEDU dumb ass, would expect people to fall for this crap.
Post only on the board unless they identify thamselves and you can track them - this is entrapment and is typical CEDU tyranny.
Look, We're not in the for money asshole - were in this to annoy, or, better yet, get rid of CEDU and dumb fucks like you, so you can work a circle K where your low intelligence will appear to have value."
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if what this is truely about is getting parents to make better decisions for there kids, a lawsuit against cedu is actually not a bad idea. i am a believer that children that attended NWA like myself, or any other cedu school are entitled to something for the torture they were put through. i can gaurentee that if a lawsuit goes public against cedu then parents will see this and make better decisions for there kids. its sad how scared cedu has all you people of what cedu can do to you now. its not even cedu anymore, its the brown schools. with all the truely big corperations going down all over the place, i do not think cedu really has the power to do too much...
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it actually is a legitimate lawsuit....i joined..and i want cedu to go down for all they did to me...u people make me paranoid like maybe you are CEDU trying to find out more about the lawsuit....if you want to help please email me at Juliet052@aol.com (http://mailto:Juliet052@aol.com)
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Juliet, please post the attorney info.
On 2004-04-23 15:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
"it actually is a legitimate lawsuit....i joined..and i want cedu to go down for all they did to me...u people make me paranoid like maybe you are CEDU trying to find out more about the lawsuit....if you want to help please email me at Juliet052@aol.com (http://mailto:Juliet052@aol.com)"
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u email me and prove youre not cedu...i will give info needed...this whole site seems shady to me all of a sudden. im not begging for anyone to join the case....thats up to you. we truly wanna wanna make a change here..im already in and trying my best..u can sit back in fear if you wish just like cedu taught us to do...but im trying to move fwd..if you would like to u can im me or email me.
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No, not doing that. I've contacted the other attorneys on these web pages so I'll leave it at that. I am not willing to contact any individual on these posts. It's just too risky - you see, I don't know if YOU are CEDU, either! What a shame they leave us so paranoid.
On 2004-04-23 17:41:00, Anonymous wrote:
"u email me and prove youre not cedu...i will give info needed...this whole site seems shady to me all of a sudden. im not begging for anyone to join the case....thats up to you. we truly wanna wanna make a change here..im already in and trying my best..u can sit back in fear if you wish just like cedu taught us to do...but im trying to move fwd..if you would like to u can im me or email me."
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"cedused"
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Wow....I looked up CEDU on the Internet to see if that hellhole still existed and discovered this forum. I was enrolled at CEDU during 1982-83 timeframe. It should say alot that after so many years, I still cringe when I remember that place. Yes, I was a "troubled" teen...but the abuse CEDU issued, at the hands of it's counselors (John Pagent (sp) and Eric Meltzer to name a couple), was the most traumatic experience I went through as a teen. I went through the Truth Profeet and was disgusted at some of the things people said just to have the counselor leave them alone. I am not a psychologist or a psychiatrist, but I'm sure that yelling at kids, and belittling them in front of their peers, is not a proper form of "treatment." I ended up "splitting" from that cult, and made my way back home. I still remember that school with a child's fear and hate that will never go away...even after so many years. It does make me feel better knowing that I am not alone. Please reply.
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Welcome to these posts!
There are several lawsuits going on here. Look through the posts. If you were mistreated, you can speak up and do something.
Some of the posts are rageful. Some are from ex-students. Some are from staff. I suspect that there may be one or two from people at CEDU now. I have no reason to think this except for my brief time working there - it makes you paranoid about them.
It is interesting that although I have posted that I worked a short time, immediately started looking for another job when I saw how they treated the kids, I never abused the kids, I constantly caught hell from CEDU for not abusing them, and I still get letters almost ten years later from kids telling me that I was the only one who was kind and acted like I believed in them (I did), there are some here to yell at me in the posts.
It makes me wonder if they are turning the ears of new readers deaf. I am hoping that parents will look at these threads and decide to not send their kids there based on LOGICAL argument. Some of these posts might make them think that the person posting is a raving lunatic and will just not take that persons seriously.
Also, beating up ex-staff may not help convince them that they should speak up in the lawsuits. We can help these ex-students who are suing the school. However, if all they want to do is beat us up, how are we going to feel about that? I did contact some of the attorneys posted here. Staffers know things, even if we were there only a short time. We saw stuff - that's why we left.
So, new friend, I ask that you not post in a way that parents won't listen to you at all. CEDU is an abusive hell hole and we need to convince them of that there are 105 things they can do to help their kids that don't involve this kind of "treatment."
You also might be interested in knowing - and not surprised - that the staff, the "counselors" are uneducated. The only education they get is from the CEDU brainwashing. Some of them have degrees from California Coast University. This is no real university - it's an unaccredited, mail-order school. So, CEDU claims that they have counselors but they are just people who have been manipulated. The ones who are on some sick power trip enjoy abusing the kids. The ones like me, LEAVE.
I have spoken with ex-staff who believed that although they hated the treatment of the kids, that they were doing the right thing there. They finally figured it out and are full of remorse. Some of these people posting are not willing to allow a person that mistake. They are rageful and not allowing that a person with no training or experience might NOT UNDERSTAND that what CEDU does is not helpful and, in fact, harmful. They just were ignorant, and as soon as they figured it out, they left. So I am asking you to please be kind to these folks. They are trying to apologize for their ignorance and sometimes they're getting beaten up for that.
As for you, here it is a couple of decades later and you're still harmed by CEDU. Ask yourself the kinds of questions an attorney would ask - and call one of these attorneys. I'm glad you got out. You were never shipped back, I assume? Good for you! I'm glad you've made a life for yourself and am disgusted that CEDU is still hurting you. We are hoping a massive lawsuit will take them down.
You are so right about the profeets. Lots of kids lie just to get it over with. I went through one and refused to talk about myself and refused to cooperate with how they were treating the kids. Brandi Elliot (Running Springs) was enraged at me over this. Too bad. I was horrified. I was going to school (a REAL school) to earn a psychology degree, but I didn't need any of that to know that what was going on was wrong. I said so in my first staff meeting - that yelling and belittling and staff talking about some really raunchy and discusting stuff they had done was NOT therapeutic nor beneficial to ANYONE. Boy, did I get reamed.
And look - I was right. You weren't there very long and you are carrying scars for life. What do your parents say about it now? I'm curious. But don't blame them. CEDU has such slick packaging that they give scared parents hope. They promise their troubled kid will have a great life if they send him to CEDU. Parents are scared and don't know what to do. CEDU knows that and preys on their fears.
Then when the kids talk to their parents on the phone, the staff are always monitoring. If the kids get a chance to tell the parents they are miserable, the staff say that they are "manipulating." I remember asking if manipulating wasn't just doing what you needed to do to get what you needed. I got yelled at for that. But I was right. When those kids were doing things that staff called "manipulation" they were simply trying to get their needs met. Parents were taught to not listen.
I hope you have been able to forgive your parents. They didn't know any better. I'm glad you got out when you did.
On 2004-04-24 10:14:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Wow....I looked up CEDU on the Internet to see if that hellhole still existed and discovered this forum. I was enrolled at CEDU during 1982-83 timeframe. It should say alot that after so many years, I still cringe when I remember that place. Yes, I was a "troubled" teen...but the abuse CEDU issued, at the hands of it's counselors (John Pagent (sp) and Eric Meltzer to name a couple), was the most traumatic experience I went through as a teen. I went through the Truth Profeet and was disgusted at some of the things people said just to have the counselor leave them alone. I am not a psychologist or a psychiatrist, but I'm sure that yelling at kids, and belittling them in front of their peers, is not a proper form of "treatment." I ended up "splitting" from that cult, and made my way back home. I still remember that school with a child's fear and hate that will never go away...even after so many years. It does make me feel better knowing that I am not alone. Please reply."
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Indeed you are not.
I was there graduated in 89.
It leaves scars that never seem to heal. I know that sounds corney but it is the truth.
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Doug and Mona were part of creating Cascade and then Amity.
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On 2005-04-23 13:38:00, font wrote:
"Doug and Mona were part of creating Cascade and then Amity.
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Did you go to Amity?
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No. I'm a CEDU grad with a few classmates that became Amity staff briefly. And I realize I made a typo above. Not Doug and Mona but Merv and Mona were at Amity. The problems with typing before reading ...