Fornits
General Interest => Open Free for All => Topic started by: Anonymous on April 07, 2009, 02:22:02 PM
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Should we really be encouraging people to be fat?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sizeism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sizeism)
The fat acceptance movement, also known as the size acceptance movement, fat liberation movement or fat power, is a grassroots effort to change societal attitudes towards individuals who are fat.[1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9] The movement consists today of a diverse group of people, who have different beliefs about how best to address the widespread prejudice and discrimination against people whose girth is above average in contemporary Western societies.[10][11][12][13][14][15]
Generally dated to the 1970s, the 1980s and 1990s witnessed an increase in activist organizations, publications, and conferences.[16][17] In the 1980s, new anti-dieting programs and models began to appear in the research literature in response to new information dispelling common myths about obesity.[18] The contemporary movement perceives negative societal attitudes as persistent and based on the presumption that body fatness reflects negatively on a person's character.[9][19] For example, a paper by Chang and Christakis describes how, during the early part of the 20th century, obesity was seen as detrimental to the community, by means of decreasing human efficiency, and that obese people interfere with labour productivity (V Chang and N Christakis, 2002). [20] Furthermore, anti-fat stigma and aggressive diet promotion have led to an increase in psychological and physiological problems among those who feel that their weight is above the "socially acceptable norm".[21]
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Should we really be encouraging people to be fat?
Why do you care what other people put in their own bodies?
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Should we really be encouraging people to be fat?
Why do you care what other people put in their own bodies?
Why do you want to encourage other people to live unhealthy lifestyles resulting in an early death?
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We should continue to educate everyone one on the risk factors of being overweight and not getting enough exercise. It does decrease productivity in many areas of the job market and therefore making it more difficult to get a job and support yourself and a family. It shortens a persons life span.
I believe over the next decade the obesity rate will self correct thru education and medical breakthroughs like continued peer pressure, gastric bypass surgery and eventually gene therapy. I don’t see any future in people wanting to be fat, they just want to be treated better, but that is just not going to happen. Look at all the models in the magazine. This is what everyone aspires to.
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I suppose it depends on what you consider "fat".
Today, most women think 135 pounds is fat. Which is ludicrous. Even if your are only 5'2.
There should be a natural body type acceptance movement instead. There is never an excuse for morbid obesity, its not natural or conducive to human efficiency in any way...no more than excessive thiness to the point of emaciation is.
I wont accept anyones poor choices in regards to their personal health. The are entitled to them, but I will not agree with them. Thats like saying that I should just accept the people that are lazy and dont do a good job my office becasue thats just the way they are.
Some people have a weight issue tied to hormonal imbalance and genetic issues, I am not talking about those people....who represent a fraction of those actually obese. A great portion of obesity is not physiological "disease". Its emotional or learned, poor habits.
If you are so big that your own bodyweight breaks your knees, thats not acceptable under any circumstance.
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Should we really be encouraging people to be fat?
Why do you care what other people put in their own bodies?
Why do you want to encourage other people to live unhealthy lifestyles resulting in an early death?
I don't encourage or discourage. I, frankly, don't give a shit... and if and "unhealthy" lifestyle results in a happier person, then perhaps unhealthy is ultimately healthier... or at least resulting in a better life.
Who cares. If a person eats to excess, it's his/her deal. Who are you or anybody else to judge. Frankly, i'd be more worried about the people running around like headless chickens worried to death that they didn't count the carbs/calories/latestfad in the ritz cracker they just ate... but then again, if they want to live a worry filled miserable life, that's their deal.
Only in America can you make up a problem to sell a solution to masses of hapless boobs, hooked on the TV image of "this is what you should be". Fucking sheep. Diet this diet that... in europe they don't' have the obsession and guess what... as a result.. there are less fat people. Yes, I would argue that America's obsession with dieting actually causes people to gain weight.
Similar to how I would argue that drug prohibition makes drugs more "taboo" and thus more desirable, food deemed to be "sinful" (and is often advertised as such) sells better. Advertisers would not label their food "guilty pleasures" or "sinful" if this was a deterrent. They know full well taboo sells. Diet craze makes food taboo. Americans are thus kept in a constant flux of "don't' do this!... unless you want to sin because it's sinful and thus soooo good". And when they get fat, they get sold a ridiculous, latest craze, Hollywood diet which doesn't work, but makes people feel helpless to the point where people go to OA meetings and declare themselves powerless over food (thereby adding more learned helplessness to the mix)... and they end up stuffing their faces even more after that. Yes, there is a lot that's amiss in American society in regards to eating, but blaming those who eat too much is missing out on the bigger picture...
All that being said, it's still a choice... and if sinful pleasures make people feel good, and they want to do it, and it's not harming anybody... let them! If you want to help, focus on how marketing drives people to do things and show people how they are being manipulated.
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Look at all the models in the magazine. This is what everyone aspires to.
Then they're fools. Magazine models are photoshop concoctions and nothing more.
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Look at all the models in the magazine. This is what everyone aspires to.
Then they're fools. Magazine models are photoshop concoctions and nothing more.
They are fools! That is one of the reasons why we have young girls who are dangerously underweight and have poor body images. If they photoshopped these images of models to look 20 lbs heavier (instead of thinner) then that would help ease the pressure off these young girls and help the obese to be more socially accepted. But this isnt going to happen anytime soon if ever.
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I, frankly, don't give a shit...
Who cares. If a person eats to excess, it's his/her deal.
Well let's say for sake of argument, your mom is morbidly obese. What's eating gilbert grape type of obese. You have to live with your mom because your other siblings ran as fast as they could, but your sense of responsibility and guilt of knowing your mother wouldn't have anyone to care for her, you stay and help her.
She has a special deal with the local store to deliver her food and put it in the kitchen, same order twice a week. Four party size cheetos, two 5 pound bags of tator tots, a tub of butter, 3 cans of whip cream, case of yoo hoos, restaurant size ketchup, tub of red vines, "tha biggest hershey theys makes", four boxes of white castles, one gallon of chocolate ice cream, one gallon of mint chocolate chip icea cream, jar of cherries, 4 two liters of dr pepper, double size jar of peanut butter, graham crackers, at least a brick size piece of cheddar cheeze, largest tub of philadelphia cream cheese, and a bag of plastic forks.
She pays for this with her disability, and lives in the old farm house your father payed off, god rest his soul. She's got nobody in the world but you. One day she starts sporting a t-shirt that says "proud to be phat" and begins calling you a fascist for trying to get her to eat a salad once in a while . How would that make you feel?
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I, frankly, don't give a shit...
Who cares. If a person eats to excess, it's his/her deal.
Well let's say for sake of argument, your mom is morbidly obese. What's eating gilbert grape type of obese. You have to live with your mom because your other siblings ran as fast as they could, but your sense of responsibility and guilt of knowing your mother wouldn't have anyone to care for her, you stay and help her.
She has a special deal with the local store to deliver her food and put it in the kitchen, same order twice a week. Four party size cheetos, two 5 pound bags of tator tots, a tub of butter, 3 cans of whip cream, case of yoo hoos, restaurant size ketchup, tub of red vines, "tha biggest hershey theys makes", four boxes of white castles, one gallon of chocolate ice cream, one gallon of mint chocolate chip icea cream, jar of cherries, 4 two liters of dr pepper, double size jar of peanut butter, graham crackers, at least a brick size piece of cheddar cheeze, largest tub of philadelphia cream cheese, and a bag of plastic forks.
She pays for this with her disability, and lives in the old farm house your father payed off, god rest his soul. She's got nobody in the world but you. One day she starts sporting a t-shirt that says "proud to be phat" and begins calling you a fascist for trying to get her to eat a salad once in a while . How would that make you feel?
I have to agree...it would be the same if your mom was a full-blown heroin junkie. I guess its her choice, but I am not going to be forced to accept it as a social norm. Its isnt, its excessive and aberrant. Obseity to the point of immobility is not a normal human condition.
I dunno, I guess I am of the same mind on all personal choices....you want to be fat, junked, gay, straight, thin, dumb, furry-fucking, etc....fine great, have at it, I can accept it....but nobody is going to DEMAND that I accept anything. A persons choices about themselves are theirs to keep, but when it starts to become my problem when they get too huge to fit in their own plane seat they need to be prepared to face the reality that it isnt the chairs fault or the airlines fault.
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Man the harpoons.
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Should we really be encouraging people to be fat?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sizeism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sizeism)
The fat acceptance movement, also known as the size acceptance movement, fat liberation movement or fat power, is a grassroots effort to change societal attitudes towards individuals who are fat.[1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9] The movement consists today of a diverse group of people, who have different beliefs about how best to address the widespread prejudice and discrimination against people whose girth is above average in contemporary Western societies.[10][11][12][13][14][15]
Generally dated to the 1970s, the 1980s and 1990s witnessed an increase in activist organizations, publications, and conferences.[16][17] In the 1980s, new anti-dieting programs and models began to appear in the research literature in response to new information dispelling common myths about obesity.[18] The contemporary movement perceives negative societal attitudes as persistent and based on the presumption that body fatness reflects negatively on a person's character.[9][19] For example, a paper by Chang and Christakis describes how, during the early part of the 20th century, obesity was seen as detrimental to the community, by means of decreasing human efficiency, and that obese people interfere with labour productivity (V Chang and N Christakis, 2002). [20] Furthermore, anti-fat stigma and aggressive diet promotion have led to an increase in psychological and physiological problems among those who feel that their weight is above the "socially acceptable norm".[21]
I don’t think it’s so much about encouraging people to be fat, it’s more about getting people to drop the sanctimonious, judgmental, contemptuous attitudes about people considered fat.
Also, if I'm not mistaken, being large isn't necessarily as unhealthy as it’s supposed to be. In fact, overweight people live longer, or something as according to one study. A lot goes into being healthy or unhealthy. I am about 89 lbs and 5 ft 7 (or so) and quite unhealthy, but no one looks at me and thinks, oh gross, like they do with people who might be on the larger side. That’s not right.
:soapbox: :soapbox: :beat: :jamin: :cheers: :deal: :nods: :whip: :dose: :trophy: :) :rasta: :smashcomp: ::poke:: O0
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I don’t think it’s so much about encouraging people to be fat, it’s more about getting people to drop the sanctimonious, judgmental, contemptuous attitudes about people considered fat.
Also, if I'm not mistaken, being large isn't necessarily as unhealthy as it’s supposed to be. In fact, overweight people live longer, or something as according to one study. A lot goes into being healthy or unhealthy. I am about 89 lbs and 5 ft 7 (or so) and quite unhealthy, but no one looks at me and thinks, oh gross, like they do with people who might be on the larger side. That’s not right.
Lose 8 more pounds and you will look like this:
Photo (http://http://sidaorg.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/anorexia4lp.jpg)
Both ends of the spectrum have a reduced life expectency.
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I don’t think it’s so much about encouraging people to be fat, it’s more about getting people to drop the sanctimonious, judgmental, contemptuous attitudes about people considered fat.
Also, if I'm not mistaken, being large isn't necessarily as unhealthy as it’s supposed to be. In fact, overweight people live longer, or something as according to one study. A lot goes into being healthy or unhealthy. I am about 89 lbs and 5 ft 7 (or so) and quite unhealthy, but no one looks at me and thinks, oh gross, like they do with people who might be on the larger side. That’s not right.
Lose 8 more pounds and you will look like this:
Photo (http://http://sidaorg.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/anorexia4lp.jpg)
Both ends of the spectrum have a reduced life expectency.
i don't look like that though. You cant see my ribs. I am just very small boned. My body seeks and finds its own comfort level. I do think if I was healthier I might weigh a bit more, but all things considered, my body weight is not a problem and i dont look weird or anorexic, just very slight.
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no one looks at me and thinks, oh gross, like they do with people who might be on the larger side. That’s not right.
I don't see how it's a matter of what's right or wrong. This is about basic human instinct and reaction. In time it might become so politically incorrect that you just can't mention the obvious fact that rolls of fat on people is not physically attractive. But then people will just be lying. Fat people aren't as attractive as people who stay in shape, this is a fact of nature.
Being too skinny and having bones stick out is also unattractive, but not in the same revolting way that the obese are. Too skinny is more like holding up a sign saying "I got mental problems", which is also unattractive. But not as unattractive as two hundred pounds of unnecessary fat.
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no one looks at me and thinks, oh gross, like they do with people who might be on the larger side. That’s not right.
I don't see how it's a matter of what's right or wrong. This is about basic human instinct and reaction. In time it might become so politically incorrect that you just can't mention the obvious fact that rolls of fat on people is not physically attractive. But then people will just be lying. Fat people aren't as attractive as people who stay in shape, this is a fact of nature.
Being too skinny and having bones stick out is also unattractive, but not in the same revolting way that the obese are. Too skinny is more like holding up a sign saying "I got mental problems", which is also unattractive. But not as unattractive as two hundred pounds of unnecessary fat.
From a relationship point of view, heavier woman are better to be with. They are more secure with themselves and can sustain a long lasting relationship. Woman who are thin or too thin are more superficial and tend to have issues or mental problems, as you mentioned. They are hung up on appearances. Neither one is very attractive but I would rather hang with the heavier chick anyday rather than be depressed with the anorexic ones.
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no one looks at me and thinks, oh gross, like they do with people who might be on the larger side. That’s not right.
I don't see how it's a matter of what's right or wrong. This is about basic human instinct and reaction. In time it might become so politically incorrect that you just can't mention the obvious fact that rolls of fat on people is not physically attractive. But then people will just be lying. Fat people aren't as attractive as people who stay in shape, this is a fact of nature.
Being too skinny and having bones stick out is also unattractive, but not in the same revolting way that the obese are. Too skinny is more like holding up a sign saying "I got mental problems", which is also unattractive. But not as unattractive as two hundred pounds of unnecessary fat.
From a relationship point of view, heavier woman are better to be with. They are more secure with themselves and can sustain a long lasting relationship. Woman who are thin or too thin are more superficial and tend to have issues or mental problems, as you mentioned. They are hung up on appearances. Neither one is very attractive but I would rather hang with the heavier chick anyday rather than be depressed with the anorexic ones.
No! Fat people are disgusting! That is truth! Have you not heard? Anything else is the political correctness.
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This thread would be better if you could post pictures.
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A persons choices about themselves are theirs to keep, but when it starts to become my problem when they get too huge to fit in their own plane seat they need to be prepared to face the reality that it isnt the chairs fault or the airlines fault.
See... Now there's where I totally agree with you. If people make the choice to eat to excess to the point where they no longer fit in one seat, they have to live with the consequences (buying two tickets). The airline shouldn't be forced to pay for people's personal choices...
But there is a caveat there... what about the people who are naturally fat no matter what they eat. In those cases, i'd say that the airline should be forced to give a person more room... the same as with any other legitimate disability (something a person does not choose and cannot control through free will).
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From a relationship point of view, heavier woman are better to be with. They are more secure with themselves and can sustain a long lasting relationship. Woman who are thin or too thin are more superficial and tend to have issues or mental problems, as you mentioned. They are hung up on appearances. Neither one is very attractive but I would rather hang with the heavier chick anyday rather than be depressed with the anorexic ones.
Amen. Stay clear of the ones obsessed with their weight. By and large batshit crazy.
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begins calling you a fascist for trying to get her to eat a salad once in a while . How would that make you feel?
I wouldn't bother trying to control what she puts in her body. I hate it when my mother bothers me about smoking... why would I bother her about something she enjoys.
If somebody tries to tell me what to put in my own body, it implies that they know better than me and I am somehow a child not old enough to make my own decisions. It's insulting, and I could imagine somebody being annoyed over it... even if done with good intentions.
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what about the people who are naturally fat no matter what they eat.
They don't exist, well, unless they rewrote the laws of physics. Do you think there are people incapable of starving to death if they stopped eating altogether? Where are these super humans that can exist without food? Humans can go weeks without food, and if any human stops eating they WILL lose weight. fact!
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what about the people who are naturally fat no matter what they eat.
They don't exist, well, unless they rewrote the laws of physics. Do you think there are people incapable of starving to death if they stopped eating altogether? Where are these super humans that can exist without food? Humans can go weeks without food, and if any human stops eating they WILL lose weight. fact!
i dont think thats true, i think some are predisposed to be heavy. Since i was a kid i was always 30 lbs lighter than my peers. i think that exists in the opposite direction too. Obviously if youre 1,500 lbs that's not the case, bit some people are just naturally built like this:
http://www.plusmodels.com/barbara.html (http://www.plusmodels.com/barbara.html)
http://www.plussizeliving.com/articles/ ... 7ai998.jpg (http://www.plussizeliving.com/articles/images/art507ai998.jpg)
espcially after you get a certain age...
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Amen. Stay clear of the ones obsessed with their weight. By and large batshit crazy.
This.
As proof, I'm obsessed with mine, and I am indeed, batshit crazy.
This psychologist I knew was telling some of us crazies how her thesis in college was on body image issues, and she found that there was only one demographic of people who had as much of an obsession with their body image as women did, and that was faggots.
So I'm fucked both ways.
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I wouldn't necessarily support a "fat acceptance" movement, but I would support a movement that encouraged our media to stop glorifying the stick figure. This would be easier to put into action and a goal more likely to be obtained then fighting the stigma that "fat" has. More than anything I would suggest encouraging a healthy average weight, and proper eating and exercising habits instead of forcing people to accept fat people.
I honestly don't know why anyone would want to be either bone thin or obese, that's when you start to get health and mental problems, there is nothing okay with encouraging that with society acceptance. However it isn't fair that our society is obsessed with being skinny, because that is exactly what gives young girls body image issues that drive them to either overeat or have anorexia (or bulimia). I think it would be fair to encourage improvements in this area, but I don't think they should ask people to accept obesity as normalcy.
No one will ever truly accept that, you cant change truth into acceptance in order to be politically correct, just like no one really thinks that "niggas" arent god awfully annoying. funny enough society now tells me I cant even mention that fact, let alone say the word and I think that's bullshit. If that's what these people are going for, to force people not to mention how other people make them feel, then this becomes an infringement on MY freedom. I don't give a shit if people want to be overweight, I'm certainly not going to tell them what to do, but I don't think anyone will ever be able to change their minds about that sort of thing... its just not humanly possible.
I must mention however that girls who are healthy weight are MUCH MUCH more attractive, and as it was mentioned before those are usually the girls that make better girlfriends because they aren't insecure about their bodies. Call it a sign of strong mental health, with a bonus of "more cushion for the pushin". Of course I'm not talking about the Michelin Man here, just a beautifully curvy woman.
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Psy will vouch for the fact that I'm no slim jim. On the other hand I'm not rolling fat tub of guts either with an ass so big I have to have custom made pants.
Gentics has made me into the kind of dude who will be heavier than most. Some folks call it being larged boned I call it being as big as an ox. On the upside it also made for good times in high school when playing sports. I was always the guy who could pound anything into the ground, bench press over 300 pounds, squat absurd amounts of weight, and held a record for the leg press that was something like over 1000 pounds.
I was fat yes.. but very strong and healthy despite it. Still am, but more so now that I drive myself hard at the gym three times a week.
Fat Acceptance is one thing.. I think people who are prone to being heavy by genetics ought to be accepted. But for fucks sake the absolute most compelling drive for me to lose 30 pounds came from getting my fat ass jammed in a plane seat in Vietnam.
Mind you the seats were made with the Vietnamese ass size in mind.
Still.. damn talk about embarrassing... Took me four months but I did it.
So don't immediately dismiss the value of shame.
Big is one thing.. Disgustingly obese to the point of being a danger to yourself and others if you slip on the stairs or your ceiling collapses is another.
I like big women myself, but I draw the line at having to hook them up to oxygen before sex.
To conclude I'd also like to say that we should drink a beer in honor of Vietnam Airlines for providing the best diet plan in the world.
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As a person who is now far more overweight than is healthy, I feel torn. Overweight people, especially women are discriminated against in western society. Anyone who for whatever reason has gone from being healthy weight to obese can tell you how painful and degrading it is to have some stranger yell something offensive from their car window or to occasionally hear the uninvited comments of strangers. The media also seems to constantly give itself a free pass to make fat jokes and to portray overweight people as dorky, stupid and lazy with barely an eyelid being blinked. Just look at the offensive recent “fat suit” fad.
On the other hand once a person is at a certain weight there are real health issues. So the idea of promoting it as a wise lifestyle choice is not a great idea. Perhaps instead of a pro obesity movement, there should just be a movement toward all citizens conducting themselves with a bit more kindness and dignity
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Then be BOLDwith your big self! Keep your head held high and sing:
Dare to be fat
Fat is where it's at
Dare to be fat
Fat is where it's at
Havin' a ball
with cholesterol,
eatin' breakfast, lunch, and dinner
and a few other meals that might be new to you.
We live in a nation of extremes and labels. No wonder we're spiraling down toward the toilet drain.