Fornits

Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Carey on November 04, 2003, 10:27:00 PM

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 04, 2003, 10:27:00 PM
U.S. Representative George Millar, Senior Democrat on the Committee on Education and the Workforce, sent a letter to U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft yesterday requesting a federal investigation into allegations of abuse by the WorldWide Association of Specialty Programs (WWASP).

One of Rep. Millar's congressional aids had told The Tico Times in September that the U.S. lawmaker was preparing to request a federal probe following the closure of Costa Rica's WWASP-affiliated Dundee Ranch Academy and allegations of abuse at other WWASP facilities in the United States, Jamaica and Mexico (TT, Sept. 12).

WWASP is the umbrella organization under which Dundee Ranch Academy, a behavior-modification program for troubled teens, operated here, before being closed last May following government interventions to investigate allegations of rights abuse (TT, May 23).

"I am requesting, in my capacity as Senior Democratic Member, that you initiate a formal investigation into allegations of child abuse, human rights violations, fraudulent and deceptive advertising, fraud and unjust enrichment under the Internal Revenue Code, and violations of other Federal civil or criminal laws by [WWASP] and its founders," reads the congressman's letter to Ashcroft.

Dundee Ranch was one of 11 WWASP programs in the United States and abroad. An estimated 2,200 children were enrolled in the residential programs, including 200 in Dundee Ranch.

"There have been serious allegations that hundreds of children have been mistreated or neglected and that their legal rights have been regularly flaunted. There are also hundreds of parents who assert that they were drawn into the program by misleading advertising. We believe that the Department of Justice should investigate whether federal laws concerning child abuse and neglect, interstate commerce or unfair or deceptive advertising have been broken by WWASPS or those operating these facilities," the letter reads.

The letter to Ashcroft mentions that "Dundee Ranch was closed after Costa Rican authorities charged the facility with violating children's civil rights," and quotes testimony of abuse by former Dundee Ranch director Amberley Knight, who first told The Tico Times last March that the academy "is poorly managed, takes financial advantage of parents in crisis, and puts teens in physical and emotional risk " (TT, March 14).

The letter concludes by asking Ashcroft to "please provide by Nov. 17, 2003, a written report on steps you have taken to initiate an investigation of all allegations."


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 12:18:00 AM
is this posted on any news sites?
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 05:52:00 AM
http://www.ticotimes.net/daily.htm#story_two (http://www.ticotimes.net/daily.htm#story_two)
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 05, 2003, 09:04:00 AM
What do ya'll suppose Scary John will do?

The trouble with practical jokes is that very often they get elected.

Will Rogers, American humorist, political commentator and cowboy philosopher

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 11:28:00 AM
Apparently Tim Rogers is unaware Carey B from Louisianna is a stool pigeon who rats out the anti wwasp people to wwasp attorneys.

He must still think she is anti wwasp oppose to pro wwasp.

I guess he doesnt know Carey hates Amberly K. almost as much as she hates Sue S. Enough to turn squealer.To jeopordize the kids still in wwasp facilities.

We KNOW the truth about Carey Bock the wanna be.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 11:54:00 AM
I thought some of you might want to write something similar to your elected officals. You can find them at:
 
http://www.house.gov/writerep/ (http://www.house.gov/writerep/)
 
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_i ... m?State=KY (http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm?State=KY)
 
 
 

Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2003 11:36 AM
Subject: WWASP Federal Criminal Investigation


Dear Senator/ Representive: ,

I wish this had been you, making this request. I hope you will now join ranks with Representative Millar in asking for this investigation. I have been writing and calling your office for a more than a year now, about this very issue. There is a related situation that may directly negatively effect the Republican party; Which is that these people who make up WWASP are the largest contributors to the party in Utah - and this is likely to be viewed as tainted money when the public understands the actions behind it. As a republican voter, this adds to my concerns; but first and foremost is stopping this business of warehousing troubled young men and women and subduing them by physical, emotional and mental abuse.

Most respectfully yours -

 Name

Phone #

Address


ATTACH THE STORY - COPY & PASTE, THEY WONT TAKE ATTACHMENTS
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 12:06:00 PM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 08:54:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I thought some of you might want to write something similar to your elected officals. You can find them at:

 

http://www.house.gov/writerep/ (http://www.house.gov/writerep/)

 

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_i ... m?State=KY (http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm?State=KY)

 

 

 



Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2003 11:36 AM

Subject: WWASP Federal Criminal Investigation





Dear Senator/ Representive: ,



I wish this had been you, making this request. I hope you will now join ranks with Representative Millar in asking for this investigation. I have been writing and calling your office for a more than a year now, about this very issue. There is a related situation that may directly negatively effect the Republican party; Which is that these people who make up WWASP are the largest contributors to the party in Utah - and this is likely to be viewed as tainted money when the public understands the actions behind it. As a republican voter, this adds to my concerns; but first and foremost is stopping this business of warehousing troubled young men and women and subduing them by physical, emotional and mental abuse.



Most respectfully yours -



 Name



Phone #



Address





ATTACH THE STORY - COPY & PASTE, THEY WONT TAKE ATTACHMENTS"


You might want to change the Kentucky I.D. attached to your search inquiry which is a dead givaway as to who posted this message.

 :wave:
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 12:24:00 PM
Who cares who posted this Carey.  It is to help the kids that are still in these programs.  All, please put your energy where it can be of use and write to your representatives to save these kids!
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 02:01:00 PM
You might want to change the Kentucky I.D. attached to your search inquiry which is a dead givaway as to who posted this message.

Well shut my mouth and call me corn bread ; )

Cats out of the bag and the hounds is on the trail.

In all seriousness, I had some difficulty getting a link that didn't indicate the state - and wasn't willing to not post it due to this glitch.

I hope people will take the time and trouble to respectfully write and wanted to save them as much work as possible in the hope more will take the time to do the writing.

By the way - I expect at least half a dozen Ky letters to go out.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 03:52:00 PM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 02:52:00, Anonymous wrote:

"http://www.ticotimes.net/daily.htm#story_two"


Thanks Carey!
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 05, 2003, 04:14:00 PM
From the stats page (click Whos Online to the left)

Number of Users (Not from mirror)  667  
Active Topics (posts witin 5 days) 57 Active Users (posts witin 30 days) 95
New Users (past 7 days) 10

How many from Kentucky? The world may never know...

No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the sources of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power.
P. J. O'Rourke

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 05, 2003, 04:17:00 PM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 08:28:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

We KNOW the truth about Carey Bock the wanna be."


Do you know the truth about whether or not Sue refered Ian August to Skyline Journey before he died? Seems like a reasonable question. She announced the PURE/SJ relationship a couple of months before he died and boasted that she refers families there. But, for some damned reason, no one will answer the question?


On reading through this thread again, I'm confused about a couple of things. First, where does Tim Rogers' article reference Carey? What would give anyone the impression that anything he wrote had anything to do with her? And what makes anyone think she posted the comment about Kentucky?

You people are frigging amazing! Every time ya'll get going I become more and more convinced that PURE is just a red herring.

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones



_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
American drug war P.O.W.
   10/80 - 10/82
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
Anonymity Anonymous
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 04:26:00 PM
The representative's name is Miller, not "Millar"-- fyi.  Just in case people use that as an example of how the article has got to be wrong, etc.

But they really should have fixed the typo.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 04:30:00 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/05/natio ... ner=GOOGLE (http://www.nytimes.com/2003/11/05/national/05BRFS4.html?ex=1068613200&en=b152c7e08dfc6ecf&ei=5062&partner=GOOGLE)
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 04:51:00 PM
Ginger,

What does Carey being a snitch have to do with Skyline ?

One has nothing to do with the other.

For some reason you and Carey do not seem to be able to see the bigger picture .

What I DO know is Carey is a snitch .Probaly for money.  Hypocrite.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 04:59:00 PM
Ginger,

I hate to bring this to your attention. YOU dont know everything.In fact you know very little it seems about many of the things that have been posted on this site.

Will I elaborate? no!
Carey will share with WWASP.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 05, 2003, 06:11:00 PM
Oh, here we go with the doctrine of devine enlightenment. I have a pretty good idea of what's been posted to these forums because I read the stuff. I also have a better than average chance of making an accurate guess as to who posted what. It's not that I don't know, it's that I don't find a lot of the accusations very compelling.

And why do you find these accusations so compelling? I've asked and asked and no one has given me any real compelling reason to believe any of it.

You folks keep making these wild accusations and slanderous statements about Carey but there's never any factual info to back them up stronger than "Well I heard that a WWASP lawyer said that...".

Meanwhile, I ask again and again about which schools PURE refers to and all I get back in response is "Carey is a ....." So I do a little poking and find that PURE refered to SJ (till they got shut down?) and ask if anyone knew. What comes back is "Well don't you know Carey...."

Do you see a pattern developing here? I see a pattern. It's just getting so damned old and boring.

Will ya' cut it out? What the hell has your apparently unfounded opinions about Carey got to do with the Tico Times article, the letter to John Walters or helping the kids still in WWASP? Don't you think WWASP would be a little pissed if they paid someone and that someone turned around and kept drawing attention to all the bad PR about them?


Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not.
Anonymity Anonymous (http://fornits.com/anonanon)
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 05, 2003, 06:36:00 PM
Those who are paranoid are the PUREsts.  No one else has any reason to be paranoid.  I have already told everyone on this board that I will share my families entire experience with anyone and everyone who is interested.  If WWASP wants to know what happened from beginning to end, I will share with them. I have nothing to hide.  All I ever wanted was information,  I wanted all of the information that was available on Dundee when my boys were there.  I would be a hypocrit if I were not willing now to share all of the information I have on what has transpired over the past year with those who are and were involved.  Why should I not.  I have done nothing illegal and I have done nothing that is questionable to those who are independent of the industry.

Your paranoia comes from those with whom you are associated...PURE, Inc.  If you have been pulled into a web of deceipt by PURE, I am sure it is not the first time for you to have been deceived by this industry.  Afterall, if you have come to know Sue, it is most likely because you have already been stung by the WWASP.  Learn from you mistakes.  

Also, by the way, I don't hate Amberly, I just don't understand why she waited 7 whole months before she spoke out against Dundee.  She left the program in August and waited until March to speak publically.  She knew what I was going through, she knew how many directors had come and gone, and she knew exactly what was happening to the kids who were there.  I also know that it was around the time that she was put in contact with Sue's attorneys that she decided to speak out about the abuse.  Once again Sue trying to fight her battle while using others.  Sue contaminates everyone's testimony.  When will you people wake up and see that.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 05, 2003, 07:04:00 PM
Carey, I can make an educated guess as to why it took Amberly months to come around to the decision to testify against her cult. Two words. Stockholm Syndrome. Damned near all of us have experienced it firsthand to some degree or another.

For the community to have 10% to 25% of its men unable to vote or unable to access credit or other privileges of citizenship for the rest of their lives in some states creates a permanently diminished
group within society.
Jeremy Travis, Urban Institute

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 07:32:00 PM
Ginger,

I don't have any idea about Skyline or Sue's involment. That has nothing to do with me.

My involment has to do with what happened to my son. I found Pure the same way Carey found Pure. On the web. Carey neglects to mention the Pure people were nice to her. She has stabbed them in the back.
No worries all will be vindicated on their behalf.

Carey paronoid is inaccurate.There is no way I am paronoid. Pissed maybe.When you share information with wwasp attorneys you hurt our families.

What YOUR family went through is insignificant to what some of the other kids and families experienced.
YOU are a hypocrite. You know it,I know it.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 05, 2003, 08:12:00 PM
Here's something on the relationship between PURE and Skyline:

http://www.bridgetounderstanding.com/cg ... i?read=460 (http://www.bridgetounderstanding.com/cgi-bin/infoforum.cgi?read=460)

Looks asthough PURE wasn't at all nice to Ian August, now were they?

As to Carey being a traitor, I still have seen no evidence to back up the accusations. And I have seen a lot of bullshit coming along with those accusations and that tends to tank their credibility even further.

One thing I know for sure, helping PURE does not necessarily hurt WWASP and, even if it did, so what? PURE sends kids in handcuffs to abusive programs just like WWASP does. Hitler vs. Stalin; Right wing sadistic zealots or left wing sadistic zealots; kicked in the head with the right boot or kicked in the head with the left; six of these, half dozen of the other.

Looks to me asif Carey just got caught in the middle.

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
-- Aristotle

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 05, 2003, 08:18:00 PM
I did not find PURE on the net.  You might have but I didn't.  I found Sue Scheff through Ton Burton.  I knew nothing about PURE in the beginning.  

The PURE people were nice to me?  How is that?  Can you give me some examples of how you think they were nice to me?  I think they exploited me.  Afterall, they recommended the "con" ed con, Bozak.  The one who hid behind the fence at Dundee.  The one who has given out my ss number to Marti and the gang. The one who did not want to be seen.

Go ahead tell me how they helped me.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Deborah on November 05, 2003, 09:31:00 PM
Theirrrrr Baaack.  :roll:

Just wanted to say that it doesn't appear that PURE referred Ian's mother to Skyline. If Brooke Adams article was accurate it stated that she was referred by an Ed Con in Austin, Tx.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 10:19:00 PM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 16:32:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Ginger,



I don't have any idea about Skyline or Sue's involment. That has nothing to do with me.



My involment has to do with what happened to my son. I found Pure the same way Carey found Pure. On the web. Carey neglects to mention the Pure people were nice to her. She has stabbed them in the back.

No worries all will be vindicated on their behalf.



Carey paronoid is inaccurate.There is no way I am paronoid. Pissed maybe.When you share information with wwasp attorneys you hurt our families.



What YOUR family went through is insignificant to what some of the other kids and families experienced.

YOU are a hypocrite. You know it,I know it. "


In many parents and professionals? opinions, the very fine line of their cult-like program is enough to destroy many families and children, as we have many testimonials to. For any parents that want names and telephone numbers of post-WWASP families, please let us know. (Please review some of our previous Newsletters for more true stories.) Again, as a once follower, I am speaking from experience. I used to ?sell? their program and market their schools to gain free months? tuition. Yes, whenever you refer a family, you would get a free month! What a concept, and I fell for it! Being involved in selling the program controls your mind in the consistency of ?how great they are? when in reality, you have not even spoken to your child. I had no idea how the program was working; I was just trained to sell like a good follower.

From Sue Scheff's "true story"
http://www.helpyourteens.com/true_story.html (http://www.helpyourteens.com/true_story.html)

 :???:
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 05, 2003, 10:26:00 PM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 19:19:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2003-11-05 16:32:00, Anonymous wrote:


"Ginger,





I don't have any idea about Skyline or Sue's involment. That has nothing to do with me.





My involment has to do with what happened to my son. I found Pure the same way Carey found Pure. On the web. Carey neglects to mention the Pure people were nice to her. She has stabbed them in the back.


No worries all will be vindicated on their behalf.





Carey paronoid is inaccurate.There is no way I am paronoid. Pissed maybe.When you share information with wwasp attorneys you hurt our families.





What YOUR family went through is insignificant to what some of the other kids and families experienced.


YOU are a hypocrite. You know it,I know it. "





In many parents and professionals? opinions, the very fine line of their cult-like program is enough to destroy many families and children, as we have many testimonials to. For any parents that want names and telephone numbers of post-WWASP families, please let us know. (Please review some of our previous Newsletters for more true stories.) Again, as a once follower, I am speaking from experience. I used to ?sell? their program and market their schools to gain free months? tuition. Yes, whenever you refer a family, you would get a free month! What a concept, and I fell for it! Being involved in selling the program controls your mind in the consistency of ?how great they are? when in reality, you have not even spoken to your child. I had no idea how the program was working; I was just trained to sell like a good follower.



From Sue Scheff's "true story"

http://www.helpyourteens.com/true_story.html (http://www.helpyourteens.com/true_story.html)



 :eek:
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 06, 2003, 12:49:00 AM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 18:31:00, Deborah wrote:

"

Theirrrrr Baaack.  :roll:



Just wanted to say that it doesn't appear that PURE referred Ian's mother to Skyline. If Brooke Adams article was accurate it stated that she was referred by an Ed Con in Austin, Tx.

"


The point is that she might just as well have. She sent other kids there, right? Where else does she send them and what reason do I have to believe that PURE is any better than WWASP? Certainly if history is any instruction, they're not any more different than Straight was from The Seed or than WWASP is from CEDU or than Elan is from Daytop or than SAFE is from Straight.

The strength of the Constitution lies entirely in the determination of each citizen to defend it. Only if every single citizen feels duty bound to do his share in this defense are constitutional rights secure.
-- Albert Einstein

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 06, 2003, 12:57:00 AM
Quote
On 2003-11-05 19:19:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I had no idea how the program was working; I was just trained to sell like a good follower.

From Sue Scheff's "true story"
http://www.helpyourteens.com/true_story.html (http://www.helpyourteens.com/true_story.html)



And this is different from what they're doing now, exactly how? Will someone please explain the difference?


All our liberties are due to men who, when their conscience has compelled them, have broken the laws of the land.
--William Kingdon Clifford



_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
American drug war P.O.W.
   10/80 - 10/82
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
Anonymity Anonymous
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 06, 2003, 01:09:00 AM
That stuff doesn't strike me as hypocritical. I understand and deeply apreciate parents who come to their senses. Wes did it. My dad did it. I know there have been many of them, and thank God for them.

What strikes me as hypocritical are that they endourse escort services to kidnap unwilling young adults to force them into programs and that they attack and smear instead of engaging in open dialog just like some folks I used to know.

Which brings me to a question. How in the hell did we get from U.S. Representative George Miller, Senior Democrat on the Committee on Education and the Workforce, having sent a letter to U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft yesterday requesting a federal investigation into allegations of abuse by the WorldWide Association of Specialty Programs (WWASP) speculation about what Carey Bock is up to these days or what her diabolical motives might be?

What I see with my own little eyes is that Carey spotted this story and spread it, which does not seem like the sort of thing someone in the employ of WWASP is likely to do. Then I see a bunch of people jumping all over her case for it, completely derailing any meaningful conversation about this latest news.

So if anyone wants to talk about the news, I've reposted the article and the link to the Tico Times article here:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=9&0 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=3388&forum=9&0)

 

It really puzzles me to see Marijuana connected with Narcotics - Dope and all that crap?it's a thousand times better than whiskey - it's an Assistant - a friend.
Louis Armstrong

Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 06, 2003, 08:31:00 AM
Quote
I truthfully just wanted help for my child and thought for the money I was paying, it must be good."


Did you not ask how your money was being spent to help your child?  Did you just assume that because it cost a lot it must be good?

If you support Sue, you are not trying to help kids.  You are mad because you spent a lot of money and are not satisfied with what you got for it.  If you support Sue then you suppor the industry and the inherent risk within.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 06, 2003, 09:08:00 AM
Yes !

Yes I do still think Craey is a hypocrtite.

How convient for you that Sue can easily be used as a scapegoat for your narrow ,limited presepective on the situation.

My child was mistreated by WWASP before I ever found Pure.   BEFORE.

Is that fact being missed here.

WWASP mistreated my child.

So easy for Carey to say we are disappointed because we spent money. Bull crap. That is not the issuse. You know it.

Save your Pure nonsense. Whatever you think you know about Pure is secondary to Carey being a snitch (probably for money).

What goes around comes around they say.

My expeierence of you,you are extremly shallow.
To defend a snitch is unconscionable to me. No excuse ever.

Where I grew up snitches were taken to the back alley beat up and dumped in the ocean for fish food.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 06, 2003, 10:36:00 AM
You calling me a snitch implies that someone was doing something shady.  You calling me a snitch implies that I am informing others of wrong doing.  Are you implying that you were doing something shady?  Are you implying that Sue was doing something shady?  Who exactly is it that you claim I am snitching on?  

After you tell me who I am snitching on then tell me how is it that I am a snitch.  Is it because I am willing to share my story with everyone?  Is that what makes me a snitch?  Does telling what happened to me and my family make me a snitch?

You are trying to control who I talk to.  You can't do that.  You can't control people.  Have you not learned that by now.  Look at what you did to your child while trying to control him/her.  

Telling what happened to me and my family is not hurting you.  What is hurting you and your family is your affiliation with Sue.  Once you realize that and can separate yourself from others like sue who promote these types of programs then maybe you will be able to help yourself and your family.  Until then, you are only putting one program down in order to promote and protect another.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 06, 2003, 10:51:00 AM
Quote
Where I grew up snitches were taken to the back alley beat up and dumped in the ocean for fish food.


Since that is how you see life, why then are you so upset about what you say has happened to your child.  You sent he/she to program to straighten him/her out for his or her own wrong doing.  Sounds to me like that is what you would expect. YOu know, beat the shit out of your child, scare the shit out of your child, straighten him out, then send him home. Problem is, it must not have worked, you must not have gotten what you paid for.  It just did not work out the way you planned.  So now you are mad.  

I take that as a personal threat.  You know who the dangerous people are.  People like YOU.  Parents like you.   People who need to control everyone and everything.  The more I hear you people talk the more I realize just how STUPID you are.  I use to could not for the life of me understand how parents such as yourself could be so blindly led...but it all becomes clearer and clearer with every  statement you make.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 06, 2003, 07:12:00 PM
Anon, do you care to elaborate?
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 10, 2003, 07:44:00 AM
Oh Anon, where did you go?  Why are you not willing to answer the questions?
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 10, 2003, 10:43:00 AM
Can't answer for the other anon - but heres a few for you Carey O -

How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.

Did you first call them, or did they call you?

What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?

Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?

Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?

What do you suppose they intend to do with it?

How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?

Did you think about that at all?

Do you care?

Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?

Just courious.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 10, 2003, 10:46:00 AM
Rich Titsch's forum is like a ghost town. Really like a ghost town; despite the fact that there have been only a couple of posts in the last couple of days, the hit counter keeps on running. It's like you can feel the eyes on you, but there's nobody showing themselves.

http://www.bulletinboards.com/view.cfm? ... ch#537688L (http://www.bulletinboards.com/view.cfm?comcode=Titsch#537688L)

SOMEbody's reading, but nobody's saying a thing. I bet if I crawled my logs right now, I'd come up with a consistent pattern of hits from certain users located in Utah, too.

(Hi!  :wave: You know we love you. A lot of us were once brainwashed maniacle zealots ourselves, just like you, after all.)

I think they may have suddenly realized that the dedicated defenders are doing more harm than good by voicing their real thoughts and the honchos have issued a moratorium on public discussion.

Honestly, I was surprised to see them come out like this in the first place. When I was in the Program, it was verboten to even read news about it, far less respond publicly to it.

               The body of
        Benjamin Franklin, printer,
      (Like the cover of an old book,
            Its contents worn out,
    And scripts of it's lettering and gilding)
       Lies Here, food for worms!
     Yet the work itself shall not be lost,
For it will, as he believed, appear once more
                 In a new
         And more beautiful edition,
          Corrected and amended
                By it's Author!

Epitaph for himself.

--Benjamin Franklin 1706-1790



_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
American drug war P.O.W.
   10/80 - 10/82
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
Anonymity Anonymous
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 10, 2003, 04:38:00 PM
Quote
How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.

Anon, you want to know how long I have been communicating with WWASP.  I don't mind at all sharing that with you.  I have been talking with WWASP since July of 2002.  That was when I sent my first email stating my objections to my boys placement within their program. It was sent directly to Amberly Knight, the director at the time of my boys incarceration.

Quote
Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?


Are you talking about me telling about what has happened to my family?
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 10, 2003, 07:49:00 PM
Carey O

you skipped a bunch.
Wanna try again?

And remember, your problem isn't with wwasp, but with Dundee. wwasp didn't hurt your family. Dundee did.
Shall I find the quote for you?

I'm not asking when you wrote Dundee.

I'm not talking about your family.

Now, lets try this again. . .

How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.

Did you first call them, or did they call you?

What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?

Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?

Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?

What do you suppose they intend to do with it?

How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?

Did you think about that at all?

Do you care?

Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?

Just courious.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 10, 2003, 09:13:00 PM
Anon O
Quote
I'm not asking when you wrote Dundee.


Are you saying that Dundee is not part of WWASP?  Either you think it is or you think it isn't.   Tell me, what do you think, is it or is it not?  

After you answer that question, give your real name, if you have the balls, and I will gladly answer all of your questions.  I have nothing to hide...that is why I post as Carey and not Anon.  

The difference in me and you is that I don't have to hide behind an Anon posting because I speak the truth.  You on the other hand fear your very own words.  

Why do you fear my communication with WWASP?  What would I have to share that could or would be so detrimental to one such as yourself.  You know everything about my experience.  

If you answer this one questions I will answer all of yours.   How can my telling about my experience with Sue Scheff, Trekers, Amberly, Dundee and Bozak hurt kids?
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2003, 02:04:00 PM
Are you saying that Dundee is not part of WWASP? Either you think it is or you think it isn't. Tell me, what do you think, is it or is it not?


Its you who made the distinction my dear -


Carey
A regular around here

Joined: 2003-01-18
Posts: 414 Posted: 2003-08-02 08:52:00

However, I will be specific and state that my issues were with Dundee. I have had very little dealings with WWASP,

Carey
A regular around here

Joined: 2003-01-18
Posts: 414 Posted: 2003-08-03 08:10:00

What I am coming to realize is that my family has been hurt by Dundee (and all of its staff) and PURE, Inc. not WWASP.

Carey
A regular around here

Joined: 2003-01-18
Posts: 415 This one is joke...Sue's not in it for the money...right.
Posted: 2003-09-01 07:14:00

I am going to say this again, as I know I have stated it in the past, WWASP did not hurt me and my boys, Dundee, PURE, Bozak, Amberly and Joe are the ones who are responsible for that.



Carey
A regular around here

Joined: 2003-01-18
Posts: 418 Posted: 2003-10-13 18:03:00

Do you know what a snitch is? It is an informer. Yep, that is me, an informer. But then I believe in information. Information is what helps us to make better decisions. I have been informing people about what has happened to me from the very beginning...right here on a public forum and else where. I have been informing people privately who inquire.

Carey
A regular around here

Joined: 2003-01-18
Posts: 418 Posted: 2003-10-14 08:11:00

I will give any and all information I have on PURE and Trekers to WWASP. What ever they have not picked up here on this forum, they are welcome to. Why? Why not? I do not hold any secret information. What I have to share is for the public. What I have to share can't hurt kids. It can hurt others, but that is not my concern.



~~~~~~
O Scary O Carey O -  It?s the ?others? whom you?ve tried to help WWASP silence, who are sticking their necks out to inform the parents of the kids and thereby help the kids.

You can cut out the BS. You don?t care anything about anyone besides yourself; and you don?t care what kind of damage you leave in your wake as long as your gratifying your own selfish desires.  Can everybody say Malignant Narcissist? ~~~~~~~
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 11, 2003, 02:58:00 PM
Quote
Are you saying that Dundee is not part of WWASP? Either you think it is or you think it isn't. Tell me, what do you think, is it or is it not?

I know what I think.  I was asking you what you think.  If you think Dundee is part of WWASP then the first person I spoke to was Amberly.  

Quote
I am going to say this again, as I know I have stated it in the past, WWASP did not hurt me and my boys, Dundee, PURE, Bozak, Amberly and Joe are the ones who are responsible for that.

That is exactly how I feel.  You talking about being exploited...these people did the exploiting.  PURE and Bozak are only interested in making money off of those whom they claim to be helping while Amberly and Joe were both directors at the school in which my kids were being held.  They both knew I was against their placement there.  Why if Amberly knew about the abuses, did she wait so long to come forward?  I'll tell you why, it was because I had posted on the Boarding School Truth site that she was invovled in the rape.  It was then that she came forward.  She told me she would rather have walked away and moved on with her life.  I was making that impossible for her by dragging her name into the ordeal. Joe, well I am not even going to go there.

Quote
Do you know what a snitch is? It is an informer. Yep, that is me, an informer. But then I believe in information. Information is what helps us to make better decisions. I have been informing people about what has happened to me from the very beginning...right here on a public forum and else where. I have been informing people privately who inquire.


You people who keep calling me a snitch are implying that you were doing something wrong.  Is that what you feel?  Do you feel like you were doing something wrong?  I will inform everyone who wants to know exactly what has transpired over the last year.  It is my experience and it is something that people need to know.  If you feel that by sharing this information I am snitching on you...then you probably should not have been doing what ever it is you were doing.  I know that through the process of everything that I have done, I have done nothing wrong.  I am only guilty of sharing information and not like you, trying to control information.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2003, 03:03:00 PM
Wanna try again?



How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.

Did you first call them, or did they call you?

What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?

Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?

Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?

What do you suppose they intend to do with it?

How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?

Did you think about that at all?

Do you care?

Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?

Just courious.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 11, 2003, 03:08:00 PM
Duc & Wev.  That would be you...who are you?  Oh duk I forgot you are Anon.  How much more can you duk and wev than that?

Answer, is Dundee part of WWASP?  What is your opinion? You can not have it both ways, either they are or they are not.

Quote
How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.


I answered your question.  I first spoke with Amberly back in July of 2002.  This is when my issues with the program began.  This is when it all began and I started to realize that something was not right.  This is when I began to know that someone was controling  and limiting the flow of information.  

Why?  What does everyone including you, have to hide.  What is there about you to snitch on?  Why are you afraid of who you are?  Why can you not hold your head up high and speak out loud?  As a real person and not an Anon...a duk & wever?

[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-11-11 12:12 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-11-11 12:19 ]
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antibody? on November 11, 2003, 03:25:00 PM
HOW TO GET IT ON TV AND IN THE NEWS
Posted: 2003-11-11 12:21:00  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 CBS - 60 min and others
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/02/ ... 1941.shtml (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/02/22/utility/main501941.shtml)

E mail -- then submit Story

Phone calls to Ed Bradley work Best
Here are the links

MSNBC - Newsweek
http://www.msnbc.com/news/NW-front_Front.asp?ta=y#more (http://www.msnbc.com/news/NW-front_Front.asp?ta=y#more)

Go to
Link to Editor Then
E mail

ABC NEWS
http://abc.go.com/ (http://abc.go.com/)

Also Search Fox News, NY Times Editorial
Spokesman Review Newspaper in Spokane Washington and any others you know of
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2003, 06:08:00 PM
Wanna try again?



How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.

Did you first call them, or did they call you?

What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?

Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?

Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?

What do you suppose they intend to do with it?

How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?

Did you think about that at all?

Do you care?

Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?

Just courious.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2003, 06:25:00 PM
Quote
On 2003-11-11 15:08:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Wanna try again?







How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.



Did you first call them, or did they call you?



What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?



Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?



Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?



What do you suppose they intend to do with it?



How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?



Did you think about that at all?



Do you care?



Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?



Just courious.



"


What is the connection between PURE and helping kids?  I went to their website and it looks to me like they are all about HELPING TROUBLED PARENTS.

 :scared:
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2003, 07:55:00 PM
And yet again



How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.



Did you first call them, or did they call you?



What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?



Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?



Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?



What do you suppose they intend to do with it?



How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?



Did you think about that at all?



Do you care?



Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?



Just courious.



"
 



What is the connection between PURE and helping kids? I went to their website and it looks to me like they are all about HELPING TROUBLED PARENTS.

 
Whom do we know who can't help using all caps to stress a point? Seems familiar. . .
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2003, 08:50:00 PM
ANON, try asking Carey some questions that actually warrant an answer and perhaps you'll get some.  These inane questions are doing nothing but making you look like a stupid head.  

 :roll:
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 13, 2003, 07:24:00 PM
ANON, try asking Carey some questions that actually warrant an answer and perhaps you'll get some. These inane questions are doing nothing but making you look like a stupid head.


Inane or not, the questions warrent an answer. I'd ventur to guess many more people are intrested in the answers than think me a 'stupid head' for asking.
What kind of person is it that believes their views and opinions the only ones that matter?
There is a name for you people.
I'd rather be a stupid head.

And so once more, Carey O -



How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.



Did you first call them, or did they call you?



What do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?



Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?



Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?



What do you suppose they intend to do with it?



How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?



Did you think about that at all?



Do you care?



Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?



Just courious.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 13, 2003, 09:24:00 PM
Quote
How long you been chatten with wwasp? Give us a start date, please. I know you keep good records, so you can answer this with no problem.

Already answered, since July 2002.

Quote
Did you first call them, or did they call you?


Already answered, I called them.

Quote
what do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?
Openess and honesty in return.

Quote
Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?


Yes, I think they do.


Quote
Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?


Because they want to know what trekkers is all about.

Quote
What do you suppose they intend to do with it?

I am not sure.

Quote
How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?
Only those who are in the same industry who are pointing fingers.

Quote
Did you think about that at all?
Yes.

Quote
Do you care?
About what?


Quote
Do you expect to remain uneffected and unfazed by the consequence of your actions?
I have been affected about all of this since July of 2002.


Anything else you want to know?
Quote
Just courious.



[ This Message was edited by: Carey on 2003-11-13 19:14 ]
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 14, 2003, 12:19:00 PM
How about you know answering why you think I am a snitch.  Tell me what you were doing wrong and exactly what it was that I was snitching on.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Froderik on November 14, 2003, 12:54:00 PM
Let's hear it! C'mon! Don't back down!
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2003, 01:23:00 PM
//Anything else you want to know? //


The truth. Lets have some openess and honesty from you , you wwasp whore.




//what do you think will be the result of your openess and honesty with wwasp?
 
Openess and honesty in return. //

From WWASP? PUULEEZ. Spare us. You can't possibly expect anyone to believe you believe wwasp will ever be open and honest!!


//Do you really think they give a ratts ass about your story?

Yes, I think they do. //

I can almost believe you believe this, as you do seem to think the world revolves around you and all are accountable to you, But you can't actually believe they care about you and your family. All you are is the whore they bought for a night.


//Why do you suppose they want copies of your old email?

Because they want to know what trekkers is all about. //

 //What do you suppose they intend to do with it?  

I am not sure. //

 Bull fukken Shit. Didn't fill you in on the details huh?  What, they just said, Mz Bock, will you please surrender all your email from the past year, and you said sure, be my guest! Cumon, puke it up, howd it go down?


//How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?
 
Only those who are in the same industry who are pointing fingers. //

And you who gets to be judge and jury. Makes you feel powerful dosen't it. Your ego must've been so inflated when you hit send you nearly popped. Bet you creamed your pants.
Looking over your trekkers address list, how many work for them that You point Your accussing finger at?  
That finger your pointing is hitting a mirror and is pointing back at you.

One more question.
Did you consult your own attorny before trusting theirs?
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Froderik on November 14, 2003, 01:29:00 PM
Quit beating around the bush!
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Carey on November 14, 2003, 01:39:00 PM
Why do you feel I need to consult and attorney?  All I have done is tell about my experience.
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Froderik on November 14, 2003, 01:43:00 PM
That's all you have to say in response to that post? That just goes to show how vastly self-centered you really are...
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Froderik on November 14, 2003, 03:26:00 PM
more bullshit... :grin:
Title: More News on Dundee and WWASP
Post by: Antigen on November 14, 2003, 07:21:00 PM
Quote
Carey said
Quote
Anon said
How many voices in the fight to expose the abuse and fraud do you suppose this action of yours will help wwasp force to quite?

Only those who are in the same industry who are pointing fingers.


I'm not sure that's so. Carey, I think a lot of people got sucked into Sue's drama who would never help PURE's recruiting efforts. I could be wrong, but from what I've actually seen, I think that's the case.

If you actually did provide WWASP with info that will help them fuck with people who don't need fucking with, I hope you've realized by now that it was a mistake. No innocent souls here, though. I used to yell at people for being selfish if they cut up their arms or attempted suicide. I believed, at the time, that it was the right thing to do. We all fuck up.

Something else for ya'll to consider. Who has WWASP actually filed suit against? When I got my letter of demand from Ivy Ridge. I basically told them they were welcome to come post here and refrute whatever comments they thought were inacurate or unkind, but I'm not about to shut anyone up. That's their gig, not mine.

I never heard a word back. Never heard back from Englander & Fischer, either, after they wrote me on behalf of Calvina Fay.

Take a look around the net lately. WWASP has so many critics and so many of them are speaking out, even with all your kids college funds and all your second mortgages in pocket, they can't possibly afford to properly prosecute suits against everyone. And if they don't hire a really dedicated and skilled team to prosecute these cases, then the truth might seep out around the edges. That's the last thing they want! Don't you see that?

So ya'll are brawling over nothing. Once again, I'm reminded of batter spouse syndrome. In your mind, WWASP is like 8 feet tall and everyone's on their side. In reality, WWASP is just a few scammers with an ever more tenuous grasp on their following, and even that is based entirely on desception. One of the prime tenets of that desception is that all critics are hostile, angry, crazy, selfish people who are out to get them because they're unhappy with their own lives.

Please don't feed the trolls!
Quote
troll

   An electronic mail message, Usenet posting or other (electronic) communication which is intentionally incorrect, but not overtly controversial (compare flame bait), or the act of sending such a message.  Trolling aims to elicit an emotional reaction from those with a hair-trigger on the reply key.  A really subtle troll makes some people lose their minds.
(1994-10-17)

troll 1. v.,n. [From the Usenet group alt.folklore.urban] To utter a posting on Usenet designed to attract predictable responses or flames; or, the post itself. Derives from the phrase "trolling for newbies" which in turn comes from mainstream "trolling", a style of fishing in which one trails bait through a likely spot hoping for a bite.

More: http://dict.die.net/troll/ (http://dict.die.net/troll/)

To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them...
-- Richard Henry Lee, 1787



_________________
Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen
American drug war P.O.W.
   10/80 - 10/82
Straight South (Sarasota, FL)
Anonymity Anonymous