Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on June 24, 2009, 05:52:23 PM
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Good luck using the DMCA on a Canadian server (http://http://pastebin.ca/1473291)
This totals to 33 children being victimized, minus one escapee and "graduates", plus however much fresh meat Ken's managed to lie his way into getting.
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This will be interesting to see how this plays out.
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This will be interesting to see how this plays out.
I LOVE YOU GUYS.!!!!!!
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Clever maneuver.
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Ya. As far as I know, the Canadians seem to be rejecting their own version of the DMCA.
http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/06/24 ... ?art_pos=7 (http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/06/24/0049240/Canadian-Politicians-Reverse-Course-On-DMCA?art_pos=7)
The rest of their law on free speech still sucks, though.
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Interesting. It's a simple list of names that can only be found through fornits but the list of names itself cannot be followed back to fornits. If somebody stumbles across or searches for the names, by itself, it's meaningless, and there is no indication the kids have anything to do with a program... It's just a meaningless list of names.
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Interesting. It's a simple list of names that can only be found through fornits but the list of names itself cannot be followed back to fornits. If somebody stumbles across or searches for the names, by itself, it's meaningless, and there is no indication the kids have anything to do with a program... It's just a meaningless list of names.
I suppose you'll rat out the OP to Ken Huey like you did last time?
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I suppose you'll rat out the OP to Ken Huey like you did last time?
Say what? Nobody ratted anybody out. I don't even know who the OP is (though I have my guesses). Even if I wanted to, I couldn't.
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Thank you for that site. The points psy makes are good. You should add perspective about why these names are relevant: they are detainees, and so on, at change academy lake of the ozarks. Maybe link the names of the "parents" who have already been identified. Thanks so much.
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I begin to agree with the others that there is something off going on. I can't say the name '[Redacted due to DMCA claim (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27785)]'?
or that she is the daughter of Theresa sebonis-helf. She is. That has nothing to do with any email.
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DMCA claim[/url]] sebonis helf"]I begin to agree with the others that there is something off going on. I can't say the name '[Redacted due to DMCA claim (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27785)]'?
or that she is the daughter of Theresa sebonis-helf. She is. That has nothing to do with any email.
So file a counternotice. It's out of my hands.
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I suppose you'll rat out the OP to Ken Huey like you did last time?
Say what? Nobody ratted anybody out. I don't even know who the OP is (though I have my guesses). Even if I wanted to, I couldn't.
You are living a pipe dream with your lies.
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I suppose you'll rat out the OP to Ken Huey like you did last time?
Say what? Nobody ratted anybody out. I don't even know who the OP is (though I have my guesses). Even if I wanted to, I couldn't.
You are living a pipe dream with your lies.
How could I rat anybody out, Again? I told anybody even possibly connected to this that I did not want to know who who well proxied was. Ask Aaron. If you have a rat it's not me, and when you find out who it is in time, I hope you have the common courtesy to apologize.
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I think what the poster PSY IS A RAT , is referring to you PSY
Is you mentioning you personally spoke with Ken Fooey
about the issue and found him to be such a charming man.
( not your exact words but close )
Then wham , all of a sudden Ken Fooey
is
(some kind of say what ?)
I can tell you , Ken is a snake Charmer
and possibly part of the old snake oil peddlers
( he could talk the pants off his own grandmother
and maybe even has a few times ?
Does it matter ?
Not really ,
Would I trust him w/ anyone I cared about
No Never !
Just a word of advice
snakes like Fooey , that is what they are good at ....
Clever Manipulation .
( preferring to stay secretive and in the shadows to collect the
money he needs to raise the 7-8 offspring his mormon religion
hopes will follow in his footsteps to have more money to keep
them afloat .
yeah its sick but true .
anybody here ever watch the stepford wives ?
thats the experience I had personally when I
visited Calo . ::puke::
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I think what the poster PSY IS A RAT , is referring to you PSY
Is you mentioning you personally spoke with Ken Fooey
about the issue and found him to be such a charming man.
( not your exact words but close )
Those were Ginger's words (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27785&start=15#p334578) ("sounds like a sincere sort of fellow"), actually, unless you're accusing her of being a rat as well. Ya, we talked to Ken Huey. We had a conference call to discuss the issue of the posts on Fornits. We told him that we could not moderate and explained our position (the main purpose of the call). He told us his story from his perspective and we told him ours. It was an interesting chat. We explained why we felt that treatment without consent was always wrong. We explained a bit about thought reform, the stanford prison experiments. Lots of stuff. It was a fairly long call and most of the discussion was philosophical and from personal experience. AT NO POINT did we identify the original poster (who we do not know and do not want to know) and we made it very clear that while we would comply with any binding legal orders, we could not take action on our own, even though we might want to. At no point did we beg "please don't sue us" or make any sort of "deal" either.
Then wham , all of a sudden Ken Fooey
is
(some kind of say what ?)
I can tell you , Ken is a snake Charmer
Could be. I make no judgment any way. I hardly know the guy. Also keep in mind that I hardly trust anybody at all. I trust Ginger and a select few others, but that's about it. To say I trust some program director I barely met is a stretch at the very least.
and possibly part of the old snake oil peddlers
( he could talk the pants off his own grandmother
and maybe even has a few times ?
Does it matter ?
Not really ,
Would I trust him w/ anyone I cared about
No Never !
I was raised in a family of diplomats (literally). Just because you're polite and cordial with a person does not mean you trust them.
So is there any evidence against me other than that Ginger said he sounded like he was a "sincere sort of fellow"? If this speculation and raving suspicion is enough to hang your enemies, you kill your own case against CALO.
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Whether or not the admins are rats, the only thing to do now, if you are interested in exposing CALO and rescuing its detainees, is to post the list of CALO detainees, the 'treatment profiles' (perhaps with names redacted--theyre pretty much photos and details of a rape), lots of links to this forum and others, lots of background info, and enough terms so that when you google "troubled teen" or "attachment disorders" or "change academy Lake of the Ozarks," Ken Huey, and so forth, they appear.
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See my response here just in case you missed it:
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27792#p334694 (http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27792#p334694)
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I suppose you'll rat out the OP to Ken Huey like you did last time?
Say what? Nobody ratted anybody out. I don't even know who the OP is (though I have my guesses). Even if I wanted to, I couldn't.
You are living a pipe dream with your lies.
How could I rat anybody out, Again? I told anybody even possibly connected to this that I did not want to know who who well proxied was. Ask Aaron. If you have a rat it's not me, and when you find out who it is in time, I hope you have the common courtesy to apologize.
If pressure is on fornits, you would squeal in a heartbeat to prevent a major lawsuit. So, you really do have a motive. You are not convincing at all.
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If pressure is on fornits, you would squeal in a heartbeat to prevent a major lawsuit. So, you really do have a motive. You are not convincing at all.
Fornits has been through multiple lawsuits and always come out on top. Also, I have been through my own lawsuit which I could have avoided by simply giving in and taking my site down. 2.2 million was at stake if I lost but I fought it and won. I put the financial stability of my entire life on the line to fight a program and stand up for my principles, not to mention free speech. Look on this site for Benchmark v. Crawford. I look at legal action as an opportunity to do battle with programs, not something to avoid and my actions show that. Ginger views it the same way. Just after getting served, the first thread I started was entitled "WOO HOO, I'M GETTING SUED".
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Ya, we talked to Ken Huey. We had a conference call to discuss the issue of the posts on Fornits.
You just shot yourself in the foot by openly admitting you had a conversation with Ken Huey.
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I think what the poster PSY IS A RAT , is referring to you PSY
Is you mentioning you personally spoke with Ken Fooey
about the issue and found him to be such a charming man.
( not your exact words but close )
Those were Ginger's words (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27785&start=15#p334578) ("sounds like a sincere sort of fellow"), actually, unless you're accusing her of being a rat as well. Ya, we talked to Ken Huey. We had a conference call to discuss the issue of the posts on Fornits. We told him that we could not moderate and explained our position. He told us his story from his perspective and we told him ours. It was an interesting chat. We explained why we felt that treatment without consent was always wrong. We explained a bit about thought reform, the stanford prison experiments. Lots of stuff. It was a fairly long call and most of the discussion was philosophical and from personal experience. AT NO POINT did we identify the original poster (who we do not know and do not want to know) and we made it very clear that while we would comply with any binding legal orders, we could not take action on our own, even though we might want to. At no point did we beg "please don't sue us" or make any sort of "deal" either.
Then wham , all of a sudden Ken Fooey
is
(some kind of say what ?)
I can tell you , Ken is a snake Charmer
Could be. I make no judgment any way. I hardly know the guy. Also keep in mind that I hardly trust anybody at all. I trust Ginger and a select few others, but that's about it. To say I trust some program director I barely met is a stretch at the very least.
and possibly part of the old snake oil peddlers
( he could talk the pants off his own grandmother
and maybe even has a few times ?
Does it matter ?
Not really ,
Would I trust him w/ anyone I cared about
No Never !
I was raised in a family of diplomats (literally). Just because you're polite and cordial with a person does not mean you trust them.
So is there any evidence against me other than that Ginger said he sounded like he was a "sincere sort of fellow"? If this speculation and raving suspicion is enough to hang your enemies, you kill your own case against CALO.
So, Ken admitted his "students" were brought to CALO through "escort" and that he imprisons them? A lot of the CALO trolls were implying that this doesn't happen at CALO, despite what was written in their own manual. Disgusting liars.
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Ya, we talked to Ken Huey. We had a conference call to discuss the issue of the posts on Fornits.
You just shot yourself in the foot by openly admitting you had a conversation with Ken Huey.
I didn't realize this was a program and I was on "bans" with him. Yes, Ginger and I both had a conference call with him. I already explained what it was about.
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So, Ken admitted his "students" were brought to CALO through "escort" and that he imprisons them?
This did come up.
He said that they do not accept kids from escort services. He claimed that his staff went to kids houses during the day during which they had a sort of "intervention" and convinced them to come. We asked what would happen if they resisted. He said they would be restrained, but claimed that it has never happened.
That's what he said... not saying I believe it. It's just what he told myself and Ginger.
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There is NO reason here to come down on any of the administrators
I believe they are honest and trying to do the right things for
everyone concerned ,
I just wanted to interpet ( if you will ) how some have come to view this .
Its NOT how I feel ,
I think the damage control at Calo has its hands full, and our Non-Mormon
MISSION is still very much on Course.
Not to say ....I don't also agree that if W/P felt he/she did the right thing to
begin with, by showing how corrupt even their treatment summaries are ,
Then more power there as well.
I know no-one here in the administrators views would directly side with
a program director just on a whim.
( no matter how soft spoken he appeared )
Ken Fooey maybe better off to go in the acting Industry
and who knows may wish he had ........ < ha hahaaha )
in the end :)
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So, Ken admitted his "students" were brought to CALO through "escort" and that he imprisons them?
This did come up.
He said that they do not accept kids from escort services. He claimed that his staff went to kids houses during the day during which they had a sort of "intervention" and convinced them to come. We asked what would happen if they resisted. He said they would be restrained, but claimed that it has never happened.
That's what he said... not saying I believe it. It's just what he told myself and Ginger.
That is how I was abducted. Obviously, when one is surrounded by 5 or 6 people and one is told that you must go where your kidnappers tell you to, or you will be physically forced to comply, seeing the futility of physical resistance, many will not resist. Compliance under threat of physical violence makes this act no less of a CRIMINAL kidnapping
Ken has admitted to personally overseeing the abduction and imprisonment of human beings. Great for the kids who want to press criminal charges. And any REAL psychiatrist who looks at these victims post-abduction "treatment plans" can see them for they are.
There is no longer ANY debate necessary over the criminality of KEN Huey, Nicole Fuglsang and their organization.
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psy,
Would you be able to post your conversation with Mr. Huey in a separate thread?
Bob Peterson
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psy,
Would you be able to post your conversation with Mr. Huey in a separate thread?
Bob Peterson
It wasn't a written conversation. It was a conference call (i.e. telephone) between myself, Ginger, and Ken.
I can, however, tell you what was discussed if you ask me questions.
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Thanks
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I believe psy and ginger have decided to interpret the DMSA in a way it is not applicable .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Mi ... yright_Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Millennium_Copyright_Act)
They should wait for a legal finding there is some sort of legitimate copyright infringement here before they remove these names, even under this ruling.
I’m not judging them, but if you research the dmca, you will find their response is by no means mandatory.
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I believe psy and ginger have decided to interpret the DMSA in a way it is not applicable .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Mi ... yright_Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Millennium_Copyright_Act)
They should wait for a legal finding there is some sort of legitimate copyright infringement here before they remove these names, even under this ruling.
I’m not judging them, but if you research the dmca, you will find their response is by no means mandatory.
here is some information about what can be considered copyright, these names and materials would actually have to have BEEN copyrighted for DMCA to even be applicable. They don't have to remove them until it is found that claimed copyright is applicable
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_holder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_holder)
my 2 cents
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This is one thing that I just don't understand... when I spoke to you about a similar situation you were kinda a dick about it... at no time did you offer me any advice, let alone specific instructions, so why is it that you will give more respect and assistance to Ken Huey, our foe, than you will even consider giving to someone who should be considered your alli?
My opinion is that you went down like a $2 hooker, and you gave him all the information he SHOULD have spent thousands of dollars figuring out himself. I understand you don't want a lawsuit on your hands, but you DID NOT have to give it up so easy. I think the DMCA was YOUR idea and you handed him this redaction on a silver platter because YOU don't agree with the content posted by Well Proxied. I really wouldn't be surprised if no such order was even filed... I think you only conjured that to save face so this could be that "one time" that you could moderate this forum, and do so on YOUR terms.
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psy,
Would you be able to post your conversation with Mr. Huey in a separate thread?
Bob Peterson
It wasn't a written conversation. It was a conference call (i.e. telephone) between myself, Ginger, and Ken.
I can, however, tell you what was discussed if you ask me questions.
OK... how about this...
Did you or did you not call Ken Huey... or did he somehow initiate the call.
Can't remember. I think he suggested we should all talk after our email correspondence explaining our moderation policy. I suggested and set up a conference call.
When you spoke of these "philosophical" things, did you mention that you don't agree with the business he's running, that its unethical and a violation of the human and constitutional rights of the children in his care.
Yes. At length.
Did you explain that this poster may have had a justified reason to post these names, that he was trying to grant aid to these children by making their names available on google.
I explained that the poster was probably desperate, frustrated and angry but in my personal opinion, it was not justified, just as I have said publicly on the forum many times.
Did you or did you not first mention the DMCA?
At the time we had the call, he already knew about the DMCA, and indicated he would be sending one, so yes, in a sense, we had some forewarning.
Furthermore, this is one thing that I don't understand... when I spoke to you about a similar situation you were kinda a dick about it... at no time did you offer me any advice, let alone specific instructions, so why is it that you will give more respect and assistance to Ken Huey, our foe, than you will even consider giving to someone who should be considered your alli?
If you really want to bring that into it...
You had an issue about a statement of opinion about your Grandmother. You asked me to identify the poster (unless I misread). I refused before you could even finish typing. You suggested you would contact a lawyer and so on and so forth. I explained that what the person said, while insensitive and cruel, was clearly evaluative opinion and not in the least bit actionable (though you were free to contact a lawyer who would tell you the same thing). You were too emotional to converse about much more at that point. Need I go into detail. You demanded me to tell you a way to get the message taken down. I told you there WAS NONE and there still IS NONE. Just because the answer I gave you wasn't the one you wanted to hear doesn't mean I'm somehow at fault. I'm not your bitch to cator to your every want.
You should see the things posted about myself and my family. I don't get any special treatment either.
My opinion is that you went down like a $2 hooker, and you gave him all the information he SHOULD have spent thousands of dollars figuring out himself.
I understand you don't want a lawsuit on your hands, but you DID NOT have to give it up so easy.
Classy. Well. That's your opinion. I think both Ginger and myself have been tested on this issue many times. We are not afraid of legal action. We made it clear to Ken that our position on the forum was not to moderate anything and that without a legal requirement, we could not remove those postings.
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Lawfully , Psy was NOT obliged to remove the material Ken Huey asserts is privileged.
Contact a lawyer if you are uncertain about that. There is simply NO precedent to assume that after receiving a threatening letter from a private citizen about copyright infringement the server MUST remove the offending material, or face of criminal prosecution. Despite what is claimed,whether or not we can say Andrew Bakke, on fornits, would, at most, would be a matter of civil arbitration. (and we would win)
this is the usenet/ scientology battle under the DMCA. And, as you can see, it is not as cut and dry as Psy has presented it
http://news.cnet.com/2100-1023-226676.html (http://news.cnet.com/2100-1023-226676.html)
Not that its fornits obligation to fight every legal battle imaginable for free speech....
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Lawfully , Psy was NOT obliged to remove the material Ken Huey asserts is privileged.
Sorry, but you're wrong. Read the DMCA or this handy FAQ here:
http://www.chillingeffects.org/dmca512/faq.cgi (http://www.chillingeffects.org/dmca512/faq.cgi)
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Just because the answer I gave you wasn't the one you wanted to hear doesn't mean I'm somehow at fault. I'm not your bitch to cator to your every want.
I think you most certainly did misunderstand me, for one, I NEVER asked YOU to do anything... I said there were ways I could extract the IP, and was attempting to get your opinion on that...
Futhermore, I wasn't emotional... and I told you multiple times that it didn't bother me, just that I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
And this is what I mean, your willing to give Ken Huey what he wants without a fight and with me, you don't even LISTEN or bother to comprehend what I was saying.
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I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
If psy handed you an IP, fornits would be over, nobody would ever post here again. Besides, what do you expect to do with an IP? Do you think you can call the cable company up, and they will give you a name/address? How do you know it's not someone hijacking a neighbor's wireless? What would you intend to do, sue them, post their name and address on fornits (and make the assumption it was actually them who posted it)? What could you possibly mean when you say 'catch this fucker'? I think you are deluded, and are falling into the same trap some other fornits posters fall into.. symptoms include delusions of grandiosity, sudden onset of all legal knowledge, and unreasonable expectations. In other words, you've gone mad.. seek help, perhaps some type of program for adults.
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Just because the answer I gave you wasn't the one you wanted to hear doesn't mean I'm somehow at fault. I'm not your bitch to cator to your every want.
I think you most certainly did misunderstand me, for one, I NEVER asked YOU to do anything... I said there were ways I could extract the IP, and was attempting to get your opinion on that...
Futhermore, I wasn't emotional... and I told you multiple times that it didn't bother me, just that I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
And this is what I mean, your willing to give Ken Huey what he wants without a fight and with me, you don't even LISTEN or bother to comprehend what I was saying.
Are you sure you're not emotional?
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I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
If psy handed you an IP, fornits would be over, nobody would ever post here again.
I never asked Psy to hand me anything... your not listening either.
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Just because the answer I gave you wasn't the one you wanted to hear doesn't mean I'm somehow at fault. I'm not your bitch to cator to your every want.
I think you most certainly did misunderstand me, for one, I NEVER asked YOU to do anything... I said there were ways I could extract the IP, and was attempting to get your opinion on that...
Futhermore, I wasn't emotional... and I told you multiple times that it didn't bother me, just that I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
And this is what I mean, your willing to give Ken Huey what he wants without a fight and with me, you don't even LISTEN or bother to comprehend what I was saying.
Are you sure you're not emotional?
not really, a little perturbed yes. but honestly don't think its a big deal.
I'm just not the kind of person people choose to fuck with, not outside the protection of the internet that is... so you can understand I wouldn't just ignore it when some little punk goes out of his way to do so. Being emotional, and contemplating my options to do something about it are two completely different things. Don't take too many assumptions on my gender, one of the last things I am is emotional.
Revengeful... maybe.
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I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
If psy handed you an IP, fornits would be over, nobody would ever post here again.
I never asked Psy to hand me anything... your not listening either.
Well I for one believe psy, and that's what he said.
(21:35:36) (125178): if people like femanon were admins, fornits would be destroyed in a matter of days
(21:37:29) FemanonFatal2.0: yea I bet.
(21:38:01) FemanonFatal2.0: because I'd be showing up at the front door of the first person who fucked with me
So you claim that if you had the IP of a person who 'fucked with you', you would "catch this fucker" and "show up at their front door." :rofl: It sounds like you are getting emotional and making some classic internet tough guy claims here. Pretty funny stuff FemAdong.
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I have nothing but respect for you and ginger
However, you and ginger were in NO way required to take down those names and treatment plans after that letter demanding you do under DMCA statutes, anymore then you would be after you received a letter demanding your take down offending material under defamation statutes
Maybe Ken Huey has a better CIVIL case against you than someone who simply objects to "defamation," but, again, that would be a matter of CIVIL arbitration. And, he would LOSE. You certainly do NOT automatically become criminal “lawbreakers” by keeping this info up
http://www.etiquettehell.com/content/eh ... vice.shtml (http://www.etiquettehell.com/content/eh_misc/misc/termsofservice.shtml)
"If you haven't bothered to register your works with the US Copyright Office, you have no legal case and a DMCA Notification is abusive. "
In any case, we will not accept a clearly invalid or overly broad or ambiguous DMCA Notification. The DMCA is not a tool by which to bully or censor opinions on Etiquettehell.com, and those who abuse the process open themselves up to significant legal liabilities."
If this site "etiquette site" does not automatically remove material after they get a DMCA claims, please STOP bullshitting that you guys HAVE TO!
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I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
If psy handed you an IP, fornits would be over, nobody would ever post here again.
I never asked Psy to hand me anything... your not listening either.
Well I for one believe psy, and that's what he said.
(21:35:36) (125178): if people like femanon were admins, fornits would be destroyed in a matter of days
(21:37:29) FemanonFatal2.0: yea I bet.
(21:38:01) FemanonFatal2.0: because I'd be showing up at the front door of the first person who fucked with me
So you claim that if you had the IP of a person who 'fucked with you', you would "catch this fucker" and "show up at their front door." :rofl: It sounds like you are getting emotional and making some classic internet tough guy claims here. Pretty funny stuff FemAdong.
Femenon this person is thewho "internet tough guy" is his obnoxious refrain. Ignore him. I was one of the people who asked you to sue that person, for a variety of reasons that I wont get into again.
the CALO info will still be out there, though at a new location.
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I was one of the people who asked you to sue that person
Playing mind games with survivors seems to be your full time profession. Not everybody is as stupid as you think.
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I was willing to consider it (mainly the suggestions of the other posters) if it meant that once and for all we could catch this fucker.
If psy handed you an IP, fornits would be over, nobody would ever post here again.
I never asked Psy to hand me anything... your not listening either.
Well I for one believe psy, and that's what he said.
(21:35:36) (125178): if people like femanon were admins, fornits would be destroyed in a matter of days
(21:37:29) FemanonFatal2.0: yea I bet.
(21:38:01) FemanonFatal2.0: because I'd be showing up at the front door of the first person who fucked with me
So you claim that if you had the IP of a person who 'fucked with you', you would "catch this fucker" and "show up at their front door." :rofl: It sounds like you are getting emotional and making some classic internet tough guy claims here. Pretty funny stuff FemAdong.
You missed the part where I said, I'd just show up to give them a hug and tell them "you are truly the saddest excuse for a human being I have ever met"...
don't take everything I say so seriously... its all a big joke... this is Fornits guys.... noooooot a big deal.
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I was one of the people who asked you to sue that person
Playing mind games with survivors seems to be your full time profession. Not everybody is as stupid as you think.
"one of the people"? didn't sound like a lot of "people"
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I have nothing but respect for you and ginger
However, you and ginger were in NO way required to take down those names and treatment plans after that letter demanding you do under DMCA statutes, anymore then you would be after you received a letter demanding your take down offending material under defamation statutes
I'm sorry, but you're wrong. The DMCA changed things in the world of free speech, and not for the better. If we didn't comply, they would have simply sent the DMCA to Dreamhost which would have probably not only taken the post offline, but the entire of Fornits. Even IF we decided to resist the requirements of the DMCA, I can guarantee you Dreamhost would not have. If they wouldn't have, their upstream provider would have to and so forth. Even Google complies with DMCA requests because they have no other choice.
The DMCA is not like other claims, you're guilty until proven innocent. Information is considered likely to be infringing unless you contest it. The reason for this, supposedly, is because information can be downloaded so quickly that thousands of copies can be made, causing irrecoverable damage of sorts. It was designed because copies could be made so quickly and in such number that court cases against all of the copies would be impossible and removal time would be critical. It sort of makes sense, if it didn't have such dire consequences for free speech.
Look. You don't believe me, read this handy article:
http://writingonyourpalm.net/column010903.htm (http://writingonyourpalm.net/column010903.htm)
The DMCA is also being used as a club by corporations to silence criticism. Another article, also in Salon, tells the story of Stop Huntingdon Animal Cruelty, a non-profit group dedicated to shutting down British medical research company Huntingdon Life Sciences. HLS contacted SHAC's web hosting provider, Envirolink, and invoked the DMCA, claiming that SHAC had infringed on their copyrights. They didn't provide any specific examples, but rather objected to the SHAC pages in their entirety. Envirolink, a company that provides free web hosting to non-profit organizations, was forced to pull the plug without further discussion. According to Josh, Knauer, the founder of Envirolink, "It's very clear that Huntingdon Life Sciences just wants to shut them up." The sites are required by law to remain down for ten days before the accused can contest the accusation and prove that they're not infringing.
Trust me when I say, we had no choice at all but to comply. It's not a question of balls. It's a question of survival of the site. Move to Canada, you say? Well. If we do the law there sucks when it comes to defamation and all sorts of other things such as the ever-vague "hate speech". I like my first amendment, thank you very much.
One day, the Supremes will strike the DMCA down, i'm sure of it... but until that point, we're held more or less at it's mercy. I truly am sorry, but we had no choice to comply and this was a decision made by both myself and Ginger.
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http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/ (http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/) ... er-content
""if you allow your site's user to post content you can protect yourself from copyright infringement claims under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), as you establish effective "notice-and-takedown" procedures, promptly remove content when a copyright owner notifies you it is infringing, and have no knowledge that the material is infringing.
"""YOU ARE NOT LEGALLY REQUIRED TO COMPLY WITH THESE SAFE HARBOR PROVISIONS , but doing so may help you avoid copyright infringement liability. The sections below address those provisions of section 512 that may apply to you and discuss what you need to do in order to take advantage of the safe harbor provisions. """
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Psy,
I think you and ginger did the right thing. Law or no law those treatment plans had no place on this forum. The names don't bother me so much, but the outing of those kid's slanderous piles of shit torment plans are unconscionable. We are all better off for them having been removed. I suggest those of you playing internet lawyer take it upon yourself to consult someone who might actually know the real story behind DMCA.
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And to top it off, lemme finish by saying this...
The part I love about the DMCA is it requires Well Proxied to do his own fighting rather than forcing Ginger and Psy to do it for them. If Well Proxied wants to fight for his freedom of speech he can stand right up and do it.
Will the Real Well Proxied please stand up?
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Fornits did not have to take anything down, failing to do so would just remove its automatic, statutory exemption from culpability in "copyright infringement."
Whether or not they would be culpable would be settled in civil arbitration. ISPs have refused to submit to these notices in the name of “free speech” before and won.
http://www.ojr.org/ojr/stories/070913niles/ (http://www.ojr.org/ojr/stories/070913niles/)
Diebold sent dozens of cease-and-desist letters to ISPs hosting leaked internal documents revealing flaws in Diebold's e-voting machines. The company claimed copyright violations and used the DMCA to demand that the documents be taken down. One ISP, OPG, refused to remove them IN THE NAME OF FREE SPEECH, and thus became the first ISP to test whether it would be held liable for the actions of its users in such a situation."
Decision: Diebold sought to use the DMCA’s safe harbor provisions—which were designed to protect ISPs, not copyright holders—as a sword to suppress publication of embarrassing content rather than as a shield to protect its intellectual property.
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Fornits did not have to take anything down, failing to do so would just remove its automatic, statutory exemption from culpability in "copyright infringement."
Whether or not it would be culpable would be settled in civil arbitration. ISPs have refused to submit to these notices in the name of “free speech” before and won.
http://www.ojr.org/ojr/stories/070913niles/ (http://www.ojr.org/ojr/stories/070913niles/)
Diebold sent dozens of cease-and-desist letters to ISPs hosting leaked internal documents revealing flaws in Diebold's e-voting machines. The company claimed copyright violations and used the DMCA to demand that the documents be taken down. One ISP, OPG, refused to remove them IN THE NAME OF FREE SPEECH, and thus became the first ISP to test whether it would be held liable for the actions of its users in such a situation."
Decision: Diebold sought to use the DMCA’s safe harbor provisions—which were designed to protect ISPs, not copyright holders—as a sword to suppress publication of embarrassing content rather than as a shield to protect its intellectual property.
llllllllllllllllllllll;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
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Good luck using the DMCA on a Canadian server (http://http://pastebin.ca/1473291)
This totals to 33 children being victimized, minus one escapee and "graduates", plus however much fresh meat Ken's managed to lie his way into getting.
Has anyone else had trouble opening this? Another site cave without a fight, just like fornits?
Thank you to the people who are fighting back. And if its really so shameful to be linked to this place, parents, why have you confined your sons and daughters in it? Is the act of being raped shameful, or just when people find out about it?
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Has anyone else had trouble opening this? Another site cave without a fight, just like fornits?
It's just you, it's working fine from here.
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:bump:
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7
:bump:
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you people are really sickening. there are children who need help and you take it upon yourselves to violate them by using their names? that is immoral and God willing illegal.
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you people are really sickening. there are children who need help and you take it upon yourselves to violate them by using their names? that is immoral and God willing illegal.
Who is you people? You just everybody by the action of one idiot? The names aren't even on this site. We have no control over that. Just FYI, most here found the posting of the names and treatment profiles disgusting.
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you people are really sickening. there are children who need help and you take it upon yourselves to violate them by using their names? that is immoral and God willing illegal.
Who is you people? You just everybody by the action of one idiot? The names aren't even on this site. We have no control over that. Just FYI, most here found the posting of the names and treatment profiles disgusting.
I suppose common sense would tell you that I am speaking to those who posted AND CONDONED the posting of the names...they may have been 'removed', but they were put out there and people have saved that list!!!
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]I suppose common sense would tell you that I am speaking to those who posted AND CONDONED the posting of the names...they may have been 'removed', but they were put out there and people have saved that list!!!
Well. "You people" sounded like a pretty broad swipe. I'm sorry if I misunderstood.
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]I suppose common sense would tell you that I am speaking to those who posted AND CONDONED the posting of the names...they may have been 'removed', but they were put out there and people have saved that list!!!
Well. "You people" sounded like a pretty broad swipe. I'm sorry if I misunderstood.
no worries, 'you people' was meant towards those who did it and condoned it happening. one would hope we are all concerned with the best interests of children!
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]I suppose common sense would tell you that I am speaking to those who posted AND CONDONED the posting of the names...they may have been 'removed', but they were put out there and people have saved that list!!!
Well. "You people" sounded like a pretty broad swipe. I'm sorry if I misunderstood.
no worries, 'you people' was meant towards those who did it and condoned it happening. one would hope we are all concerned with the best interests of children!
Talk about broad swipes, Psy - how about all the references to find the parents who send their kids to RTCs and hastening their demise? That all of these parents are monsters, etc? Wow.
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Talk about broad swipes, Psy - how about all the references to find the parents who send their kids to RTCs and hastening their demise? That all of these parents are monsters, etc? Wow.
I never said anything remotely similar to that. Opinions vary on that on this forum like anything else. Personally I think most parents are victims. They're conned, simply put. Sadly, the kids suffer, but I don't necessarily hold parents responsible for being deceived.
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Talk about broad swipes, Psy - how about all the references to find the parents who send their kids to RTCs and hastening their demise? That all of these parents are monsters, etc? Wow.
I never said anything remotely similar to that. Opinions vary on that on this forum like anything else. Personally I think most parents are victims. They're conned, simply put. Sadly, the kids suffer, but I don't necessarily hold parents responsible for being deceived.
I was not referring to you, Psy. But if you take issue with this lady's perceived generalization, then take a look at the hateful, fanatical swipes at parents in previous threads. 'Nuff said!
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Dear Lizard Tits, aka Ken Hooey.
I know why you are posting here. It isn't going to work, unlike you, I'm not that big of an idiot. We'll just have to wait and see what the future brings. We both know it won't be much longer.
As for Blombro:
CALO is every bit as toxic and disturbing as Thayer is and ever will be. You giving them any credit is a slap in the face to all of those kids jacked up in a bent wrist arm lock and thrown face first on the ground.
To the rest:
Keep in mind Mr. Ken Hooey has to protect his revenue flow. What businessman hasn't lied about his dealings to protect his profits? Don't be taken in by this scumbag.
Very nice and respectful language - Che. It is one way to avoid intelligent dialogue, eh?
One thing that comes to mind when thinking about the question "are kids free to leave" is this: are kids free to leave ANYWHERE? If my kid gets mad or upset about life in our home s/he isn't free to go. Also, in the public school they attend, they are not "free" to leave campus during the school day.
I have attended several of the CALO peer group sessions discussed earlier on this thread. There is no "screaming" or confrontation and if somebody doesn't want to talk, they can just sit there. At least two coaches are there to keep things respectful and on track, I suppose. CALO is not Elan or Family Foundation.
Most of the posters here disagree with the principle of RTCs in general, and are hell-bent to find specific "bad" things at CALO. Give it a break! And with regard to RTCs in general - if not a place like CALO, what do its detractors suggest instead? In our case it would have been jail or a lock-down psych facility.
Well, this is the paradoxical thinking we are asked to embrace when dealing with programs, isn't it? On one hand the program says "We don't take violent, dangerous or criminal kids" and on the other hand the parents say "My kid would have been in jail or in a lockdown psych facility." One of you isn't being honest.
You can't say that your kid was such a danger to self or others that s/he couldn't remain at home and say at the same time that CALO is a safe environment that doesn't take kids with severe problems. Either your kid isn't that bad and you're exaggerating (for the record I believe you) or CALO accepts dangerous and violent criminals (for the record I believe this is true).
One way or the other, we're asked to wilfully suspend disbelief in one case or the other and both statements can't be true, as they are mutually exclusive premises.
I also agree with Psy that it sounds like CALO does not use any clinically appropriate therapies. Parents should never be allowed to sit in on group sessions (it violates so many privacy laws and ethical principles) and the people facilitating the groups have no educational basis upon which to perform this duty.
From just what Ken Huey and this one parent have posted, I can state unequivocally that CALO is not the place to send children. Ken, Tiger, you've shot CALO in the foot trying to support it.
Tiger Eye, what's your response to this? Does CALO accept dangerous children (you said yours was an arsonist, I believe)? How about court-ordered kids? What about convicted felons?
Just waiting for your answer here. It seems you'll answer the most trivial posts like how far people live from CALO, but you're not addressing the substance of this thread. Why wouldn't you want to respond to items like the above or bent wrist control techniques? Seems like a very familiar tactic. Very familiar.
So... How about an answer to these questions, TE?
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I was not referring to you, Psy. But if you take issue with this lady's perceived generalization, then take a look at the hateful, fanatical swipes at parents in previous threads. 'Nuff said!
I've done beat that horse to death already on multiple occasions. Those who still insist parents = evil are not likely to change. Often people see in other parents what they saw in their own. Some kids had/have some truly sadistic parents. They're often unwilling to accept any other possibilities.
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Trying to catch up here....
First, thanks, Psy, for the high praise. I think you're pretty awesome too.
Second, I'm pretty sure we were obliged to follow that order. The situation cited above about the DiBold machines? In all likelihood, a jury would be more sympathetic to the whistle blower than the plaintiff. Therefore, if I were in the shoes of that site's admin I probably would do the same thing and shoot for craps with a legal challenge. This is very very different. I don't think any reasonable jury would have taken our side in this matter--copyright or no.
Third, most importantly, I don't see Ken Huey or most other program operators and staff as evil or as enemies. I have run into some personalities in this industry who are just plain mean spirited and sadistic and fewer still who I think are actually laughing up their sleeves, very consciously and intentionally taking advantage of helpless children under color of authority. But the vast majority are, in my opinion, well intended but misguided. It's not at all unusual. Up until a few years ago, transplant physicians and their entire support staffs along with patient relatives and others used to routinely keep their young patients in total isolation, deprived of the simplest comfort and human touch for fear of exposure to germs. Many of these children went completely and irreversibly feral, which meant they were unable to care for themselves after surgery and eventually died as a result. It took a cold hearted hard ass to carry through with such treatment, and yet these people were just as well intended, if misguided, as anybody.
I do believe Ken Huey is well intended and sincere. For one thing, even though he refers to Fornits as an "attack site" (belieing a definite prejudice) when I spoke with him his main concern in this matter was to protect the privacy of his students. He had no real qualm about the idea of keeping the treatment plans up with the names and faces redacted. I think he honestly believes that his methods and policies are defensible. I disagree with that but that doesn't make him an enemy. Remember that virtually all of the staff and corporate officers in the industry are, themselves, program graduates. They're just a little more brainwashed than those of us who leave it all behind and make our way back into the more commonly accepted reality. And there, but for pure near pathological stubbornness, go I. When I split the program I was on pretraining for staff. If I had stayed on (which was prerequisite for full membership in my family) I might have eventually lost the internal battle and become one of them.
...a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right, and raises at first a formidable outcry in defence of custom. But tumult soon subsides. Time makes more converts than reason.
If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?
(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d2/A_solzhenitsin.JPG/144px-A_solzhenitsin.JPG)
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khuey@ca-lo.com > Ken Huey's e-mail address
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Why is CALO still open?
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That's scary all those people in those places, people get messed up in those type of places , I am glad I ran from the seed, I here people were stuck in for years.
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Does anyone have any real, reliable information regarding the "abuse" at CALO?
Has anyone been able to contact parents who received that letter from the former employee listing out the many issues at CALO? Is that person willing to talk to the parents. I've seen the letter and it is well written, articulate, and I know for a fact that some of the letter is 100% accurate. I have personal knowledge that it is accurate, being a family relation to one of the "students".
Am also interested in whether a lawsuit or the possibility of a class action lawsuit is, has or will be filed by the parents.
Just so we are clear, I'm not interested in all the bullshit and childish remarks I see on some of these replies. I am a concerned family member that is seeking some real answers.
I have direct personal knowledge to share, that can be verified to the proper individuals/authorities who are seeking the same.
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Does anyone have any real, reliable information regarding the "abuse" at CALO?
Has anyone been able to contact parents who received that letter from the former employee listing out the many issues at CALO? Is that person willing to talk to the parents. I've seen the letter and it is well written, articulate, and I know for a fact that some of the letter is 100% accurate. I have personal knowledge that it is accurate, being a family relation to one of the "students".
Am also interested in whether a lawsuit or the possibility of a class action lawsuit is, has or will be filed by the parents.
Just so we are clear, I'm not interested in all the bullshit and childish remarks I see on some of these replies. I am a concerned family member that is seeking some real answers.
I have direct personal knowledge to share, that can be verified to the proper individuals/authorities who are seeking the same.
From what I can gather, it is my impression that there is currently a lawsuit in progress against one or more former employees, probably filed by CALO or certain parties with essentially the same interests, and reasons for which can only be imagined.
I hope I've been sufficiently vague.
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Is anyone willing to reply?
Looking for some real answers to CALO issues
Have direct personal knowledge of events.
Will discuss.
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Does anyone have any real, reliable information regarding the "abuse" at CALO?
Has anyone been able to contact parents who received that letter from the former employee listing out the many issues at CALO? Is that person willing to talk to the parents. I've seen the letter and it is well written, articulate, and I know for a fact that some of the letter is 100% accurate. I have personal knowledge that it is accurate, being a family relation to one of the "students".
Am also interested in whether a lawsuit or the possibility of a class action lawsuit is, has or will be filed by the parents.
Just so we are clear, I'm not interested in all the bullshit and childish remarks I see on some of these replies. I am a concerned family member that is seeking some real answers.
I have direct personal knowledge to share, that can be verified to the proper individuals/authorities who are seeking the same.
From what I can gather, it is my impression that there is currently a lawsuit in progress against one or more former employees, probably filed by CALO or certain parties with essentially the same interests, and reasons for which can only be imagined.
I hope I've been sufficiently vague.
Do you have contact information for former employees and or the attorney's that would be representing former employees?
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Is anyone willing to reply?
Looking for some real answers to CALO issues
Have direct personal knowledge of events.
Will discuss.
With all due respect for your intentions, should they, in fact, be genuine, "Curious George" has not posted sufficiently for most folk to get a good sense of who Curious George might be. For all anyone here knows, Curious George could actually be... say... Curious Ken, or Curious Ken's attorney, fishing for potentially libelous material or what not. :D
So... not trying to put a damper on matters, just trying to state the obvious and inherent conundrum, for whatever worth that might be.
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Does anyone have any real, reliable information regarding the "abuse" at CALO?
Has anyone been able to contact parents who received that letter from the former employee listing out the many issues at CALO? Is that person willing to talk to the parents. I've seen the letter and it is well written, articulate, and I know for a fact that some of the letter is 100% accurate. I have personal knowledge that it is accurate, being a family relation to one of the "students".
Am also interested in whether a lawsuit or the possibility of a class action lawsuit is, has or will be filed by the parents.
Just so we are clear, I'm not interested in all the bullshit and childish remarks I see on some of these replies. I am a concerned family member that is seeking some real answers.
I have direct personal knowledge to share, that can be verified to the proper individuals/authorities who are seeking the same.
Curious George investigate this: :twofinger:
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Ursus, use some common sense. There's no way in hell CALO or their attorneys would want to bump this topic.
Che Gookin probably knows something about ongoing lawsuits. PM him. Although he is an industrial-grade asshole, he isn't about to give out your personal info.
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Ursus, use some common sense. There's no way in hell CALO or their attorneys would want to bump this topic.
Che Gookin probably knows something about ongoing lawsuits. PM him. Although he is an industrial-grade asshole, he isn't about to give out your personal info.
:feedtrolls:
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Cheesy,
I can warrant I am not Ken Huey's attorney. I can warrant I am not Ken. I can warrant that I am a family member with a "student" at CALO. Yes, you don't know me from postings, I usually do not do these "forums". You have zero reasons to trust me, but then again YOU may be Ken Huey.
By the way who are you? Employee? Ken? Landon? Russ? Mike (Oriental Mike or former Cop Mike?) or are you a family member too? I know this organization through direct experience. I am who I say I am.
I'm not fishing for crap. I'm looking for answers. Understand mistrust. Really looking for contact info for CALO's attorney as well as the "former employee's" attorney (assuming lawsuit against employee) to sift though the sea of crap that most people spew and from what I see on this site. I'm looking to confirm/deny what the employee witnessed. Will gladly go through proper channels and speak with his/her attorney, this proves I'm not full of shit. If the employee is represented by counsel, Ken cannot contact, CALO cannot contact, but I can.
If allegation against CALO is B.S. I want to know, if true I want to know...this will determine the next course of action. The parents have a right to know the truth, especially given the trust we have placed in CALO to help our children.
As far as the sissy that said responded "investigate this" go back to you 13 year old antics and leave this business to the adults who care.
CG
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Does anyone have any real, reliable information regarding the "abuse" at CALO?
Has anyone been able to contact parents who received that letter from the former employee listing out the many issues at CALO? Is that person willing to talk to the parents. I've seen the letter and it is well written, articulate, and I know for a fact that some of the letter is 100% accurate. I have personal knowledge that it is accurate, being a family relation to one of the "students".
Am also interested in whether a lawsuit or the possibility of a class action lawsuit is, has or will be filed by the parents.
Just so we are clear, I'm not interested in all the bullshit and childish remarks I see on some of these replies. I am a concerned family member that is seeking some real answers.
I have direct personal knowledge to share, that can be verified to the proper individuals/authorities who are seeking the same.
From what I can gather, it is my impression that there is currently a lawsuit in progress against one or more former employees, probably filed by CALO or certain parties with essentially the same interests, and reasons for which can only be imagined.
I hope I've been sufficiently vague.
Do you have contact information for former employees and or the attorney's that would be representing former employees?
I can help, but it will be up to them in the end if they want to contact you. Pass me along your email address and I'll link them to this thread.
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Would rather speak to the attorneys involved. No reason to share my e-mail. You also don't need it to pass along this kind of info. If you are truly willing to help, all parties involved will be protected if only the attorney info is shared at this point.
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No reason to share my e-mail.
This is why Satan made Hotmail.
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Would rather speak to the attorneys involved. No reason to share my e-mail. You also don't need it to pass along this kind of info. If you are truly willing to help, all parties involved will be protected if only the attorney info is shared at this point.
We can sniff a bullshit artist on Fornits. Seek life elsewhere asswipe. Tell Ken Huey, your client, to suck a fat cock. :twofinger:
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Then I suggest you read the letter sent out very carefully. Within it is everything you need to know about contacting the attorneys.
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Hey Jesus
Go fuck yourself. Why don't you get nailed to the cross again. I am no bullshit artist. Will prove it. The only thing you sniff is the ass crack off a dead goat.
Stop pissing serious people off. It's bad for your health.
CG
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Hey Jesus
Go fuck yourself. Why don't you get nailed to the cross again. I am no bullshit artist. Will prove it. The only thing you sniff is the ass crack off a dead goat.
Stop pissing serious people off. It's bad for your health.
CG
When did you take the bar exam before you became a lawyer?
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Hey Jesus
Go fuck yourself. Why don't you get nailed to the cross again. I am no bullshit artist. Will prove it. The only thing you sniff is the ass crack off a dead goat.
Stop pissing serious people off. It's bad for your health.
CG
What are you going to prove? :feedtrolls: prove it.
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Heh, CG, I'd not get to worked up about the forums. Thanks for the reply in PM, I'll be looking forward to helping you out anyway that I can.
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Gookin,
Will do...think the PM is way to go...to much B.S. from the small minded.
CG
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Gookin,
Will do...think the PM is way to go...to much B.S. from the small minded.
CG
O' for god sakes, grow up. Che, don't give out any info unless you are given permission by whom its relevant to.
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I don't trust this guy who wants to contact Che. He is a lawyer or someone looking to collect ammunition for Ken Huey to use. On the other hand, if Che decides to communicate with CG, he will probably use a name like jeremy phillips, tom moore, peter north or ron jeremy.
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Have the police (or any authority) been notified that Change Academy Lake Ozarks is imprisoning and abusing their detainees?
Thanks
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Missouri Department of Child Services has been informed repeatedly, by both former employees and former victims.
They don't do shit.
Thanks for asking.
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Missouri Department of Child Services has been informed repeatedly, by both former employees and former victims.
They don't do shit.
Thanks for asking.
I am certain though that CALO has gotten a visit or two from the local DCS authorities regarding former employees making complaints. Part of the suit against the former employees claims they have made false reports and are encouraging others to make false reports. Ken Hoooooey tried to subpeona these reports from DCS and got told to blow it out his back hole for his efforts by a DCS lawyer.
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Missouri Department of Child Services has been informed repeatedly, by both former employees and former victims.
They don't do shit.
Thanks for asking.
Lake news asks if anyone has gone to the police. Has anyone gone straight to the police, and bypassed MDCS all together?
Are reports, or at least summaries of reports to the MDCS, available vailable to the local media?
thanks for answering.
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Missouri Department of Child Services has been informed repeatedly, by both former employees and former victims.
They don't do shit.
Thanks for asking.
Lake news asks if anyone has gone to the police. Has anyone gone straight to the police, and bypassed MDCS all together?
Are reports, or at least summaries of reports, to the MDCS available to the local media? Can they be made available to them, LN specifically?
thanks for answering.
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My understanding is they were told to go to MDCS by the police. I'll check to make sure though.
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Good luck using the DMCA on a Canadian server (http://http://pastebin.ca/1473291)
This totals to 33 children being victimized, minus one escapee and "graduates", plus however much fresh meat Ken's managed to lie his way into getting.
bump
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Woah... I thought it's illegal to publicize these names, isn't it? Anyways, It's missing quite a few. Actually, about 10-15 aren't on here, so it must have been a more recent student who spout these out. By heart, I still remember everyone's name, age, and what city and state they're from...
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By heart, I still remember everyone's name, age, and what city and state they're from...
Roll call? That's how many people remember who they were in the program with.
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Nah, not from Roll. I used to be in charge of the "stewardships" that we did everyday. I created a chore list and everyone was required to get some of the things done. I had a check-off list with all of the boys. They came to me when they finished a chore, I'd check to see if it was done properly, then check them off. Also... just living with them makes you remember all their names. When ppl first arrive into the program, we state 5 basic things about ourselves.
1. Name
2. Age
3. City/State
4. Reasons for being here
5. Hobbies
Sometimes the students would throw in extra questions to get to know them, like favorite music or tv shows n stuff... but yeah, I always remembered people like that, lol
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Nah, not from Roll. I used to be in charge of the "stewardships" that we did everyday. I created a chore list and everyone was required to get some of the things done. I had a check-off list with all of the boys. They came to me when they finished a chore, I'd check to see if it was done properly, then check them off. Also... just living with them makes you remember all their names. When ppl first arrive into the program, we state 5 basic things about ourselves.
1. Name
2. Age
3. City/State
4. Reasons for being here
5. Hobbies
Sometimes the students would throw in extra questions to get to know them, like favorite music or tv shows n stuff... but yeah, I always remembered people like that, lol
Are you a real calo "student"?
If so post the names of the "students" you remember. No, its not illegal to post the names of the "students." Fornits caved and removed the names list because of the threat of a lawsuit over a bogus claimed copyright premised on the fact the names were taken from an email.
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Well, last I heard, it violated some privacy laws or whatever. That i'm not supposed to disclose identities or something. I dunno... but off the top of my head, I can remember 25 boys and 23 girls that were at CALO either before me, or during the time that I was there, so this list is pretty short. I'm not even on there, lol. That's why I said that this was probably supplied by a staff or a student who is pretty recent to CALO. One of the graduates who left only about 3 months ago isn't even on here, lol.
And yes, I was really a student there. I was the 7th boy, and the 13th student at the time of my arrival, but I was the 17th student in their history (2 boys and 2 girls left before I got there to CALO). That's why I'm #17, instead of #13
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And yes, I was really a student there. I was the 7th boy, and the 13th student at the time of my arrival, but I was the 17th student in their history (2 boys and 2 girls left before I got there to CALO). That's why I'm #17, instead of #13
So... are you saying that out of the first 16 students, four left prior to having "completed the program?" What would you say is the "drop-out rate," roughly speaking, to the best of your judgment?
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CALO seems to be the new HLA at fornits. I predict it will meet a similar fate shortly.
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And yes, I was really a student there. I was the 7th boy, and the 13th student at the time of my arrival, but I was the 17th student in their history (2 boys and 2 girls left before I got there to CALO). That's why I'm #17, instead of #13
So... are you saying that out of the first 16 students, four left prior to having "completed the program?" What would you say is the "drop-out rate," roughly speaking, to the best of your judgment?
No, they didn't graduate, they dropped out. If I remember correctly, there have been 11 who left the program without graduating, and I think 9 graduates that I can remember.
Of the graduates, I haven't heard too many good things about how their lives have been going. There's only a select 3 who are living meaningful and happy lives right now. I can't really say too much though, out of the respect for them that I still have.
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And yes, I was really a student there. I was the 7th boy, and the 13th student at the time of my arrival, but I was the 17th student in their history (2 boys and 2 girls left before I got there to CALO). That's why I'm #17, instead of #13
So... are you saying that out of the first 16 students, four left prior to having "completed the program?" What would you say is the "drop-out rate," roughly speaking, to the best of your judgment?
No, they didn't graduate, they dropped out. If I remember correctly, there have been 11 who left the program without graduating, and I think 9 graduates that I can remember.
Of the graduates, I haven't heard too many good things about how their lives have been going. There's only a select 3 who are living meaningful and happy lives right now. I can't really say too much though, out of the respect for them that I still have.
So... are you saying that more students leave the program without actually graduating, than actually graduate? And only three out of nine graduates are "living meaningful and happy lives right now?"
I understand that that latter statement is from your perspective, and that someone else might have a different one, but it is still ... quite... telling...
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You'd think for 10,000 a month your results would be a bit more telling wouldn't you Mr. Bear?
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You'd think for 10,000 a month your results would be a bit more telling wouldn't you Mr. Bear?
I'd think that for $10,000 a month they had better be!
:flame:
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well hello people..im a graduate and i knw of mre then four who are doing ok..and whats doing ok by you? im one of the original eight and some of the kids that left the program needed to beause calo couldnt help them with what they were going through..calo did rite by them!
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I'm tired of being tormented to hell, that's what I'm tired of.