Fornits

Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 02:05:00 AM

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 02:05:00 AM

Hey all you ex Straight Staffers-- why don't you follow in the footsteps of one of you who finally did something right--KILL YOURSELVES!

You are scum...human refuse...you are vile shit that does not deserve to live...you were paid to abuse and torture the innocent...DO THE HONORABLE THING AND KILL YOURSELVES NOW...if you are not fighting the program now like you supported it then, you should do what your conscience tells you to do, what you know is right--AND KILL YOURSELF!  Most of you know that you can never make up for the harm you inflicted, so why not try to atone for it BY KILLING YOURSELF?  Trust me, none of us will cry when you are gone.  In fact, most of us will honor your decision as the first decent thing you have done since you sold out to Straight.  It's not too late to make up for what you did--ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS KILL YOURSELF!  We promise to forgive you for your actions at Straight if you KILL YOURSELF NOW!

_________________
"Mean and hateful since 1982"


Your sponsor says it's OK for you to drink

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 26, 2004, 03:25:00 AM

Quote

"Hey all you ex Straight Staffers-- why don't you follow in the footsteps of one of you who finally did something right--KILL YOURSELVES!
"Mean and hateful since 1982"

 :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:
You are one sick jerk!  Jeff was a close personal friend of mine.  He had some emotional issues LONG before Straight that contributed to his unfortunate suicide.  
 :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:
Mean and hateful doesn't even come close to describing you.  Get some help!
 :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:
Don

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Opiod_Morphina on March 26, 2004, 04:08:00 AM

Quote

 Get some help!

 :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:  :flame:

Don "

Hi Don...Post anon much? :idea:  :lol:

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Opiod_Morphina on March 26, 2004, 06:40:00 AM

You said you didn't love me (a lie)
You said you didn't care (my lie)
I've spent an eternity destroying this (to myself)
As if you weren't there (til I die)

I've lost this taste of inner rage
A question overlooked from this day-to-day
Now this time is running low, had to give it away
Lost this sight, bring it back to life
Another wasted second to burn myself inside
Feel all rebuilding to make you repeat it all

One more dose, another sip
A few pills at the most
Breaking this silence
Of this secure nature
Not enough rest

Wondering as you sit and question what went wrong
Never once offered sanctuary to a truthful cause
Stop repeating a fault; an apology will end for now
Slipping into this un-animated world of dizziness
An empty representation of thought, mistreated wisdom
Twisted lips speak in vain, for a purpose put to shame
A double-edged purpose slaying everyone but yourself
Time is of the essence...patience a blur

A swarm of thoughts, can't catch a one
Left empty-minded
Sitting in these eyes of guilt, outraged
This barrier for what remains
Take the disadvantage, a fraction of this life
Kept close with loss of most
These lips of misfortune, kissed one to many times
Taste the truth...the pain
I've had to gain

Planning daily...getting nothing done
Open the hands of a mind-clasped identity
Taste the bitter blood on these lips
Taste the betrayal of your unfaithful kiss

A hindered growth with a grasping head spin
It will leave one bottled up with a fifth of sin
To live inside these walls till the day I die
Totally confined to love held close inside

Damned to tradition
Flawless untold superstition
Trying to find salvation
An escape from evolution

Words on top of words
Towering fortress of this inaction

These cycles of distrust
This disease that breeds disgust
Another for old times sake
Fell behind in the pack

No chances, no patience
Obedience in a mental fraction

An example of excuse
The virgin behind logic
Intimidate this full restraint
Sink into a lurid thought

God is dead, love is dead
Dark thoughts of this un-compassion

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 10:54:00 AM

Quote

 Jeff was a close personal friend of mine.  He had some emotional issues LONG before Straight that contributed to his unfortunate suicide.  

Then why do you have such a pro-Straight attitude? In many of your posts it seems like you have some sort of nostalgia for Straight.  I am not the only one who has noticed this.  If I felt that Straight had contributed to the suicide of a "close personal friend" of mine, I damn sure wouldn't think of it as some kind of summer camp.

Jeff Leugers was my oldcomer for a short while.  He was back in St. Pete after 7 stepping. I honor him for his decision to kill himself.

If using his name in the thread bothers you so much, why don't you kill your ex-Staff self and we'll call it the "Don Smith Fan Club".

You were an ex-Staffer, Don,and you obviously have not put much effort in fighting the program.  You talk about Straight like it was boarding school, whine about "how tough it was to be on Staff", and talk about some stupid book you are writing.  What's the book going to be called "My Vacation at Mel's Resort for Teens?"

You are an ex-Staffer who is not fighting the program now like you supported it then, so I suggest you take my advice and follow in the footsteps of the honorable Mr. Leugers.  

Love ya, Staff !

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 10:56:00 AM

That was me -- forgot to log in.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Carmel on March 26, 2004, 11:30:00 AM

I swear you people arent any different from the Staffers you rail against.

Im sorry, I hate to judge anyone...I dont know you guys...but dammit cant you see that spewing reckless hate and cruelty isnt ANY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT STAFF DID TO YOU?

Please help me understand what makes you any better?

Do you really think that if you were given 10 minutes on national television to talk about Straight that it would be best to rant and rave and tell people to off themselves? Yeah DUDE, Straight sucks ass, man...totally. Real credible.

How is that "all or nothing" mentality any different from the insanity of the program?  Either with us or against us? Straight or deadinsaneorinjail? If you arent a slobbering slave to the cause then you are an abusive monster?  Come on, for fucks sake guys!  

I would also like to know how so many people here talk about their abuse as if it happened five minutes ago...and there seems to be nothing else of note in their lives whatsoever.  How did you make it from then to now?  Have you just lived your life as if everything were ruined by Straight?  Somehow I doubt it.  There is alot more to us all besides that place.....I wont believe otherwise.  Just like there were some fond memories we have from being in the program...mind you, not from being IN the program...but as human beings we tend to find rays of hope when darkness is all around you know?  There were a few times I had alot of fun with my newcomers, they were funny and relaxed and it seemed as if things would be okay if only for a moment...that doesnt make me a god damned Straight supporting Nazi.  It makes me real.  If we cant find the good parts...we wont ever get past the bad ones....please PLEASE, even though it may not be right for me to do so...it makes me want to beg for a little less ignorance from you all.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: The Butcher on March 26, 2004, 11:38:00 AM

Quote

Im sorry, I hate to judge anyone...I dont know you guys...but dammit cant you see that spewing reckless hate and cruelty isnt ANY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT STAFF DID TO YOU?

I disagree. Why do want to stand up for them? In my eyes, you're no better.

Quote

How is that "all or nothing" mentality any different from the insanity of the program? Either with us or against us? Straight or deadinsaneorinjail? If you arent a slobbering slave to the cause then you are an abusive monster? Come on, for fucks sake guys!

So I guess it's "turn the other cheek then?" Fuck that..It didn't get Jesus anything more than nailed to a tree.

Quote

I would also like to know how so many people here talk about their abuse as if it happened five minutes ago...and there seems to be nothing else of note in their lives whatsoever. How did you make it from then to now?

You seem to want to claim to know a lot about people who you never met. Excuse me, but I have knives to sharpen and axes to grind.  :grin:  

I'll see you in hell,

The Butcher

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Carmel on March 26, 2004, 11:52:00 AM

Thats crazy...I dont want to stand up for them at all...but you have to see that somehow telling them to kill themselves isnt a productive way to get them to take responsibility....if you are all so gung-ho for the cause...wouldnt you want to be the most productive in your pursuits?  

And actually no...if you read closely I am claiming to know very little about people...I want to know more about who they are as people and not as victims...after all...we are all still people right?  Otherwise what are we fighting for?[ This Message was edited by: Carmel on 2004-03-26 08:54 ][ This Message was edited by: Carmel on 2004-03-26 08:55 ]

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 11:54:00 AM

Quote

Im sorry, I hate to judge anyone...I dont know you guys...but dammit cant you see that spewing reckless hate and cruelty isnt ANY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT STAFF DID TO YOU?

Me spewing venom on a website is the same as overseeing the torture of 200 kids at a time?  You are stupider than I thought.

Quote

Please help me understand what makes you any better?

It's a misbehaver thing--you wouldn't understand.

Quote

Do you really think that if you were given 10 minutes on national television to talk about Straight that it would be best to rant and rave and tell people to off themselves? Yeah DUDE, Straight sucks ass, man...totally. Real credible.

 I'm not on national TV, you abuse-minimizing dolt--I'm on a website where people are talking about abuses they suffered that caused deep psychological and emotional traumas.

Quote

I would also like to know how so many people here talk about their abuse as if it happened five minutes ago...and there seems to be nothing else of note in their lives whatsoever.

Don't tell me to "get over it" you idiot.  If I had my eyes gouged out 20 years ago, I would still be blind today.  Just because something happened 20 years ago doesn't mean it has no influence today.

 

Quote

How did you make it from then to now?

 Certainly not by turning the other cheek and meekly forgiving people who have done me serious wrongs. See Butcher's comment for an idea of what that will get you.

Quote

it makes me want to beg for a little less ignorance from you all."

You fountain of wisdom, you.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Cayo Hueso on March 26, 2004, 11:55:00 AM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 08:30:00, Carmel wrote:




Do you really think that if you were given 10 minutes on national television to talk about Straight that it would be best to rant and rave and tell people to off themselves? Yeah DUDE, Straight sucks ass, man...totally. Real credible.

No, the intentions in appearing on a television show to talk about Straight are different than the intentions here.  This is a place where people CAN talk about the abuse they endured with people who understand what they're talking about.

Quote

I would also like to know how so many people here talk about their abuse as if it happened five minutes ago...and there seems to be nothing else of note in their lives whatsoever.  How did you make it from then to now?  Have you just lived your life as if everything were ruined by Straight?  

I said in another thread that, for me, it's not so much the actual physical abuse or even the confrontational torture......it's the lasting effects of how they changed my psyche and how I deal with and process things.  I wish to God I could have dealt with this stuff a while ago and moved on, but I couldn't.  Between the damage they did and the continuing support of Straight by my family have left marks on me that will NEVER go away.  Some days I deal with it better than others.  Some days I feel like I want to take a fucking uzi and clear out the whole lot of them, staff, oldcomers, graduates....anyone connected with that place.  Then I come to my senses.  It's nice to be able to blow off a little steam on here sometimes.  It happens less and less the longer I've been visiting the boards.  When I first started, it was all so overwhelming and emotions were so raw that it was easy to rant and rave....and it helped.

I dont' sit around and feel like shit about the things that were done to me in there, I grieve for what I lost and the continuing damage to my psyche and general make-up of how I deal with things.  I realize that it's my responsibility to deal with this, but it doesn't mean that I can't still be angry about the fucking mind rape job they did.

The college idealists who fill the ranks of the environmental movement seem willing to do absolutely anything to save the biosphere, except take science courses and learn something about it.


--P.J. O'Rourke

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: The Butcher on March 26, 2004, 12:02:00 PM

Quote

Some days I feel like I want to take a fucking uzi and clear out the whole lot of them

I suggest that you put down the uzi. I've found  hands-on 'therapy' to be MUCH more gratifying. ::stab::

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 12:03:00 PM

Quote

<
I dont' sit around and feel like shit about the things that were done to me in there, I grieve for what I lost and the continuing damage to my psyche and general make-up of how I deal with things.  I realize that it's my responsibility to deal with this, but it doesn't mean that I can't still be angry about the fucking mind rape job they did.

Right you are, Cayo.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Carmel on March 26, 2004, 12:05:00 PM

Okay RTP your right...I condone abuse and want to let everyone who was a part of it get away with murder....Come on man.  

No one says anger isnt warranted...but looking at the big picture...anger just isnt the sole means to the end that you support.  Thats all I am saying.  I dont want to make peace with my abusers...but I do want peace for myself...and the longer I let the abusers and what they did have influence over what I think do and feel...even if its wiping my ass...then the abusers have won.  The abusers wanted to make us hurt...and hurt forever....and if we keep being hurt and in pain, then they have won.  Would you not agree?  If we cant see past our own nose because we are so filled with hate and anger just like them...have they not won?  

I dont support them, I dont condone their actions and I certainly dont want to walk off as if nothing happened with my tail between my legs......Im angry too....damn right Im angry and pissed off ....but if it means being a snake in the grass rather than a rampaging elephant in order to get these people to be held accountable....I'll be the first one on my belly.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: The Butcher on March 26, 2004, 12:08:00 PM

There's no need for anger! ::bangin::

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Cayo Hueso on March 26, 2004, 12:12:00 PM

That's where I think the real tragedy is.  I can get over any of the 'things' that were done to us in there, but taking us in our most vulnerable years (on many, many different levels) and forging this steel trap of self loathing and defeatism.  THAT is the lasting effect that place has on me.  We were so ill-equipped to deal with real life when we got out of that place, whether it be by running or graduating.  It took that time period that we were supposed to be learning and growing and physically fucked that with peanut butter diets, sleep deprivation, starvation...some girls ended up not menstrating for months or years.  What kind of physical and emotional stress has to happen for that[/b] to occur.  Then THAT wasn't enough....they have to 'break' us of all survival skills that we had at the time (and some of us had other abuses that we DEPENDED ON THOSE SURVIVAL SKILL FOR OUR VERY SURVIVAL) and replace them with some twisted, perverted version of how to live life.

I'm sorry, that is unforgivable for me at the moment.

You know, too many weirdos out there. At least with you people I know WHY you are weird!!!

Kady

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: The Butcher on March 26, 2004, 12:16:00 PM

I've been dealing just fine. If it weren't for Straight, I might have never discovered the sheer pleasure of cold-blooded murder.  :grin:

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 12:25:00 PM

Look, all I'm doing is advocating suicide for ex-Staff who won't make the same kind of effort against the program now as they did for the program then.  If any of them takes my suggestion and puts it to use, that's great--the world will be a little bit better without them.

This little semantic game you're playing regarding "winning" or "losing" being based on how I feel about my experience in Straight is ridiculous.  Try your pop-psychobabble somewhere else.

We all fight the program in different ways.  Some of us dose the coffee urns at NA meetings with LSD.  Some of us send emails to places that are currently employing abusers.  Some of us picket outside Mel's house.  And some of us encourage ex-Staff to kill themselves.  We all do our part.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Cayo Hueso on March 26, 2004, 12:28:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 09:25:00, RTP2003 wrote:




We all fight the program in different ways.  Some of us dose the coffee urns at NA meetings with LSD.  

 :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:

maybe if someone would have done that at the NA meeting I went to I would have stayed.  What a wonderful idea!!!!!!!!

The law in its majestic equality, forbids all men to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread - the rich as well as the poor

--Anatole France

_________________
St. Pete Straight
early 80s[ This Message was edited by: cayohueso on 2004-03-26 09:31 ]

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: The Butcher on March 26, 2004, 01:37:00 PM

Ears and noses will be the trophies of the day.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 26, 2004, 02:01:00 PM

Then why do you have such a pro-Straight attitude? In many of your posts it seems like you have some sort of nostalgia for Straight.  

 :question:
What recent pro-Straight posts have you been reading? I certainly don't consider my views on the program to be positive anymore.
 :question:

Don

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 02:17:00 PM

You only changed your (public) views because everybody posting on your alumni board had anti-Straight views.  I think you still look back with fond memories of all the good times you had in Straight.  If you have really changed, show it.  Drive a car bomb into Miller's house or something like that.  You were on Staff, and are guilty until you make a significant effort on behalf  of the Str8h8ers.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 26, 2004, 02:32:00 PM

Quote

"You only changed your (public) views because everybody posting on your alumni board had anti-Straight views.  I think you still look back with fond memories of all the good times you had in Straight.

 :lol:  :lol: So you THINK I look back with fond memories.  Well let me tell you Mark, what you think and what you know are two completly different things.

Yes people posted anti-Straight views on the Alumni site.  Just how in hell do you think I came to change my views?  I actually READ them and after some time, began to see the hell others there went through there.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 02:44:00 PM

So do you feel any remorse for participating in the abuse by being on Staff?  If so, how do you deal with it and what have you done to help in the fight against the program and its followers and sympathisers? You should be held to a higher standard than those who suffered in Straight.  You were on Staff, and by being on Staff, you actively helped to perpetuate the cycle of systematic abuse that went on, even if you did not physically or psychologically abuse others personally.  You made the choice to be on Staff, and if you have any decency whatsoever, you will make up for it by helping to destroy the program, now known as DFAF (and its offshoots, like KHK) and its loyalists.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 02:45:00 PM

me again--keep forgetting to log in.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 26, 2004, 02:55:00 PM

Quote

So do you feel any remorse for participating in the abuse by being on Staff?

Yes, I am sorry I ever went on Staff.  BIGGEST mistake of my life.  But not becaue I participated in abuse.  I didn't do that.  And when I saw it happen, I actually confronted a Senior Staff member for going too far with a client. A Trainee confronting a Senior wasn't something that happened too often, but I did it.

I'm not going to argue with you anymore on this subject because it's baseless.  Hold me to what ever standard you want.  

My way of fighting the program is providing a place for people to discuss what happened to us in Straight. That's my contibution to the cause.  I think that this and other discussion groups help prevent suicides something you seem to endorse.

Good day

Don

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 03:05:00 PM

You are right, Don, I do endorse suicide.  Particularly for ex-staff that aren't doing anything to destroy the program and its supporters.

As far as your "contribution"-- it may have turned into a place where the Straight experience can be discuseed, but your original intent was to reunite with other Straightlings and get nostalgic about fun on Staff.

Also, I don't think that confronting a Sr. staff member one time makes up for helping to perpetuate the abuse.  Unless you were taking notes for HRS while you were there, or doing some behind the scenes work to fuck up the program, you are as responsible as the other Staff you worked with.  Co-labored with. Collaborated with.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 03:06:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 12:05:00, Anonymous wrote:

"You are right, Don, I do endorse suicide.  Particularly for ex-staff that aren't doing anything to destroy the program and its supporters.



As far as your "contribution"-- it may have turned into a place where the Straight experience can be discuseed, but your original intent was to reunite with other Straightlings and get nostalgic about fun on Staff.



Also, I don't think that confronting a Sr. staff member one time makes up for helping to perpetuate the abuse.  Unless you were taking notes for HRS while you were there, or doing some behind the scenes work to fuck up the program, you are as responsible as the other Staff you worked with.  Co-labored with. Collaborated with.

"

Me again.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: The Butcher on March 26, 2004, 03:26:00 PM

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 26, 2004, 04:01:00 PM

Quote

As far as your "contribution"-- it may have turned into a place where the Straight experience can be discuseed, but your original intent was to reunite with other Straightlings and get nostalgic about fun on Staff.

You have all the anwers don't you?  You started this thread by making the outrageous notion that Jeff Leugers committing suicide was somehow noble.  Assuming of course that he did it because of his involement with Staff at Straight.  Fact is no one but God and Jeff knows why he killed himself. Straight may or may not have played a part in it.

When I say something about how I feel about your thread you falsly accuse me of having a pro-Straight opinion, again this is based on nothing specific, just what you THOUGHT!

Then you tell us that all Staff should be held to a higher standard and if they aren't "doing something" then they should kill themselves. Again this is what you THINK and frankly is pretty sick.

Yes, the Straight Inc. Alumni site started off as a pro-Straight site, but certainly not to get nostalgic about fun on Staff!  There was no fun on Staff.  I had no friends on Staff. I nearly took my own life on Staff because of the way I was treated by the other Staff members there. Reporting anything to HRS wasn't something that I thought about doing at the time.  

You need to understand that when I started the Alumni site, I was uneducated in what really happened and I was completly blind to it.  Since then my eyes have been opened.

But who are you to say that because I was on Staff I have to do anything just so I'll be somehow redeemed in your eyes?  I've made my peace with the people that I think I did wrongs to. I've become a better person because of the people I've met in this and other forums.  I don't owe you squat!

Don't forget to login when you reply.

Don

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Cayo Hueso on March 26, 2004, 04:11:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 13:01:00, Don Smith wrote:




You need to understand that when I started the Alumni site, I was uneducated in what really happened and I was completly blind to it.  Since then my eyes have been opened.

Don, I mean no disprespect.  I am sincerely interested in what you mean by this.  If you went through the program and were on staff are you saying that you never saw any of the things that we all did???

We should be careful to get out of an experience only the wisdom that is in it - and stop there;  lest we be like the cat that sits down on a hot stove-lid.  She will never sit down on a hot stove-lid again---and that is well;  but also she will never sit down on a cold one anymore.
Mark Twain

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 04:24:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 13:01:00, Don Smith wrote:


You have all the anwers don't you?

Why yes, as a matter of fact I do.

Quote

You started this thread by making the outrageous notion that Jeff Leugers committing suicide was somehow noble.  Assuming of course that he did it because of his involement with Staff at Straight.  Fact is no one but God and Jeff knows why he killed himself. Straight may or may not have played a part in it.

It was from guilt he felt for being on Staff.  I know this because my "conscious contact" with God is pretty good--He keeps me informed on what's happening, and sometimes asks me for advice.  That's how I know you're still brainwashed, too.

Quote

Then you tell us that all Staff should be held to a higher standard and if they aren't "doing something" then they should kill themselves. Again this is what you THINK and frankly is pretty sick.

  I stand by that statement.  Their crimes, committed on a daily basis, are such that they should kill themselves if they aren't working to destroy the program and its minions and spinoffs.

Quote

I nearly took my own life on Staff because of the way I was treated by the other Staff members there.

Not out of guilt or anything.  Looks like maybe you were starting to grow a conscience.

Quote

 
You need to understand that when I started the Alumni site, I was uneducated in what really happened and I was completly blind to it.  Since then my eyes have been opened.

 You were in Straight, then on Staff, and you were "uneducated" as to what really went on? Come on, Don.  That's ridiculous.  More likely you were repressing the guilt you felt.

Quote

But who are you to say that because I was on Staff I have to do anything just so I'll be somehow redeemed in your eyes?

I am a survivor of 13 months of systematic abuse by Staff members like you. Who the fuck do you think i am, asshole?

Quote

 I've made my peace with the people that I think I did wrongs to.

You participated in crimes against Humanity.  Maybe not to the extent that others did, but you were a willing participant.

Quote

I've become a better person because of the people I've met in this and other forums.  I don't owe you squat!

 Not me personally, but to the Survivors of Straight as a whole, you do.  Suicide would be a good start at repayment, since you are obviously unwilling to do anything other than whine about how rough you had it on staff.



Love ya, Staff.



_________________
"Mean and hateful since 1982"


Your sponsor says it's OK for you to drink[ This Message was edited by: RTP2003 on 2004-03-26 13:38 ]

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 05:33:00 PM

Quote

Then you tell us that all Staff should be held to a higher standard and if they aren't "doing something" then they should kill themselves.

Sounds cool to me.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 26, 2004, 06:31:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 13:24:00, RTP2003 wrote
Suicide would be a good start at repayment

Won't happen.  

Don

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 26, 2004, 06:50:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 15:31:00, Don Smith wrote:

"
On 2004-03-26 13:24:00, RTP2003 wrote

Suicide would be a good start at repayment



Won't happen.  



Don"

What a damn shame.

_________________
"Mean and hateful since 1982"


Your sponsor says it's OK for you to drink

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 07:58:00 PM

1) Admitted that I am powerless over being an unrepentant ex-Staff member and came to believe that suicide is my best, most honorable option.

2)Made a decision to put the barrel of a gun in my mouth.

3)Made a search for the highest caliber weapon and ammunition available.

4)Admitted to the Straight survivors that I am a dispicable human being whose only chance at redemption is to kill myself.

5)Made damn sure that there's a round in the chamber and the safety is off.

6)Sought to improve my conscious contact with God by going to meet him REAL soon.

7) Having received the gift of awareness, I will kill myself before I do any more harm to the Straight survivors and the world in general.


Congratulations!  You're a seven stepper now!  Too bad you won't be around for the celebration.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Carmel on March 26, 2004, 09:05:00 PM

Its unfortunate that none of you know a single thing about what death really is.  Or what it really means.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Majiktrvls on March 26, 2004, 10:36:00 PM

You are so right, Carmel. You lost your daughter last year, wasn't it?  I lost my man of 17 years, to suicide, two years ago. (And, no he was not on staff, never incarcerated in Straight, had no knowledge of the place, other than what he learned from me.)

He surely was in a very dark mental place to commit such an act.

I would not wish that state of mind on anyone, staff or not.
 
Obviously, Mark has not lost anyone to such traumatic events, or he would not even approach this subject with such general callousness.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 10:46:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 18:05:00, Carmel wrote:

"Its unfortunate that none of you know a single thing about what death really is.  Or what it really means."

I lost my mother, father, and fiance within 11 months of each other,and I have lost several close friends, so you can all take a flying fuck. I stand by my statements.  I know what death is as well as any of you assholes. Eat shit and die.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 26, 2004, 10:54:00 PM

Quote

I would not wish that state of mind on anyone, staff or not.

I would, and it would still be only a fraction of the suffering they are responsible for.  They dished it out, let 'em take it.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Majiktrvls on March 26, 2004, 11:12:00 PM

I am sorry that you are stuck in such a negative place. Perhaps, one day, you will find your way out. Until that time, I wish you the best of luck making peace with your demons.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Carmel on March 27, 2004, 02:39:00 AM

Who is to say that death isnt the ultimate reward?  We are not ones to judge what may be the answer to all these questions.  And to be honest...if death gives the same reward to a staff member..as it did to my daughter, to your mother, to your father...I wouldnt be wishing death on staff members if I were you.  What manner of justice would that be my friend?  Do you have so little respect that you would let them rub elbows with your beloved lost ones?

Open your heart and your mind will follow.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Dr. Miller Newton on March 27, 2004, 05:53:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 23:39:00, Carmel wrote:

"

Who is to say that death isnt the ultimate reward?

It is if you 7 Step from the new, improved, all-ages Straight, Inc. v2.0 ! Then you go to Heaven!  All cop outs, pull-offs, and terminations go to Hell.  If you die on Phases 1-2 you go to Limbo, and Phases 3-4 to Purgatory.  Fifth Phase is Purgatory, but with days off.  Love ya!

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 28, 2004, 12:32:00 PM

http://ash.spaink.net/nazgmethods (http://ash.spaink.net/nazgmethods).

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 28, 2004, 12:37:00 PM

This one should work: http://ash.spaink.net/ (http://ash.spaink.net/)

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: RTP2003 on March 28, 2004, 01:21:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-26 23:39:00, Carmel wrote:

"

Who is to say that death isnt the ultimate reward?  We are not ones to judge what may be the answer to all these questions.  And to be honest...if death gives the same reward to a staff member..as it did to my daughter, to your mother, to your father...I wouldnt be wishing death on staff members if I were you.  What manner of justice would that be my friend?  Do you have so little respect that you would let them rub elbows with your beloved lost ones?



Open your heart and your mind will follow.



"

We just don't know, do we Carmel?  I'm willing to bet that it's not like that.  Even if it were, I still would feel better knowing that some piece of shit ex-Staff member is not walking around, polluting the Earth with their vile stench, and wasting oxygen that would be better used lighting a cigarette.

Nice try, though.  I suppose I should be angry with you for trying to manipulate me by using my grief to get me to stop advocating suicide for those worthless shitheads, but I'm not.  I do feel sorry for you that you are unable to see the difference between the loss of someone who deserves to be mourned and the "loss" of some disgusting ex-Staff that is unwilling to "make amends" ( a perfectly valid phrase, until the Stepcult tried to hijack the meaning) or unable to due to the amount of suffering they caused.

The problem with Staff apologists is that they try to accept the ex-Staffer's claims that "they were brainwashed too".  This is unacceptable.  Sure, it is the Executive (I wish they were the 'Executed') Staff that deserves the blame for keeping the place open and running, but it was the JUNIOR AND SENIOR STAFF THAT DID THE BULK OF THE HANDS ON ABUSES AND PSYCHOLOGICAL TORTURE.  THE JUNIOR AND SENIOR STAFF WERE JUST AS RESPONSIBLE AS THE EXECUTIVE STAFF FOR MAKING STRAIGHT INC. A LIVING HELL.  The Executives may have started the car, but the daily drivers were Junior and Senior Staff.  To let them off the hook by allowing them to claim they were victims is a load of shit.  As I have stated elsewhere, unless they are putting at least as much effort into fighting the program now as they did in supporting it then, the world would be a much better place without them, and I for one encourage them to kill themselves with all deliberate speed.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 29, 2004, 02:04:00 AM

Quote

But not becaue I participated in abuse.  I didn't do that.

I want to ammend this statement.  I was so wrapped up in my own problems I was having with Staff that I don't honestly know if I ever did anything specifically abusive to the kids while I was on Staff.

With that said, if anyone who was in the program while I was on Staff believes that I was abusive toward them, please let me know so I we can work it out.

Respectfully,

Donald Smith

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 29, 2004, 05:07:00 AM

Damn some of the shit i read on this board makes me think that some people believe that they are still in straight , and furthermore that they are fucking misbehavers, and thus cooler than the rest of us poor schlubs who took the path of least resistance, what the fuck do you think that there is honor in that? that somehow you are justified in All of your actions? grow up and see things for what they really are, you whiny victimized  bithes.
P.S. you have no idea who this Jeff Luegers person was(who he became) he was probably someones son, husband, brother, father grandson, uncle....friend.
and for you to reduce him to his actions 15 years ago is immature and one dimensional, think about everyone in his life(wich by the way you have noyhing to do with) are hurting because of the loss of this guy, and not your own pathetic self centered lil universe
I'm Rick James BITCH!

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: toddbrown on March 29, 2004, 05:10:00 AM

Hey that last post(ANON) was me , so please direct all hate mail or pathetic replys my direction, I wouldnt want the stigma of posting anon hanging over my head, as it is decidecly uncool in certain circles around here.
I'm Rick James BITCH!

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: ehm on March 29, 2004, 12:24:00 PM

:nworthy:

Very nicely worded. " and for you to reduce him to his actions 24 years ago is immature and one dimensional," -- My personal favorite part. I changed the number because that's how long it's been for him. Glad to see you posting again.

 :wave:

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Froderik on March 29, 2004, 12:35:00 PM

Quote

Very nicely worded. " and for you to reduce him to his actions 22 years ago is immature and one dimensional," -- My personal favorite part.

Bull-fucking-shit! What difference does it make how long ago it was? I'm not referring to this Leuger guy specifically. Fuck you Morli and Todd Brown-stain, you two should stop having 69 and pull your tongues out of each other's asses. So if I killed someone 22 years ago, I guess that makes it OK, right??? How's the water down there in Texas? I hear it ain't too good, and it shows considering how fucking ADDLED both of your fucking brains seem to be! It's amazing that someone who suffered the abuse that you did (morli) could spew this sort of tripe. I guess you have some fucked-up reason for keeping those rose-colored glasses on. Go ahead now, say something like, "We were ALL victims..etc" Bullshit. It Depends. I'm not saying that I hate every staff member there ever was, but there were some who are GUILTY no matter how you slice it! That's all there is to it.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Dr. Miller Newton on March 29, 2004, 02:33:00 PM

The staff did what they had to do...why do you want to hold resentments?

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 29, 2004, 03:12:00 PM

Don, you were in Cincinnati?  Do you remember the floor there?  The nails, tacks or whatever they were that you guys restrained kids on.  You don't recall kids getting cut up on that fucked up floor.  Did you ever point out that the place needed to be retiled or carpeted.  Since your not going to kill yourself, will you at least cut yourself up will some old rusty nails?  And Todd, that whole family defense thing is so lame.  John Wayne Gacy was a father, husband, son, etc. if family were a defense for the guilty, I would take Robert Will's son down to the Texas killing machine and say, "Let him go." He is on death row for killing a police officier, though the physical evidence showing his innocence was not admitted as his trial.  [ This Message was edited by: Reagan Youth on 2004-04-03 01:06 ]

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Froderik on March 29, 2004, 04:04:00 PM

BUMP!  :smokin:

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Froderik on March 29, 2004, 04:22:00 PM

BBBBUUUUMMMPPPP.......  :roll:

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Don Smith on March 29, 2004, 05:43:00 PM

Quote

On 2004-03-29 12:12:00, Reagan Youth wrote:

"Don, you were in Cincinnati?  Do you remember the floor there?  The nails, tacks or whatever they were that you guys restrained kids on.  You don't recall kids getting cut up on that ###### up floor.

No I don't really.  Were you in Cincinnati?

Don

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on March 30, 2004, 11:31:00 AM

No, I was in Dallas.  We had a transfer named Jeff (Young I think was his last name)  from Cincinnati.  He told me a lot about that place.
I mainly remember him telling me about the nails and how one guy got his face cut from one.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: toddbrown on April 01, 2004, 02:51:00 AM

what are you so butt hurt about?

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: toddbrown on April 01, 2004, 02:55:00 AM

Froderick, whats your problem with me?
is it possible that you are wrong about the whole ALL STAFF MEMBERS MUST DIE thing?
seriousley, how old are you anyway?
would you say that shit to peoples face?
I doubt it, as it is undeniably retarded.
Seriousley, get over it, get a life.
I cant wait to here your retoric reply to this one by the way, because you know that your reply is only going to make you look stupid, yet you cannot just let it go.
So what say you?

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Froderik on April 01, 2004, 09:51:00 AM

Quote

and for you to reduce him to his actions 22 years ago is immature and one dimensional

I don't think so. I say "reduce" him to it, who gives a flying fuck how long ago it was. Now, this only applies if he was abusive. Personally, I don't have quite as much of a bone to pick w/ ex-staff as some others here, but if they are GUILTY, and especially if they FUCKED WITH ME PERSONALLY, I don't have a problem with revenge, or them killing themselves. And oh hell yeah, I'd say it to someone's face. It's not really YOU that I have a problem with these days, so much as it is Morli (no explanation should be needed here) And, I'd like to add that I have friends TODAY that were staff members in VA straight when I was there - three of them, in fact, that I can think of. Sorry for the obscenity back there, it was really meant for Morli. I hope this has answered your questions.

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Froderik on April 01, 2004, 02:07:00 PM

Just wanted to bump this thread...  ::rainbow::

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: toddbrown on April 03, 2004, 04:01:00 AM

Fair enough Froderick, fair enough

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: toddbrown on April 03, 2004, 04:02:00 AM

p.s. is your avitar hellboy?

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Froderik on April 03, 2004, 11:45:00 AM

Someone else will have to answer that one.  :question:
I just like the way it looks.  :em:

Title: Jeff Leugers Fan Club
Post by: Anonymous on April 03, 2004, 11:03:00 PM

I can see why you might have thought that it is, but I don't know.

http://www.devildinosaur.com/hellboy.jpg (http://www.devildinosaur.com/hellboy.jpg)